[HN Gopher] The theory of infectious origin of the Alzheimer's d...
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The theory of infectious origin of the Alzheimer's disease
Author : JPLeRouzic
Score : 89 points
Date : 2020-03-27 18:14 UTC (4 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (padiracinnovation.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (padiracinnovation.org)
| narrator wrote:
| This is why methylene blue probably works as an Alzheimer's
| treatment. It's an antiviral that can cross the blood brain
| barrier.
| ink_13 wrote:
| Use of methylene blue derivatives for Alzheimer's treatment has
| been definitively ruled out.[0]
|
| [0] https://www.alzforum.org/news/conference-coverage/first-
| phas...
| jjtheblunt wrote:
| Is there an article about that?
| melling wrote:
| We've gone from under $9 trillion about 15 years ago, to I'm
| guessing, $25 trillion in national debt.
|
| After this one is over, perhaps we can add a few billion for
| research into diseases like Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, pancreatic
| cancer, etc ...
|
| ...and the millions that Bill Gates asked for pandemic research 5
| years ago.
| sslayer wrote:
| Woah, slow down there copper-top, workers are disposable too.
| streptomycin wrote:
| More is good, but the NIH alone is already spending $2.8
| billion/year on Alzheimer's research https://www.alz.org/get-
| involved-now/advocate/research-fundi... and that's not
| including spending from other government agencies (both US and
| international), charities, or pharma companies.
| snazz wrote:
| Currently $23.6T: https://www.usdebtclock.org/
| melling wrote:
| Includes the $2 trillion package about to be signed?
| oDot wrote:
| There's a different clock on there for unfunded liabilities
| at $132T. If that package is unfunded, it's not even a dent
| to the overall.
| snazz wrote:
| Presumably not.
| _red wrote:
| >...and the millions that Bill Gates asked for pandemic
| research 5 years ago.
|
| I for one really regret I haven't been chipped yet from Bills
| ID2020 program. I wish it could be funded. The only people who
| could be against it are the anti-science nutters.
|
| I'm sure the EULA of the chip program will include both a
| robust privacy policy and a CoC.
| omgwtfbyobbq wrote:
| $9 trillion in 2005 dollars, right? So ~$12 trillion in 2020
| dollars? Still pretty crazy to see it double in less than two
| decades.
| anonsubmit2671 wrote:
| $23.6 trillion plus whatever else this situation will cost. I
| would guess $5-7 trillion more, at a minimum, because it will
| cost $1.2 trillion a month for shelter-in-place UBI.. and then
| however much of many trillions in loans go into default or are
| forgiven.
|
| https://usdebtclock.org
| odyssey7 wrote:
| I'm not able to access this content, but I've noticed several
| theories about specific chronic diseases being the effects of
| persistent infections that haven't been widely recognized as
| such.
|
| If any of the theories are true, it means that many research
| efforts have been unwitting attempts at turning symptomatic
| carriers into asymptomatic ones.
| cactus2093 wrote:
| If this ends up being true, does it lead to any potential
| lifestyle changes or medical interventions that could help lower
| one's risk of Alzheimer's? Are these infections measurable and
| curable with antibiotics or something, and we just don't bother
| doing it because there are no noticeable short-term effects?
| nextos wrote:
| Most autoimmune disorders are either infections or gut dysbiosis,
| which is actually pretty close to an infection too.
|
| It's sad the establishment is taking so long to accept this.
| There are papers in Nature / Science showing really strong
| evidence for some autoimmune disorders.
|
| See this previous thread for an extended discussion:
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21917884
| JamesBarney wrote:
| The establishment(God I hate that word) all pretty much agree
| that the majority of autoimmune diseases are a self
| misclassification.
|
| The establishment also believes that gut dysbiosis and
| infections can trigger or play a role in this misclassification
| too.
|
| The problem is that a lot of enthusiasts believe this insight
| is a lot more beneficial than it is.
| eternalny1 wrote:
| > The establishment(God I hate that word) all pretty much
| agree that the majority of autoimmune diseases are a self
| misclassification.
|
| Certainly not the majority, there are a lot of very severe
| auto-immune diseases that are very real.
|
| I had my immune system attack my thyroid gland 30 years ago
| (Graves Disease) and had to have it ablated completely with
| radioactive Iodine 131. My TSH was 0.00.
|
| I was skinny, angry, and losing my mind prior to being
| diagnosed.
|
| After stabilizing me (I just have to take Synthroid for the
| rest of my life), everything is normal again.
| [deleted]
| James_Henry wrote:
| Have the establishment really been pushing against these ideas
| that hard? Molecular mimicry seems to be a rather old idea, but
| I'm thinking that the push back is maybe more about what to do
| with this idea treatment wise. You've definitely done more
| research and reading in this area, so perhaps you could expound
| on how the establishment is being slow?
| treeman79 wrote:
| Extremely hard.
|
| I was given a preliminary diagnosis for an auto immune
| (Sjogrens) because among other weird symptoms I put down that
| antibiotics would resolve symptoms for several weeks.
|
| Doctor had noticed that people with Sjogrens often did better
| on antibiotics. He informed to find a rhumotogist that
| understood this.
|
| I can't find any locally, and mentioning it gets me
| dismissed.
|
| They have been taught that it's nonsense and they refuse to
| listen.
|
| Bringing in research just annoys them.
| phnofive wrote:
| First time I've heard of someone else with this experience
| - do your symptoms fluctuate with infections as well?
| JamesBarney wrote:
| Mind linking to the research between Sjogrens and
| antibiotics?
| snapetom wrote:
| For Alzheimer's, yes, they have pushed hard.
|
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21911225
|
| TFA looks at one researcher who was looking at antivirals.
| She has constantly gotten papers rejected and turned down for
| funding.
| bitwize wrote:
| Dr. Hackernews: Whatever it is, the underlying cause is
| inflammation or gut bacteria. And the cure is fasting.
| clumsysmurf wrote:
| > Preclinical data have indicated that microorganisms associated
| with periodontal disease may contribute to the pathology of
| Alzheimer's disease.
|
| I read damage to the nasal epithelium can allow pathogens to
| reach the brain:
|
| "New research from Griffith University has shown that damage to
| the lining inside the nose increases the risk of bacteria
| sneaking into the brain via nerves, potentially causing long-term
| health issues." ... "Bacteria and viruses, and resultant
| neuroinflammation, may even contribute to neurodegenerative
| disorders, such as Alzheimer's and Parkinson's diseases"
|
| https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-03-injury-nose-bacteria-...
| anonAndOn wrote:
| Although rare, amoebas found in untreated water can cause fatal
| brain infections if they get in your nasal passage[0], via
| neti-pots or swimming, for example.
|
| [0]
| https://www.ijidonline.com/article/S1201-9712(18)34525-9/pdf
| jonny_eh wrote:
| Sounds like we shouldn't be blowing our nose, shooting more
| bacteria than in necessary into our nasal cavities.
| e40 wrote:
| I wonder if that means people with seasonal allergies are more
| likely to have these diseases.
| drusepth wrote:
| Also people that chronically pick their nose.
| loco5niner wrote:
| Likely not unless they make it 3 inches in:
|
| > "The olfactory epithelium is a specialized epithelial
| tissue inside the nasal cavity that is involved in smell.
| In humans, it measures 9 cm2 (3 centimetres by 3
| centimetres) and lies on the roof of the nasal cavity about
| 7 cm above and behind the nostrils."
| onionionion wrote:
| Phew, that's a relief
| zackees wrote:
| The original article has been removed, but you can still find the
| archived version here:
|
| https://web.archive.org/web/20200327181753/https://padiracin...
|
| Full text:
|
| The theory of infectious origin of the Alzheimer's disease The
| hypothesis that Alzheimer's disease has an infectious origin, has
| a long and controversial history. The data at the origin of this
| hypothesis are contradictory and mainly associative in nature,
| without it being possible to demonstrate a causal link. Interest
| in this theory has been renewed, however, by several recently
| published observations. In the section Viewpoint de la revue
| Nature Reviews Neurology, Ben Readhead, a researcher at the
| Biodesign Institute's ASU-Banner Center for Research on
| Neurodegenerative Diseases, joined several distinguished
| colleagues to discuss the idea that bacteria, viruses or other
| infectious pathogens can play a role in Alzheimer's disease.
|
| First, it has been shown that the amyloid b can act as an
| antimicrobial peptide and that selected microorganisms can seed
| the deposition of Ab in mouse models.
|
| Second, genetic data has rekindled interest in the role of
| herpesviruses, in particular the human Herpes 6 virus (HHV6), in
| Alzheimer's disease.
|
| Third, the epidemiological data from Taiwan suggests that
| antiherpetic drugs reduce the risk of dementia.
|
| Preclinical data have indicated that microorganisms associated
| with periodontal disease may contribute to the pathology of
| Alzheimer's disease.
|
| Finally, genetic, pathological and modeling studies of
| Alzheimer's disease have shown that the immune system plays an
| important role in Alzheimer's disease.
|
| A hypothesis that has never been favored by researchers This
| hypothesis may have been rejected too quickly. For example,
| microorganisms do not only cause acute illnesses, in fact certain
| microorganisms can hide in the body for decades in latent form,
| causing damage intermittently or after long periods of silence.
|
| In addition, being infected does not necessarily mean being
| symptomatic. For example, out of the millions of people infected
| with Mycobacterium tuberculosis, only about a tenth of them will
| develop tuberculosis. Likewise, most people infected with HSV1 do
| not develop cold sores so it is possible that asymptomatic
| carriers of this virus were often mistakenly included in the
| control groups. It should also be noted that many viruses of the
| Herpes family (HSV1, HSV2, VZV) live preferentially in neurons.
|
| A role for an infectious agent - in particular the herpes simplex
| 1 virus (HSV1) - in Alzheimer's disease (Alzheimer's disease) was
| proposed about 30 years ago based discovery of HSV1 DNA in the
| brain tissue of a large proportion of the elderly, followed by
| evidence that e the virus confers a high risk of disease to
| carriers of the e4 allele of the gene apolipoprotein E (APOE *
| e4).
|
| Shortly after the detection of HSV1 DNA, two different species of
| bacteria, Borrelia burgdorferi and Chlamydia pneumoniae, were
| implicated in Alzheimer's disease, and a third species,
| Porphyromonas gingivalis, was recently added to the list.
|
| Doubts remain, however Nevertheless, it is known that an acute
| end-of-life infection, such as pneumonia, can cause a dramatic
| increase in the amount of microorganisms in the brain. They will
| then be detected post-mortem but that does not mean that these
| microorganisms are at the origin of the Alzheimer's disease. In
| addition, the issue of reverse causation is never really
| addressed: For example, clinical Alzheimer's disease can lead to
| poor dental hygiene and, therefore, damage to the oral
| microbiome.
|
| Indeed, there are many challenges to prove the theory of
| microbial origin of Alzheimer's disease. A potential challenge is
| that each drug has a relatively narrow spectrum of antimicrobial
| activity. However, since a large number of microorganisms have
| been associated with Alzheimer's disease by a range of
| researchers, it would be difficult to interpret what a negative
| result in a clinical trial would mean, which would necessarily
| use a specific antimicrobial.
|
| Another problem is the duration of the disease. We know that the
| underlying pathology of Alzheimer's disease begins 20 years or
| more before the onset of symptoms. So, how to prove that an
| infectious process that occurred decades before the onset of
| symptoms, really contributed to the disease process?
|
| One may also wonder why bacteria or viruses would escape the
| innate innate immune defense mechanisms, which are responsible
| for protecting the brain against such an invasion.
| untilHellbanned wrote:
| Aging and infectious agents are both environmental insults. The
| cell doesn't care so much about the difference. Result is the
| same.
| James_Henry wrote:
| What exactly do you mean by this?
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