[HN Gopher] Tuxedo Book BA15: AMD-only and Linux-preinstalled la...
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Tuxedo Book BA15: AMD-only and Linux-preinstalled laptop
Author : jrepinc
Score : 250 points
Date : 2020-05-24 11:32 UTC (11 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.tuxedocomputers.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.tuxedocomputers.com)
| Already__Taken wrote:
| Isn't only 1 stick of RAM leaving a lot of perf on the table with
| these APU's not having dual channels?
| Pmop wrote:
| I just wish laptop designers would stop copying Macbook form
| factor.
| Awelton wrote:
| I'm with you. I don't want a knockoff macbook, I want a
| modernized T420 thinkpad with a huge battery and a good
| keyboard.
| throwaway743 wrote:
| For $100 more you could get a laptop with a solid gpu and dual
| boot it.
| baybal2 wrote:
| I very much suspect this is a relabeled Qinghua Tongfang machine.
|
| Almost all OEM laptops with 4 __* Ryzens are made by them.
| jacek wrote:
| This is a rebranded laptop from an ODM [1]. It is also available
| from Schenker [2] and was reviewed by the Notebookcheck [3]. It
| looks really good, but I would love a few things to be
| fixed/updated: better 16:10 screen, Ryzen 4000, more USB-C ports,
| USB-C charging and dual-channel memory.
|
| ___________
|
| [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Original_design_manufacturer
|
| [2] https://www.schenker-tech.de/en/schenker-via-15-en
|
| [3] https://www.notebookcheck.net/Schenker-VIA-15-Laptop-
| Review-...
| kova12 wrote:
| I noticed single-channel memory and was about to bring it up.
| Unbelievable that a supposedly high-end laptop's RAM operates
| on single channel. But no USB-C charging I didn't notice, and
| that really is the deal breaker. Wtf Tuxedo
| I_am_tiberius wrote:
| I noticed that system 76 uses the same models as Schenker and
| Tuxedo.
| bcrosby95 wrote:
| Last I looked System76 gets their laptops from Clevo. Not
| sure if Schenker does the same.
| scns wrote:
| They are from clevo
| baybal2 wrote:
| I doubt, Clevo has no 4 __* Ryzens yet
| simlevesque wrote:
| All of the System76 laptops only have Intel processors.
|
| https://system76.com/laptops
|
| I wish System76 had ryzen 4000 and an amd GPU...
| lhl wrote:
| This laptop is a Tongfang chassis and it's basically the
| same laptop as the Schenker Via 15. Someone already
| linked to the comprehensive Notebookcheck review, but
| here's a review of how the Schenker plays out of the box
| with Linux: https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/commen
| ts/fmzch5/schen...
|
| Note, the internals are similar to the 14" (Walmart)
| Motile M142s that have been selling for as low as $300
| since last winter. There's a 4000H refresh of the 14"
| being released next month as well (Mechrevo S2 Air), see
| my previous post for links to the details.
| chrismorgan wrote:
| What are the keyboards like on these things? My previous
| laptop (bought May 2014) was Clevo1 (Horize W550SU-1), and
| its keyboard was OK but not great at the start, poor within
| one year (lost _all_ crispness of feel) and close to
| unusable (spongy all over, activation issues in a few of
| the most commonly typed keys and especially the space key)
| within two.
|
| Now I have a Surface Book, whose keyboard _feels_ great,
| but it has two major problems: 1 a modal Fn key (where
| tapping it, which happens _all the time_ by accident,
| toggles its mode); and 2 its matrix is awful: typing at
| full speed, it likes to _drop and transpose letters_ in
| some words (e.g. "mouse" may come out as "moes" or "moeu"!)
| because it can't handle even 3-key rollover properly.
|
| For my next laptop I'd consider a Clevo build because they
| do tend to check the boxes nicely in most regards (e.g.
| https://www.metabox.com.au/store/b249/Metabox-Multimedia-
| Pho... looks _great_ on paper: AU$2,000 for 15'' with 4K
| IPS and other good specs; touch /pen support is the only
| thing I would expect to miss), but unless I have reason to
| expect the keyboard is better than the one I experienced,
| I'm leery.
|
| --
|
| 1 At the time I was price-sensitive but wanted a decent
| screen, my first laptop having been a second-hand HP 6710b
| with a 1680x1050 screen; I was not willing to accept
| 1366x768. For a 1920x1080 IPS panel, the cheapest brand-
| name option was around AU$1,400, but a Clevo one at
| AU$1,000 had better specs all round save for using
| integrated graphics rather than a dedicated graphics card,
| which was plus for me as I didn't need dedicated and would
| prefer to save the battery life, weight and bulk.
| lhl wrote:
| Just as an FYI, the 4000 series refresh is being released in
| China by Mechrevo (CODE 01) next month:
| https://www.weibo.com/5057286913/J2CoFhyLu
|
| It has dual channel memory and USB-C PD and is running H series
| processors with a 54W TDP.
| analognoise wrote:
| Why not just buy it directly?
|
| I mean let's cut these crappy Linux shops out as middlemen.
| lhl wrote:
| Clevo and Tongfang are the ODMs for most of these white
| label laptops. I assume minimum orders are in the hundreds
| if not thousands of units, which is the main reason not to
| buy direct. That and you'll have no warranty or other
| support, have to do your own customs, etc etc.
| twotwotwo wrote:
| FWIW, early signs are Linux worked well on at least one 4700U
| thin-and-light (after upgrading the kernel for support for the
| iGPU):
| https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=ryzen7-4...
|
| One 4700H(S) machine with a dGPU (and other parts without
| drivers) did not do so well:
| https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2020/04/linux-on-laptops-asu...
|
| Some of the 4700U laptops perform better than you'd think from
| the nominal 15W TDP. Partly just to be expected from the spec
| (still >4GHz single-core boost and 8C), and also seems most of
| these run at a 25W TDP-up when plugged in (often noisily so,
| under load).
|
| Would be nice to see these put into better designs; right now
| I'm mostly seeing 14-inch 1080p machines. Previous gens of AMD
| chips had the same issue, but it's especially annoying when, in
| terms of performance, battery life, and weight, you can see the
| elements for a great laptop are there.
| slaw wrote:
| In US 14 inch version was rebranded as Walmart Motile M142. It
| was on sale for $299.
| drewg123 wrote:
| And an eraser stick with the option to disable the trackpad in
| the BIOS. This is what keeps me coming back to Lenovo.
|
| EDIT: This is not intended as a shameless plug for Lenovo, I
| just have so many false touches with trackpads, and I wish
| eraser sticks were more common, outside of a diminishing
| percent of Lenovo and a small percent of Dells.
| xur17 wrote:
| > And an eraser stick with the option to disable the trackpad
| in the BIOS.
|
| I used to love these, but with my last 2 X1 Carbons from
| Lenovo, I could not get the mouse to move fast enough in
| Ubuntu, even with all settings maxed out. I've since moved
| back to using trackpads.
| numpad0 wrote:
| I think I've read or heard Panasonic rep say a rectangular
| trackpad is Windows 8 requirement from Microsoft, Lenovo also
| added trackpad and Windows Logo Key(miTian ) right when they
| inherited ThinkPad from IBM. So I'm sure there are more
| design requirements to Windows than publicly discussed, and
| IBM was exempt from some of it for historical reasons that
| Lenovo isn't.
|
| With trackpad being a requirement, rationale for having
| redundant pointing device is weak I imagine.
| hojjat12000 wrote:
| I think you are using the phrase "shameless plug"
| incorrectly. "shameless plug" is normally used to advertise
| _your own_ merchandize. For example, a Youtuber talking about
| his/her other Youtube channel shamelessly. However, in your
| comment I think you meant to say "a dig" instead of
| "shameless plug". "This is not intended as a dig on
| Lenovo...", or "I'm not trying to pick on Lenovo..." cheers
| lonelappde wrote:
| You've got it backwards.
| nmstoker wrote:
| Well spotted. However technically they are correct, it is
| not a shameless plug!
| drewg123 wrote:
| What I'm saying is that, because I need an eraser stick, I
| can only consider Lenovo (and some Dells). And I wish I had
| more options.
| silon42 wrote:
| Some HPs (Elitebook) also have (had?) one.
| frxx wrote:
| ZBooks usually feature them. I've got two of them now,
| they both have it. Personally I still prefer the feel of
| the Thinkpad ones.
| smacktoward wrote:
| I'm in exactly the same boat. TrackPoint 4 life, yo.
|
| What's extra weird is that the first TrackPoint laptops
| appeared more than 20 years ago, so any IBM/Lenovo
| patents on the technology must have expired by now...
| tyingq wrote:
| Schenker is also a bit less expensive at EUR829 vs EUR859 for
| the Tuxedo.
| analognoise wrote:
| I stopped buying Linux only computers after buying a System76.
| I'll never make that mistake again.
| mikelward wrote:
| Looks great. Hope they have a Ryzen 4000 model soon.
|
| They say their US keyboard is ISO (tall Enter), not ANSI (wide
| Enter). Hopefully that's just a typo. Emailed them to ask.
|
| https://support.getfreewrite.com/article/44-freewrites-physi...
| XelNika wrote:
| It is probably not a typo, they are aware of the difference.
| Just read their support page. [0]
|
| > Unless otherwise stated, TUXEDO always uses ISO standard
| keyboards. Other standards, such as ANSI, are available
| depending on the model, but are also marked as such.
|
| Browsing from the EU, I am not seeing an ANSI option on the
| linked 15" or either of the 14" models. It seems they're not
| capitalising on the enthusiast developer segment.
|
| [0] https://www.tuxedocomputers.com/en/Infos/Help-
| Support/Freque...
| AmosLightnin wrote:
| I purchased a Tuxedo laptop last summmer in order to support
| Linux only hardware vendors, but sadly it's been one of the worst
| computers - with the worst customer service - I've ever used.
| Sending it back for repairs doesn't help - they ignore the issues
| and fail to resolve them. At one point I didn't get a response
| for weeks. I'm not sure how their trustpilot score recently
| improved from fair / bad to great, but I'm suspicious that they
| could make such a turnaround so quickly. Read the bad reviews and
| they're quite consistent.
| https://au.trustpilot.com/review/tuxedocomputers.com
| perlgeek wrote:
| I too had problems with their hardware and awful customer
| support experience, including a several weeks radio silence (a
| call to their hotline didn't help; in a second call I asked for
| the responsible manager, which resulted in me getting a status
| update a day later -- but still no resolution to my issues).
|
| Avoid them like COVID-19.
| neltnerb wrote:
| Thanks, I really appreciate the review. It looked good but a
| little pricey to me, I noticed Acer and others have ryzen 3 and
| 5 laptops now so I think there are a lot of options.
|
| I'm skeptical that the market for users who want Linux
| preinstalled is significant... is it easy enough now to use
| that installing it is hard in comparison? I feel like if you
| can use it you can probably install it fine if pointed at a
| distro. Maybe a link to Rufus to write the USB boot disk.
| mcpeepants wrote:
| I agree that there is probably a limited market for
| preinstalled Linux. Perhaps it's an option for folks who
| want/need Linux and don't want to deal with any of the
| complications that often exist for desktop use. I figure part
| of the allure is also that the machine is then inherently
| optimally compatible with Linux to begin with. I'm not sure
| how much that matters in practice these days though since
| there seems to be very few commonly used components that have
| poor support.
| neltnerb wrote:
| True, I suppose some mismatched or buggy hardware is a
| bigger issue in laptops. Like it's a pretty big problem if
| the wifi driver on my laptop is buggy in Linux, though
| nowadays that likely means it's buggy in Windows anyway.
|
| The last laptop I purchased would literally BSOD only when
| connected to certain manufacturer (Cisco) access points
| under unclear conditions. It was a known bug. HP never
| bothered to release an installable patch and the one
| provided by Intel made the computer unbootable.
|
| But I suppose there's likely still a market for people
| buying enough computers at a time that the risk of a
| hardware issue is not worth the premium.
| jeena wrote:
| I'm buying laptops with preinstalled Linux and then I purge
| it and install Arch Linux on it. But then I'm at least sure
| that there are drivers for all of the hardware build in
| there somewhere and I can install them and use everything
| build in. Also I'm hoping to vote for Linux support with my
| (or my employers) wallet.
| Moru wrote:
| The common reason to buy a computer preinstalled with linux
| is to not pay the windows/ios tax. Not that the price would
| be different though.
| CountSessine wrote:
| Yeah - there's that too. I need to run Windows in a VM
| anyways for some specialized tasks, so having the Windows
| license is useful.
| usr1106 wrote:
| The sad fact is that the Microsoft tax is cheaper than the
| extra costs niche manufacturers need to charge because by
| nature they have worse economics of scale.
| dkersten wrote:
| For me it's more about making sure the hardware support is
| good.
| DyslexicAtheist wrote:
| I second this. Bought a notebook from them in 2016 and it was
| one of the worst purchases. The fan last around 8-12 months
| before it craps out. (went through 3 so far) The power supply
| is fragile, and I had to solder it several times already. The
| support ... well I asked them about when they would ship a bios
| update for some common vulns - first I got denials that these
| (Intel ME) vulns "aren't an issue" because you need physical
| access to the machine. Once the news about the vulns hit
| mainstream media they promised to email me with updates about
| their latest updates. After most my colleagues machines from
| other vendors had been patched after few months but they still
| had not shipped any fix. After 1 year of back and forth and
| empty promises about "stay tuned" or "please check our website
| for updates" I eventually told them to get f'ed.
|
| It seems the people who work there also have little love for
| the community they serve. They use the FOSS/Freedom type of
| branding to sell into a niche of gullible enthusiasts (like
| myself) who believe that supporting such companies makes a
| difference. The prices don't justify the product. You're better
| off building your own system from scratch or buying a more
| commonly available brand for 30% less of the price. It's not
| like they invest some of the money back into developing
| replacements for proprietary binary blobs or open hardware or
| any of these things. You want to stay away from this company
| and the rubbish they're peddling!
| nlstitch wrote:
| Same here, the fans are awfull and have very limited
| lifespan.
| hanklazard wrote:
| Hmm, these are disappointing reviews ... specs and price look
| quite good.
|
| I really want a company like this to succeed with Linux first
| laptops! Maybe System76 is closer to making it happen? I have
| really enjoyed pop!_os, so I'm considering one of their
| machines for my next laptop.
| zeus_hammer wrote:
| I have a System76 laptop, a Gazelle 17-inch. See [0] for
| exact specs.
|
| pop_os! has been fantastic, though it has some ways to go,
| particularly in the power management department. Overall,
| the biggest drawback is definitely the battery life. If you
| look around for System76 laptop reviews you'll see that
| battery life is a consistent issue. I'm able to get ~1.5-2
| hours on integrated graphics, about 45 minutes using Nvidia
| graphics.
|
| At first I thought it was just the battery/device itself,
| (the device is largely is a rebranded Clevo laptop with
| System76's firmware and other custom parts), so I installed
| Windows on the machine to see what kind of battery life I'd
| get under that. Windows was able to get ~6 hours with the
| same workflow (mostly browsing, streaming, email) and ~4
| hours with the Nvidia graphics.
|
| [0]: https://system76.com/guides/gaze14/17b
| rashkov wrote:
| Anecdata, but I had a Dell xps 15 with discrete nvidia
| graphics. Similar numbers to yours. For my next laptop I
| got a Thinkpad X390 and this little 13" laptop gets about
| 4-6 hours on linux, without any tweaking.
| vbezhenar wrote:
| They claim up to 17.6 hours in tech specs. Did you check
| your workflow with Windows? 4-6 hours is nice, but if you
| could get full work day with Windows, it doesn't look
| that impressive.
| nullify88 wrote:
| I guess that is the default experience with no tweaks?
| Any success with TLP?
| ngold wrote:
| That is pretty drastic. What's the culprit for such a
| massive difference?
| toyg wrote:
| Linux power management has always been terrible. It's a
| server OS, all the big players develop for server first,
| and PM on laptops is an obscure and unsexy corner of the
| ecosystem.
|
| TBH it's not even a Linux issue as much as a FOSS issue,
| pretty much any alternative ecosystem has the same
| problems.
| [deleted]
| ekianjo wrote:
| On Lenovo thinkpads like the x1 carbon I am able to get
| to get 4 to 5 hours of battery life on a charge. Not bad
| at all.
| TazeTSchnitzel wrote:
| Is "Tuxedo" a brand applied to whitelabel laptops? If so, they
| may have no control over hardware issues, and you might be able
| to get the same laptop at a better price / with better support
| elsewhere.
| daxhuiberts wrote:
| I was looking to buy a laptop from Tuxedo Computers, but I've
| read the same customer service experience from other people.
| Their positive trustpilot reviews are mostly generic short and
| always 2 days apart, which seems like fake reviews to me.
| bmn__ wrote:
| I am sad that choice in Linux laptops is greatly diminished
| compared to six, seven years ago. Hackers, recommend some other
| vendors in Eurozone because Tuxedo leaves me barely satisfied.
|
| Bought a laptop from them in 2017, it shipped out eight days
| after ordering.
|
| The good: Great value for the cost, all components properly
| supported with drivers.
|
| The bad: The product photos on the shop site tell a selective
| truth. I have some gripes with the hardware design that I only
| noticed after unpacking and using the device.
|
| 1. ||\\ keys are positioned unergonomically. On keyboards in
| Acer and Sony laptops they are in a much better place.
|
| 2. One rubber foot is attached to the rechargeable battery. If
| you take it out to conserve product life, the device will
| wobble considerably. The battery is also very difficult to
| remove. In an Acer or Sony laptop one unlocks a grasp and pulls
| it off the back-side, this can be done blind and with one hand
| and with the device oriented for normal operation.
|
| In the Tuxedo, one has to turn over the device because the
| rechargeable battery lifts out of the bottom. One has to risk
| breaking off a finger nail each time to get some leverage. At
| the same time, one hand lifts it out, and the other hand holds
| open the grasp, otherwise it snaps shut again, and one can't
| help but apply some pressure into the opposite direction.
| That's fucking retarded. What was the responsible engineer
| thinking?
|
| 3. The power supply pack is huge and heavy.
|
| 4. After powering up, the device always starts out with
| keyboard backlight switched on. There is no BIOS option to
| permanently disable it, one always has to wait until the OS is
| sufficiently loaded to switch it off.
| vbezhenar wrote:
| I suggest you to look at a 3-5 year old business models from
| trusted vendors (whoever you like, Dell, HP, etc) and check
| out their hardware and whether it's compatible with Linux.
| They usually have good enough build quality and unless
| there's some incompatible piece of hardware, things are
| likely to work.
|
| There are mobile workstation lines with awesome hardware
| (like Xeon, ECC, Quadro) which support Linux officially. If
| you have extra money to spend, you might want to check them
| out as well. Every major brand has those. They usually are
| bulky and not that mobile, but they are powerful.
| lhl wrote:
| You can check out Slimbook (ES based) which has some nice
| Clevo ultrabook models (Intel-only). For those in the US, IMO
| System76 seems to be providing the most value add from the
| Linux system vendors these days.
| jeena wrote:
| Damn I had kind of the same, also the worst computer I ever
| bought after having done research for a long time to get a
| Linux computer. I send it back two times and they fixed the
| Bluetooth and audio two times and then it broke again. And the
| glue under the plastic bezel around the screen started
| dissolving, I lost most of the screws and then I think it
| started overheating and switching itself off in both Windows
| and Linux. I payed about 1000 EUR for it and after 1.5 years
| later I had to buy something else.
| aae42 wrote:
| now with 16:10 and ryzen 4000 series
| forty wrote:
| How are you supposed to plug 2 screens? Graphic card description
| says it should be possible, but there is only one HDMI port for
| video output
| gvjddbnvdrbv wrote:
| USB-C?
| LeoPanthera wrote:
| The USB-C ports do not support DisplayPort.
| neogodless wrote:
| Yeah that's a good question. The integrated video card
| supporting it isn't going to matter without ports. The USB
| Type-C port specifies that it does not support DisplayPort.
| nlstitch wrote:
| I bought a tuxedo laptop for my work but the experience has been
| very bad. I WOULD NOT recommend them.
|
| They overturned the screws of the cooling fans with the cooling
| upgrade I ordered, and ordering spareparts is a hassle (Takes
| very long, sending constant reminders and getting sarcastic
| responses).
|
| Tried to be smart guy and support FOSS suppliers in the process,
| but now I get laughed at at work for having the most ghetto
| laptop in the office.
| tontonius wrote:
| 2020 might be The Year of the linux desktop
| analognoise wrote:
| The year of the Linux Desktop will be when Microsoft offers
| transparent support for it with WSL.
| rolph wrote:
| >ATTENTION: To use our store you have to activate JavaScript and
| deactivate script blockers! Thank you for your understanding! <
|
| too bad i thought it would be a good place but not from this
| angle
| illuminated wrote:
| Id need a sim card slot implemented in order to consider thinking
| about buying this laptop. I'm a Thinkpad user and my last and my
| current laptop are equipped with one and it's such a convenience
| to have connectivity on demand without sacrificing the phone's
| battery.
|
| In order to actually buy this laptop, I'd really need it to have
| the trackpoint. Implemented not like HP does it sometimes, or
| Dell, but like Lenovo does it. The response and overall feel of
| the trackpad is the best among the options I have tried so far.
|
| Other present specs are more than fine.
| ThreeFx wrote:
| Comes with an Intel wifi card if I'm not mistaken. Maybe update
| the title?
| 4cao wrote:
| It's optional.
| corty wrote:
| Nice, except for the screen. FullHD is the new "barely adequate".
| But at least it is non-glare, not "bathroom-mirror" finish. The
| latter would be unacceptable due to workplace regulations here.
| mamon wrote:
| In my country workplace regulations forbid working on laptop
| screen anyway - if a worker is supposed to work on computer for
| more than, iirc, 4 hours a day, then external screen is
| mandatory. And it's not really about a screen size, it's more
| that you are not supposed to be looking down, so the external
| screen top border must be at the same height as your eyes.
| wegs wrote:
| That's the make-or-break for me.
|
| Without 4k, I'll move along.
|
| With 4k, it'd probably be my next laptop.
|
| With 4k and touch or pen, it'd definitely be my next laptop.
| thinkloop wrote:
| What regulations advise screen reflectivity?
| helldritch wrote:
| Not the OP, but one example (UK specific but guided by
| European law) is The health and safety (display screen
| equipment) regulations 1992, as amended by the health and
| safety (miscellaneous amendments) regulations 2002 [1]
|
| Under the heading Requirements for Work Stations (Reg 3. and
| schedule):
|
| 24 Regulation 3 requires workstations to meet the
| requirements of the Schedule, (subject to the proviso
| outlined below), which sets out minimum requirements for the
| display screen, keyboard, desk, chair, work environment
| (including working space, lighting, reflection and glare,
| noise, heat and humidity), task requirements and software.
| Requirements are set out in fairly general terms, eg "The
| seat shall be adjustable in height". The Schedule does not
| contain technical detail.
|
| Paragraph 32 states that anti-glare filters must be provided
| by workplaces which use DSE (display screen equipment) which
| are capable of projecting glare.
|
| [1] https://www.hse.gov.uk/foi/internalops/ocs/200-299/oc202_
| 1.h...
| corty wrote:
| helldritch already answered for the UK. In Germany there is
| the Arbeitsstattenverordnung, the appendix requires non-
| reflective desktop and laptop screens (6.3 (2) 3 and 6.4 (2)
| 1): https://www.gesetze-im-
| internet.de/arbst_ttv_2004/anhang.htm...
|
| There is also a similar European Union directive, however,
| that does not apply to laptops if they are used only
| infrequently (annex 1b): https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-
| content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:01...
|
| So while the rest of the world might differ, in the EU non-
| glare screens are usually required if you intend to sell to
| business customers.
| barbecue_sauce wrote:
| Can anyone describe how a magnesium chassis compares to an
| aluminum chassis?
| mcguire wrote:
| (Since no one else has answered...)
|
| It's more fun to set on fire? (https://chem.rutgers.edu/cldf-
| demos/1016-cldf-demo-burning-m...)
| lucb1e wrote:
| Wow, from the EU (no hassle with expensive shipping, either
| initially or for warranty) and 830 euros for a laptop that would
| usually cost me ~1000 because manufacturers usually force
| Microsoft tax, a GPU, and a new SSD on you (I don't want a
| dedicated GPU but they always have one when the CPU is
| reasonable; and I don't want an SSD because I already have my
| own). This is pretty neat indeed!
|
| The only nitpicks are:
|
| - a keyboard with a short left shift which doesn't work as well
| for my hands (I worked with it every day for 6 months while
| writing PHP, i.e. constant stretching to get to the $ symbol, but
| couldn't get used to it) and no numpad despite being a 15"
| laptop, and
|
| - the battery can't be taken out. My current laptop (2 years old)
| has the same issue and it already lost 25% capacity because I use
| it as a desktop much of the time and it's charged at 100%
| capacity all day long. With my 2012 laptop I'd just pop out the
| battery at ~40-70% charge: it takes 4 seconds (I didn't need to
| look or turn it over) and after 5 years of use the battery
| reported having lost 3% capacity. I don't trust that number,
| that's too good to be true with 2012 battery tech, but the
| runtime from 100%-0% was still about half of what it was
| originally (and I used the battery daily, either for standby mode
| between classes or on the train where I would, of course, have a
| deeper discharge cycle than when near a power source).
|
| But compare that to all the plus points that I see that many
| other reasonably-priced (<1200 euro) laptops don't always have:
|
| + No new SSD, a GPU, or Microsoft tax forced on you (as
| mentioned)
|
| + WiFi 6
|
| + reasonably-priced 16 or 32GB RAM option
|
| + RJ45 connector without needing an adapter
|
| + No Intel
|
| + Big battery
|
| + The up/down arrow keys are not shoved into a single (split)
| key! I don't know who ever thought that was a good idea
|
| + Pgup/dn/home/end are nicely reachable. Though I noticed it's
| actually not a big deal to have them under Fn+arrow keys, I
| remember how much I got used to my Asus EEE 1215n having this
| layout. While using that laptop, I'd miss the layout even on a
| desktop keyboard where the keys are further away.
|
| ~ Screen brightness is specified (most of the time, you just have
| to hope that the screen is readable in sunlight, though I used to
| work outside more when I had a public transport route with
| switches so it's not very relevant for me now)
|
| ~ USB-C capabilities mentioned, even if both displayport and
| power delivery modes are a "no" it's good to know
|
| ~ earphones and microphone jack in one. Nice sometimes; super
| annoying when you want a separate mic or some other device that
| uses the mic jack. I should just find a splitter for that I
| guess, no getting around that anymore.
|
| All in all, this is a steal and I'm considering getting one just
| to be rid of my crappy Lenovo Ideapad (maybe I'll donate it to
| one of these organisations that provide kids with laptops for
| corona-related homeschooling), but I don't technically need it...
| seltzered_ wrote:
| > + Screen brightness is specified (most of the time, you just
| have to hope that the screen is readable in sunlight, though I
| used to work outside more when I had a public transport route
| with switches so it's not very relevant for me now)
|
| Luminance: 321 cd/m2 (aka 321 nits)
|
| That isn't bright enough for working outside. Macbooks are
| 500nits, iPads are 600nits. I'd pay extra for an option that
| went to 1000nits (HP elitebook dragonfly / MSI are offering
| this).
| lucb1e wrote:
| Good point, I should change that to a ~ instead of a +
| because it's good that they mention it even if the value is
| not what one might hope.
| openplatypus wrote:
| > 1x USB 3.2 Gen1 Typ-C (DisplayPort: no; Power Delivery: no)
|
| So close. Why would you release laptop like this in 2020?
| rixed wrote:
| A bit surprised by the amount of negative comments about the
| company in here, so I feel that I have to offer a different
| perspective: I ordered a 14" fanless linux laptop from them about
| one year ago and that's one of the best laptop I ever owned. It's
| fast, has a great mate screen of the right proportion, decent
| backlit keyboard with no crazy layout (which has become rare
| recently), better than average trackpad (although nothing like
| that of a Mac), good battery. Of course being fanless it is also
| 100% silent. And it runs Linux flawlessly (I've run debian and
| nixos on it).
|
| Only downsides I can think of are the specific charger cord (as
| opposed to USB) and its large-ish besel which makes it a bit too
| large for comfortable use in planes or trains.
|
| I also interacted with support at the time because I had not
| heard from UPS and I remember them as quite quick to answer and
| friendly.
|
| Overall, I'm afraid this thread might leave readers with an
| unfair impression on the company. Maybe not all of their laptop
| have the same quality? Mine is actually a Clevo, branded as
| "infinitybook 14".
| crypt1d wrote:
| I really appreciate how descriptive they are in the specs.
|
| ` Battery life: (with our optimizations) about 25 hours at min.
| display-brightness, without Wifi & Bluetooth, without keyboard
| backlit, in idle mode about 13 hours at medium brightness with
| Wifi, at office work
|
| We're testing battery time always in idle mode, at minimal
| display brightness, with keyboard backlight deactivated, WIFI &
| Bluetooth disabled and without any further connected devices
| (USB, LAN, HDMI, VGA etc. unplugged!). This way you get an
| information of maximal possible battery life. Starting from this
| you can manage your individual battery life depending on your
| demands and to influence it e.g. is keyboard backlight
| unnecessary during daylight. Bluetooth is also only needed to be
| turned on, if there's a Bluetooth device connected. Full display
| brightness as well is hardly always necessary. `
|
| or their disclaimer about the display panel:
|
| ` Modern displays with IPS panels have bright areas along the
| frame as a normal characteristic. This has hardly any influence
| on everyday operation, not least because the displays are
| optimized for daylight operation. It can only be minimized, but
| not completely avoided, regardless of the manufacturer and for
| manufacturing reasons. `
| blacksmith_tb wrote:
| Hmm, seems a bit steep, price-wise. I am writing this on a cheap
| ($500ish USD) Asus VivoBook w/ a Ryzen 7 3700U and Vega 10 gfx,
| it runs Ubuntu 20.04 without any problems. The display is a bit
| dim, and it really ought to do usb-c pd, but it was a bargain, so
| I can't complain too much.
| Sebb767 wrote:
| I've bought a Tuxedo as work laptop for my parents and they
| couldn't be happier. The hardware looks and works great and
| Tuxedo Linux runs effortless and does automatic updates.
|
| I'd definitely recommend it.
| pmontra wrote:
| How does Tuxedo Linux differ from vanilla Ubuntu?
| makerofthings wrote:
| I have a Tuxedo Infinitybook pro 14 v4, fully maxed out. I love
| it. It's dirt cheap and everything works out of the box. I was a
| little concerned about moving from Mac to Linux but I can sync my
| phone, I can print, I can connect to all my bluetooth devices,
| external displays work nicely, it sleeps properly, battery life
| is Ok...
| btwotch wrote:
| no trackpoint available :-(
| iagovar wrote:
| Feel you mate
| jotm wrote:
| I hate myself for saying this, but guys, just get someone to fix
| up the English around the website. It can't be that difficult.
| Looks like a great product, aimed at a specific niche, I think
| details matter
| weinzierl wrote:
| It's a small shop in a mid-sized town in southern German - just
| give them some slack...
| DyslexicAtheist wrote:
| I bought hardware from them. they don't deserve slack (sadly)
| jotm wrote:
| I mean, I could rewrite the whole website in a couple of
| hours at most... I buy from AliExpress and it always baffles
| me why most listings are so poorly written. I've even offered
| to rewrite them properly but got no replies :D
|
| Sales copy matters when someone views your website, it can
| increase conversion by a noticeable margin. And it's easy to
| fix, just get some American or British writer, maybe give
| them a discount on a new machine, I dunno :)
| josteink wrote:
| > Looks like a great product, aimed at a specific niche, I
| think details matter
|
| Maybe you should fix up your own English first. ;)
|
| There's at least a misplaced comma there and two missing dots.
| jotm wrote:
| Because of the weird phrasing of some sentences, my first
| thought was "hmm, something interesting from China?". Then I
| saw the price is in Euros, then I found that it's a German
| company.
|
| What I mean is, it's a sales page, in English, presumably for
| English speakers. Appearances matter, and this one's easy to
| fix.
|
| Some people like feedback, although I admit my comment was
| poorly written. English is not my first language, either, and
| I like when people point out my mistakes.
| LeonM wrote:
| Just ran the configurator, the price is _really_ good IMO. With
| memory maxed out (32GB), a 1TB SSD and WiFi 6 it's only 1099 EUR.
|
| Too bad it's not offered with a 4K display. And personally I
| would have preferred a TB3 port over all the I/O that this
| machine has build-in. When on-the-go I'm using wireless
| connectivity anyway, and at my desk I like to use a TB3 dock with
| PD as an all-in-one docking solution. Not supporting charging
| trough USB-PD is also missed opportunity.
| Awelton wrote:
| I thought I was very reasonably priced considering the 19%(!)
| tax is included.
| Already__Taken wrote:
| Weird pricing trade offs though in there. 250 to 500GB m.2
| drive is +25, adding a second 250GB drive is +95
|
| Upping the wifi to 6 is only +10? Why bother even offering
| that.
|
| I don't mind the display but not being USB-C Charging is really
| disappointing.
| zamadatix wrote:
| They've got a pile of 3168s they want to get rid of or
| acquired for free/near free. There is no reason to buy that
| card new in 2020, it wasn't even a good option for the price
| when it launched in 2016. +10 is a touch over the full per
| unit price on bulk orders of the ax200 (I just bought a
| couple hundred recently) so they are saying they save nothing
| by keeping a 3168 on hand. WiFi cards have this happen a lot
| since they are one of the few things that are still modular
| in laptops and most people wouldn't even notice (well in this
| case they might since the 3168 is only 1x1 and the ax200 is
| 2x2).
|
| That being said if you're planning on running Linux do know
| for the ax200 you'll want to be on/backported from 5.4+ and
| grab the latest microcode or it could be a bumpy ride.
| Sebb767 wrote:
| > 250 to 500GB m.2 drive is +25, adding a second 250GB drive
| is +95
|
| That's because the base price includes the 250GB SSD. You can
| remove it for a 75 Euro price reduction.
|
| The second SSD is also a bit more expensive since there's no
| M.2/SATA option on the second slot. If you select the 970 EVO
| Plus (250GB) you'll have to add 20 Euro, which matches the
| price in the second slot.
| benibela wrote:
| Perhaps it would be cheaper to buy the SSD separately and
| add it yourself?
| 40four wrote:
| I agree, this seems like a great value. I'm in the market for a
| Linux first laptop, I will have to consider this company.
| rz2k wrote:
| There are tradeoffs with this machine compared to a Macbook
| Pro. Intel laptops also have twice as fast USB along with
| Thunderbolt 3. At 350 cd/m2 and 84% sRGB the relatively low
| resolution screen is also going to be darker with poor color
| reproduction.
|
| However, in addition to the CPU power, and a sane configuration
| being half the price, the weight looks really good. At 1.4 kg
| (3.1 lbs) it weighs like a 13" MacBook Pro rather than a 15 or
| 16 inch one. I've found the difference between 3 and 4 lbs
| surprisingly noticeable if frequently moving the computer or
| commuting with it.
| newacct583 wrote:
| > There are tradeoffs with this machine compared to a Macbook
| Pro.
|
| The MBP is the world's premier laptop and more than twice as
| expensive. I'd certainly expect so!
| AnthonyMouse wrote:
| > There are tradeoffs with this machine compared to a Macbook
| Pro. Intel laptops also have twice as fast USB along with
| Thunderbolt 3.
|
| On the other hand, this has a builtin HDMI port, ethernet
| port and the capacity for internal expansion (unlike the
| Macbook), so the performance for external expansion is a lot
| less relevant.
|
| Who wants to carry around a bunch of overpriced dongles
| anyway?
|
| > At 350 cd/m2 and 84% sRGB the relatively low resolution
| screen is also going to be darker with poor color
| reproduction.
|
| I wish somebody would make laptops with high quality screens
| and low end everything else. Sometimes that's all you need.
|
| Plus, the low end processors often have the best battery
| life.
| rz2k wrote:
| Sadly, the plain MacBook doesn't have a low end price. :)
|
| An upcoming ARM MacBook could be a great machine for a text
| editor, terminal, and browser, but I fear there will be new
| user limitations that block customizations like Karabiner
| and Hammerspoon that I would miss too much.
| shadowpawn wrote:
| Decent Windows based machine prices out cheaper?
| JimmyRuska wrote:
| Ended up getting an e595 thinkpad with ryzen several months ago,
| flashed it with pop-os. Originally there was all kinds of
| problems; opening chrome would completely freeze the computer,
| the computer would not come out of suspend mode so I had to shut
| it down, battery life is probably less than 4 hours. With the
| latest pop-os everything is fine now.
|
| If I were to do it again I would probably get an intel cpu for
| any laptop just because good battery life ended up being much
| more important than any cpu power gain for me. I definitely would
| have spent a little more on getting one pre-installed with linux
| just knowing it would have good hardware support. Older laptops
| seem to always work great, but anything new always has a chance
| of having some hardware issues.
| mikelward wrote:
| Ryzen 4000 laptops promise to improve battery life to match
| Intel.
|
| https://www.anandtech.com/show/15624/amd-details-renoir-the-...
| ben-schaaf wrote:
| If you normalize for performance the ryzen 4000 laptops
| should have considerably better battery life than comparable
| intel models, at least while under load if not idle.
| analognoise wrote:
| ... Who would do that?
|
| Most people want to know how long it lasts on a charge. If
| it lasted 30 minutes but was the cheapest, literally nobody
| would say "If you normalize for cost, it lasts the
| longest".
| __roland__ wrote:
| Just as an anecdotal counterpoint to all the negative reviews
| here: I have a 2015 Tuxedo notebook that is still going strong,
| and never had any issue with it. There is quite a bit of fan
| noise, which I don't hear as I'm typically using a noise-
| cancelling headset anyway. The keyboard is rather flimsy and the
| build quality is definitely not on par with Dell XPS or a
| T-series Lenovo, at least for this model: in my use case (using
| external keyboard and monitor 99% of the time) this is not an
| issue, so I'm (still) quite happy with it. As others have already
| said, the pricing is hard to beat and its Ubuntu setups are well
| configured.
|
| I also had very positive interactions with their support staff;
| very friendly and knowledgeable. I have yet to see a piece of
| Tuxedo hardware fail, and know several people who are using their
| hardware (both laptops and workstations, which are even nicer and
| have a much better build quality IMO).
| eecc wrote:
| Single channel RAM? What's this nonsense
| clarry wrote:
| Dang. This looks like something that could replace my aging T460s
| (which has a garbage trackpad, and cost over 2000 eur with all
| its 8GB of RAM; Linux keeps OOMing and freezing all the time[1]).
|
| Ryzen 4000 series would be nice. 17" would be nice. But 3000
| series Ryzen and 15.6" screen is already a decent upgrade over my
| Thinkpad with i7-6600U..
|
| I'm feeling conflicted because it's obviously not a dream-come-
| true laptop, but the price point seems very very reasonable (and
| if I wait for the perfect laptop, I might have to wait forever).
|
| [1] https://lkml.org/lkml/2019/8/4/15
|
| Just this morning I found my laptop non-responsive and spinning
| the fan at full speed. I cut the power. It's probably been
| thrashing all night. In my case, "this little crisis" never lasts
| for just a few minutes, it'll last as long as I care to wait
| (I've waited hours and it never recovered).
|
| EDIT: Specs say there's a 9-in-1 card reader, but in photos I
| only see a micro SD slot.. what am I missing?
| ahsima1 wrote:
| Why not just upgrade the ram? DDR4 is rather cheap these days.
| Alternatively you can try enabling ZRAM, which can save memory
| by using compression.
| https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Improving_performance#Z...
| throwaway2048 wrote:
| not that its anything more than a bandaide, but I have found
| earlyoom to be immensely useful in cases like that.
|
| https://github.com/rfjakob/earlyoom
| srazzaque wrote:
| Odd, I've had nothing but positive experiences with Linux on
| Thinkpads for 3 machines running (t61p, x220, now an x260).
|
| Not sure what distro you're using, but from what I hear, a lot
| of the Fedora devs use Thinkpads, so if you're on a thinkpad,
| Fedora workstation is likely to be your best bet (which is what
| I've been using for quite a while now).
|
| For me right now, the upcoming T14 is the thing to beat, even
| for a Linux laptop. Given its got a 4k screen and my
| anecdotally positive experience with the Linux/Thinkpad combo.
| So I don't know if I'll jump onto Tuxedo or System76.
| ksec wrote:
| Not sure if any representative from Tuxedo are reading. There are
| spelling mistakes;
|
| _Another highlight of the TUXEDO Book BA15 is its elegant and
| durable chassis, which is partly made of magnesium allow (AZ91D)
| (display cover as well as baseunit), while aluminum is used on
| the bottom panel._
|
| Magnesium "Alloy", and "base unit". And in other places,
| "videostreaming",
|
| On another note, if AMD have sufficient capacity right at launch
| for AMD Ryzen 5 3500U to be used by so many ODM models suggests
| it might not be doing so well in the Top 5 laptop brand which
| represent 80% of the market. And if you exclude Apple, it is
| close to 90%.
| FunnyLookinHat wrote:
| Getting a 500... anyone have a mirror?
| pmontra wrote:
| Compared to my HP ZBook from 2014:
|
| Pro:
|
| - No number pad, I really love this. I could finally align the
| center the laptop with my body.
|
| - Smaller footprint, same screen size. Nice to have.
|
| - Half the weight. Good.
|
| - Much better battery. Nice to have.
|
| - Lower price for the same configuration (32 GB / 2 TB.) Good.
|
| Cons:
|
| - No physical touchpad buttons. I really hate this.
|
| - Generally awful reviews of the company in the other comments
| here. Probably a deal breaker.
|
| I didn't investigate the self serviceability of the hardware and
| the availability of spare parts. The ZBook is great about that.
| I'm also used to next business day on site repairs from HP for
| the first 3 years. The last time the package cost about 100 Euro.
| That's important. I've got an old spare computer but I can't do
| everything there.
| lucb1e wrote:
| > Generally awful reviews of the company in the other comments
| here. Probably a deal breaker.
|
| There are also good reviews in the thread. I'm sure we can find
| similar reviews about any other random laptop brand, except
| that there you pay the Microsoft tax and they aren't merely
| showing little love for techies' issues but instead never even
| heard of the word Linux and require that you reproduce issues
| on "a normal system like Windows" before they accept it could
| be their hardware that's faulty.
|
| I don't have experience with Tuxedo Computers, but this is
| Germany. The EU warranty and 'remote purchase' laws ("koop op
| afstand", not sure how to translate) are quite excellent (even
| if the Dutch are better). It might be a headache to get issues
| fixed depending on how stubborn they are, but rotten apple
| stories about support is not something I'd generally reject
| European hardware for.
|
| (I once had a drone from a company that was beyond stubborn,
| and while I wouldn't wish that experience upon anyone, I
| learned a lesson or two and now feel a lot more confident in
| dealing with companies unresponsive to warranty claims: they
| really don't have many options when you send them registered
| snailmail stating your claim and subsequent steps if they don't
| fulfill or refute the claim. If someone had told me to start
| doing that earlier instead of trusting promises to fix it or
| call me back or whatever, I'd have saved a lot of time, but I
| eventually realized how the game was to be played.)
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