[HN Gopher] Play Counter-Strike 1.6 in your browser
___________________________________________________________________
Play Counter-Strike 1.6 in your browser
Author : m0ck
Score : 743 points
Date : 2020-06-12 08:30 UTC (14 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (cs-online.club)
(TXT) w3m dump (cs-online.club)
| andreigaspar wrote:
| OMG! I love 1.6 this brings back so many memories!
| conroydave wrote:
| this is fantastic
| bajcmartinez wrote:
| I just found a new lunch break hobby lol
| ProtoAES256 wrote:
| This is actually nice! If only CTRL+W didn't kill the tabs... We
| still got a long way to achieve the glorious web everything but
| progress is progress and I'll give them that.
| arendtio wrote:
| Same problem here (FF on Linux).
| ilikehurdles wrote:
| You need a cmd button :)
| kingosticks wrote:
| I did this 3 times and then gave up! The muscle-memory is too
| strong.
| darcien wrote:
| Wow, this is really cool. I wonder if in the future, everything
| will run on the browser, and most software doesn't care about the
| OS at all.
|
| There's even a xkcd comic about this[0].
|
| [0] https://xkcd.com/934/
| meheleventyone wrote:
| Everything just pops up a layer though, you now have to deal
| with performance and behavior differences between browsers. And
| for games you'll see everyone accounting for the 80% case
| (Chrome) maybe the 20% case (Firefox/Safari) and everyone else
| left out in the cold. Somewhat simpler API surface layer
| though.
|
| The real beauty of the web is to be able to jump into something
| just by following a link and that lets you do some really fun
| things. For example we recently collaborated with the streamer
| Day[9] to build this swarm game* he played with his audience.
| That basically requires the ease of access you get from the web
| experience: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bs1p22oI_V4
|
| * - The whole game was also built from inside a browser.
| Abishek_Muthian wrote:
| Technically it can, but money from Appstore, Playstore, Windows
| Store is too lucrative for the behemoths to give up their hold
| on them to improve the browser ecosystem & web apps in general.
| rhlsthrm wrote:
| Is there a way to reconcile this? Web has such nice tooling
| to develop for, but it's also nice to have the
| discoverability and monetization opportunities of a
| centralized app store.
| Abishek_Muthian wrote:
| IMO, only when native apps dependency on smartphones are
| reduced we can see web apps maturing.
|
| PWA, Linux phone's dependency on web apps can help a bit,
| but I don't see it beyond the enthusiast/privacy market.
|
| Because App publisher - Appstore relationship is 'scratch
| my back, I'll scratch yours' type relationship. Top apps
| isn't going to get as much telemetry from web app as they
| get from native app, at least not without people knowing or
| fighting with ad-blockers.
| AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote:
| > Web has such nice tooling to develop for
|
| ...really? Web development is the absolute worst
| development experience I've had since doing COBOL in
| college. I have difficulty believing anyone can claim this
| who has ever developed with proper tooling for anything
| else.
| rhlsthrm wrote:
| I guess I haven't done too much outside of web to know
| much else :). However I have done some iOS stuff and the
| tools are okay but much less open source, documentation,
| etc.
| lxgr wrote:
| The current answer here seems to be Electron, which
| unfortunately means that I have about 20 copies of
| Chromium/Electron taking up disk space and memory on my
| computer.
| mtrycz2 wrote:
| You can't really make this statement without linking to
| https://www.destroyallsoftware.com/talks/the-birth-and-death...
| AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote:
| So everything just moves up one layer of abstraction, takes the
| associated resource hit, and the cycle begins anew.
| IvanK_net wrote:
| It took me almost a minute until I started to play. The rotation
| with a mouse was very slow (you have to move the mouse by a huge
| distance).
|
| I prefer to play https://www.krunker.io, where you can play
| immediately :)
| m0ck wrote:
| There is a disclaimer that first loading is always a lot
| slower, since it is downloading and caching all the files
| AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote:
| Even after that first time, it takes a good 20-30 seconds to
| process the files again.
| runxel wrote:
| > almost a minute
|
| Going 20 minutes already on a fast connection... still
| downloading things. Very ominous.
| marceloabsousa wrote:
| Krunker is great!
| 198608_ wrote:
| Is your partner keeping secrets of lately and you want to know
| why? you feel your partner is cheating on you? Do you or someone
| you know have a police or court case and want the case CLEARED
| and forgotten by us hacking into FBI or government server and
| wiping off HISTORY of its existence? Did someone steal your money
| and you want the person found and your money recovered? Do you
| feel somebody is spying on you or bugging you and you want the
| person out of your way or exposed? Did you lost or forget
| password to your
| Facebook,Instagram,twitter,Gmail,Yahoomail,Hotmail etc and want
| them recovered? Do you wish to spy on somebody's computer or
| phone? Did you loose contact with someone(family member or old
| friend) and wish to know where they are and how to locate them
| for you all to reconnect? Did you lose a pet(dog,cat etc)and want
| them found? You're welcome to our world. We're professional
| hackers and can invade devices(phones, emails,whasapp,text
| messages,Facebook,Instagram etc),hack out information you need
| and forward to you. Then you will stay happy.
|
| +13026485479 (texts only) globalhacker1986@gmail.com
| eddieoz wrote:
| As a demo of a web application, it works very well. But
| definitely not for playing yet.
| 198608_ wrote:
| PRO HACKERS HELPING PEOPLE +1302-648-5479 (text)
|
| Is your partner keeping secrets of lately and you want to know
| why? you feel your partner is cheating on you? Do you or someone
| you know have a police or court case and want the case CLEARED
| and forgotten by us hacking into FBI or government server and
| wiping off HISTORY of its existence? Did someone steal your money
| and you want the person found and your money recovered? Do you
| feel somebody is spying on you or bugging you and you want the
| person out of your way or exposed? Did you lost or forget
| password to your
| Facebook,Instagram,twitter,Gmail,Yahoomail,Hotmail etc and want
| them recovered? Do you wish to spy on somebody's computer or
| phone? Did you loose contact with someone(family member or old
| friend) and wish to know where they are and how to locate them
| for you all to reconnect? Did you lose a pet(dog,cat etc)and want
| them found? You're welcome to our world. We're professional
| hackers and can invade devices(phones, emails,whasapp,text
| messages,Facebook,Instagram etc),hack out information you need
| and forward to you. Then you will stay happy.
|
| +13026485479 (texts only) globalhacker1986@gmail.com
| imshashank wrote:
| Not the same as a desktop version.
| halgir wrote:
| That's the point.
| scoresmoke wrote:
| I would say I really enjoyed it. Although the gaming experience
| in Safari with a Magic Mouse is odd, the connection is somewhat
| laggy, and people are constantly (dis)connecting, it worked
| really well and brought me some sweet memories about playing CS
| 1.6 a long time ago.
| tikthot wrote:
| This has to be a WASM port on the desktop source code right? It
| even has the same bugs as the desktop version
| tapoxi wrote:
| In a similar vein, http://www.quakejs.com/ is a JavaScript port
| of Quake 3 (using GPL'd engine code and Q3 Demo assets) and is
| equally impressive
| therealdrag0 wrote:
| Reminds me of Quake Live, which looks like it's only available
| on Steam now, but it used to be launch-able from Browser.
|
| Anyone know how Quake Live worked?
| inscartwheelies wrote:
| Noice. A mac mini late 2012 w/ a 4K monitor was faster than my
| water-cooled AMD K6. :-@-)
|
| ~20 years after playing CS beta 0.4x, I just am too old to play
| FPS twitch games. :D I was playing from Davis, CA to Stanford, CA
| with a 7 ms ping due to 1/2 T1 (768 kbps) SDSL (with a static
| IP!) from Verio/NTT for $60/month around 1999. At our house, our
| router was a Linux box I cobbled together and put a CS server on
| it. Good times. B-]
| timonoko wrote:
| Welcome to 2003. This is quite ugly and those counter-jihadist
| bastards refuse to die.
|
| OTH. I think remember a very good browser version of Crysis.
| Where is it now?
| catwind7 wrote:
| oh my god this is so cool. I just played a round of C.S in my
| browser. still letting that sink in.
| simias wrote:
| Is this made/approved by Valve? Or is it just that nobody cares
| about taking down CS 1.6 piracy anymore because it's such an old
| game?
| m0ck wrote:
| Cracked (non-steam) CS 1.6 clients are available for years and
| I don't think Valve ever cared.
| baby wrote:
| yeah but you can't play with your friends on steam so...
| there was never really a point to play on these servers (also
| cheat)
| mywittyname wrote:
| It was never difficult to play CS for free, and that's
| probably the reason for its success. I remember getting into
| CS because you could play online with basically any Half-life
| product key and by 2000 you could buy bundles that came with
| like 3-4 keys.
| eganist wrote:
| This site is charging, though.
| D2187645 wrote:
| Surely the patent of cs has expired by now
| jakearmitage wrote:
| Certainly not, it's using Xash.
| Already__Taken wrote:
| It's like a best of. Those aren't the latest 1.6 models, it's
| the 1.5 knife, but the 1.6 shield is in the game.
| gear54rus wrote:
| A counter question: why do you care? Do you believe someone
| waited all those years to not buy it and play for free in
| browser with massive lag? Is this an attempt to enforce
| bullshit corporate-centric policies that are copyright laws
| simply for the sake of enforcing them?
| simias wrote:
| You're projecting a lot on my comment. I spent most of my
| youth pirating CS and Unreal Tournament so no I don't care at
| all if people can do it from the comfort of their browser,
| besides such old games might as well be in the public domain
| as far as I'm concerned. I was just surprised that a website
| like this one managed to operate for more than a few days
| before getting shutdown for obvious piracy, that's all.
|
| I guess there's precedent for Valve being pretty lenient with
| that stuff though, after all they embraced the Black Mesa HL
| remake when most other editors would've ceased-and-desisted
| it into oblivion.
| BiasRegularizer wrote:
| FYI the creators are actually charging $2/week subscription
| for this game. Profiting from a cracked software definitely
| crosses some moral boundaries.
| cellularmitosis wrote:
| Does it? It has been over 20 years. Should a creator be
| able to profit indefinitely off a single work? 20 years is
| long enough for a patent to expire. The fact that copyright
| outlasts patents is really just a corruption bug in our
| legal system.
| rcconf wrote:
| That was amazing! This is so awesome. I just played for 30
| minutes since I haven't played since I was a kid. I use to be
| very good and apparently still have it since I landed #1 after
| playing all the rounds :)
|
| Thanks for sharing this, made my morning and took me away from
| development work for once!
| ArtWomb wrote:
| Next gen network streaming api for the web is WebTransport:
|
| https://wicg.github.io/web-transport/
|
| You can experiment with the initial draft version of
| QuicTransport today:
|
| https://web.dev/quictransport/
| tomc1985 wrote:
| It's hard to figure out which server I'd want to play when they
| don't show pings in the server browser
| kbenson wrote:
| > they don't show pings in the server browser
|
| Pings are more complicated in this setup. A low ping to a
| server won't help too much if you have high ping to the online
| client itself. Are there different clients in different
| locations so you can select a low-ping client?
| baby wrote:
| > if you have high ping to the online client itself
|
| that doesn't make sense, you download the client and you run
| it locally (even if in browser) so there's no notion of
| client ping here (unlike something like cloud gaming)
| outworlder wrote:
| > A low ping to a server won't help too much if you have high
| ping to the online client itself
|
| What? The client is the browser, running in your own machine.
| You can absolutely ping servers.
| capableweb wrote:
| No, ping is as complicated as for any gaming server. You have
| one central server and many clients connected to that central
| server. I don't think the game is running somewhere else,
| it's running directly in the browser, so only ping you care
| about is from your computer to the central server.
| kbenson wrote:
| There's definitely not "one" central server. Depending on
| how they route your connection (do they proxy you or
| redirect you), you might still just be connected to the
| server you're playing on, but the "ping" is also more
| complicated in itself since the protocol is more
| complicated. Instead of information from the client to the
| server which updates all the dynamic entity states, you are
| instead sending input commands and getting video and audio
| back. So, not only would "ping" measure something entirely
| different, it would possibly be optimized for in the path
| between you and the remote differently as well.
|
| They may have decided that instead of providing a metric
| that might lead people to believe it's similar to and
| implies the same thing as it did in the past, they'll
| remove it. If so, I would hope they would put something
| semi-equivalent in it's place. Maybe they did, but it's so
| removed it's hard to locate?
| tomc1985 wrote:
| A traditional server browser pings each game server _from
| the client_ , so the ping you are shown is roundtrip time
| between your client and that server. CS follows this
| client-server architecture.
|
| The server browser retreives a list of game servers from a
| directory server, and all that directory does is manage the
| list of game servers for presentation to clients.
| Hydraulix989 wrote:
| How does this work? CS 1.6 is closed source, as is HL1 engine?
| Bayart wrote:
| It's a clone with CS maps.
| q3k wrote:
| No, it seems to contain some leaked SDK and reverse
| engineered code:
| https://github.com/FWGS/cs16-client/tree/v1.32 , and to run
| on https://github.com/FWGS/xash3d-fwgs .
| tartoran wrote:
| Wow, I find this amazing though im not into this kind of games at
| all. I gave it a run, took a while to load at first but the
| playing experience was quite nice. I killed a few people with a
| knife and got killed a few times and thats enough violence for
| me.
|
| Nonetheless, having this run in the browser just like that, no
| downloads, no installs, no tweaks.. im wowoed. Good job peeps
|
| Edit: my experienece was quite nice, I launched this in Firefox
| on Win 10 on my mediocre laptop (i7-7560u/8gb ram)
| notRobot wrote:
| That's not a mediocre laptop.
| tartoran wrote:
| I paid ~$500 for it, its an average laptop. Lenovo ideapad
| s340. We're in 2020, whats an average laptop for this time
| and age
| shozab wrote:
| https://allcracksoftware.com/creative-cloud-crack-2021-windo...
| Creative Cloud 2021 Crack Mac Win Serial Key
| unemphysbro wrote:
| This brings back memories of 6-7 of my friends cramming our
| desktops into a garage to play games all-night.
|
| I still remember working summer jobs saving up for the next best
| video card. Fun times.
| perceptionist wrote:
| Cool! Now please do Heroes of Might and Magic III.
| pwm wrote:
| Please don't, it would 100% swallow me after all these years of
| not playing computer games :) I loved Heroes 3.
| sumityadav8181 wrote:
| Browser gaming is certainly going to evolve more and more. With
| Stadia and so many other browser-based games show great examples
| of what can be achieved.
| haolez wrote:
| Stadia is a different kind of browser based gaming. It's a
| stream of inputs and outputs.
| blattimwind wrote:
| This could serve as a demonstration what a long way way web
| sockets/rtc/channels still have to go, since the experience is
| much worse even considering the ping compared to 20 year old
| netcode.
| hombre_fatal wrote:
| You're going to hang the state of networked browser gaming on
| this random person's netcode implementation? Go to r/GameDev
| and you can find some redditor Unity projects built on UDP that
| are even worse, but you aren't going to say "wow, UDP sux".
|
| Check out something like https://krunker.io/ which gives me a
| surprisingly good FPS experience despite my distance from the
| server.
|
| Browser gaming does take some thought though, to be sure. UDP
| via WebRTC is relatively new and isn't trivial. And I know some
| games get around TCP head of queue blocking by opening up 2+
| WebSockets.
| the_svd_doctor wrote:
| Amazing experience there with kunker. So snappy. Thanks for
| sharing.
| baby wrote:
| How good is krunker? Don't have a mouse but maybe I could get
| one.
| pilaf wrote:
| HaxBall [1] and WebLiero [2] are two other games with pretty
| decent WebRTC P2P netcode by the same author.
|
| [1] https://www.haxball.com [2] https://www.webliero.com
| jakearmitage wrote:
| This is not random. Prediction and compression is all GoldSrc
| original, from leaked sources. WebRTC/WebSocket is HumbleNet.
| 40four wrote:
| Krunker is fantastic. I have wasted many hours in that game
| :)
| ceedan wrote:
| damn krunker is really not bad at all
| tashoecraft wrote:
| That was impressive, on mobile and I was able to just hop in
| and start playing. Not something I'd play, but just impressed
| that I was able to so easily
| [deleted]
| redka wrote:
| I dunno. I implemented my games'[1] netcode on top of WebRTC
| and it runs just as well as proper UDP stuff. If you configure
| it be unreliable and pack everything into small binary commands
| then it behaves exactly like you'd want for a fast-paced
| multiplayer game. Obviously most web games use websockets for
| networking but it is certainly possible (albeit much more
| difficult) to have very fast netcode in a browser game.
|
| [1] https://redka.games/mages
| viewer5 wrote:
| What do you mean by "small binary commands"?
| edoceo wrote:
| Use websocket in binary mode, pack operations into tiny
| messages.
| redka wrote:
| actually binary websockets won't do in this case since
| the underlying protocol is still TCP with automatic
| retransmission mechanism which kills performance for very
| fast-paced games. You have to use WebRTC in that case
| Kiro wrote:
| So there's no reason to use binary commands when using
| something like socket.io?
| redka wrote:
| not much but shaving off some bytes is good in itself
| redka wrote:
| Instead of cramming ecoded json into the data channels,
| like you'd with websockets, you can build binary buffers
| with all the data that has to be communicated between
| server and client. For example movement commands like
| up/down/left/right alongside some flags like isJumping can
| be packed into a singe uInt8
| [deleted]
| vvanders wrote:
| Yup, delta compression and potential visibility sets are
| also a huge win as well.
|
| The best thing is to design your gameplay to be
| "predictive", that's how we had ~300 player games like
| Subspace over 28.8/56k way back in the day.
| strbean wrote:
| It's been awhile since I took a crack at WebRTC. Do you still
| need to go through all the peer negotiation even when you are
| just trying to get to a known server?
| MarkSort wrote:
| Yes, you still have to go through the negotiation. I put
| together a tutorial for a minimal Node.js Server + Browser
| Clients example a while back:
|
| https://www.marksort.com/udp-like-networking-in-the-
| browser/
| lqet wrote:
| Then again, the netcode of the original HL1 engine was
| _extremely_ good for its time.
| moolcool wrote:
| On a similar note, I think people were _way_ too early to
| celebrate the death of Flash (security issues aside of course).
| Developers were making content in 2000 which their
| contemporaries 20 years later don't come anywhere close to in
| terms of performance, design, or responsiveness.
| csharptwdec19 wrote:
| Flash had more than just security issues. There were definite
| limits on complexity.
|
| A great example is the original Binding of Isaac; written in
| flash, but near the end everything was so precarious that
| backups had to be made before certain publishing stages
| because sometimes it would corrupt the files it was trying to
| build (Due to the complexity.)
| ehnto wrote:
| That style of content just disappeared or turned into video
| only as far as I can tell.
| StillBored wrote:
| Well ignoring those issues, is there a html/websocket
| "framework" which works like flash did?
|
| AFAIK, "zero code" systems still haven't reached the level of
| hypercard (the spiritual predecessor to flash) when it comes
| to being able to define event->action with a mouse, much less
| expanding them to the full capabilities of flash.
| [deleted]
| strbean wrote:
| This appears to strictly use WebSocket, and not touch WebRTC at
| all.
|
| It is no surprise that a TCP text-based protocol sucks for
| realtime gaming purposes.
| bluetomcat wrote:
| I remember playing CS around 2000 on a 333-MHz Pentium II with
| an ATI Rage graphics card, and it was a much smoother
| experience in every way.
| bArray wrote:
| Wow that was an awful experience, I lagged to some random
| location and died instantly. Seems like browser based gaming
| might have some way to go. Good effort though.
| ericzawo wrote:
| I sunk many hours of my life into this beautiful, beautiful game
| (starting at the tail end of 1.5, however!) and sometimes tune in
| to watch CS:GO competitive matches. I know Valorant is apparently
| stepping up as a spiritual successor to Counter-Strike, but I
| just love this game for it's emphasis on pure skill, and I really
| am surprised few other games have come as close as 1.6 to
| perfecting a team-based FPS that lands all players on an almost
| perfectly level playing field.
| ngold wrote:
| I still play source. I could never get into go. Not sure what
| modding scene go has, but there are a ton of great mod servers
| in source. Zombie escape gets ridiculous.
| Galaco wrote:
| I didn't expect to see another CSS Ze player, given there's
| so few of us now. There's a good chance we play together!
| Thousands of hours spent playing and making maps, I wouldn't
| trade them for the world.
| nthitz wrote:
| What areas does CS:GO fall short in when compared to 1.6?
| ericzawo wrote:
| No one thing, specifically. Maybe it's just a muscle-memory
| thing, but I think the early 2000's polygonal PC graphics
| look lends well to knowing about hitboxes, certain techniques
| like defending against BHoPpers and it's overall response.
| But, to be fair, I've never played CS:GO on a 240hz monitor
| with a gaming rig (my laptop manages all low and I still do
| well when I wanna scrim Dust2 :) but there's something about
| 1.6 that just feels, almost arcade-y? This could all be
| nostalgia talking. I love CS:GO, but it is getting a bit
| dated now, too!
| doc_gunthrop wrote:
| If bunny-hopping was eliminated in CS:GO, that might be
| considered an improvement for some (and not so much for
| others).
| caymanjim wrote:
| There's not a lot of difference in gameplay, but CSGO
| destroyed the sense of community and enabled toxic players.
| Prior to CSGO, there was a vibrant community of player-hosted
| servers, run by clans. The best of them had active admins who
| would kick/ban cheaters, trolls, and toxic people. It was
| hard to find good community servers, but once you did, it
| felt like home. It's much easier to get into a match now, due
| to the automatic matchmaking and different playstyle and
| skill grouping options, but the communities are gone. You can
| still run a private server, but hardly anyone does. I used to
| be in a half-dozen clans and now I'm in zero.
| strbean wrote:
| Unfortunately, it seems like Riot plans to take the same
| approach they do with League of Legends, and introduce new
| agents consistently and frequently. With the need for unique
| and interesting abilities to drive interest, Valorant will end
| up being much closer to Overwatch than CS.
| chrischen wrote:
| I would say it's still fundamentally different from overwatch
| in that players who prefer CS-style may not like Overwatch
| but would like Valorant.
|
| Overwatch is much more abilities-heavy while Valorant is
| still more aiming heavy.
| kodt wrote:
| I think CS will keep its popularity. Only players who can't
| cut it at a high level in CS are bailing to Valorant.
| smabie wrote:
| You mean like Skadoodle?
| llama052 wrote:
| or Hiko for that matter.
| burmanm wrote:
| So instead of "couldn't make it top", we're talking about
| players "who couldn't stay at the top" ?
| pbhjpbhj wrote:
| It's different for professional players, isn't it:
|
| >'On June 3rd 2020, it was announced by T1 that he has
| resumed his professional career but in Valorant -
| reuniting with ex-iBUYPOWER teammates Braxton "swag"
| Pierce and Keven "AZK" Lariviere in the process.'
| (https://liquipedia.net/counterstrike/Skadoodle) //
|
| If Valorant is less aim-based (I don't know) wouldn't
| that make sense for a retiree from a more aim-based game?
|
| Also Valorant could have just paid a load of CSGO "names"
| to move to their games as part of their marketing.
| TheCraiggers wrote:
| For sure. I don't know about all you, but I would go nuts
| if I had to stay in the same job forever. Sometimes you
| desire new challenges or greener pastures.
| [deleted]
| JakeTheAndroid wrote:
| While plenty of people will likely move over to Valorant, as
| someone who's played a bit I think there is still a distinct
| difference between the two games.
|
| The main thing shared between the two is the feel while
| shooting. It's hard to explain, but you feel the "weight" of
| the gun and it's rate of fire really well and it's satisfying
| when you land shots.
|
| But, the abilities, while not overly broken, does change the
| feel and strategy considerably. And Valorant maps are really
| bad in comparison to CSGO. So much useless space, bad angles,
| etc.
|
| So, while I hope Valorant pushes CS to get better, it's
| unlikely that the pool of players or viewers will be 1:1. The
| CS pros moving to Valorant are basically doing so because they
| either can't have a CS career (Brax, perma ban for match
| fixing; iBuyPower) or haven't been good enough in a while/never
| were good enough for a T1 CSGO team.
| birdyrooster wrote:
| Valorant is already dying. I doubt it will do anything to
| displace CSGO. If anything the toxic and racist community
| GabeN has cultivated will do CSGO in before a competitor will
| best them in gameplay.
| vecter wrote:
| > Valorant is already dying
|
| Hard to take this seriously considering they had 3 million
| DAU during the closed beta and it's averaging 100k+
| concurrent viewers on Twitch during the day (North
| America).
| ta17711771 wrote:
| Seriously sick of hearing this.
|
| The Internet has been "toxic and racist" since, oh, the
| first chat room...
|
| Kiddies in a game can't hurt you. Worry about the important
| shit, like being killed or thrown in a cage by law
| enforcement.
| sumnole wrote:
| Food for thought: kiddies playing games might one day
| work in law enforcement
| rootlocus wrote:
| Are you trying to justify online toxicity and
| unsportsmanship in multiplayer video games by comparing
| them with the tragedy of George Floyd?
| AlexMax wrote:
| > The Internet has been "toxic and racist" since, oh, the
| first chat room...
|
| In any respectable community, those sorts of people tend
| to get unceremoniously ejected from the community - from
| IRC channels to web forums to community-run game servers
| of old.
|
| Now, games are match-made and game companies are pretty
| much forced to exercise discretion about what kind of
| community they want to have playing their game.
| Personally, I no longer have the patience for losing 30+
| minutes of my life to a game that was lost because
| there's a 3-stack on my team who do nothing but throw,
| team-kill and think they're the height of comedy because
| they say offensive things or have a swastika as their
| profile picture.
| paulmd wrote:
| if you don't have a porn spray, are you even really even
| serious about playing CS 1.6?
| chaostheory wrote:
| Pavlov IMO is the spiritual successor
| koiz wrote:
| Hell no. The game is basically becoming some garrys mod
| hybrid mess.
|
| https://store.steampowered.com/app/496240/Onward/
|
| Onward is way better experience.
| capableweb wrote:
| Seems to be a VR game, so unless VR suddenly gets a lot
| cheaper and a lot better, Pavlov will never replace CS.
|
| Looking at the first few seconds of the first video on Steam
| for Pavlov
| (https://store.steampowered.com/app/555160/Pavlov_VR/) shows
| a very low-skilled encounter as well. If they are trying to
| attract CS players, they need to show it's a game that shows
| skills, not like that.
| kbenson wrote:
| > shows a very low-skilled encounter as well
|
| That might be the difference between having to actually aim
| your gun with hands in front of you, and flicking your
| reticle to a location with a mouse.
|
| > unless VR suddenly gets a lot cheaper and a lot better,
| Pavlov will never replace CS.
|
| Not that I think it will ever replace CS, but I think you
| can side-load Pavlov onto a Quest, and that's not
| necessarily a high cost of entry depending on what you
| compare it to. For a casual player, that's probably a lot
| of money. For people more serious about gaming, that might
| be equivalent to a few optional upgrades to their mouse and
| keyboard.
|
| Interesting to me is that it opens up some interesting
| competitive options, where you could ensure people are all
| on equivalent equipment, if for example you have a Quest
| tournament.
| baby wrote:
| VR is 400$ with the oculus quest, no computer needed, no TV
| needed. Considering that, it's a bit more expensive than
| the nintendo switch, and cheaper than pretty much all
| consoles and PC gaming.
|
| I just played Pavlov on it and it works flawlessly, I'm not
| sure I get your comment.
| enahs-sf wrote:
| Thousands of hours gone to many a sleepless night of
| scoutzknivez with friends. Fond memories.
| treebornfrog wrote:
| Yes it's a shame, I have so many fond memories of playing
| condition zero. Used to switch between playing CS:CZ, frontpage
| and photoshop.
|
| Back when PSD slicing was a thing.
| anoraca wrote:
| Valorant appears to me to be an uninspired clone with a few
| gimmicks and a lot of marketing money behind it. It's the same
| way that LoL was a clone of DotA with extra marketing and a few
| gimmicks.
|
| I don't understand why anyone knowledgeable would be installing
| a "free" game that includes a kernel level rootkit.
|
| https://www.techspot.com/news/84841-valorant-anti-cheat-soft...
| AndriyKunitsyn wrote:
| A kernel level rootkit is a usual form of an anti-cheat
| software nowadays (BattleEye, EAC).
|
| You can dislike it, you can question whether you can trust
| such software from a Tencent-owned company, but it doesn't
| make Riot's solution somehow different.
| elefanten wrote:
| 1. Overwhelming majority of the (potential) player base is
| not "knowledgeable" as per your comment
|
| 2. It worked for LoL, which has made something like 10x the
| money of Dota 2. Valorant doesn't have to be "the best" in
| its category, as judged by connoiseurs, to win its market.
| Avicebron wrote:
| I've seen Valorant blow up in my little circle of online
| content/professional gamer types. Personally I haven't taken
| to it, I think the graphics are not very inspiring and the
| game play seems derivative of almost every team vs team
| shooter in the last decade. That being said, marketing means
| a lot and if they flood the digital airwaves, they might just
| reach critical mass.
| joyj2nd wrote:
| And there goes the weekend...
| mleonhard wrote:
| It feels like 15 years ago, complete with random lag. :)
| baby wrote:
| I discovered that the other day, I find it completely insane.
| Also how is this even legal. Well I hope Valve doesn't get angry
| at it, actually I don't know why Valve is not even doing this
| (and adding their own skins marketplace)
| quyleanh wrote:
| Such a memory... There is some lag due to network, but this is
| still a great and very promise project.
| me551ah wrote:
| I love how people like to make browser versions of everything.
| From chat apps to email clients to games. But they all end up
| consuming 10x the memory but are still 10x slower than their
| native counterparts !
| lqet wrote:
| I would actually love to see an old browser (e.g. IE 6) purely
| implemented in JavaScript to run inside a browser, without
| using the browser's DOM rendering capabilities (the web page
| should be rendered by the JS code on a <canvas> element, input
| events should be correctly handled, and of course a JS engine
| also has to be implemented).
| meditative wrote:
| If you haven't seen The Birth & Death of JavaScript, you're
| in for a treat.
|
| Gimp running in Chrome running inside Firefox
|
| https://www.destroyallsoftware.com/talks/the-birth-and-
| death...
| userbinator wrote:
| Here's Win95 in a browser: https://win95.ajf.me/
| zitterbewegung wrote:
| Well since we now have 10x the memory and 10x the compute we
| are able to do this.
|
| Also, you don't need no stinkin App Store, zero time for
| installation. The only next step would be to have everything
| open source I think these are good tradeoffs. I rather have
| Freedom than performance and more and more tech users are doing
| this.
| pixelpoet wrote:
| Justifying everything becoming a web app to avoid app stores
| seems to me a lot like swallowing a spider to catch the fly.
| tryptophan wrote:
| Agree. I seriously do not understand what is so hard about
| going to a website and downloading a program. It takes
| literally all of 30 seconds.
| holoduke wrote:
| think the biggest issue with browser apps is proper asset
| management. what you see most of the times is a huge payload of
| assets getting loaded at the start. I would like to see some
| kind of streaming service for assets. specially with textures
| that would be really neat.
| hombre_fatal wrote:
| The hard part there isn't a browser vs native thing (native
| apps also generally ship with all of the assets in a front-
| loaded client) but abstracting your rendering pipeline to
| handle streaming or incremental LoD over the network.
|
| It's more of challenge of taking the time to add that level
| of polish.
|
| Kind of like the rare native game, like League of Legends,
| that will let you play before the entire client is finished
| downloading. Being a native app didn't give Riot Games that
| for free, they had to specifically build it for their game.
| Even in the native game market, it's AAA-level polish for a
| small fraction of games.
| throwawhey00 wrote:
| This is a flippant useless negative comment on someone's cool
| effort. Looking at your other comments, and at your blog -
| everything is negative. "This sucks, this is crap, I would
| never use this". What's with all the negativity? Just give
| creating comments and posts about stuff you like a try. The
| internet is not short of critics to make useless negative
| comments.
| me551ah wrote:
| Comment OP here
|
| I am an avid gamer who players a couple of hours of Apex
| Legends and Call of Duty Modern Warfare everyday. And I've
| been info FPS gaming for 2 decades now.
|
| To play a game released a couple of decades ago and see it
| take up almost the same amount of resources as the games I
| mentioned earlier gave me a chuckle.
|
| I commend the developer for his effort though. To make a game
| like that run on browsers is a mighty impressive effort and
| it is Uber cool. I don't dispute that even for a second.
| baby wrote:
| Weird, I'm similar to you and seeing 1.6 running in my
| browser was just mind-blowing and took me back.
| Kaze404 wrote:
| Are you actually saying you need an Apex Legends-capable
| machine to play Counter Strike on the browser? You can
| probably play this with an Intel integrated card from 10
| years ago.
| baby wrote:
| GP's comment is a short and non-insightful comment, this
| usually gets downvoted but for some reason it made it in this
| thread. I usually call this "driveby feedback" at work.
| [deleted]
| hombre_fatal wrote:
| Yeah, enumerating why something sucks is trivial. Anyone can
| do that about anything. Yet for some reason it's tempting to
| do it. Maybe because it makes us feel like a critic?
|
| For some reason it takes more effort to see the positives in
| something or someone, even ourselves.
|
| It's often a good practice to stop and think of the positives
| of something. Maybe it's not so obvious. Why did someone
| decide to build it this way? They probably are well aware of
| the downsides (after all, they're the one who built it) yet
| they saw some upsides. They must have thought the upsides
| outweighed the downsides. What were they? The harder that
| question is to answer, I think the more useful the practice
| is.
|
| Internet (and HN) discourse would be a lot better if we did
| more of that.
|
| I know it's a challenge for me -- it's really easy to get
| stuck in a negative thought loop, especially while spending
| so much time on social media (incl Twitter, Reddit, and HN)
| where we like to award ourselves points for being critical.
| Zhyl wrote:
| This was actually explored in this Cracked article [0]
| which I heard about on the Cracked Podcast. Basically,
| being cynical and negative is one of the easiest ways of
| appearing smart because you don't need to back up any of
| your assertions and people are less likely to be called out
| for shitting on something.
|
| [0] https://www.cracked.com/blog/the-7-stupidest-things-
| that-mak...
| baud147258 wrote:
| I don't see how being negative allow one to not back
| anything, I can say something sucks, but I'd have to
| explain why. And people will get called for shitting on
| something, see the GP comment.
|
| I'd even say you're less likely to be called out for
| being negative without giving an explanation than being
| positive without giving an explanation.
|
| Though it's usually easier to explain why something sucks
| than why something is great, since a negative explanation
| has only to find which part don't work, rather than
| explaining why something is globally good.
| Zhyl wrote:
| This isn't about being negative or critical. It's about
| being negative _all the time_. It 's about labelling
| yourself as cynical and making all of your _schtick_ be
| about that negativity.
|
| I see plenty of well-thought out criticism on hacker news
| and reddit. I see excellent deconstructions and
| refutations which show excellent balance and are clearly
| the work of a lot of thought and rumination. This isn't
| about those posts.
|
| The 'cynical is an easy way to appear smart' comment will
| apply most to daily conversation and low-effort drive-by
| comments on forums. In an everyday example, think about
| how people will make a joke or comment about how they
| dislike certain bands or pieces of technology. Do they
| always follow up with a bullet pointed list of what it is
| that they found disagreeable? No. I mean, sometimes, but
| if I were to take a clicker with me throughout my day and
| count every time someone made a casual negative comment,
| it would be higher than those presented with backing
| evidence, justification or even explanation. So to
| counter this comment:
|
| >I don't see how being negative allow one to not back
| anything, I can say something sucks, but I'd have to
| explain why.
|
| I disagree. You absolutely don't have to say why
| something sucks and most people don't most of the time.
|
| But this is ok, though, because people are mostly just
| expressing their opinion. There may be some signalling
| that you have a better taste in music or that you have a
| more refined taste in technology, but most people won't
| even consciously register that that is the intent that
| you are trying to signal. So I'd say that this covers
| this:
|
| >I'd even say you're less likely to be called out for
| being negative without giving an explanation than being
| positive without giving an explanation.
|
| I will agree with you if the comment is negative _and
| controversial_ but most of the time people are negative,
| it passes most people 's internal 'controversiality
| test', it doesn't get challenged and nothing further
| happens.
|
| >And people will get called for shitting on something,
| see the GP comment.
|
| They will. Sometimes. However, we're not talking here
| about nobody ever being called out for being overly
| negative. We're talking about how _overall_ it is easier
| to appear to be coming from a place of authority by
| taking a negative stand point.
|
| Hacker News is rife with this. A new technology is posted
| and the first things that will be commented will be
| picking holes in it, finding obvious flaws, decrying or
| otherwise.
|
| Statistically, this would seem to be fine and you're
| likely to be on the winning side of history most of the
| time. New stuff is more likely to be either undeveloped
| or unstable, ignore or duplicate work or be so forward
| looking that it isn't viable in the near term. However,
| this then also becomes the intellectually lazy stance to
| take. 'This is probably going to be bad, so let's find
| all the flaws first and then we can call it a day'. You
| will see many comments which will include lots of
| technical flaws without themselves saying what experience
| their criticism is based on. And the cost would appear to
| be minor: some things that become good and viable ideas
| eventually get shot down, but so what? If they become
| good then that person can just change their mind and no
| harm no foul.
|
| Overall, this means that the 'cynical' mindset appears to
| be a stable one, one that means that you're right more
| often than you're wrong and one that means that you can
| appear to be talking from a position of authority without
| actually having to back that up.
|
| So, sure, I see what you mean to an extent, but I think
| your point grossly misses the point of what my post (and
| indeed the two parents) were really getting at.
| pensivemood wrote:
| > It's about being negative all the time. It's about
| labelling yourself as cynical and making all of your
| schtick be about that negativity.
|
| But you are talking about being positive all the time,
| and about labelling yourself as a better person and and
| making all of your schtick be about that positivity.
| userbinator wrote:
| I think it's a perfectly valid criticism of the ridiculous
| levels of resource wastage of software today.
|
| This has merits as a form of art, but as something for
| practical use, I do not think we should be so wasteful with
| computing power.
|
| For something related, but not so wasteful (and also a form
| of art), look at: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.kkrieger
| nindalf wrote:
| > In many ways, the work of a critic is easy. We risk very
| little yet enjoy a position over those who offer up their
| work and their selves to our judgment. We thrive on negative
| criticism, which is fun to write and to read. But the bitter
| truth we critics must face, is that in the grand scheme of
| things, the average piece of junk is probably more meaningful
| than our criticism designating it so.
|
| > Anton Ego
|
| Maybe GP will learn this someday, but based on their replies
| to you, that day is not today.
|
| Meanwhile, they're raking in the upvotes thanks to their
| cyniscim, so why change their approach?
| moolcool wrote:
| I agree with you on one level-- I think people on HN are
| generally overly critical of projects like this which are
| clearly huge accomplishments and the culmination of tons of
| effort... But on the flip side, I think it's plenty valid to
| look at projects like this as case studies into why modern
| web tooling isn't up to the standards of the tooling of 20
| years ago (on much less performant hardware no less). Even
| within the browser, decades old flash games run circles
| around their JS contemporaries.
| scastillo wrote:
| Which may be good. If I post to HN I'm looking for critics,
| not for an empty Attaboy.
| scotu wrote:
| constructive criticism exists tho, being just negative is
| just cheap
| mrlala wrote:
| It taking like 1gb of ram in chrome.
|
| Your point? I literally just clicked on a link, downloaded a
| few assets and was into an online FPS. Virtually any modern
| computer in the world no matter what OS/browser should be able
| to do the same.
|
| But I guess for someone like you it has to be written in
| assembly so it's 100% efficient, even though you take 100x more
| to attempt to get it working than your counterpart.. and you
| never actually finish.
| ramblerman wrote:
| This is a pretty short sighted observation. It's obvious to
| most tech folk here that yes, moving up to higher abstractions,
| higher level languages and paradigms comes at a performance
| cost.
|
| But we could have just stopped at assembler with that insight.
| I mean all the rest is just slower, and less efficient.
| outworlder wrote:
| > This is a pretty short sighted observation. It's obvious to
| most tech folk here that yes, moving up to higher
| abstractions, higher level languages and paradigms comes at a
| performance cost.
|
| This is not even necessarily true. There are zero cost
| abstractions. Compilers can generate better assembly code
| than the overwhelming majority of developers.
| dumbfounder wrote:
| It works well on my laptop without installing a darn thing. Why
| do I care if it's 10x the memory if I have that memory to use?
| Graphics are good enough. Gameplay is like I remember it 20
| years ago (was it that long?!?!). I think this is pretty
| amazing.
| nearmuse wrote:
| I didn't check but I don't think what you said is the case with
| graphical resources.
| austincheney wrote:
| What is a solid alternative that allow access to applications
| cross OS without an explicit installation step?
| Spooky23 wrote:
| I think mad props are due to people figuring out how to port
| non-trivial, closed-source applications to browser javascript
| environments.
| Narishma wrote:
| This is a clone, not a port.
| koonsolo wrote:
| On the other hand, they don't require admin rights, disk space
| or installation time, and are platform independent (including
| for example chromebooks)
| tasogare wrote:
| Those are all very minors inconveniences. Installation took a
| few clicks, disk space is negligible for that category of
| apps (and if it isn't re-downloading on each access is a more
| pressing issue). Only the platform thing matters, yet the
| exemple you give isn't convincing given it's super low market
| share.
| [deleted]
| umaar wrote:
| I'm all for web apps, but does CS actually require admin
| rights?
|
| > disk space
|
| CS just downloaded 185mb of network resources for me to play.
| I would have thought those resources are stored on my disk,
| and not just in memory.
|
| > installation time
|
| That 185mb of resources took ~1 minute to download. By the
| time it had finished, it told me the server was full.
|
| Regardless this is still very impressive.
| koonsolo wrote:
| I'm not going to claim that one is better than the other,
| because it's all about tradeoffs.
|
| But I'm sure more people played this right now because of
| the low barrier to entry.
|
| And the admin rights might not even be technical. Not a lot
| of people are fond of installing games on the laptop from
| work.
|
| But like I said, everything has tradeoffs.
| andybak wrote:
| > But I'm sure more people played this right now because
| of the low barrier to entry.
|
| This is the key point. If I'd seen a post about CS with a
| zip of an executable I would have passed.
|
| Why? Because it probably wouldn't have run correctly or I
| would have had some other issue with it.
|
| Let alone checking the provenance and worrying about
| malware.
| gsich wrote:
| >I'm all for web apps, but does CS actually require admin
| rights?
|
| No. The cracked version(s) that are played in schools and
| whatnot are usually just a zip file you extract and run.
| AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote:
| The first two are trivially solved by portable applications
| (AppDirs, Application Bundles, AppImage, etc.). Platform
| independence is only kinda true, as many of these things
| don't actually function correctly on anything but Chrome, so
| they effectively target just one platform.
| 32gbsd wrote:
| Omg the modern web has become a monoculture!
| Klinky wrote:
| Chrome runs on many different platforms.
| hombre_fatal wrote:
| Seems a bit unfair to only acknowledge one side of the trade-
| offs. Obviously native apps win the perf side.
|
| How about being able to play with your friends after just
| handing them a link? Native 1.6 doesn't even run on my computer
| at all.
|
| I think browser ports are the only hope that old games have at
| coming back. The other month I played Nox's quest mode with my
| friend on a browser emscripten port (plus a lot of custom code
| / networking to get it online). And it's a game I thought I'd
| never get to play again. Gog.com sells Nox for Windows but of
| course the servers are long offline.
|
| The adolescent glee over how much worse browser applications
| run really misses the big picture.
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nox_(video_game)
| jfkebwjsbx wrote:
| > How about being able to play with your friends after just
| handing them a link?
|
| That doesn't work well for games with lots of modern assets.
|
| > Native 1.6 doesn't even run on my computer at all.
|
| That is strange, it works on the latest Windows.
|
| > I think browser ports are the only hope that old games have
| at coming back.
|
| Why? Steam, GoG, DOSBox, Proton, DXVK, emulators, VMs, etc.
| all give you access to almost every game that has been
| produced, today.
|
| Many of those have thriving online communities, too.
| baby wrote:
| pretty sure I can't run 1.6 on my mac
| xythobuz wrote:
| I think you can, it has a native Mac port on Steam.
| viklove wrote:
| You know no-one is forcing you to play CS in your browser,
| right? Why is it so offensive to you that this exists and
| someone else is finding joy in playing it? Why does HN love
| to rag on web technologies so much?
| jfkebwjsbx wrote:
| I simply stated that downloading dozens of gigabytes from
| a link is far from ideal. You also lose performance,
| features, community, and everything a place like Steam
| gives you.
|
| > Why does HN love to rag on web technologies so much?
|
| HN is quite pro-web and there are dozens of startups
| based on the web.
|
| Nevertheless, my counter is: why does "the web" try to
| recreate existing technologies and operating systems?
| JakeTheAndroid wrote:
| I mean, before Steam this was basically the state of
| gaming. No community, limited features, spotty
| performance. This is just teething issues. There is no
| reason a platform like Stadia can't work in the future as
| these things get better.
|
| And, in terms of downloading gigs from afar, you're
| already doing that, but instead of being able to play
| games while downloading you have to wait to download 60gb
| of COD updates, consume your entire PS4 drive with a
| single game. And while that is happening, you're just
| sitting there not using your PS4 because opening another
| application pauses the download.
|
| We are starting to see more cross platform support for
| games between PS4, XBO, and PC. But older games won't
| ever support cross platform between Windows, OSX, and
| *Nix. A browser port could easily change that.
|
| > Why does "the web" try to recreate existing
| technologies and operating systems?
|
| It's the same trend we've had since basically the dawn of
| computers. We move things into deeper abstraction layers.
| Why is this an issue in your opinion? Isn't more options
| better? Isn't ideal to adapt old concepts to new
| implementations? At the very least does it not provide
| potential educational value?
| [deleted]
| Grimm1 wrote:
| Because the web is the closest to a universal platform
| where as the existing operating systems are walled
| gardens?
| eptcyka wrote:
| Mouse tracking is clearly broken on Firefox here. The input
| lag is insance. I wouldn't link this to any of my friends
| with the intention of getting them to play Counter Strike
| with me.
| sebular wrote:
| Shame, I just played a few rounds in Firefox on a Mac
| without any mouse tracking or input lag issues and had a
| blast! Is it possible that you have some Firefox Add-ons
| installed that are messing with it?
| tomc1985 wrote:
| I don't think that lowering friction is a great thing. A
| certain amount of easy-to-overcome exclusiveness helps keep a
| community vibrant.
|
| When I was a kid I heard about a group of hippies that would
| have parties deep into the desert, far from roads or
| civilization. They had a "list", and if you were on it you'd
| get invited to the parties. Long story short, I figured out
| how to get on the list and one of the coolest things about
| those parties was how much effort everyone who attended went
| through to get there, both in however they managed to get
| invited and how much of a potential ordeal the journey was
| just to show up. The friends I made there put me on my
| current life course and now I'm surrounded by great people
| and a good tribe, which is really hard to find once you
| finish university. All because I put in the effort to get on
| the list and attend.
|
| Sure, not making things super easy creates slightly less
| inclusive communities and they are definitely smaller, but
| they're longer lasting, have some shared plight to bond
| around, and are generally of much higher quality. Allowing
| any old yokel easy access kills community because there are
| too many tourists
| pensivemood wrote:
| >How about being able to play with your friends after just
| handing them a link?
|
| I ll tell you how. It sucks.
|
| > I think browser ports are the only hope that old games have
| at coming back.
|
| Dosbox? Wine? Look them up.
| apetresc wrote:
| Hey, can you send me a link to that Nox port? What a blast
| from the past - I remember saving up to buy that game as a
| kid :)
| hombre_fatal wrote:
| The subreddit has a small community of people playing. iirc
| there's a community server you can point the Gog.com binary
| to: http://old.reddit.com/r/nox. (The Gog.com binary
| actually runs on macOS if you're pre-Catalina as it's
| 32bit, they just removed the indication since everyone is
| on Catalina now)
|
| The browser "port" is here: https://playnox.xyz/ (200mb) --
| Whether online play is available or not can be hit or miss.
| The single player campaign does work as well -- worth it
| for insta-nostalgia.
|
| I say "port" in quotes because it's not just a matter of
| `cat nox.exe | emscripten > nox.js` of course. The creator
| posts in the subreddit / the nox community forums and has
| some really interesting technical comments where he
| explains some of the challenges.
|
| People who can pull off something like this (talk about
| cross-cutting engineering skills) really blow me away.
| valerij wrote:
| nice. i once spent a week trying to hack the engine to
| support widescreen resolutions. time to re-play it :D
| Kaze404 wrote:
| We used to hold game nights at my previous company and we
| would all play quake on the browser together. No installing,
| no sharing files, nothing. Just click the link on Slack and
| you're in. Nothing beats that.
| moooo99 wrote:
| > How about being able to play with your friends after just
| handing them a link? Native 1.6 doesn't even run on my
| computer at all.
|
| This is actually one of the major selling points for Cloud
| Gaming. Although it still has a lot of issues to be adressed
| before getting into the mainstream, this is exactly what it
| promises. Just sending your friends an invite link and get
| them to sign up is a much more pleasant experience than
| downloading 100+GBs of game files before being able to join
| the session.
|
| I also enjoy seing browser implementations of popular games.
| My favorite recent example is the classic version of
| Minecraft running in the browser [0]. The browser is
| obviously a much more restrictive environment than a native
| app, but I can still imagine plenty of useful examples for
| performant 3D graphics in a browser. After all, Games are
| often just used as a showcase for the capabilities of new
| Apis and performance improvements.
|
| [0] https://classic.minecraft.net
| thefounder wrote:
| I always thought the cloud gamming is really just a way to
| move gammers to "subscriptions" instead of one time
| purchases, in the end milking more money and taking more
| control from them just like Adobe did with their creative
| products.
| Damogran6 wrote:
| Why not both?
| nuclear_eclipse wrote:
| Microsoft has been successfully charging subscriptions to
| millions of players every year without needing to run
| games in the cloud. Cloud gaming is a play at capturing
| revenue from people who aren't willing to shell out $300+
| for hardware _and_ $60 for every AAA title they want to
| play.
| wetmore wrote:
| Minecraft actually started as a browser game, before it had
| survival mode.
| ThrowawayR2 wrote:
| Mojang put the browser version back on-line last year:
| https://classic.minecraft.net/
| modzu wrote:
| then there are apps like photopea.com. feature parity with
| Photoshop, but starts immediately, consumes virtually no
| memory, requires no special permissions, runs on virtually any
| os. compare that to the adobe app which loads half a dozen
| services, takes about a minute to load, wont run on linux,
| etc...
| taf2 wrote:
| Was it 10x faster to build and easier to maintain or are 10x of
| statistics not true?
| ksec wrote:
| Does it work on Safari? It has been initialize Shaders for the
| past 10 min.
| solenlyser wrote:
| Yes, works fine in Safari 13.1.1
| asjfj9 wrote:
| Facing same issue on Chrome.
| lovehashbrowns wrote:
| This is actually a lot of fun! The mouse movement sucks and I
| don't remember the spray patterns like this but it's still very
| enjoyable.
| VirgilShelton wrote:
| Ah memories!
| ameyv wrote:
| This reminds of Gary Bernhardt The Birth & Death of JavaScript :)
| gt565k wrote:
| Wonder if the physics bugs exist on this web port of CS for maps
| like ka_roadwars_v2
|
| That was an epic map where you could glitch into the wall with a
| vehicle and shoot yourself off in the air and go into the hidden
| gun room.
|
| Fun times.
| lxgr wrote:
| Impressive! But it also feels like this is making a convincing
| case for an UDP equivalent to websockets.
| jbverschoor wrote:
| For me, this is a good gaming experience.. Just stream and cache
| :-)
|
| Never mind, it's more like: download, wait, server full
|
| Still awesome
| aarong11 wrote:
| Faithful to the original in that sense!
| andreigaspar wrote:
| haha
| fareesh wrote:
| I don't know much about the topic - but from what I understand,
| Valve games use Protocol buffers and UDP connections to the lobby
| server, in their netcode (someone correct me if I'm wrong).
|
| Is there an equivalent way to do this with the same level of
| efficiency in the browser? What are browsers missing in order to
| achieve this?
| 8192kjshad09- wrote:
| There's nothing stopped anyone from using protobuf in the
| browser, it's just not that common since JSON is easier to work
| with. Not sure how the netcode on this game works though.
| blattimwind wrote:
| > Valve games use Protocol buffers and UDP connections to the
| lobby server, in their netcode (someone correct me if I'm
| wrong).
|
| The netcode originally used in GoldSrc/1.6 came from QuakeWorld
| and predates Google. IIRC it got replaced at some point. The
| current iteration of Source's netcode doesn't have anything to
| do with that, though.
| reubenmorais wrote:
| > IIRC it got replaced at some point. The current iteration
| of Source's netcode doesn't have anything to do with that,
| though.
|
| Do you have a source (heh) to back that? Lots of the
| networking configuration cvars from 1.6 are still there in
| CS:GO and do the same thing. Maybe it was cleaned up but I
| wouldn't be surprised if it's still mostly the same code.
| Jasper_ wrote:
| According to Valve, they deployed
| https://github.com/ValveSoftware/GameNetworkingSockets
| successfully on CS:GO.
| reubenmorais wrote:
| GameNetworkingSockets is pretty cool, and integrating it
| must have required some extensive changes, but it's more
| of a networking middleware library. I thought blattimwind
| was referring to the gameplay related netcode
| (prediction, interpolation, lag compensation, etc). My
| understanding is that it hasn't changed much since the
| 1.6 days, because all of the configuration knobs are
| still available today, but maybe they rewrote it and I'm
| just out of the loop. It'd be a major task to do that
| without affecting gameplay "feel", which is why I was
| interested in some source to read more about it.
| bmn__ wrote:
| https://github.com/SteamDatabase/Protobufs
| reubenmorais wrote:
| Those are GC (Game Coordinator, server list, matchmaking)
| and Steam (items, trading, etc) protobufs, not for the
| actual netcode of Source games. There also seems to be
| some demo (saved game replays) related messages there,
| but I don't see anything gameplay related.
| m00dy wrote:
| How does this work actually ?
| __alexs wrote:
| It's a WebGL clone of Counter-Strike 1.6 that can even load
| original maps.
| jjkmk wrote:
| This is really well done, is there an easy way to change mouse
| sensitivity?
| RogueBurger wrote:
| Man, if you had told me back when I was playing 1.6 that one day
| I would be playing it in a browser, I would have laughed. Crazy
| how far we've come with video games.
| Insanity wrote:
| That's amazing! Used to be addicted to CS:S (surfing) and found a
| surf server on here.
|
| But for something as fast-paced as surfing, the experience is not
| wonderful (small input lag). Still, really impressed by this.
| ben-schaaf wrote:
| This seems like quite the achievement. Can't crouch and walk
| forward though (ctrl+w), nor is it anywhere close to the
| performance of say cs:go at least in terms of input lag.
| julianwachholz wrote:
| So crouch + forward will close the game? This might become the
| new Alt+F4 for more money hoax.
| slig wrote:
| Use "c" to crouch.
| cagenut wrote:
| On a semi-related note, if anyone feels nostalgia for CS1.6/CS:GO
| and has a VR HMD, jump on Pavlov and join a Search & Destroy
| server/map. The experience of spawning into and running around a
| map that you have played for 20 years is beyond mind blowing.
| tupac_speedrap wrote:
| I like how they have Russia as the flag of Europe despite most of
| the country not even being in Europe, most people would use the
| EU flag but I guess this is CS 1.6 so they are most likely a fair
| few Russians about.
| de_watcher wrote:
| It's a good addition to the running joke about Valve's games
| that EU servers are Russia West.
| nindalf wrote:
| Became moderately proficient at Russian thanks to Valve.
| takaia khaliava.
| pbhjpbhj wrote:
| My kids can swear in Russian as they play CS:GO ...
|
| I enjoy when I get foreign language players of a language I
| know some of, it's a good way to practice IMO - wish one
| could choose a preferred language.
|
| I guess they don't do that because of the impact on
| matchmaking (mm), the mm seems crazily sub-optimal I'd love
| to know that logic behind it : like when you have a game of
| 9 people, why you abandon it rather than finding a person
| from the pool of 100k waiting that will play. It could be a
| setting "allow game requests from mm" and they could give a
| little xp for it - beats searching and waiting another
| 10mins to start a game.
| doikor wrote:
| The server is most likely in Saint Petersburg or Moscow which
| both are very much in Europe.
| diegoperini wrote:
| Isn't network topology is the determining factor (instead of
| world politics) for these naming conventions?
| throwaway9d0291 wrote:
| Most of the land isn't in Europe but most of the population is
| and I daresay Russians outnumber other nationalities on
| European servers.
| Jnr wrote:
| Last time I checked - Valve has no game servers/entry nodes
| in Russia.
|
| Western Russia connects to Sweden or Poland. Northern
| European and Eastern European countries connect through the
| same nodes.
|
| Connections within Valve network are handled internally
| (since they can tune it for better latency, etc.) and you
| don't even know where the actual game server is hosted. So
| there is always a big mix of players no matter where you are
| in Europe.
|
| Fun thought: it depends on how much throughput can be handled
| by Starlink, but Valve could waste some money on it to bring
| players closer from further away. They already have the
| dynamic, latency based entry node selection set up. If they
| hooked up some of the internal network through Starlink, it
| could be amazing low latency cross-continent gaming. And
| games like CS:GO and Dota 2 doesn't require too much
| bandwidth.
| [deleted]
| shultays wrote:
| I thought dota had one but it has been a while and can't
| remember if that was really the case.
|
| Assuming it is not, I wonder why? Lots of russian players,
| why wouldn't Valve put servers in Russia?
| Bayart wrote:
| I'm guessing all their EU servers are in Russia. My ping was
| pretty high from France.
| rapsey wrote:
| Russia is and always has been considered a European country.
| computerfriend wrote:
| Tell that to the Vladivostokians.
| thaumasiotes wrote:
| They're well aware of it.
| dreen wrote:
| Russia is the last remaining European Colonial Empire with
| their colonies still part of the original power, mostly
| thanks to them being geographically together.
| pixelpoet wrote:
| Unless you count Alaska:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaska_Purchase
| crawlcrawler wrote:
| I was always told Russia spans two continents.
| thaumasiotes wrote:
| The Russians are firmly in charge. Try asking some Turks in
| Russian territory whether they have an equal voice in the
| country compared to the Russians.
|
| Is the US more of a European country or an Amerind country?
| What would its geographic location suggest?
| valvar wrote:
| France technically spans 6 continents. It's still a
| European country.
| rightbyte wrote:
| I guess it is where the server is? See Asia (Indonesian flag?)
|
| Also most of the dannish kingdom's land is not in Europe
| either.
| xbmcuser wrote:
| It is not indonesia but singapore which is just 0.0017% of
| asia.
| toyg wrote:
| but 100% of the money laundered in Asia! /joke
| mothsonasloth wrote:
| A good chunk of Russia is geographically in Europe.
| mrmonkeyman wrote:
| So is Holland's. Let's use the Dutch flag for Europe.
| leonfedden wrote:
| Very cool, thank you for sharing.
|
| Unfortunately I downloaded resources, waited, and the server was
| full. After repeating for 3/4 times I gave up, so maybe a little
| more work needed there to cache and/or manage servers a little
| better for the end-user.
|
| Still a very cool project!
| MayeulC wrote:
| As often, the keybindings use a QWERTY-centric layout, that
| doesn't make much sense if that's a different keyboard, and no
| obvious way to change it.
|
| The steam controller API is nicely designed: you define actions,
| and let the user pick a way to trigger those actions. I think
| there are predefined ones that already have mappings for common
| input devices. The API then returns an image and name to
| correctly prompt the user. I wish we had something like this at
| the browser or operating system level.
| simias wrote:
| I have the same problem and it exists with virtually all web
| apps. No easy rebinding and often no rebinding at all.
| baby wrote:
| I've had to deal with this all my life because of the French
| AZERTY, but honestly the best solution to this problem is to
| get a QWERTY keyboard. I haven't thought about this issue once
| in the last decade.
| pbasista wrote:
| I have tried it in Firefox 77 on Linux running on a Core i7 CPU
| and the experience was mediocre. Low fps, delayed sound and
| imprecise mouse movement.
| Krasnol wrote:
| FF77, i5 CPU on Win10 -> perfect.
| nullifidian wrote:
| browser FPSs will never take off due to complete lack of
| protection from cheating, and cheating is the core implementation
| issue with FPSs.
| kroltan wrote:
| How is it that running in a browser is inherently unprotected?
|
| Sure, they don't usually have the thousands of man-hours
| dedicated to cheat detection, but the basics are usually sorted
| out.
| basro wrote:
| Because it runs in the browser it's trivial to apply client
| side cheats. For example see through walls, auto aim.
| orbital-decay wrote:
| Client-side anticheats are essentially advanced rootkits, and
| cannot be implemented in a browser sandbox.
| Jyaif wrote:
| Is it WebSocket or Data channel based?
| sealthedeal wrote:
| this is super cool. any chance this is open sourced?
| jean-malo wrote:
| It worked for me after a few tries, input lag is pretty
| significant though.
|
| Anyhow it's a very neat project, thanks for sharing!
| vvpvijay wrote:
| It is facing outage due to its popularity
|
| https://androidrookies.com/counter-strike-1-6-in-a-browser-o...
| sid_dubey0312 wrote:
| This is so cool, the guy that made this has my respect!
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