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#Post#: 35440--------------------------------------------------
Bargain 1/2 hp G. Sipp .... the good, the bad & the ugly
By: Stoker Date: February 12, 2021, 6:28 pm
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Hummmm .... where to actually start this thread?
Perhaps a link to the original thread of my epic trip to go pick
it up, as seen here:
(HTM) https://www.officeofsteamforum.com/general-discussion/12-hp-g-sipp-in-the-bag/
So, as the tale just linked makes clear, I risked life & limb,
and possibly some sanity as well, to go get this big brute, and
even though it was an impressive bargain, there are reasons that
might help explain just why that was the case.
I have now taken it down far enough to have a pretty good idea
as to what issues are at play here, and although none are wholly
irredeemable, there are several that suggest that this will
never be a first class engine, unless totally rebuilt to a
standard that would be difficult to achieve given the material
at hand. I believe somewhere I made reference to this engine as
being a case of buying "a pig in a poke", and as it turns out,
that was a rather prescient observation.
Yes, the seller showed a video of this engine running on air.
But, it ran poorly, jerkily and I sensed it was requiring very
high air pressure to accomplish that, thus I really didn't like
what I saw then, so was some suspicious right from the git go,
and those suspicions have now proven correct.
Still, I think having it in my collection now is good, and I do
believe I'll be able to make it run reasonably well, even if not
superlative. Yet it will never be a prime example of the type or
anything like it, no matter what I do to give it the help it
definitely needs.
But, at the end of the day, it was one hell of a bargain
generally, and it does look very well beside its little brother
the 1/4 hp Sipp, so I'll do what I can for it, and settle for
whatever I actually end up with here.
[attachimg=1]
I'll add photos & descriptions of what I have found at issue
with this engine in following posts.
#Post#: 35441--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bargain 1/2 hp G. Sipp .... the good, the bad & the ugly
By: St Paul Steam Date: February 12, 2021, 7:27 pm
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I'll be right here waiting for your updates Daniel, thanks for
including us in your journey.
#Post#: 35442--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bargain 1/2 hp G. Sipp .... the good, the bad & the ugly
By: Stoker Date: February 12, 2021, 8:11 pm
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Well okay Bruce ... let's get started down this road, shall
we!?!?
As mentioned above, in the video provided by the seller, the
engine looked to run really rough, and it seemed that a lot of
pressure (subjective judgement that proved correct) was being
used to get it to run at all. When I picked it up, the seller
told me that they were using 60-80 psi from his compressor in
the video, and it sure wasn't running smooth and fast like it
should have. Besides that, it was immediately obvious that the
cylinder lagging cover was not on the engine, and that is
perhaps the most visually conspicuous and iconic part of a Sipp
engine. Furthermore there was a bolt sticking up out of the top
of the cylinder that simply had to go all the way into the
inside of the cylinder. This is not a normal feature of a Sipp,
and was likely used to put a little oil on the piston from time
to time when running on air, though it wouldn't do much of
anything to oil the D-valve.
Both of those features, or lack thereof, are seen here:
[attachimg=1]
So this much I knew before I committed to buy it, and drive down
to pick it up! But was still hopeful that these were perhaps the
only real issues.
Other issues of note that became obvious upon seeing it in
person, and getting it home for proper study, showed that it
never had that iconic cylinder lagging cover mounted, as the
photo also shows the witness marks for locating the cover
mounting screws that are cast into the top of the cylinder, have
never been drilled and tapped. Furthermore, you can just see
from the above photo that the inside walls that project above
the ends of the cylinder are not square, but rather tapers
toward the top of the photo, which would make mounting the cover
difficult at best, and a proper mounting has the cover edges set
square and parallel.
Fact is I do believe that this was not a factory finished
engine, but was rather sold as a set of partially machined
castings, which was an option back in the day.
#Post#: 35443--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bargain 1/2 hp G. Sipp .... the good, the bad & the ugly
By: St Paul Steam Date: February 12, 2021, 8:46 pm
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Wow , 60-80 psi , that should have flung itself to the floor as
big as that brute is and the weight shifting displacement it can
achieve, my knowledge of Sipp engines is that most were kits
that were often included or offered as an option in new metal
lathe sales as on easy 1st build, I imagine a 2 sided brass
cover could be fabricated for it.
#Post#: 35444--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bargain 1/2 hp G. Sipp .... the good, the bad & the ugly
By: RedRyder Date: February 12, 2021, 9:38 pm
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Hi Daniel, a big CONGRATS on a fine acquisition for your
collection.
Perhaps a bit of timing will help. 60 to 80 psi ought to be
downright scary on one of these without a work load and without
a governor.
#Post#: 35447--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bargain 1/2 hp G. Sipp .... the good, the bad & the ugly
By: Jim Date: February 12, 2021, 9:57 pm
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Following vicariously along with you Daniel, I'm going to
thoroughly enjoy this thread and watch this biggun' being
restored.
#Post#: 35455--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bargain 1/2 hp G. Sipp .... the good, the bad & the ugly
By: PatJ Date: February 13, 2021, 9:04 am
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That is a very nice looking engine.
I don't recall ever seeing that style/brand before.
.
#Post#: 35456--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bargain 1/2 hp G. Sipp .... the good, the bad & the ugly
By: Stoker Date: February 13, 2021, 9:36 am
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[quote author=RedRyder link=topic=3787.msg35444#msg35444
date=1613187507]
Hi Daniel, a big CONGRATS on a fine acquisition for your
collection.
Perhaps a bit of timing will help. 60 to 80 psi ought to be
downright scary on one of these without a work load and without
a governor.
[/quote]
Well the video the seller had of it running did show it "jumping
around" pretty badly, but I think that was mostly due to the
wobbly table he had it set up on. Even though he said his
compressor was giving him 60-80 psi, I doubt that the engine was
actually seeing that much, as it would also depend on the volume
of air, and not just the pressure of that air, that was making
it into the engine. With that said, I will add that much of what
I have found so far would definitely preclude this engine
running on any "reasonable" amount of air or steam. Large volume
and substantial pressure is the only way this engine is likely
to turn over in it's current condition, as you will soon see
with further postings.
Certainly my little airbrush compressor at 25 psi would not
budge this big brute, even though I believe the pressure should
have proven adequate (just), but the volume was lacking. I
couldn't even get the D-valve to seat, so all the air I was
putting in was just blowing out the exhaust!
Most, if not all of the issues with this engine will be revealed
in due course .... so stay tuned!
#Post#: 35469--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bargain 1/2 hp G. Sipp .... the good, the bad & the ugly
By: txlabman Date: February 13, 2021, 12:15 pm
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I am staying tuned Daniel.
#Post#: 35474--------------------------------------------------
Re: Bargain 1/2 hp G. Sipp .... the good, the bad & the ugly
By: St Paul Steam Date: February 13, 2021, 1:02 pm
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[quote author=txlabman link=topic=3787.msg35469#msg35469
date=1613240126]
I am staying tuned Daniel.
[/quote]
I'm here as well...
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