[HN Gopher] Ottawa Library fines people using unreliable automat...
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Ottawa Library fines people using unreliable automatic calling
system (1994)
Author : cnst
Score : 28 points
Date : 2020-01-06 04:13 UTC (18 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (catless.ncl.ac.uk)
(TXT) w3m dump (catless.ncl.ac.uk)
| tekstar wrote:
| Since this is oddly on the front page I want to shout out the OPL
| for being a great place for everybody. I love libraries. There
| are so few places you can go with no expectation that you will
| purchase something.
|
| OPL also has a $100k makerspace available at the Centerpointe
| location with multiple 3D printers,scanners, and laser cutters.
| All available for free (if you can book a spot!)
| ogre_codes wrote:
| Every library I've been to has told me the return date when I
| checked out the book and stamped on the library card or receipt
| you get when checking out the book. For decades there was no
| phone call/ notification, you'd get a letter in the mail after
| you'd already started racking up late fees.
|
| Regardless of how broken their notification system is, keeping
| track of the return date has always been the borrower's
| responsibility.
| jackcarter wrote:
| This is about the notification that a book is ready for pickup.
| nogabebop23 wrote:
| yes - Calgary used to fine you $2 if you did not pick up a
| hold within 7 days, now it just expires. I wonder if it was
| the same specific motivation or the PITA of collecting fines
| in general.
| tantalor wrote:
| > if you do not pick up the book in three days, you are fined
| $2.00
|
| Why would a library fine you for _not_ borrowing a book? That is
| the opposite of how libraries work!
| nogabebop23 wrote:
| Because you can go online and place holds on many books and the
| library will ship them to your prefered branch once available
| and then shelve them for pick-up. There's a significant amount
| of effort and cost, plus most holds are for the same limited
| supply of popular books; while your hold is sitting there
| counteless others are waiting.
|
| The fine is to discourage making hold requests and then never
| claiming them.
| andi999 wrote:
| Maybe it got canned because the pickup dates are not
| predictable. If I place hold on a book with e.g. two holds on
| it already by somebody else, the book will be ready in 2
| month if each person keeps the book for 1 month. If each
| person returns it on the spot its basically 2 days. Good luck
| planning your holidays ard that.
| lerie wrote:
| why is this even here? it happened more than 2 decades ago.
| red-indian wrote:
| For years my public library charged a $3 fee to get a book sent
| from another library in the system.
|
| At some point I was chatting with a librarian about this and she
| revealed they had eliminated the fee so as not to discourage the
| use of interlibrary loans.
|
| I few weeks later I tried checking out something from another
| library and was then treated to a 10 minute lecture on how it
| costs them $20 to process these loans and am I really sure I want
| it.
|
| No thanks. I'll just get it for a penny plus $3.99 shipping from
| amazon, less than the cost of gasoline to drive into town to
| order it, pick it up, and return it (3 round trips).
| gruez wrote:
| >No thanks. I'll just get it for a penny plus $3.99 shipping
| from amazon
|
| There are books for a penny on Amazon?
| colechristensen wrote:
| The shipping charge covers whatever meager profit they get.
|
| Something like the profitability of collecting cans for the
| deposit.
| nitwit005 wrote:
| Quite a lot of them. The publishers are quite upset at the
| price collapse of used books as people go grab those up.
| reaperducer wrote:
| That's really a shame. My library will transfer any book, DVD,
| computer game, power tool, or even a wifi hotspot from another
| library for free and usually within two days.
|
| As recently as this past fall I requested books from libraries
| in New Mexico and New York and both came with zero fees.
|
| I sure hope your local library system has dropped their fees by
| now.
| [deleted]
| ramshorns wrote:
| The author mentions parking tickets as a possible future
| automatic fine that could be unreliable. Red light cameras were
| introduced in Ontario in 1998, which automatically issue fines to
| the vehicle owner, and automatic speed enforcement is being
| rolled out now.
|
| I guess the difference is that it improves road safety, which
| library fines don't, and that you can contest the ticket with a
| human in traffic court.
| Rebelgecko wrote:
| >I guess the difference is that it improves road safety
|
| I don't think this is necessarily true for red light cameras.
| Many studies have shown that they lead to more fatalities and
| more collisions (fewer people getting T-boned when they run red
| lights, offset by more people getting rear ended when they slam
| on the brakes so they don't get a ticket). Other studies have
| also found that cameras reduce collisions and deaths, so I
| think to some extent it's still an open question and the answer
| may vary in different locations.
| nogabebop23 wrote:
| >> I guess the difference is that it improves road safety
|
| Exactly - just like when I want to change the way my kids are
| acting:
|
| I pick a random occurrence of a specific behaviour, punish them
| well after the fact and they inevitably draw the correct cause
| => effect linkage and never repeat the targeted behaviour
| again.
|
| </s>
| jonny_eh wrote:
| > automatic speed enforcement is being rolled out now
|
| It was already rolled out in the 90s, then removed by a
| different government in the 2000s. It was called "Photo-radar".
|
| > Photo radar was introduced to the province's major highways
| in the early 1990s by Bob Rae's NDP government, but the
| controversial project was scrapped by Mike Harris' Progressive
| Conservatives.
|
| https://torontosun.com/news/local-news/photo-radar-makes-com...
| Maxious wrote:
| 25 years later, automated parking tickets via number plate
| recognition vans are here:
|
| > One of the more amusing reasons for Smart Parking's loss was
| flagged in its interim numbers in February when the company
| told investors its cash cow of issuing parking fines was being
| bled by "increased driver compliance resulting in fewer PBNs
| [parking breach notifications] being issued".
|
| https://www.itnews.com.au/news/automated-and-iot-parking-fin...
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