[HN Gopher] Picture Hanging Knot (2017)
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Picture Hanging Knot (2017)
Author : polm23
Score : 116 points
Date : 2020-05-22 09:35 UTC (13 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (blog.ukpictureframingsupplies.co.uk)
(TXT) w3m dump (blog.ukpictureframingsupplies.co.uk)
| johnatwork wrote:
| I've always used a twisted wire, or Ashley's bend
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashley%27s_bend
| [deleted]
| pathartl wrote:
| Parents were photographers for ~40 years and I've framed
| countless pieces.
|
| We always just used wire.
| [deleted]
| tiborsaas wrote:
| Knot related:
| https://media.giphy.com/media/SwgCIQuqu7ay3exAVe/giphy.gif
|
| I've seen it in a FB math group with the text: Applications of
| knot theory :)
| an_ko wrote:
| I watched it 5 times and can't figure it out. Explain to me
| this sorcery.
| skosch wrote:
| Perhaps you find the reversed gif helpful:
| https://imgur.com/a/hwzePnS
| thinkingkong wrote:
| What? No. A reef knot will never pull apart under tension and
| allows you to have a flat knot with a loop. Its also way easier
| to tie and you could make multiple passes if you want.
| regularfry wrote:
| This knot traps the two lengths together. If you just use a
| reef knot, a) you'll have more slack, because there's no pulley
| mechanism to take advantage of to tighten the string, and b)
| it's easy to accidentally hang the picture by only one of the
| lines, so the slack has twice the effect, and the picture hangs
| lower than it otherwise would.
| lkjasdfasdf wrote:
| this isn't just bad advice, it's dangerous. i wouldn't want to
| drive behind somebody that tied down an external load with only
| reef knots.
| baggy_trough wrote:
| Step 6 is a doozy.
| Wistar wrote:
| Close-up photos sure would help me see the details better,
| particularly whether the cord is passing over or under.
|
| For any heavy or large art I tend to use a french cleat(s):
|
| https://www.govart.com/cleat-flare-10-inch-pair.aspx
| alexpotato wrote:
| I started using a taught line hitch with cotton cord for hanging
| pictures.
|
| The taut line hitch makes it easy to adjust the height without
| moving the nail and the cotton cord helps keep the taut line
| hitch from slipping (vs says monofilament).
| japhyr wrote:
| The taut line hitch is a great knot to know for lots of
| situations; once you learn it, you'll find yourself using it in
| a number of different ways. It's great for adding guy lines to
| a tent fly, or hanging a tarp in the woods for camping. I've
| used it to tie small gifts together at the holidays.
| mirimir wrote:
| Indeed. And with an alpine butterfly loop, you have basically
| tackle. So it's great for tying stuff, because tightening
| doesn't require retying.
| freedomben wrote:
| Agree, the taut line hitch is amazing and an excellent knot
| to know. I also love the "trucker's hitch." I often use the
| truckers hitch in situations where having easy control over
| the tightness with minimal risk of slippage is my goal. If I
| need to adjust it much then taut line hitch is preferred,
| otherwise I truckers hitch is my favorite knot (and seems
| magical the first few times you use it).
| PuffinBlue wrote:
| I like the Farrimond Friction Hitch[0] for this.
|
| It's essentially a quick release Prussik tied with the
| working end.
|
| You can use a toggle, or slip a second bight through the
| first to prevent accidental untying.
|
| Big benefit is that it is faster to tie in longer lengths of
| cord and it's faster to undo, being quick release.
|
| [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Farrimond_friction_hitch
| ChuckMcM wrote:
| Agreed, any "knot explainer" that includes the step " _Tie a
| few 'granny knot' L over R, then R over L to secure the
| underlying knot_ " immediately disqualifies it as an actual
| knot.
|
| The taughtline hitch is a much better knot for this.
|
| I never could master the trucker's hitch[1] though :-)
|
| [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUHgGK-tImY
| tgb wrote:
| But doesn't alternating L over R then R over L make it
| actually a square knot? That's pretty classically an "actual"
| knot, albeit poorly described in this case.
| burmer wrote:
| I don't think so, they're just repeating half hitches for
| stability. This is very commonplace. I've never seen a
| reason to alternate the direction of the half hitches
| though.
| dugmartin wrote:
| Knots have always fascinated me. I keep "The Morrow Guide to
| Knots" handy to look at when I'm bored and I think mentally tying
| the knots is as much (or even more) fun than physically doing it.
|
| If you are interested here is a non-affilate link:
|
| https://www.amazon.com/Morrow-Guide-Knots-Sailing-Climbing/d...
| mirimir wrote:
| Huh. Me, I've always used soft iron twisted wire.
| etaioinshrdlu wrote:
| Alright, I really don't get this. Where does the final nail go?
| Is there anything that prevents the picture from becoming un-
| level? Is there a tiny hole for the nail?
| raziel2p wrote:
| The nail goes in the wall, then you put the string over the
| nail. You can move the frame left and right on the nail to make
| it level. You can also have more than one nail for more
| stability, in which case you just use a level to make them
| straight.
| etaioinshrdlu wrote:
| So it seems like this project is quite literally, how to tie
| a very tight cord between the edges of the frame.
| emerongi wrote:
| Yes. And your comment is quite literally just words in a
| specific order.
| londons_explore wrote:
| If this were a taught unstretchable string, the tension in the
| string ends up _infinite_ and the compression in the picture
| frame also _infinite_.
|
| Obviously the string has a little stretch, but even so, the
| tension in the string is proportional to 1/sin(angle), which for
| very small angles makes very large amounts of tension, which will
| eventually bend or warp the frame.
|
| Instead, you should deliberately leave a reasonable amount of
| slack, and the tension in the string will then stay under 3x the
| frames weight, which it will be able to handle forever.
| baldeagle wrote:
| The answer is a bowline or sheet bend (same knot). They show how
| to do it with pictures.
| p0llard wrote:
| It depends what material you're tying. For twine, sure; if
| you're hanging a 30 kg artwork you probably want to use steel
| wire, and pretty much any kind of knot is unsuitable here.
| lmilcin wrote:
| As an amateur sailor I beg to differ.
|
| First, you can tie knots with steel wire, too.
|
| Second, I would be much more comfortable hanging artwork on a
| thin twine than on steel wire. Steel wire tends to be sharp
| and scratch and punch holes in anything it gets into contact
| with. Rope that will be durable and can withstand the stress
| of hanging 30kg artwork is still very thin. Just google it
| and be surprised. (https://www.ingersollrand.com/pt-
| la/lifting-equipment-materi...)
| semi-extrinsic wrote:
| Rubbish. Stuff like e.g. boats in the multi-tonne weight
| class are secured by tying knots every day. Spearfishers.
| Mountain climbers. I could go on.
|
| Get some 2 mm Dyneema rope, which has an average breaking
| strength of 300 kg, run it through some D-rings and tie it
| with an Alpine Butterfly. You will be able to do pullups off
| that artwork if you want.
| throwaway0a5e wrote:
| >Rubbish. Stuff like e.g. boats in the multi-tonne weight
| class are secured by tying knots every day. Spearfishers.
| Mountain climbers. I could go on.
|
| Oil rigs are towed to location using steel cables. Steel
| wire rope is substantially stronger for its weight and for
| it size but generally harder to work with than plastic
| things of similar capacity. Both materials can hang
| pictures just fine. It's not exactly a dynamic load. People
| will argue over anything.
| japanuspus wrote:
| Steel cables are at high risk of corrosion in off-shore
| environments and are rarely used. Tug operations will use
| simple synthetic cables (spectra, dynema).
|
| Platform anchoring cables are often a rather complex
| combination of synthetic cables and weights to obtain
| neutral buoyancy.
| twanvl wrote:
| > Steel wire rope is substantially stronger for its
| weight and for it size but generally harder to work with
| than plastic things of similar capacity.
|
| That is not true. The tensile strength of kevlar and
| dynema is higher than that of steel, while they have a
| density that is several times lower.
| abakker wrote:
| This all depends on what you're hanging. If hanging art
| worth more than $100, use steel cable. Museums and
| galleries all use steel cable because it is easier and
| nicer to work with. dyneema is strong, but not chemically
| stable and will degrade over time with exposure to
| atmosphere and light (though obviously there isn't a lot of
| light behind a piece of art on the wall).
| semi-extrinsic wrote:
| I agree that it's easier to work with - you don't need to
| know any knots, just twist it and it stays. So that's a
| definite benefit.
|
| But when it comes to UV and chemical resistance, I don't
| see how one would get any degradation in a museum
| setting. Dyneema is used in heavy industrial applications
| like mooring lines and tugboats for very large ships with
| lifespans over ten years. Unless you're hanging up
| something that you're not taking down for a century, it
| shouldn't be a worry.
| freedomben wrote:
| Neat, thanks for introducing me to Dyneema rope. I just
| ordered some. I suspect it will come in really handy.
| benjohnson wrote:
| It's also has a huge benefit for towing or wrenching over
| steel cable - there's virtually no recoil if it breaks.
|
| Steel cable will slice people in half and send wrenches
| through car windows and to stab the driver when it
| breaks.
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(page generated 2020-05-22 23:01 UTC)