[HN Gopher] Don't Touch Ya Face
___________________________________________________________________
Don't Touch Ya Face
Author : dkobran
Score : 275 points
Date : 2020-03-11 18:26 UTC (4 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.donttouchyaface.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.donttouchyaface.com)
| waterhouse wrote:
| How about this solution: If your face itches or something, use
| the _back_ of your hand to rub it? Or some other part of your
| body that you can be confident isn 't used to touch anything
| potentially contaminated.
| aengvs wrote:
| Problem with this is I'm now using the back of my hand or other
| parts of my body to open doors, press elevator buttons etc...
| waterhouse wrote:
| Partition your body: some parts used for some things, others
| for other things. Use an elbow or knee to push buttons, use
| the long sleeve of a jacket as a mini-glove if you need to
| grasp a handle. Or wear gloves that you take off once you're
| inside.
| freehunter wrote:
| I see a lot of people using their jacket sleeve to open doors
| or to cover a cough, etc. But how often do you wash your jacket
| versus washing your hands? I'd rather open a door with my hands
| then wash my hands (or use sanitizer if a sink isn't around)
| because I can wash my hands several times a day. I can't wash
| my jacket more than once a day.
| waterhouse wrote:
| Consider the sleeves of your jacket to be permanently
| contaminated. (Though hopefully the inside of your elbow is
| contaminated only by your own coughing.) Repeatedly
| contaminating the sleeves doesn't make them worse; just try
| to avoid having them touch anything else important.
| (Theoretically you could be worsening the _doorknobs_ , but
| it seems unlikely you're adding anything they don't already
| have.) It may not be a perfect solution, but I think it's
| pretty good.
|
| Regarding washing hands, I've found that if I do that too
| much then my skin (starting on the back of my hands) tends to
| dry out and flake off. Certain kinds of moisturizing soap are
| less bad at this, but I don't choose what soap is available
| except at home, and it has led me to find other solutions
| like the above.
| csours wrote:
| I've tried this when eating spicy things, and it's been very
| self evident that I'm not good at it at all.
|
| Edit: this may be a potential vector for reinforcement learning
| joe_the_user wrote:
| Being on the spectrum of ADHD, I'm pretty certain that it's going
| to be absolutely impossible for me to stop touching my and
| suspect that small nervous habits of this sort just aren't going
| to be worked out of a significant portion of the population even
| if I could stop myself somehow.
|
| I'm fortunate I can work remotely. Social distancing is a
| thousand times easier for me than stopping nervous habits,
| include touching my face. I suspect such actions are on the
| interface between conscious control and reflex actions.
|
| I suppose the authorities should still keep telling us to stop
| doing but I think planners should pretty much assume this is not
| a barrier that's going to stop the disease.
| amyjess wrote:
| I'm in a similar situation. I have a very large number of
| physical tics (classified as "tic disorder" and not
| "Tourette's" because mine are all nonverbal), and on top of
| that I have a massive number of sensory processing issues that
| make me react very strongly to any sensation on my body so I'm
| constantly addressing them, and I've long since decided I'd
| rather get the coronavirus than not touch my face. The
| coronavirus cause me less discomfort than not touching my face,
| by multiple orders of magnitude.
| gaogao wrote:
| As a fellow person with ADHD, I naturally socially distance
| myself!
| faust42069 wrote:
| My app works while you use other apps
| https://foundationlabs.io/face-no-touchy
| faust42069 wrote:
| For those looking for an app that works while you use other apps:
| https://foundationlabs.io/face-no-touchy
| wldcordeiro wrote:
| Security warning page for the certificate?
| wirrbel wrote:
| With all the talk about not touching your face, I fear that
| sometimes this is overemphasized for Corona virus. It is a virus
| with a viral envelope, and viruses with viral envelopes are
| especially unstable outside of the human body. Keeping your
| distance to people, not staying long in rooms where droplets may
| floating in the air carrying virus is just as important if not
| more.
|
| Also, after washing your hands with soap, viral counts should be
| so low that there isn't a danger of infecting yourself anymore,
| so the situation where you sit at your laptop isn't especially
| dangerous IF YOU WASH YOUR HANDS BEFORE USING IT (and possibly
| wiping the keyboard down with a wrung-out cloth that was soaked
| in soap water).
| ajross wrote:
| None of that is well-established. It might be right, but there
| hasn't been time to do the science. Certainly facial contact is
| a known vector for many viruses, including other coronavirus
| genera.
|
| This is a crisis. We have to work things via defense in depth
| and hope that it is enough. So we wash our hands, isolate, wear
| masks where available, and _we don 't touch our face_.
|
| Please don't try to finesse a pandemic just to seem smart on
| the internet. No one knows whether you're right or not.
|
| Seriously, just don't touch your face.
| echelon wrote:
| Unrelated to the content of the page, I'm really starting to hate
| the push for SSL everywhere.
|
| This website has misconfigured certs and because of that my
| browser blocks it. Chrome is corp IT-managed and has no opt-out,
| whereas Firefox lets me accept the certs, but it's ultimately
| been blocked by our DNS/firewall for the same reason.
|
| I really hate SSL. The majority of informational sites do not
| need it. I understand that it doesn't protect my privacy, but it
| doesn't frankly matter that I'm accessing an informational page
| about Coronavirus. If people are willing to give up their privacy
| to adtech platforms like Google and Facebook, the information
| about what websites you read is already out there.
|
| I feel like Google has just created a deeper moat by pushing for
| SSL.
|
| People complain about Kubernetes, but that's infra for large orgs
| that you shouldn't opt into unless you need it. SSL is being
| forced on the small guys who can't handle the complexity nor
| automation. It's not fair.
| chipperyman573 wrote:
| The biggest benefit for me is, it guarantees my ISP can't mess
| with my pages. They already do it with mild stuff
| (https://www.zdnet.com/article/comcast-injects-copyright-
| warn...) so I wouldn't put it past them to inject ads or
| something if they thought they'd make any money.
| sigjuice wrote:
| It is not just about _YOUR_ ISP messing with your pages.
| There are many ISPs (a different one, every few hops).
| smitop wrote:
| You can bypass hard HSTS errors in Chrome by typing in
| "thisisunsafe". There is no textbox to type it into, you have
| the press the letters on your keyboard blindly.
| sciurus wrote:
| What errors are you seeing? Perhaps your IT department is the
| cause. The certs look fine.
|
| https://www.ssllabs.com/ssltest/analyze.html?d=www.donttouch...
|
| https://www.ssllabs.com/ssltest/analyze.html?d=lzdmsmujepoc2...
| zerocrates wrote:
| 1: What's wrong with the site's certificate? Seems fine to me.
|
| 2: How does a greater penetration of HTTPS help Google's moat
| specifically? To my understanding, all the vendors are pretty
| much pushing in the same direction.
| jiggawatts wrote:
| What are you talking about? It's using TLS 1.3 and is signed by
| the GlobalSign root CA! It's using the most compatible RSA 2048
| crypto, and all the parameters look valid.
|
| Maybe you are a victim of a man-in-the-middle attack _right
| now_ and the "stupid warnings" you're blithely clicking
| through are _informing you of this_.
| emmelaich wrote:
| For me, GlobalSign lack of / failing to get GlobalSign
| _intermediate_ certs pops up surprisingly often.
| nathancahill wrote:
| Seems to be fixed now? Unless your corp doesn't have GlobalSign
| root?
| sigjuice wrote:
| How you know the coronavirus information that you are getting
| from an http site hasn't been tampered with before it reaches
| you?
| j88439h84 wrote:
| This also seems really useful for people trying to stop biting
| their nails and other habits. Any chance you'd share the code?
| jascii wrote:
| With the pandemic of working from home, maybe we need an app to
| help us stop touching, eh, _other_ bits of our anatomy?
| qntmfred wrote:
| Now do it for bad posture plz
| rsanek wrote:
| Take a look at https://github.com/z1lc/HeadUp2 -- it's basic
| but it works OK
| 5cott0 wrote:
| > I looked up your code because you don't know how to hide it and
| have made my own cloned app for some reason. Nobody liked you in
| high school, I'm sorry you had to find out this way.
|
| I really felt this.
| CCoffie wrote:
| I'm pretty sure you just made more people touch their face...
| sigjuice wrote:
| How is this supposed to work? Most people have carved their
| webcams out of their laptop and put tape over the hole :)
| zmmmmm wrote:
| A bit tangential, but I have a mild concern that the focus on
| hand / face transmission which is undoubtably valid may be
| encouraging people to overlook the fact that covid-19 is _highly_
| transmissable without any contact through air / droplets. Many
| cases have been documented where people were infected without
| contact. To avoid infection, you need to avoid being in close
| proximity, especially in enclosed environments, with large
| numbers of people.
| prox wrote:
| The guidelines talk about 1-2 meters distance and 15 minutes of
| presence in the same space. This makes public transport and
| venues big transmission vectors for that reason. Someone who
| sneezes unprotected will no doubt widen that area by a factor.
| aeturnum wrote:
| Cool project, but what got me to comment was the really stellar
| FAQ on the landing page.
|
| I think it's really hard to strike capture the tone of software
| in written descriptions of those pieces of software. Coding
| projects that are programmed in an experimental and light-hearted
| way can end up being spoken about in somber tones that lose that
| sense of fun and playfulness.
| perk wrote:
| I love this loose writing style, but when I try it myself I
| feel like an idiot.
| godelski wrote:
| Do it more often (practice!) and don't take it seriously. Who
| cares if you sound like an idiot. This isn't a serious
| project after all.
| sramsay wrote:
| I got a _much-needed_ laugh out of it.
|
| Especially:
|
| > My dude, I can barely make a website, much less a mini NSA.
| ccktlmazeltov wrote:
| looks like we read the same thing
| frequentnapper wrote:
| too slow. told me like 1 minute later after i touched the face if
| at all...
| ricardobeat wrote:
| The app fails to even ask for camera permission in Firefox, and
| simply dies.
| lkbm wrote:
| It worked for me. Could you have it set to Never Ask? (I'm
| using Firefox Nightly on Mac OS.)
| emmelaich wrote:
| Also, wash your hands.
|
| https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-03-10/how-south-east-asia-i...
| wesleyfsmith wrote:
| The FAQs are amazing haha
| lxe wrote:
| Done with https://teachablemachine.withgoogle.com/train/image I
| bet. Love this thing. You can make your own 'Don't Touch Ya Face'
| in a few minutes!
| ISL wrote:
| I have addressed this issue with a simple hardware innovation:
| the Facespoon.
|
| Find a clean object with a well-defined handle. Use the non-
| handle end of the object to touch/scratch/adjust/manipulate your
| face. Clean the object regularly.
|
| Working from home, I've designated a kitchen cooking spoon on my
| desk for this dedicated task. Plastic appears to better than
| wood, as it is more-readily cleaned and does not absorb facial
| oils.
| a-wu wrote:
| Even better: get a copper spoon as copper is naturally
| antimicrobial
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antimicrobial_properties_of_co...
| ISL wrote:
| Looks like it may be effective against at least some viruses,
| too. Interesting.
| pmiller2 wrote:
| Yeah, that's why I'm glad the door handles in my building
| are brass.
| pbhjpbhj wrote:
| > Plastic appears to better than wood //
|
| Do your own due diligence on this one, but a few years ago I
| think it was reported that, surprisingly, wooden chopping
| boards are better than plastic ones (which had been assumed to
| be better as they're less absorbent, etc.) and actually combat
| bacteria.
|
| Given Covid19 is reported to - unusually for a virus - last up
| to a week [check a proper source!] or so on hard surfaces then
| maybe in this situation wood might also be better???
|
| >"A study by the Food Research Institute in Wisconsin (Ak et
| al. 1994a and b) compared wooden and plastic boards and came to
| the surprising result that wood possesses substantially better
| hygienic characteristics than plastic. After contaminating
| different cutting boards with bacteria, significantly fewer
| viable bacteria could regularly be recovered from wooden boards
| than from plastic boards. These results were confirmed by
| Gehrig et al. (2000) in a recent study investigating hygienic
| aspects of wooden and plastic boards regarding the risk of food
| contamination. Previous studies assumed that the detected
| reduction in bacterial numbers on the wood surfaces is caused
| by an antibacterial effect of wood based on several physical
| and chemical properties of wood. The porous structure and
| hygroscopic characteristics of wood could remove the water
| needed by the bacteria for their vital functions and
| multiplication and thus kill them (Kampelmacher et al. 1971,
| Schulz 1995). In addition, substances present in wood (e.g.
| polyphenoles) could be responsible for an antibacterial effect
| (Willaman 1955, Biswas et al. 1981, Laks and McKaig 1988, Field
| et al. 1989, Schra"gle and Mu"ller 1990, Scalbert 1991, Mu"ller
| et al. 1995)"
|
| >from DOI 10.1007/s00107-002-0300-6, "Wooden boards affecting
| the survival of bacteria?"
| marcsto2 wrote:
| My wife and I built something similar. Take a look:
| https://www.DontTouchFace.com
| forkexec wrote:
| Or I Breaka Ya Face
|
| And if Ya Cougha ina Public,
|
| I Beata Ya to Deatha ina Alley.
|
| Poe's law disclaimer: ;-P
| zwieback wrote:
| didn't even work on my machine but upvoted for FAQ
| spdebbarma wrote:
| Give it a minute or two, after you press start. Also, try a
| different browser.
| andrewnc wrote:
| I love it. I built something similar a few days ago.
|
| https://twitter.com/andrew_n_carr/status/1237413723658055680...
| thoraway1010 wrote:
| Like it!
|
| Maybe train people not to touch their face and in higher risk
| situations (think public transit with lots of touching or bigger
| group events) add a mask as another layer of protection and a
| reminder.
| anotherevan wrote:
| This immediately reminded me of the joke about a tourist talking
| with an old Australian bushman. The original rambles on a bit,
| but the shorter version is the tourist asks if he knows any
| bushman remedies for chapped lips.
|
| "What you do, mate," replies the bushman, "Is lift up your horses
| tail, and kiss him straight on the bum."
|
| "And that fixes your chapped lips?!" exclaims the tourist.
|
| "No," replied the bushman, "But it stops you licking them."
| lanewinfield wrote:
| We made this a week ago! https://donottouchyourface.com
| fancyfredbot wrote:
| Did they look up your code because you don't know how to hide
| it and make their own cloned app for some reason?
| lanewinfield wrote:
| Nah, none of us are original--the amount of people working on
| this exact idea and execution is huge. We just got out before
| a lot of them.
|
| Plus, it's all front end, so it's not hidden!
| edjrage wrote:
| It was a joke referring to the FAQ on donttouchyaface.com
|
| > 9. I looked up your code because you don't know how to
| hide it and have made my own cloned app for some reason.
|
| > - Nobody liked you in high school, I'm sorry you had to
| find out this way.
| lanewinfield wrote:
| the joke
|
| .
|
| .
|
| .
|
| me
| andrewnc wrote:
| https://twitter.com/andrew_n_carr/status/1237413723658055680...
|
| Same...
| marcsto2 wrote:
| I guess we all had the same idea. My wife and I built
| https://www.donttouchface.com
| dmix wrote:
| Congrats, you've made the least annoying one so far!
|
| A simple beep is all we need, people. Also it seems more
| accurate than the others few linked here it seems, the face
| part is more narrowly detected, the other two went off
| whenever my hand was in the frame at all for some reason.
| This one only beeps when I actually put my hand on my face.
| (Not to be super critical of toy projects)
| lanewinfield wrote:
| We tried a lot of different strategies in--
|
| pre-made models
|
| hand and face detection separately
|
| training the algo yourself
|
| and it felt like the last one was the strongest (which is
| what we released). The one we built is as strong as the
| training you give it--it shouldn't be going off if your
| hand is at all in the frame.
| crusso wrote:
| I liked the way yours worked a little better than the dtyaface
| version. I like that yours allowed recording of samples since I
| have a three monitor setup and my laptop with camera is at a
| side angle. Your app handled side view face touching alerts
| quite well.
| lanewinfield wrote:
| biggest problem: you have to touch your face to train it! :)
| ldenoue wrote:
| I also made one using BodyPix.js see
| https://www.appblit.com/handoverface
| godelski wrote:
| This crashes for me as soon as I touch my face
| GuiA wrote:
| It's easy to trick by just having your hand anywhere in front of
| your face, even a foot away. Is this something current image
| classifier architecture could address with more data? It seems
| like it'd be hard to tell whether a hand is large and on a face,
| or small and far away from the face unless there is some sort of
| depth estimation going on (based on cues like shadows).
| maxmunzel wrote:
| Maybe, but its actually really good at not firing when you
| scratch your head, which is probably more common than casually
| waving at your webcam ;)
| lilbobbytables wrote:
| Is this a problem? Do you find yourself waving at your webcam
| much?
| [deleted]
| lkbm wrote:
| I find that my hand goes between my webcam and my face
| reasonably often.
|
| It's still a brilliant idea and I love it, regardless of its
| limitations.
| ukyrgf wrote:
| The URL of the actual app is terrifying. I was certain the site
| had been hijacked when it redirected to the most suspicious
| looking URL imaginable at the domain "drv.tw":
| https://lzdmsmujepoc2xlgp13srg-on.drv.tw/Don%27tTouchYaFace/...
| (HN shortens this, but I think the real kicker is the '.com.html'
| at the end)
| kingbirdy wrote:
| From the 3rd question of the FAQ:
|
| > Why does it open in a new tab with a different URL?
|
| > Setting up websites is hard and I got frustrated and you're
| not paying anything, so...
| ukyrgf wrote:
| I have no idea why someone would go through all this trouble
| when you can just drag and drop a folder onto Netlify or
| Zeit.
| nothrabannosir wrote:
| Because setting up websites is hard and they got
| frustrated.
| londons_explore wrote:
| drv.tw is a "Google Drive to web" proxy. It lets you stick an
| html file on google drive and have it on the internet.
|
| I'm not sure how it pays for itself - after all, every byte
| served has to go through their servers, and running a service
| like this I can imagine a lot of illicit content gets posted
| too (requiring a lot of admin time).
|
| Why not just use github/lab pages?
| ivthreadp110 wrote:
| https://teachablemachine.withgoogle.com/models/1lXY78MD/
|
| Also terrifying... I mean, it's google... after all - Pretty
| sure my android device knows when I'm touching my face when
| it's turned off.
| crusso wrote:
| Great idea. Also, after people become trained to change their
| behavior when hearing that Ralph "I'm in danger", start playing
| it periodically when people are on Twitter, Facebook, etc.
|
| The world will be a better place.
| Regardsyjc wrote:
| This is awesome. Does anyone have a tutorial they recommend for
| building something like this (preferably in Python)?
|
| https://teachablemachine.withgoogle.com is awesome and it looks
| super easy to use - but any tutorials if you wanted to learn it
| the harder way via OpenCV or Darknet?
|
| I found this tutorial from fast.ai but haven't been able to check
| it out yet: https://course.fast.ai/videos/?lesson=1
| closeparen wrote:
| This is blocked by my employer's OpenDNS profile as a security
| threat. I'd chalk it up to a false positive but I've not seen
| that happen in years. Be careful.
| spectramax wrote:
| Dr. Michael Osterholm was on Joe Rogan's podcast explaining in
| detail how this virus spreads [1]
|
| - Washing hands and not touching face is inconclusive but it
| makes sense to keep up the hygiene. That's not the primary means
| of how this virus spreads.
|
| - Virus primarily spreads via airborne means, simply by breathing
| (not even coughing or sneezing) is enough. It stays suspended in
| air (you can imagine the negligible weight of a 0.1um particle
| compared to the fluid mechanical forces from circulating air).
|
| - N95 masks (contrarily to the popular myth) are the most
| effective means of stopping the spread. Shortage of masks for
| hospital workers is an orthogonal issue.
|
| I urge everyone of you to watch this interview and to be more
| informed.
|
| [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3URhJx0NSw
| fofoni wrote:
| I've touched my face while testing the app way more than I would
| have if I weren't aware of the app at all.
| gmanley wrote:
| I'd say a big part of that is just you're more aware that your
| doing it. I bet the total count is similar.
| devin wrote:
| Maybe someone said in the comments somewhere, but it kind of
| makes me chuckle to sit here testing it by... well... touching my
| damn face.
| other_herbert wrote:
| This is cool but the downside of having a dell xps is that the
| camera is basically always looking at my hands :D... works fine
| if I'm not using the keyboard :)... or if I got up and actually
| went to my desk and that sort of thing..
| elicash wrote:
| Here's another idea:
|
| Start wearing a bracelet or something else to give yourself a
| little reminder when you are reaching for your face. I have no
| idea whether bracelets themselves are germ traps, of course.
| kevsim wrote:
| Here you go: https://immutouch.com/
| elicash wrote:
| Honestly, all I need is a string.
| pbhjpbhj wrote:
| Elastic band?
| ChuckMcM wrote:
| Of course the killer app here is to use the accelorometer in a
| fitbit or a other fitness bracelet to play the danger ring tone
| on your phone if your arm comes up to your face.
| [deleted]
___________________________________________________________________
(page generated 2020-03-11 23:00 UTC)