[HN Gopher] Vitamin C and Immuno-Oncology
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Vitamin C and Immuno-Oncology
Author : daddylonglegs
Score : 73 points
Date : 2020-03-02 18:19 UTC (4 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (blogs.sciencemag.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (blogs.sciencemag.org)
| chrisco255 wrote:
| Worth noting that clinical trials are underway for studying the
| effect of vitamin C infusions on 2019-nCov:
|
| https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04264533
| 1996 wrote:
| TLDR: A team of researchers affiliated with multiple institutions
| in Italy has found that giving cancerous mice high doses of
| vitamin C (ascorbic acid) enhanced immunotherapy, resulting in
| slowed or stopped tumor growth.
|
| Maybe Linus Pauling was indeed on to something
| (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linus_Pauling ) with his idea of
| high dose IV vitamin C: skipping the article as it seems to take
| political positions ("But if this work makes some headlines of
| the "Linus Pauling was right" sort, don't believe them") and
| using Wikipedia as a source instead:
|
| Pauling's work on vitamin C in his later years generated much
| controversy. He was first introduced to the concept of high-dose
| vitamin C by biochemist Irwin Stone in 1966. After becoming
| convinced of its worth, Pauling took 3 grams of vitamin C every
| day to prevent colds.[13] Excited by his own perceived results,
| he researched the clinical literature and published Vitamin C and
| the Common Cold in 1970. He began a long clinical collaboration
| with the British cancer surgeon Ewan Cameron in 1971 on the use
| of intravenous and oral vitamin C as cancer therapy for terminal
| patients.[143] Cameron and Pauling wrote many technical papers
| and a popular book, Cancer and Vitamin C, that discussed their
| observations. Pauling made vitamin C popular with the public[144]
| and eventually published two studies of a group of 100 allegedly
| terminal patients that claimed vitamin C increased survival by as
| much as four times compared to untreated patients
|
| (...)
|
| medical establishment concluded that his claims that vitamin C
| could prevent colds or treat cancer were quackery.[13][151]
| Pauling denounced the conclusions of these studies and handling
| of the final study as "fraud and deliberate
| misrepresentation",[152][153] and criticized the studies for
| using oral, rather than intravenous vitamin C[154] (which was the
| dosing method used for the first ten days of Pauling's original
| study
| SAI_Peregrinus wrote:
| I wouldn't say that "But if this work makes some headlines of
| the "Linus Pauling was right" sort, don't believe them" is a
| political position. Pauling was wrong: he didn't say "High dose
| IV vitamin C is helpful", he said (paraphrased) "High dose IV
| vitamin C is helpful because it is an antioxidant". But it's
| not an antioxidant, as this paper shows, it's an oxidant! It's
| helpful, but for exactly the wrong reason, and low-dose vitamin
| C _is_ an antioxidant, which is _harmful_! So if Pauling were
| correct you 'd expect other antioxidants to help, but they also
| cause harm (in oncology).
| agumonkey wrote:
| I've been curious about balancing [anti]oxydants, do you know
| good texts on this ?
| pazimzadeh wrote:
| Here's the original article:
|
| High-dose vitamin C enhances cancer immunotherapy
| https://stm.sciencemag.org/content/12/532/eaay8707/
|
| Takeaways:
|
| Oral Vitamin C and intravenous Vitamin C have vastly different
| pharmacokinetics and effects on cancer.
|
| - Low dose vitamin C (oral) is anti-oxidant and may attenuate
| chemotherapy:
|
| Chemosensitizing effect of vitamin C in combination with
| 5-fluorouracil in vitro
| https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12929582 "only a high
| concentration of vitamin C increased the cytotoxicity of 5-FU"
|
| Ascorbic acid attenuates antineoplastic drug 5-fluorouracil
| induced gastrointestinal toxicity in rats by modulating the
| expression of inflammatory mediators
| https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5598240/
|
| - High dose vitamin C (intravenous) is pro-oxidant
|
| - High dose vitamin C (intravenous) alone slows tumor growth
|
| - High dose vitamin C (intravenous) combined with immunotherapy
| has a synergistic effect
|
| High dose vitamin C (intravenous) also synergizes with
| chemotherapy and spares healthy cells
| https://stm.sciencemag.org/content/6/222/222ra18
|
| If you are in chemotherapy or immunotherapy, stay away from low
| doses of oral anti-oxidant supplements such as Vitamin C.
| mrfusion wrote:
| But why would oral be so different?
| pazimzadeh wrote:
| I don't have the specific answer, but oral has to go through
| the microbiota and be absorbed by your gut before getting to
| the bloodstream.
|
| Vitamin C pharmacokinetics: implications for oral and
| intravenous use
| https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15068981?dopt=Abstract
| tomlue wrote:
| We did a data extraction project for 81 trials using oral or
| intravenous IV as a cancer therapy! You can see the whole
| project at https://sysrev.com/p/6737. Basically we imported 81
| VitC trials from clinicaltrials.gov and extracted dose levels,
| administration methods, placebo usage, and some other data.
|
| You can see all the oral studies here:
| https://shorturl.at/mvxy4
|
| You can see all the IV studies here: https://shorturl.at/bn019
|
| The results of the research will be published soon...
| KWxIUElW8Xt0tD9 wrote:
| look up papers by Dr. Klenner on the use of intravenous vitamin C
|
| see also "living proof" a New Zealand 60-minutes segment
| clumsysmurf wrote:
| I found this summary to be an easier read than the original
| research paper
|
| https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-02-high-doses-vitamin-im...
| pstuart wrote:
| Shooting up C doesn't sound appealing, but I wonder if liposomal
| C might be worth exploring after all.
| bastian wrote:
| This is an interesting link from the comments section of the
| article: https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04264533
| british_india wrote:
| Fresca is packed with Vitamin C.
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