[HN Gopher] Ask HN: I'm an incoming freshman to college for a CS...
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Ask HN: I'm an incoming freshman to college for a CS major, what
should I know?
I've been coding since I was young, so I'm not worried about
struggling academically, at least in my CS classes. I'm more
interested in knowing what I should do now to give me an advantage
in getting a job or otherwise. All advice is appreciated!
Author : fish45
Score : 46 points
Date : 2020-05-31 18:33 UTC (4 hours ago)
| tracer4201 wrote:
| Let me start by sharing what I think is the most important
| advice. I would focus and really ensure you "learn" things. Don't
| worry about optimizing for exam scores. In my opinion, it's
| better to get a 75% on an exam and understand that 75% well as
| opposed to getting 95% on an exam but only because you
| "remembered" things without really understanding them.
|
| When you study, spend time deeply thinking about the concepts.
| Yes you're going to learn CS, but it's not just about learning
| data structures, algorithms, compilers, etc. etc. College is an
| opportunity to think critically. It's okay to be wrong or to not
| understand things. Use the internet to reinforce concepts you
| don't understand well, or go speak with your professor or TA's in
| office hours.
|
| Okay... with that out of the way, here are some other thoughts:
|
| 1. Don't index too heavily on advice folks give you on learning
| any specific programming language. Focus more on the concepts
| that translate from one language to another.
|
| 2. In the first year or two, do invest in understanding object
| oriented programming principles, as OOP is quite common today.
| You'll probably cover this in one of your introductory
| CS/programming courses anyway. Note: OOP is not the end all/be
| all.
|
| 3. If you've used Windows your whole life, great. I would
| encourage you to spend some time learning a Unix-based operating
| system. This isn't so much related to your CS degree/course work,
| but I will bet it comes in very handy later on.
|
| 4. Do take a compilers course if it's not required in your degree
| program. Many universities who have ABET accreditation require it
| but I recall at least one (several years ago) that didn't.
|
| 5. Do pay attention in your Operating Systems course. Take that
| course if it's not required. Threading, memory management,
| scheduling algorithms... you learn concepts here that will likely
| be very useful in your career.
| aloukissas wrote:
| 1. Sweat the fundamentals. CS isn't a coding school. Algorithms,
| complexity theory, databases, operating systems, graph theory,
| compilers, math, etc. will get you further than any coding.
|
| 2. Go for depth, not breadth. I know most US colleges make
| students do all sort of breadth stuff, which I don't get (I come
| from European undergrad, all our classes were CS/EE - coming to
| US for grad school, I was more prepared than others coming from
| top US undergrads). You have time to dive into other stuff after
| school. Do adjacent things like Biology or EE.
|
| 3. Find grad students and see what they're working on. This is
| where you'll see the value of the fundamentals. Then work
| backwards and fill the gaps. Try to get a tiny part in a research
| project (ideally one that can lead to publication).
|
| 4. Read timeless papers one each topic.
|
| 5. Hack, hack, hack - the gap between theory and practice is
| small in theory but large in practice.
| mshron wrote:
| Skill up in the humanities. Pick topics outside of technology
| that interest you, and learn how to communicate about them. Take
| as many seminar discussion and writing-heavy classes as you can.
|
| From a career perspective, programming skill is relatively easy
| to come by. Programming AND speaking AND good writing will put
| you on a better career path. You won't get stuck after a job or
| two when you know the tools of the trade but not how to handle
| things outside the compiler.
|
| But also, just as a person who has to make it in this world, you
| need more than one frame of reference to make sense of things.
| Humanities students are enriched by taking science and math
| classes, and getting a new way of seeing things. STEM undergrads
| who learn to tolerate ambiguity and learn some history are
| rounder humans.
| vegannet wrote:
| I emphatically agree. Very few programmers are so talented that
| their soft skills don't move the needle. For the majority of
| programmers, soft skills will be the single greatest
| differentiator between being a middle of the road software
| engineer or excelling and being _the_ engineer people adore.
|
| An average programmers job is 90% writing code that anybody
| with a year of experience could write, it's the 10% where
| you're bridging the gap between technology and business that
| can realise a whole new world of value -- and that depends on
| soft skills.
| ck425 wrote:
| I'll plus one this and recommend you also try doing things
| outside of class. Uni is an amazing time to try a load of
| hobbies and new non-academic skills. I personally did a ton of
| theatre and event planning for fun at uni and learned a loads
| of useful skills such as:
|
| - How to coordinate a team - How to write a good email - How to
| interview people (helps for being interviewed) - How to clearly
| communicate my ideas to others - Public Speaking - How to give
| feedback - Conflict resolution
|
| Beyond the basics technical skills tend to vary by job. Soft
| skills are universal.
| psidebot wrote:
| On the flip side, if a degree program is at a liberal arts
| institution it may have plenty of humanities builtin and you
| may want to add a few extra CS courses to round things out.
| bproven wrote:
| >Programming AND speaking AND good writing will put you on a
| better career path.
|
| This is very true. If you are a decent developer AND have this
| "speaking AND good writing skills" you will go much further -
| it really separates you from the pack...
| bdcravens wrote:
| Find a language and learn it deep (at this point, I'd say
| probably Javascript).
|
| Find opportunities to work on code someone else has written.
| Triaging bugs in open source projects (even if you aren't
| involved, but are just following along in issues) is great.
|
| If you can become involved in open source, working on someone
| else's project, that's a great way to learn the communication
| skills needed to function in a career.
|
| Learn CI/CD.
|
| Learn SQL.
|
| I'd strongly encourage you to minor in business.
|
| Get as good as you can at public speaking, whether in coursework
| or on an extra-curricular basis.
| phased20 wrote:
| (Some general advice in the last few paragraphs)
|
| One thing you should absolutely put on your radar: are you at all
| interested in grad school?
|
| You have plenty of time to actually make the decision to go to
| grad school (plenty of people don't decide until years after
| graduating), but if you think it might even be a remote
| possibility, there are two things you absolutely need to do:
|
| (1) Get STELLAR letters of recommendation. This is the most
| important thing to know, and you should consider that you'll need
| between 3 and 6 depending on your program.
|
| (2) Keep your GPA above ~3.5 (landing something lower won't break
| your application, but it will make your life harder).
|
| Lots of the career advice I've seen maps to getting SWE jobs in
| industry, where things like your undergrad GPA, research
| experience, and letters of recommendation don't matter as much.
| You can be a phenomenal engineer at a "prestigious" company
| (whatever that means to you) with a huge variety of undergrad
| track records (including not even going to college!). But just
| like getting a referral from someone who works at a certain
| company is a higher-signal (and easier) way to select an
| applicant to interview than trying to sort through a stack of
| resumes, getting a "referral" from a professor in the form of a
| letter of recommendation is a higher-signal way to filter
| applications than basically anything else. For research, grad
| school admissions committees tend to not care too much about
| internships / work experience, unless they're tied to research in
| some way. If you're interested in this, read the link at the end
| of this post [0].
|
| Also, considering COVID-19's impact on engineering hiring right
| now, if you're having trouble finding an internship, doing a
| summer of undergraduate research can be a great backdoor to
| getting some hands-on experience, work with a professor, and
|
| Generally, on the career side of things, I'd say spend a good
| chunk of time exploring what types of work you enjoy and find
| engaging. It's hard to predict what this will be when you're
| coming in, so do lots of small experiments to try to figure this
| out. Build small projects, reach out to professors and try your
| hand at research, join clubs and find other students who share
| your interests.
|
| The last thing I'll say here is realize that there might be a
| whole set of career options you didn't even know existed coming
| in. Amongst my friends, the most common "discovered" post-
| graduate plan was (management) consulting, which virtually none
| of my friends knew existed coming into college, and many ended up
| getting excited about while there.
|
| Overall, you'll be hard-pressed to find another space where
| you're surrounded by thousands of other people your age who are
| excited about learning, meeting each other, and working on
| ambitious stuff. There's way more to do and discover than there
| was in high school, but you'll also have to be much more active
| in finding and leveraging opportunities instead of waiting things
| to come to you. Work hard and explore, but also remember to make
| friends, let loose, find some parties, go on dates, stay healthy,
| and keep an open mind throughout. It's a wild ride, and it can be
| an incredibly rewarding handful of years. Good luck!
|
| [0] https://www.cs.cmu.edu/~harchol/gradschooltalk.pdf
| NotSammyHagar wrote:
| Keep writing programs, that's the ultimate skill and what you
| need to demonstrate at interviews. Second, if you are shy like a
| lot is us, take communications, meet other people. Try new
| things. You can find friends, ignore the cool kids if you have no
| connection. Also, this pandemic and violence will pass, hopefully
| we can improve society - but society will still be there.
| diebeforei485 wrote:
| For your non-CS electives - fill them up with classes that are
| much easier to learn in a college environment.
|
| If there is an intro to law class (preferably one meant for non-
| lawyers, for example Intro to Business Law), you may find that
| useful.
|
| Take 1 or 2 business classes. It doesn't have to be a minor or
| double major - just the basics of marketing, finance, economics,
| and entrepreneurship.
|
| Get better at "presentation" - speaking and writing. Public
| speaking (or debate) would be helpful. This could be an
| extracurricular like Mock Trial, it doesn't have to be a class
| (though if one is offered and fits in your schedule, that could
| be great).
|
| Oh. Machine Learning. Make sure you know the basics of it, even
| if you don't want a job in ML.
| zests wrote:
| College is a place to learn social skills as well as technical
| skills. 75% of your effort should go to technical college work,
| 25% of your effort should go to socializing. Conversely, 75% of
| your leisure should go to socializing and 25% to non technical
| yet brain stimulating work.
|
| I shouldn't have to state that this rule is better taken
| figuratively than literally.
| tsumnia wrote:
| This is more of an aside, but since you've been coding for some
| time, please understand that concepts you already know need to be
| taught to those that do not. Concepts like a nested loop are
| often one of the hardest initial hurdles for many students. Your
| first CS courses will spend a lot of time on these types of
| concepts.
|
| Please be patient and not become annoyed with how "slow" the
| class is going. Students that struggle with that first hurdle
| will continue to struggle as the class moves forward [1]. I would
| say, if you pick up or complete the homework without any issues
| to reach out to your peers and offer help. You don't need to
| share code, but something like a small whiteboard to explain
| concepts would be good.
|
| [1] http://www.ppig.org/sites/ppig.org/files/2014-PPIG-25th-
| Ahad...
| sircastor wrote:
| In spite of having programmed for many years before starting my
| degree, there was a lot of academic challenge. There's a lot of
| theory that simply writing code does not teach you. There's a lot
| of course work that doesn't have to do with programming.
| Iteracting with people, project design, team management. If
| nothing else, it's 8-9 hours of work a week per class any way you
| look at.
|
| Do the work, don't short-change yourself in your education.
| JabavuAdams wrote:
| Do side projects. Do internships, if possible. Aim for A's
| instead of A+'s. The time-savings will be enormous, and allow you
| to do other things.
|
| EDIT> Join project teams, if possible. E.g. game development
| club, robotics club, rocketry club, etc.
| acmexyz wrote:
| Doing side projects is so key and very underrated. The downside
| of a CS degree is it tends to be heavily theory-skewed (which
| can be really great!), but it doesn't take much to forget the
| practical side of the craft.
| Spooky23 wrote:
| Math.
|
| When I was a TA, the kids who struggled were most hurt by
| calculus.
|
| The other thing is read up on how to do the college game.
| Participate in office hours, understand what drives your grades,
| etc. I had a hard time with this, as I was able to coast through
| high school with minimal effort.
| bra-ket wrote:
| start doing competitive programming as early as you can , enroll
| in ICPC https://icpc.baylor.edu/ and join competitive programming
| weekly group at you school (or start one if you don't find any)
|
| this is a good book for preparation
| https://www.amazon.com/Competitive-Programming-3rd-Steven-Ha...
|
| participate in contests on https://onlinejudge.org/, topcoder or
| similar on weekly basis (you will hear a lot about leetcode as a
| hard prerequisite to getting a job these days, but it's trivial
| for people who do competitive programming)
|
| you will learn much more from doing that for a couple of years
| than any college can teach you
| tibbar wrote:
| This. After a couple years of serious effort on Codeforces,
| algorithms interviews are trivial. And perhaps more
| importantly, it becomes much easier to bang out a state
| machine, toss around some data structures, check for edge
| cases. You'll become really comfortable with that middle tier
| of software algorithms that are a non-trivial composition of
| standard ideas, but still fall short of needing a research
| paper, etc. (And you'll develop a sense for when a problem _is_
| actually-hard).
| mikaelmello wrote:
| I second this. Competitive programming helps you develop skills
| that I find important in a career and that, in my opinion, had
| a strong influence on my current success.
|
| There are many benefits and things where Comp. Programming can
| help you, but the most obvious one is how interview questions
| in FAANG (and similar) companies are easy compared to your
| weekly Comp. Programming contests.
| saalweachter wrote:
| 1. Don't assume your CS classes will always be easy.
|
| Having programmed a lot is a big advantage, but you're going to
| be learning a wide variety of things as a CS major that you may
| not have had to think about previously, and there is going to be
| a lot of it which isn't intuitive. Be prepared to study more than
| you have in the past and don't get cocky; sometimes it isn't
| until your junior or senior year that you get beyond what you
| already sort-of know and hit a wall.
|
| 2. Try to double major or minor in something completely unrelated
| to CS and math, unless you are _really_ into CS or math.
|
| Programming is a tool to make computers do stuff. A pure CS
| degree leaves you qualified to program compilers and IR systems
| and computer games. If you learn about something really hard,
| like chemistry or biology or whathaveyou, you'll also know what
| sort of programs chemists and biologists and whathaveyou need and
| have a domain to write programs in.
| liquidise wrote:
| I strongly second both of these points will provide some more
| color:
|
| > 1. Don't assume your CS classes will always be easy.
|
| Easy or _quick_. Some of my worst college experiences involved
| putting off CS work that, while still easy, had sneaky edge-
| cases that took many hours to cover. Don 't be lazy with your
| CS projects and you will be in a comfortable place.
|
| > 2. Try to double major or minor in something completely
| unrelated to CS and math
|
| Sage advice. I know a few CS/SE majors who minored in psych.
| Each, without exception, left college with an understanding of
| what drives office politics and dynamics that surpassed their
| peers. Computers are easy in that they work in objective ways.
| It is hard to overstate how valuable a diverse education can be
| once you are in the real world dealing with real (read: flawed)
| humans.
| hatsunearu wrote:
| double majoring is a hilarious waste of time and money. don't
| do it.
| curiousllama wrote:
| Definitely not a waste of time. Learning to think in a non-CS
| way can be incredibly valuable. Will it make you a better
| programmer? Maybe not. Will it make you a more effective
| employee, founder, or person? Yes.
| javajosh wrote:
| False. I was a physics/philosophy double and I haven't
| regretted it for a second. Physics was profound (although
| somewhat disappointing!) but philosophy is the home of
| ethics, and lots of writing, and the study of both of those
| will serve you in good stead.
| mattlondon wrote:
| Here are a few things that either I regretted not learning/being
| taught in my CompSci course, or that I see lacking in new juniors
| who start on my team:
|
| - How to actually build something entirely from scratch and host
| it somewhere so others can use it. I.e. do something 100% top-to-
| bottom where you not only design & write a bit of software then
| hand the assignment in, but actually set up a server, install
| what you need, deploy the software, monitor it etc etc - bonus
| points for getting your friends to try and use it have them file
| bugs for you to fix. Some suggestions - write a clone of
| Wordpress/StackOverflow/HackerNews or whatever and do the _whole
| thing_ yourself, right down to database schemas and installing
| and configuring nginx yourself. You will learn so much if you
| have never done this. Too much at school was compartmentalised so
| that you only had to "focus on the problem" and the other stuff
| was provided for you.
|
| - Source control: Git/Mercurial and other distributed ones, plus
| also still-in-use dinosaurs like Perforce/SVN. These days with
| Github everyone probably knows this, but I'll say it anyway since
| at school it is often just you working on your own.
|
| - Unit testing :-) Bonus points for continuous
| integration/deployment.
|
| - Basic project management: how things are run in teams, code
| reviews, bug handling etc.
|
| - web + networking fluently (answer the "what happens when I
| enter example.com in the browser" question from the initial DNS
| lookup through to the DOM rendering and everything in between)
|
| - fundamental *nix familiarity. Don't need to be l33t, but at
| least be able to get basic grunt work done with pipes and the
| like instead of having to resort to dumping data to excel and
| filtering it there. Sed, awk, grep, wc, uniq, sort, vi etc etc
| etc.
|
| - the obvious algorithms + data structures stuff.
|
| - These days: Cloud: the 12 Factor App thing is quite a good
| thing to read and internalise - it may change your perspective of
| how you think about approaching things. Probably worth having at
| least a basic understanding of docker + k8ns, as well as using at
| least one of the major cloud provider's services (they're all
| largely the same for the basics)
|
| Otherwise my advice would be to just generally get stuck into
| stuff and just keep messing around with as much different stuff
| as you can to keep your horizons broad and experience varied.
| Don't try to focus too much on specific areas - there might be
| stuff you didn't even think about previously.
|
| Have fun & good luck!
| downerending wrote:
| You're young and your brain is still rather plastic. So, learn
| everything. Textbooks for a CS curriculum is a great place to
| start. But also practical programming texts, the Unix classics,
| man pages galore, lots of math (esp discrete and linear algebra).
| xupybd wrote:
| Find Friends to work with. You will help them they will help you.
| Exams are not like coding they need practice despite how well you
| know the topics. Sitting down for hours by yourself is near
| impossible. Sitting with a group helps to maintain focus and
| gives you someone to explain this. It also gives you someone to
| explain things too. Nothing will sharpen your ability to clearly
| answer an exam question more than teaching someone that concept.
|
| Those same friends will be the start of your professional
| network. The more contacts you have the better for you career.
|
| Finally try to intern during your holidays. Work experience will
| help you land a job.
| 3pt14159 wrote:
| There is no speed limit. I wish I read this when I was younger:
|
| https://sivers.org/kimo
|
| I breezed through university and I could have made so much more
| of it if I'd just self-taught from the textbooks and started
| grappling with papers in my undergrad. Once your foundation of
| mathematics and CS is stronger than your peers you'll find so
| many doors open to you.
| hindsightbias wrote:
| Look to other comments for short term advice. For long term, play
| to your strengths and work on your weaknesses. Those things you
| might never be good at - look around you. You are surrounded by
| all sorts of people with their own skills. Mingle - build a team,
| it will help getting thru all the ups and downs of college life
| and teach you about people
|
| Jobs are mostly about connections. Volunteer. Mentor a freshman
| every year. Ask for help. Treat the lab guys well. Connect
| people.
|
| Finally, the most important thing: screw up enough to get
| noticed.
| Jemaclus wrote:
| My advice might be controversial, but here are some thoughts I
| have...
|
| My big piece of advice: Major in something useful (CS, check!),
| minor in something fun. A lot of the computer science classes you
| take will be boring AF, or you'll start to bang your head against
| the desk wondering why you have to know how operating systems
| work when you just want to make iOS apps (or vice versa!). Some
| of the classes will be deeply math heavy. It can and will seem
| overwhelming at times. So minor in something fun. Pick something
| that has no bearing on your chosen career path. Minor in Theater
| or Music or Art or Literature or Physical Education. The best
| part about minors is that you generally get to take all the fun
| classes and not the terrible ones! You'll meet a whole bunch of
| people with diverse interests that aren't solely computer nerds.
|
| As far as the CS stuff is concerned, focus on absorbing as much
| as you can. Contrary to what other people said, don't sweat the
| details. You should have a fundamental understanding of all the
| big areas (databases, languages, algorithms), but you don't need
| to be an expert in any of those things to get a job. In fact, 90%
| of the subject matter you learn in college won't be relevant to
| whichever job you get. BUT... the act of learning is important,
| and the fact that you have fundamental understandings of those
| things will get your foot in the door
|
| Think of your college degree as a ticket to an interview, and
| your first job as the real education. Your degree is proof of two
| things: 1) that you can learn, and 2) that you can start, stick
| with, and complete a large, multi-year project. Nobody expects
| someone with a Bachelor's degree to be an expert programmer, but
| they _do_ expect critical thinking skills and the ability to
| learn. You'll learn more on the job in the first 6 months than
| you will in 4+ years of college education... so don't put too
| much stress on yourself there.
|
| So... take it seriously, but not too seriously. Study hard, but
| take fun classes too. Make connections in your computer classes,
| but make friends across a wide variety of interests. Learn the
| fundamentals, but don't sweat the details.
|
| (Also, pro tip: nobody gives a shit about your GPA. A 4.0 doesn't
| get you anything in the real world except a rude awakening. By
| all means, try to get all A's if you can, but don't burn yourself
| out by trying to get perfect grades.)
| LifeIsBio wrote:
| I read through this waiting to get to the controversial part
| and never found it. This is good advice not only for CS but for
| any rigorous degree. One of my favorite classes in undergrad
| was Ultimate Frisbee because it ensured I got some aerobic
| exercise each week and I got to experience playing UF with some
| really good people.
|
| There are lots of other critical points casually shoved in here
| that could probably be expanded to book chapters if you wanted.
| The point about making connections is huge. Arguably the
| biggest difference between a state school and Ivy League
| education is the network available to you. Regardless of where
| you're at, establishing connections is a major part of
| undergrad.
| tsumnia wrote:
| > minor in something fun
|
| I agree. I double majored in CS and Acting specifically because
| I enjoy both topics and wanted to get better. It does take some
| dancing around with your schedule, but if you take the time to
| create some different alternative schedules it can be done.
| There were some semesters where I was more CS heavy, and others
| more Theatre heavy. I was able to walk out with both degrees in
| 4.5 years.
| flaque wrote:
| You should take a serious look right now to make sure you're
| going to a college with a good program for getting a job.
|
| From someone who went through a school with effectively no
| program, I definitely wished I'd considered this before devoting
| 4 years and 100k to one particular school.
|
| So here's some actionable questions you can ask your career
| center right now to see if you're getting your money's worth.
|
| __Does the university protect you against exploding offers? __An
| exploding offer is when a company offers you a job offer, but you
| have to decide immediately or within a short time period (like a
| day or two). In the "real world" this can make sense because the
| company may actually need someone immediately. For students
| though, this practice is a bit scummy, since no company
| immediately needs an intern. Typically it's just manipulating
| someone who might not know any better. To prevent this, any
| college worth it's tuition will require all companies recruiting
| students to follow some form of [offer
| guidelines](https://ecs.engineering.illinois.edu/career-
| resources/offer-...).
|
| If they _don't_ have this sort of guideline, it likely means they
| don't have any leverage or industry connections. For example,
| most schools will just blacklist companies from their career
| fairs that don't follow their guidelines. If the companies don't
| care, then the career program is pretty bad.
|
| And on that note, __does the school have regular career fairs
| attended by tech companies you 've heard of? __
|
| In some schools the vast majority of students get their
| internships or new-grad jobs from career fairs. In others, there
| won 't be a technical career fair. Or if there is, there won't be
| any CS/programming jobs that show up.
|
| One hack to figure this out is to check if the school is
| _charging companies_ money for STEM career fairs. For example,
| San Jose state charges $850 a table the last time I checked. If a
| school isn't charging, it often means they can't actually get
| anyone to come. (though obviously YMMV)
|
| __Does the school have course offerings for technical
| interviews? __Many, many schools these days are creating classes
| specifically to help students pass their technical interviews.
| For example, here 's [Boise State's
| class](https://github.com/BoiseState/CS-HU390).
|
| If the school _doesn't_ have a course like this at some point, it
| may mean they are disconnected to the real world and have little
| to no support for you in general. It is not a hard thing for CS
| professors to setup a class for extra practice with algorithms &
| data structures.
|
| __Do students have access to investment capital or startup
| support? __Many schools have some form of a "student startup"
| program specifically around CS students. If they don't, there may
| also be a "college student" specific VC fund nearby, such as
| [Contrary Capital](https://contrarycap.com/), [Dorm Room
| Fund](https://www.dormroomfund.com/), or [Rough Draft
| VC](https://www.roughdraft.vc/).
|
| _You_ may not start a business, but one of your peers might, and
| that creates a network that can help you get a job in the future.
| Plus, this opens up opportunities you may not have considered
| before.
|
| It's important for you that these are heavily associated with the
| computer science program and not uniquely available to the
| business students. Some schools only allow biz kids to do these;
| the money comes from a grant that's only allocated for biz
| students.
|
| __Does the school have access to hackathons? __Hackathons may be
| for you, or they may not be. (I personally dislike them) But you
| should seek out a place where they exist or you have access to
| them. They encourage students to actually build things, which is
| the type of environment you want to be in. You should surround
| yourself with other people who are actually using their CS skills
| rather than just passing their classes.
|
| Does the university host a hackathon? If not, is it in the local
| area? If not, does it sponsor students to go? If not, have _any_
| students gone?
|
| You'd be surprised how many schools with a CS program where all
| of those answers are "no".
|
| __In general, you should a baseline goal in your university.
| __There 's obvious benefit to learning as much as you can in many
| different subjects while you have the time. But get a job at the
| end.
| kccqzy wrote:
| > I've been coding since I was young
|
| Same here, but that doesn't mean you won't struggle. If you have
| been coding since very young, you could very well be quite
| skilled at software engineering, the practical aspect of
| producing software, but not at computer science. I was fortunate
| enough that a middle school teacher found out I was interested in
| coding and decided to teach me real computer science instead.
| That's where I struggled a lot. I didn't even know why for
| example learning about heaps or binary trees was a necessary
| endeavor, when I could very well build websites or make DOS games
| on my own. It took until high school for me to truly grok these
| computer science concepts, mostly about algorithms and data
| structures. Even then I still learned a great lot in my undergrad
| CS classes beyond algorithms and data structures.
|
| Computer science is a vast field; don't think that just because
| you have coding experience you can afford to coast along, instead
| there's always something new to learn. Go find your own subfield
| that you are interested in and go deep in it. I personally really
| enjoyed learning about type theory (going through Pierce's TAPL)
| for example. It may not be an undergrad course but still.
|
| As for advice, I'd say go talk to the professors more often. They
| are generally willing to help. And if they sense that you are so
| much ahead of your peers, they could very well give you new work
| to challenge yourself. Perhaps even ask you to collaborate on a
| research project they are working on.
| Jhsto wrote:
| > Go find your own subfield that you are interested in and go
| deep in it.
|
| Conversely, do know that this may not yield much appreciation
| from professors. BSc and MSc degree programs don't generally
| reward you for doing work that is so deep to be publishable.
| Even though you are at college to learn, you can't get carried
| away learning by yourself, if it is in the way of passing
| exams.
| koheripbal wrote:
| How to differ admission for 1 year.
|
| Seriously. College is going to be a shit show this year with
| covid-19.
| aaron_seattle wrote:
| "Real life has no curriculum".
|
| ~80% of what I've learned vocationally, came after school, under
| the informal mentorship of seasoned practitioners.
|
| Arguably the #1 exportable skill you gain from college is
| metacognition - learning how to learn. So that the next time you
| find yourself staring into a "I have no idea" moment, instead of
| being stuck, you'll be able to iteratively expand your mental map
| of the territory; form and test hypotheses; sketch out needed or
| missing tooling, etc.
| aaron_seattle wrote:
| i.e. remember this when you find yourself deep into some "am I
| ever going to really need this" curriculum. Directly, probably
| not. Indirectly, you are rewiring your neurons for generalized
| problem solving to the nth degree.
|
| Also, this "missing course": https://missing.csail.mit.edu/
| lackbeard wrote:
| Join your school's ACM Programming Contest or ICPC team. It will
| prepare you well for whiteboard coding interviews.
|
| Also try to do at least two internships; they'll teach you a lot
| about what professional work is really like and once you've
| graduated a lot of companies will like seeing this experience on
| your resume.
| veeralpatel979 wrote:
| I'd say choose an area to specialize in. Whether it's security,
| graphics, drones, something else...find what you like and don't
| just gravitate toward AI/machine learning/blockchain since that's
| what's hot.
| Ologn wrote:
| In recent times I have been taking night and weekend classes to
| finish my CS bachelors along students half my age, so I will tell
| you what I told them.
|
| One thing is we took CS classes, and also some English courses in
| writing. Even on the job, those writing classes are important.
| You will be writing e-mails, documentation etc. and being able to
| be clear and to the point is helpful.
|
| Also, in my eyes, some students were not doing enough to get an
| IT job out of school, never mind a good IT job with an upward
| trajectory. One guy told me "I don't study for quizzes since they
| are only 10% of the grade". I studied for quizzes because they
| were 10% of the grade, but also because I wanted to keep up with
| the subject and know about it for the future. Then part-way
| through a semester, or after a semester, I would often manifest
| whatever I learned. So if I learned Java, I would write a project
| in Java for myself. Or at least go on Github or somewhere and fix
| an issue on a Java project. Or if I learned graphics programming
| I would write a graphics program, or at least contribute to a
| free/open-source one. Through this, I would take all the theory I
| had learned over some months and ground it and manifest it in
| real work.
|
| Also you would probably do well to get on CS department mailing
| lists, and check the bulletin board or whatever for internship
| listings.
|
| I was surprised how lackadaisical some kids took it. Maybe it was
| their youth. I have seen many people parlay their CS skills into
| everything from a well-paying job, to parlaying it into an
| enormous amount of money. So I went above and beyond. I recall
| one homework where we had to talk about process schedulers,
| something I was always interested in but never stopped to read
| about. I figure in the first half hour of work, I already had
| gotten an A, but I spent hours and hours reading about process
| schedulers before turning in my homework.
|
| I recall speaking to a bunch of the brighter CS seniors, and I
| mentioned something about version control. "Version control?" one
| said. I said, "Yes, you know, like git". "Git?" he said. None of
| them knew what version control was. You should know things like
| that before your first job interview, taking classes is not
| enough. It's good to know what algorithms are linear big O, and
| which are exponential, but you are going to have to learn some
| things they won't teach you in class to get a job. I would
| suggest going to Github, finding a project that has merged pull
| requests from a number of contributors recently, and looking at
| contributing a pull request to that project. Then at least you'll
| get an idea of what work is - someone posts a bug to issues, you
| look at it, you fix it and put up a pull request, then someone
| with more (or equivalent) experience looks at it and either gives
| you some pointers, or merges your changes. At work you will be
| doing similar stuff.
| mnky9800n wrote:
| Paying for mooc courses from your University is going to suck. I
| would defer if I was you assuming your University will be having
| some sort of crazy online or hybrid thing in the fall due to
| covid19.
| nlawalker wrote:
| Not to imply you're not ready, but in response to "I've been
| coding since I was young, so I'm not worried about struggling
| academically":
|
| _" Computer science is no more about computers than astronomy is
| about telescopes."_
|
| Depending on the nature of what your department offers, be
| prepared to learn about, spend time on and potentially struggle
| with concepts that have _nothing_ to do with coding or software
| engineering as you might be familiar with it, or even sitting in
| front of a computer.
| xyzwave wrote:
| Such a timeless quote. I believe this is the source:
|
| https://youtu.be/2Op3QLzMgSY
|
| While there, SICP is not a bad way to augment a CS degree :-)
| Gmw1999 wrote:
| My advice as someone who was in the same position and has just
| done a year in industry and about to go back and do my final year
| of CS (UK), is make sure you enjoy yourself and learn how to
| manage your time as this will help dramatically. Then during this
| time if you can learn parts of the syllabus, so it's not the
| first time you hear about it when going into a lecture. Find your
| niche what interests you, and gets you excited, talk to your
| lectures about that stuff, that can help later, especially if you
| get bored or want to go into research. Overall spend time doing
| side projects, enjoying learning, part taking in clubs and
| societies and if you find it easy find something to challenge
| you! If you want to ask me anything more about my experience so
| far, feel free to send a message (email in bio)
| yawz wrote:
| This! You should never lose the curiosity and drive that made you
| ask a question here. I would argue this is the most important
| thing you need for good first steps in your career and in life.
| cushychicken wrote:
| You squander a big benefit of going to college if you focus
| solely on academics.
|
| This is one of the only times in your life you will have a ton of
| free time and proximity to a bunch of smart people your own age.
| Don't pass up an opportunity to do something fun, just because it
| doesn't have anything to do with school!
| verdverm wrote:
| Learn your first (class's) language now, so when you are learning
| you can focus on concepts not syntax.
|
| Learn bash and master the terminal, bash programming guide,
| advanced bash PG, https://github.com/hofstadter-io/jumpfiles
|
| Consider Vim
|
| Be involved in the CS groups, this is where the smartest people
| are
|
| Talk to your faculty all the time
|
| Get into research
|
| Build things that aren't for class
|
| Hit me if you like, email is in my profile
|
| Good luck!
| sesuximo wrote:
| Make friends with the TAs. In a year or two, they'll be able to
| refer you for internships.
| javajosh wrote:
| Learn to meditate, find a sport that you like and do it
| regularly, take a class on how to learn (Coursera has a good one
| "Learning how to Learn"), and take a class on how to take good
| notes. You might also want to study up on personal organization
| and personal finance.
|
| WRT study groups, YMMV. I found them incredibly stressful and
| counter-productive, but other people really seemed to like them.
| Eventually I actively avoided them.
|
| Start your projects as soon as possible, and then put them aside.
| You'll come back with new eyes, but your brain needs time to chew
| on it. Sadly, I think a lot of college courses go too fast, and
| sometimes you'll have an "aha!" moment months, or even years
| later. Not sure if there is a solution to this.
|
| Love is almost inevitable, and is almost always a huge disaster
| for everyone. It's possibly an even worse impact on study than
| video-game addiction. I would say try to avoid love, but honestly
| its wonderful. But if you feel lonely, feel lucky that you're not
| either distracted or heartbroken.
| enhdless wrote:
| Some thoughts I have as a CS student right now (for context, I
| grew up the in Bay Area and am a rising senior at UC Berkeley):
|
| - I started coding when I was young, and I still struggled
| academically. There is a difference between knowing how to code
| and understanding computer science. For me, I found discrete math
| and formal proofs extremely difficult.
|
| - It is very, very easy to get caught up in a constant mode of
| grinding CS hw/projects, especially if you're around a lot of
| studious people. Work smarter, not harder.
|
| - Grades aren't everything! If your main goal is to get a job,
| you don't need straight A's. No recruiter or manager has ever
| asked for my GPA.
|
| - Take classes outside of CS. Have hobbies outside of coding.
| Make friends who are studying different disciplines. You need
| outside perspectives to better understand the impact of
| technology on the world. Be aware of life outside the tech
| industry. Recognize software engineering as a tool to apply to
| issues.
|
| - You'll meet people from so many different backgrounds. Some
| people come from high schools that taught Java and some people
| come from high schools that are not able offer any technology-
| related classes. Remember that some people are learning to code
| for the first time in their life!
|
| For getting an internship (assuming you're interested in a SWE
| role):
|
| - First of all, it's perfectly fine to not have an internship!!
| You can take classes, do research, work on side projects, etc.
|
| - If you don't have prior job experience, spend some time on side
| projects (that are meaningful to you!!) to demonstrate your
| technical abilities.
|
| - Have someone who is more experienced review your resume.
|
| - You might hear that it's very difficult to get an internship
| straight out of freshman year. Honestly, at that stage, it's just
| a numbers game-the more online applications you throw your resume
| at, the more likely you'll get an interview.
|
| - Don't discount career fairs on campus! I used to think they
| wouldn't be helpful because they were so crowded, but I got my
| internship after freshman year by talking to a manager at a
| career fair.
|
| - Be able to clearly and succinctly describe yourself and your
| goals. What are your interests, and why? How do your hobbies
| and/or past experience support those interests?
| newqaz wrote:
| Discrete math topics teach amazing way to think that most people
| never get to see in high school. Knowing stuff in free a book
| like [0] is immensely helpful. There are a ton of decent
| introductory discrete math books like the ones by Susanna Epp, Ed
| Scheinerman, Goranko bros and Gary Chartrand. Just google "list
| of discrete math book". What google spits out won't even scratch
| the surface of what's available out there. But modern CS folk
| will have to know much more than the basics of discrete math. For
| example, math analysis and probability theory are very helpful.
| This free book [1] gives a sampling of such topics. As
| preparation, one can start by looking at pre-real-analysis books
| like the ones by Lara Alcock and Jay Cummings, Linear Algebra by
| Kuldeep Singh and Probability Theory by Dimitri
| Bertsekas/Tsitsiklis. These books are very easy to read. There
| are also introductory books that give a bare-bones sampling of
| most undergrad math subjects from abstract algebra to topology
| like the ones by Gary Chartrand (separate from his discrete math
| book) and Steve Warner. Such books are designed to be as hand-
| holdy as possible. The more I type the more I realize there's
| more (much, much, much more) to say about the math side of
| things. Anyway, for another thing, google category theory just to
| be aware of it. There are a few undergrad/high school level books
| on the subject, but I am not sure how useful that is to a
| freshman.
|
| [0] Book Of Proof by Richard Hammack
|
| https://www.people.vcu.edu/~rhammack/BookOfProof/
|
| [1]Foundations of Data Science by Avrim Blum, John Hopcroft, and
| Ravindran Kannan
|
| https://www.cs.cornell.edu/jeh/book%20no%20so;utions%20March...
| MattGaiser wrote:
| Hackathons! Check out Major League Hacking. It is a ton of fun
| and the prizes have been quite useful when job searching.
| _hardwaregeek wrote:
| I've written a lot about this. If you want a job, start applying
| early. But don't feel like you have to get one immediately. If
| you're sufficiently motivated, consider taking time off to work
| on your own projects.
|
| 1. Don't take all CS classes. Try other subjects and diversify
| your knowledge. 2. Get good at sending emails. It can help you
| get a job, get contacts or just gather information. 3. Even
| though you should take non-CS courses, that doesn't mean you
| should get a double major. It's not always worth it. 4. Make sure
| you like CS. Having experience is a good sign, but people can be
| advanced or good at a subject they don't like. Make sure you like
| it even when it gets tough.
|
| [1]: https://blog.torchnyu.com/2020/03/04/take-fewer-cs-
| classes.h... [2]: https://blog.torchnyu.com/2019/12/19/sent-from-
| my-iphone.htm... [3]: https://blog.torchnyu.com/2020/05/15/the-
| case-against-double... [4]:
| https://blog.torchnyu.com/2020/05/14/do-you-like-it.html
| theduder99 wrote:
| don't go straight through college fast as possible. take some
| internships along the way. If I see a resume that only includes
| class based projects, it is an immediate skiperino.
| readingnews wrote:
| As a CS professor, the main thing most incoming freshmen are
| lacking in is MATH skills. If the weed out courses of "can you
| think algorithmically" do not get them, the math department will.
| So many students too far behind in math.
|
| I would second a number of comments on here like "study another
| subject" (most CS courses require a minor outside of CS, other
| than MATH, which you should get a minor in just due to the
| numbers)
|
| I would also second the idea that CS in college is not coding, is
| not SW engineering, etc. It is learning fundamentals and how to
| prove your code is correct, mathematically and algorithmically.
| jimhefferon wrote:
| Lot of good advice here. Another is: take courses in accounting
| and management.
|
| First of all, the path up from being a coder is to lead a group
| of coders. Second-- who knew? -- a lot of this stuff is
| interesting.
| caymanjim wrote:
| CS undergrad will teach you principles and fundamentals, but
| won't teach you much of anything about actually writing software.
| Make sure you learn practical skills, like organizing large
| projects, deploying, scaling, tools, etc. You'll be exposed to
| some of this, but I've never met a CS grad who could hit the
| ground running unless they'd already been working as well. Get
| internships as early as possible. Work on large team projects and
| learn some structured planning and estimation skills. Learn Unix
| deeply. Don't skimp on the math and statistics, because while you
| might not need it for a decade (or ever), knowing math opens a
| lot of doors (NASA, finance, machine learning, and also general
| utility).
| ykevinator wrote:
| You just have to know one thing- cs takes more time than you
| think. It's normal to spend 4 hours a night, your non-cs friends
| are going out, you can't. Everyone's going to the game, you
| can't. Don't get upset because it takes time. Literally, some
| homework may take 4 hours. Just accept that and you'll enjoy it
| and you'll do well. If you think it's an hour a night of work,
| you will fail.
| kleiba wrote:
| Don't forget your social life. Don't forget to study.
| zengid wrote:
| Two main points. Care about the details, but don't get
| overwhelmed.
|
| 1) Care about the details. Programming languages are incredibly
| powerful, but there is a lot of subtle effects that even a tiny
| change of syntax can make (`*` vs `&` in C++ for instance). Try
| to pay attention to these details and their implications, because
| that is the key to get to being more productive and also to not
| making costly mistakes.
|
| That being said, there is a limit to how many details you can
| keep in your head at one time, so:
|
| 2) Don't get overwhelmed. Just try to focus on the problems
| you're trying to solve, and take a first step towards solving it.
| IT WON'T BE PERFECT! Just keep going, and always acknowledge that
| there might be a better solution if you need to go back and
| improve on what you have. This is what I believe technical
| interviewers will be looking for: "Can this individual solve
| problems, and know the value of the trade-offs at hand. Do they
| know why choosing 'x' over 'y' is the better choice in this
| situation, and do they also know the cost of choosing 'x' now?".
| You can only spend so much time worrying about details if you
| have a deadline to meet, so sometimes you just have to make a
| decision and live with it.
|
| Good luck and godspeed.
| dehrmann wrote:
| Be mindful of your program's retention rate. My first CS class
| has a very bimodal distribution (this is common in CS classes),
| and about half the students weren't in the followup class next
| semester. We lost another third after that semester. The
| engineering program at my school was run similarly--only about a
| third of students entering the program would graduate with an
| engineering degree.
|
| Not every school is run like this, but it's something to be aware
| of.
|
| Don't immediately freak out if you get a 70% on your first
| Physics exam. A lot of science and math classes are graded on
| curves, and professors don't want to see too many (or any)
| perfect scores. I had one class where 25% was the lowest passing
| score on an exam.
|
| Especially at research universities, professors are often more
| interested in research than teaching. Even when it's not
| obviously that bad, they're worse at teaching and care less than
| the average high school teacher.
|
| Try to get out and have some fun.
|
| Also do something that's somehow very different than programming.
| I majored in CS, but got three minors (two in liberal arts), and
| even found time to take a golf class and a scientific
| glassblowing class. But even intramural sports are good.
| RNeff wrote:
| College is more than just learning a vocation. Another goal is
| evolving yourself into a well rounded human being. Each quarter /
| semester take one course outside your comfort zone. Public
| speaking, improv theater, drawing, photography, music,
| philosophy, film production, drama, writing. Join a non-tech
| club. Learn new stuff, and how to relate to non-nerds. Expand
| your abilities, world view, and persistence.
| schoolornot wrote:
| I think more people who be apt to do this if electives were
| pass/fail. There were tons of interesting classes available
| that I could have taken but chose not to because I had a decent
| GPA in major reqs.
| MattGaiser wrote:
| My university gives certain faculties a certain number of
| pass/fails for this very reason.
| dahart wrote:
| > I'm more interested in knowing what I should do now to give me
| an advantage in getting a job or otherwise.
|
| Always stay curious, challenge yourself, and have fun.
|
| Take charge of your education, talk to your professors during
| class, visit them during office hours, interrupt the class to ask
| questions when you don't understand. I was always scared to be
| noisy in public, but finally discovered in a grad school math
| class that when I didn't get it and I spoke up, other people in
| the class would thank me later because they were in the same
| boat, and I learned faster.
|
| Try to find an undergrad research project.
|
| Do an internship between junior & senior year.
|
| When you're a senior, start researching which companies you like.
| Read about job interviews and how to do well. Practice some job
| interviews! You'll be ahead of the majority of applicants if you
| do any practicing at all. Learn what companies want. (Hint:
| superior coding skills often aren't the top item in their list.)
|
| Also, exercise (I'm not kidding, it doesn't matter how, but this
| will help your CS career, your life, and your job prospects.)
| abhinuvpitale wrote:
| This probably sounds too cheesy, but don't forget to have fun!
| So, try different domains of CS, and see which one excites you
| the most!
|
| There are a lot of subtleties of programming, algorithms and
| there are enough domains to choose from. So, don't follow the
| crowd, try enough new things to know what excites you, and then
| be a master at it!
| currymj wrote:
| take linear algebra ASAP. it's probably the single most useful
| course you can take at a university.
| dehrmann wrote:
| I'm trying to decide what the right call is if school is online-
| only in the fall. On one hand, a lot of what you're paying for is
| in-person instruction and all the other experiences you get in
| college. If it's online, it's not worth $5k-$10k for a semester.
| On the other, if a college says you can defer, there might not be
| room in a year because of how many people deferred, and the
| longer your break between high school and college, you're either
| less likely to actually go to college or less likely to graduate.
| dilap wrote:
| look into ACM aka ICPC programming competitions -- super-fun,
| you'll learn tons, & job interviews will seem easy in comparison
| zekehernandez wrote:
| You should know why you want a degree in CS. Because if it's
| solely to get a job in software development, know that it's one
| of the longest and most expensive ways to reach that goal,
| especially since you've been coding for such a long time. There
| are many other reasons one would want to go to college, and if
| they apply to you, feel free to disregard this comment. But to
| reiterate, if your only goal is to be a software developer, I
| would try to see if someone will hire you with the experience you
| have now, or maybe do a bootcamp of sorts.
|
| Let me add more nuance: I'm not trying to say that a CS major
| won't be valuable to a software developer, or that it doesn't
| have advantages over a bootcamp-like thing, or just raw
| experience. But there are tradeoffs, and I think a lot depends on
| what kind of software development you want to do.
| mixmastamyk wrote:
| Disagree. Skip a CS degree and be instantly skipped over for
| coveted jobs. Sure you'll still get _a_ job. Ask me how I know.
| Ologn wrote:
| I think these are good times for this theory of not needing a
| CS degree to be tested. I am thinking of Google's recent
| rescinding of offers to thousands of contractors, or the
| latest from https://layoffs.fyi/tracker . Lots of companies
| have frozen hiring.
|
| I know I would not want to be among the "I did some coding on
| my own, and a bootcamp for a few months" brigade. Also
| someone is of this age and is not thinking of it, but in some
| years time how will they feel in tough times when they have
| no degree and have a mortgage and kids, and the wife just
| told them another kid is on the way, and their current job is
| shaky or they just got laid off?
|
| Of course you can always point to outliers like John Carmack
| and what have you.
|
| I don't see how getting a CS degree is "the longest" way to
| reach that goal. You will have to learn most of this stuff
| any how (unless you never learn it and want to be doing low
| level low paying CRUD work in thirty years). The only
| difference is you get a degree when doing it, plus professors
| with office hours, peers studying the same thing you are etc.
| College is flexible - you can study for four years, or you
| can get a full-time job and take one class a semester at
| night or on weekends. The latter way is longer, but
| eventually you graduate.
|
| As far as expenses - you can go to an expensive private
| school, or you can go to an affordable but decent state
| school. And if you want an impressive college name at some
| point but money is an issue at the moment - get a Bachelor's
| from a state school, then get an advanced degree at a fancy,
| expensive school at some future point.
|
| Look at all the layoffs and rescinded offers and hiring
| freezes and ask if you would prefer not to have a degree now.
| If you send your resume in but you don't get a response from
| a high percentage of them - maybe it's because they got a lot
| of resumes, and only kept the ones of people who had degrees.
| dehrmann wrote:
| > I know I would not want to be among the "I did some
| coding on my own, and a bootcamp for a few months" brigade.
|
| Especially when the resume next to yours is someone from a
| top-20 CS program who's been at AirbnUberLyft for 4 years.
| fish45 wrote:
| To be honest, I would consider finding some sort of bootcamp
| type thing if not for my parents being pretty dead set on
| college. I do have a lot of stuff I want to learn which will,
| in my limited experience, be a lot easier to to understand with
| a formal education.
|
| I've been looking for a software dev job for the past few
| months and almost everything I've found that's more than a
| WordPress/shopify job wants a bachelor's. Do you have any
| advice for getting a software dev job straight out of high
| school?
| jrumbut wrote:
| Start with a WordPress/Shopify job and then look for ways to
| expand your horizons.
|
| Struggling startups, small consulting companies, they also
| have more ability to bring someone in straight out of high
| school so even if they say "bachelor's required" still apply.
| mikaelmello wrote:
| That depends on what type of job and career you are looking
| for, CS is a pretty broad field.
|
| If you are looking for one of those high paying jobs in the
| top companies and want them without a degree, you will need
| to impress much more than your graduated peers.
| analog31 wrote:
| I graduated from high school in 1982, and already knew how to
| program. I was keenly interested in programming, and my mom
| was teaching intro CS courses at a local community college.
| Now her advice may be outdated, but it was that programming
| _per se_ is too easy to justify 4 years of college study, if
| that 's what you want to do for a living. Also at the time,
| many of the colleges didn't really have full blown CS
| departments.
|
| I ended up teaching myself programming (and electronics)
| while doing a double major in math and physics, which led me
| to develop enough of an interest that I continued in physics
| through grad school.
|
| I had a summer internship at a computing facility, which led
| me to think that a pure programming job would actually be
| kind of boring. Again, this was long ago, and is related to
| my interests and not yours.
|
| Today, I program. A lot. In fact, if you walk past my office
| (my basement right now), you've got a 50% or better chance of
| seeing a code editor up on my screen. But I use programming
| as a problem solving tool, and am not employed as a
| programmer. Good programming skill is a "force multiplier"
| for virtually any occupation.
|
| One thing about college is that _many_ students change their
| majors. College is a place where you can be exposed to a
| whole variety of fields, and where you can soak up the vibe
| of a field and get excited about it. I don 't know where I'd
| have found my love of physics at a coding boot camp.
|
| CS attracts a lot of students who are interested in
| computers, or who hear that it's lucrative, but are not
| necessarily interested in computer science as an end unto
| itself. But, figuring this out is part of the college
| experience!
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