[HN Gopher] Apple: Apps should not require users to opt into tra...
       ___________________________________________________________________
        
       Apple: Apps should not require users to opt into tracking to access
       content
        
       Author : Nextgrid
       Score  : 242 points
       Date   : 2020-09-11 18:38 UTC (4 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (developer.apple.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (developer.apple.com)
        
       | _Microft wrote:
       | Anything else wouldn't be GDPR compliant anyways, would it?
        
         | Nextgrid wrote:
         | In Europe it indeed wouldn't, however GDPR enforcement has been
         | severely lacking despite the potential for significant fines,
         | so Apple taking matters into its own hands (and using its
         | influence and power over the App Store) is very good news.
        
       | Nextgrid wrote:
       | Full text of the clause:
       | 
       | > 3.2.2 Unacceptable
       | 
       | > (vi) Apps should allow a user to get what they've paid for
       | without performing additional tasks, such as posting on social
       | media, uploading contacts, checking in to the app a certain
       | number of times, etc. Apps should not require users to rate the
       | app, review the app, watch videos, download other apps, tap on
       | advertisements, enable tracking, or take other similar actions in
       | order to access functionality, content, use the app, or receive
       | monetary or other compensation, including but not limited to gift
       | cards and codes.
        
         | jonplackett wrote:
         | Amen.
        
         | JadeNB wrote:
         | Is this in the usual technical sense of MUST / SHOULD / MAY, or
         | does 'should not' here actually mean 'may not' (as suggested by
         | the category being 'Unacceptable', rather than 'Discouraged')?
         | 
         | (Several other entries are phrased much less ambiguously:
         | "Unacceptable: (i) Creating an interface ...", and (ix) is
         | explicitly "Apps _must not_ ... " (emphasis mine).)
        
           | reaperducer wrote:
           | Apple's guidelines are usually written in soft language to
           | give it wiggle room in case an unexpected scenario arises.
           | 
           | Practically-speaking, if Apple decides an app has violated
           | this provision, the app is toast. No app company on the
           | planet has enough lawyers to challenge Apple on such nit-
           | pickery.
        
             | ChrisMarshallNY wrote:
             | This has been my experience, as well.
             | 
             | I once had to delete an entire bug fix version, and turn it
             | into a feature version, because I "shouldn't" have done
             | something (can't remember what, exactly -I'd have to go
             | digging through the commit comments to find it, and I don't
             | want to do that).
        
               | darklion wrote:
               | Apple says bug-fixes will no longer be held up by rule
               | violations.
        
           | jmull wrote:
           | I'm just about 100% sure Apple uses "should" and "should not"
           | in the absolute sense, not the way RFC's define it.
        
         | jtsiskin wrote:
         | The clause starts with "get what they've paid for" - does this
         | apply to free apps?
        
         | DoofusOfDeath wrote:
         | I find that policy entirely acceptable, for the same reasons I
         | think shrink-wrap EULAs should be illegal.
         | 
         | This makes me curious about Apple and iOS / OS X. Does Apple
         | try to require that the user accepts an EULA for the OS after
         | buying Apple hardware?
        
           | donarb wrote:
           | All of Apple's EULAs are published on their website. You can
           | download the PDFs and read through them before you decide to
           | purchase software that Apple creates and sells.
           | 
           | https://www.apple.com/legal/sla/
        
             | matsemann wrote:
             | EULA's are basically unenforceable in Europe, so why
             | bother. For a contract to be valid it has to be understood
             | by both parties, be reasonable etc., and in many countries
             | forcing arbitration on consumer matters is invalid (don't
             | know if Apple has those terms, but many do). Forcing a
             | consumer to read 20+ pages of legalese for each purchase,
             | each app they download etc. is just not feasible.
        
           | easton wrote:
           | Yes, they do. On the Mac, at least for the longest time, they
           | put a sticker on the shrink wrap for the device that said
           | something to the effect of "By using this device, you agree
           | to the terms of Software License Agreement found at
           | apple.com/legal/sla". Of course, if you didn't agree with
           | that you could return the device or install Windows/Linux,
           | but on the iPhone (which won't activate without agreeing),
           | you can't since the bootloader is locked.
        
             | fizzled wrote:
             | When did they stop? I just bought a new MacbookPro
             | yesterday and there was nothing on it like that. Same for
             | the iWatch I bought last year, and the iPhone 6 two years
             | ago.
             | 
             | Or is this just software?
        
             | placatedmayhem wrote:
             | Iirc, those shrink wrap licenses are of questionable
             | enforceability. The Wikipedia entry on "shrink wrap
             | contract" agrees, but I'm not well-versed on the topic.
        
               | izacus wrote:
               | Do you think you can fight this out in court against
               | Apple?
        
               | hombre_fatal wrote:
               | Are individuals taken to court over it for "misusing"
               | their Macbooks?
        
               | threeseed wrote:
               | It has been possible to run OSX on PCs for quite a few
               | years now courtesy of the Clover and OpenCore apps. There
               | have been countless Github projects, websites, forums etc
               | dedicated to providing material assistance in using them.
               | 
               | At no point has Apple ever gone after the websites or
               | individuals despite it being fairly trivial to do so e.g.
               | DCMA or cease and desist letter.
               | 
               | In fact Craig Federighi has gone on the record stating
               | that they fully support people hacking the Mac, OSX etc
               | and believe it to be an important part of the ecosystem.
        
               | DoofusOfDeath wrote:
               | Something about this has always confused me...
               | 
               | IIUC (at least in US legal system), using software
               | without an appropriate license from the copyright holder
               | is considered a violation of civil copyright law.
               | 
               | Suppose that courts deemed shrink-wrap EULAs to be
               | invalid. _If_ the EULA is the agreement that grants end-
               | users permission to use the copyrighted software, would
               | the invalidation mean that users were in violation of
               | copyright law? Or is there a right to use the software
               | that 's implicitly granted by the original purchase?
        
               | johnday wrote:
               | What would you actually be buying, if you bought the
               | software without being legally capable of using it?
        
               | Consultant32452 wrote:
               | You've bought the privilege of being allowed to accept
               | the EULA.
        
               | Ma8ee wrote:
               | It reminds me of a US visa, which is far from free, and
               | you pay for applying whether you is granted it or not. It
               | allows you travel to a border control and ask to be let
               | in. They can refuse you without explanation.
        
               | [deleted]
        
           | [deleted]
        
         | Angostura wrote:
         | Feels in line with GDPR
        
         | electriclove wrote:
         | This sounds.. great!
        
         | ggrrhh_ta wrote:
         | Doesn't youtube, with its ads, violate this policy?
        
           | Nextgrid wrote:
           | When it comes to YouTube the waters are muddy. The YouTube
           | app is just a client to a third-party web service (whose
           | functionality falls outside of App Store rules); so in this
           | case it can be argued that the "functionality" of the app is
           | just the client functionality and not the content itself.
           | 
           | Furthermore you can skip ads on YouTube after a 5-second
           | timer, so this seems reasonably fair, though I would still
           | not install it and recommend everyone to just use the web
           | with a content blocker extension (AdGuard) or a third-party
           | frontend like Invidious (https://github.com/iv-
           | org/invidious).
        
             | kevinventullo wrote:
             | That seems like a pretty big loophole if applied. Taken to
             | the logical extreme, one could make an app that streams raw
             | user inputs to a server and streams back a video output and
             | be allowed to do whatever they like (albeit with horrendous
             | performance).
        
               | Spivak wrote:
               | I mean this is the main argument against game streaming
               | and HN seems to take the 100% opposite opinion.
        
               | derefr wrote:
               | Apple already declared a policy against game-streaming
               | service apps; presumably specifically to avoid this
               | loophole where the ads, purchases, etc. are happening
               | "remotely" and so Apple can't get a cut of them.
               | 
               | Presumably, if anyone tried to build a service for
               | "streaming" non-game apps, that wouldn't be allowed on
               | the App Store either.
        
               | pieno wrote:
               | They've thought of that loophole and closed it already
               | ;-) Basically you can only stream from a device that is
               | owned by the user/owner of the iPhone/iPad on the same
               | LAN, and you should not use streaming to mimic a thin
               | client of a cloud app. See rule 4.7.2 on Remote Desktop
               | Clients.
               | 
               | (Note: this does not apply for "generic" remote desktop
               | clients that are not intended to stream specific apps or
               | services, such as the generic Microsoft Remote Desktop
               | Client for iOS.)
        
             | pier25 wrote:
             | > _so in this case it can be argued that the
             | "functionality" of the app is just the client functionality
             | and not the content itself_
             | 
             | The problem is that companies like Google are able to get
             | away with it, but not small developers.
        
             | zimpenfish wrote:
             | > Furthermore you can skip ads on YouTube after a 5-second
             | timer
             | 
             | For me, that only really happens these days with mid-video
             | ads (and even then it's happening less frequently despite
             | the number of mid-video ads increasing.) Most of this week
             | I've had double unskippable ads at the front of many videos
             | and they're generally 60+ seconds combined.
        
               | gerash wrote:
               | You can, you know, pay for the service (be the customer
               | and not the product) and not see any ads
        
         | toredash wrote:
         | Should. Not "must not"
        
           | msbarnett wrote:
           | The subsection this falls under is "Unacceptable" as in "Will
           | not be accepted". The "should" in the sentence is a normative
           | statement about values, not recommendational.
        
           | marvel_boy wrote:
           | In this legal context 'should not' means 'must not'.
        
         | criddell wrote:
         | > watch videos
         | 
         | So games that periodically stop to show a full screen ad and
         | don't resume until the user closes the ad are in violation?
        
           | pindab0ter wrote:
           | Is this for paid games? I imagine this would not apply to
           | freemium games.
        
             | ricardonunez wrote:
             | As soon as I start using an app in a regular bases and I
             | notice they stop me too many times to watch videos or look
             | to timed ads, I check if they have a paid version. So this
             | is a good solution and a good compromise for paid. For free
             | apps, I get it because developers need to make money.
        
         | sizzle wrote:
         | Wow this is why my next phone will be an iphone, so sick of
         | apps in Android play store pestering me to rate their app after
         | completing an action in the app or forcing me to turn on
         | location services when I can easily enter a zip code instead.
        
           | bmarquez wrote:
           | > forcing me to turn on location services when I can easily
           | enter a zip code instead
           | 
           | This exists on iOS too. I recently downloaded a wardrobe app
           | that refused to let me select clothes for hot or cold weather
           | unless I turned on location services. Also some fast food
           | apps (either Burger King, Popeye's or Taco Bell...can't
           | remember which one) constantly whine about location services
           | off and introduce extra friction to type in a zip code.
        
         | dathinab wrote:
         | But this also excludes letting the user chose between either
         | watching ads or paying for the content.
         | 
         | A not very well working but reasonable business model.
         | 
         | Why is it incompatible?
         | 
         | Because getting access to normally payed-extra-for content by
         | watching apps means receiving a "monetary or other
         | compensation"
        
           | [deleted]
        
       | 2Gkashmiri wrote:
       | I remember ios 5 I think brought app permissions. Essentially say
       | app A should not get location or contacts and put this behind a
       | password. The app couldnt do shit. Then android after late got
       | some permissions but its still lame IMO. App can deny you access
       | without a permission. A recent thing I have seen on android is
       | permission protection or whatever. The system gives dummy or no
       | access to the contacts for example instead of actual contacts.
       | Sounds good but now every app can detect this and bugs you to
       | allow the sameby nagging you. Look, if I want to deny app A or B
       | access to contacts, as far as the app is concerned it should get
       | 0 access. Not blocking or pseudo blocking but a sinkhole type
       | "huh. Nothing here". It should not be able to detect this. Same
       | for internet access. If I deny internet to an app, that app
       | should think its in flight mode. Thats it.
       | 
       | Same thing here. Say I dont want to be tracked, apps should think
       | I have allowed access and go ahead. Why should they tailor access
       | based on my permission to track ? My installing the app is proof
       | I want to use the app. I just dont want it to be tied to
       | anything. Kinda like the original "sandbox" idea
        
         | renewiltord wrote:
         | Okay, but I don't want that as a user. If I accidentally say
         | "Deny Location Permission" I want the app to say "I actually
         | can't navigate for you without this, sorry. Want me to request
         | the permission again?". I don't want to debug this shit - oh
         | why is navigation not working? No thanks. Life's too short.
        
           | reaperducer wrote:
           | Life is too short for you to press Settings > Privacy >
           | Location Services > app > enable?
           | 
           | Are you on life support or something?
        
             | renewiltord wrote:
             | Haha, hilarious! But yes, I don't want to do that.
        
         | mumblerino wrote:
         | Correction: iOS has had permissions at least for as long as
         | apps were allowed and more permissions were added over time.
         | 
         | Screenshot in the Camera section of this iPhoneOS 2 review:
         | https://www.imore.com/iphone-os-2-review
        
       | ugh123 wrote:
       | Could say the same thing about these cookie-accept popups as some
       | will just redirect you off their site if you don't accept.
        
       | ffpip wrote:
       | Such things are never going to come to Android are they? Every
       | preinstalled app abuses every permission possible
        
         | dheera wrote:
         | With most Android devices, at least you have the option to
         | install a different OS (e.g. LineageOS) that allows you to
         | spoof all such data, including to Google, which IMO provides a
         | better level of safeguarding against tracking.
         | 
         | With iOS, the closed source OS and lack of alternatives
         | fundamentally means that Apple Inc. gets to secretly violate
         | your privacy while they play the moral high ground.
         | 
         | Ultimately the best security comes when you, the user, control
         | the device AND the OS.
         | 
         | EDIT: Apple fanboys downvoting me again, eh? You worship Apple
         | or something that would never do something wrong (ha)? Enjoy
         | your HN echo chamber.
        
           | derefr wrote:
           | It's hard to _prove_ that this is a fix (i.e. I can prove it
           | for my device, but your device might be special), but you can
           | always just install a VPN app that doesn't actually connect
           | to a VPN, but rather acts in a LittleSnitch-alike way to the
           | traffic it's proxying.
           | 
           | I believe this is, in part, how CloudFlare's 1.1.1.1 app
           | works on iOS.
        
         | cmeacham98 wrote:
         | Pre-installed apps where you can't disable them or revoke their
         | permissions are a cancer on the Android ecosystem. Especially
         | fun when they have permissions like "access the filesystem" or
         | "obtain device location" or "send notifications".
        
           | wvenable wrote:
           | Are there pre-installed apps you can't disable? I have a
           | bunch disabled on my phone.
        
           | ffpip wrote:
           | There used to be a security app on my MIUI phone. Security
           | apps can't do anything on android, because each app is
           | sandboxed. But of course, it had full non-revocable
           | permissions including physical sensors, precise location,
           | contacts, camera and microphone.
           | 
           | I hope someone cracks open their 'security' app and controls
           | every MIUI device, just for them to learn their lesson.
        
         | lern_too_spel wrote:
         | On Android, you can deny permissions to preinstalled apps (I
         | just verified this myself) or even disable the apps entirely,
         | which unlinks all entry points into the app. On iOS, they just
         | sit there sucking up your data like iMessage keeping track of
         | everybody you message.
        
         | cma wrote:
         | With a user controlled Android phone, you can just feed apps
         | you don't trust fake location data. But now Google has started
         | restricting user-owned Android to a fixed number of flashes or
         | something, or they get locked out of Google Play Services.
        
           | expectsomuch wrote:
           | Can't tell if this is a serious reply.
        
             | cma wrote:
             | https://www.xda-developers.com/fake-android-location/
             | 
             | https://www.xda-developers.com/how-to-fix-device-not-
             | certifi...
        
       | cblconfederate wrote:
       | Thats a good thing. Can Apple guarantee that they themselves are
       | not tracking their users' app preferences/behaviour either?
        
         | scarface74 wrote:
         | Of course they can't guarantee it. The best they could do is
         | give users the ability to block all internet access in an app.
         | Currently you can only block an app from using cellular data.
        
         | Nextgrid wrote:
         | Nope they can't. In fact to use an iOS device you pretty much
         | need an Apple account (if you want to be able to install any
         | apps) and that comes with a privacy policy and some extra
         | "features" you might not know about like every sender e-mail on
         | iOS Mail being synced to their cloud.
         | 
         | However, at least we can find comfort in the fact that their
         | business model so far has been against the
         | surveillance/advertising economy and their entire marketing
         | strategy has been based on that for the past few years, so at
         | least they currently do not have any incentive to misuse that
         | data even if they do collect it (and if they do eventually
         | think about misusing it, we can hope that there would be some
         | actual enforcement of laws such as the GDPR that would
         | discourage them from doing so).
        
           | [deleted]
        
         | NovemberWhiskey wrote:
         | There's a fairly simple _cui bono_ aspect to this.
         | 
         | Apple makes money by selling products to their users or taking
         | a cut of the users' purchases in their marketplace.
         | 
         | Facebook and Google, on the other hand, make most of their
         | money by selling micro-segmented access to their user base to
         | third parties.
         | 
         | Which of these two kinds of companies stands to benefit from
         | harvesting more data about their users whenever possible?
        
           | cblconfederate wrote:
           | Apple profits from knowing their users'
           | app/music/news/books/siri etc preferences and making purchase
           | suggestions, don't they?
        
             | sbuk wrote:
             | That's not quite the same as selling that information to
             | political 'think tanks' to buy influence in an election.
        
             | reaperducer wrote:
             | Sort of.
             | 
             | Apple's recommendations are handled on-device. It's great
             | for security, but the downside is that Apple News on my
             | iPhone and Apple News on my computer don't have the same
             | list of publications I dislike.
        
               | hu3 wrote:
               | That's genius! Apple avoided developing synchronization
               | of user data and got good PR for doing that.
               | 
               | I'm gonna try that with my clients. "Sir, I wont
               | aggregate your store's point of sale data because it's
               | more secure if the data never leaves the store. Now pay
               | me a premium for the added security, thanks."
        
       | Angeo34 wrote:
       | Apple wants all the data for themselves obviously.
        
       | daveisfera wrote:
       | > (iii) Artificially increasing the number of impressions or
       | click-throughs of ads, as well as apps that are designed
       | predominantly for the display of ads.
       | 
       | So they're going to remove most of the games that my kids have
       | been duped into installing from an ad in another game? ;p
        
       | beervirus wrote:
       | Everybody complains about the walled garden, but damn I love to
       | see things like this.
        
         | dayjobpork wrote:
         | You do realise Apple could still do this in their app store AND
         | allow 3rd party app stores?
        
           | threeseed wrote:
           | But 3rd party app stores just mean a race to the bottom.
           | 
           | The app store with the least oversight and cheapest prices
           | would be the winner.
           | 
           | Policies like this are good for users but bad for apps and by
           | extension app stores.
        
         | ProAm wrote:
         | Doesn't Apple track every app you install, access and run?
         | Track you if you want to develop your own code for your own
         | fully paid for device?
        
           | ffpip wrote:
           | > Doesn't Apple track every app you install, access and run?
           | 
           | Do you have a source on the them tracking every app a user
           | runs? Obviously they have to collect every app I install for
           | updates and subscriptions, but collecting every run might be
           | too much.
        
             | cblconfederate wrote:
             | Don't they verify executables for this reason? Do they
             | provide info about whether they log this process?
        
               | Nextgrid wrote:
               | I believe iOS handles this process differently. Apps are
               | signed in advance (when the app is approved and published
               | to the Store) and the signatures are only checked locally
               | against a hardcoded signing key. But even on Mac when it
               | comes to notarization, I'm pretty sure the signatures are
               | only checked on first run and then the result of that is
               | cached (partly for performance reasons).
        
               | sroussey wrote:
               | Same on Mac AppStore.
        
               | ffpip wrote:
               | Why would they verify it everytime you run the app? It
               | already goes through heavy review before it comes onto
               | the app store.
        
             | izacus wrote:
             | They advertise a whole product which draws all this
             | tracking data as nice graphs to developers:
             | https://developer.apple.com/app-store-connect/analytics/
             | 
             | It's essentially Google Analytics, just for apps on iOS.
             | 
             | Where do you think those "Daily active devices" data comes
             | from?
        
               | anater wrote:
               | Users must opt in though. It's part of the iOS set up to
               | allow this and you can change it any time
        
               | lern_too_spel wrote:
               | This setting is opt out, not opt-in. It's unclear if
               | opting out hides the data from Apple or just from the app
               | developers.
        
           | slipheen wrote:
           | That really does seem like whataboutism.
           | 
           | No one is claiming Apple is perfect, but this is a marked
           | improvement of apps requiring tracking to function.
        
             | ProAm wrote:
             | No its more about the pot calling the kettle black. Do as I
             | say not as I do because I know whats best for you. I can
             | see it seems to be whataboutism but that was not my
             | intention, it's about hypocrisy.
        
               | samatman wrote:
               | whataboutism: n. An accusation of hypocrisy designed to
               | deflect from bad behavior on the part of another party.
        
               | ProAm wrote:
               | Ha! Ive never actually looked the definition up. This is
               | definitely whataboutism (I still havent looked the
               | definition up so Im trusting this the actual definition)
        
               | samatman wrote:
               | well, I did make that up.
               | 
               | but here's dictionary.com on the subject, and I think
               | it's congruent, you'll have to judge for yourself:
               | 
               | https://www.dictionary.com/browse/whataboutism
        
               | birthdaydog wrote:
               | This is exactly whataboutism.
        
               | ProAm wrote:
               | I think we're arguing semantics about business
               | philosophy.
        
           | sbuk wrote:
           | There has to be be some degree of tying purchases to an
           | account. The real issue here is what is done with the data
           | after it's been collected. Internal use is one thing; such as
           | improving apps etc. When it's used to target individual in a
           | bid to influence their thinking, that's when the real problem
           | starts. Are Apple guilty of the latter?
        
             | lern_too_spel wrote:
             | Certainly. They use it in app store ads, to determine their
             | own product development, and to market their products.
             | 
             | On other platforms, I can install apps on my devices
             | without telling anybody.
        
               | anater wrote:
               | Which platforms?
        
               | lern_too_spel wrote:
               | Most Android distributions, most Linux distributions,
               | Windows, etc.
        
         | sneak wrote:
         | Note that "tracking" is used in an intentionally misleading way
         | here. Apple's guidelines expressly permit all sorts of silent,
         | invisible, no-opt-in tracking within apps, and most apps in the
         | app store embed this sort of spyware.
         | 
         | The term "tracking" in this instance refers to GPS or contacts
         | permission and other such things that Apple has built an opt-in
         | switch for.
        
           | beervirus wrote:
           | What sort of "silent, invisible, no-opt-in tracking" does
           | Apple allow?
        
         | lern_too_spel wrote:
         | This policy is straight from GDPR. The Play Store and the
         | Amazon App Store also enforce this, despite neither enforcing
         | walled gardens.
        
       | ryandrake wrote:
       | I've always wondered why do companies call it "opt" in if it's
       | not optional?
        
       | dellcybpwr wrote:
       | Should not vs may not. Any difference?
        
       | RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote:
       | This is one of the reasons, I am actually in favor of only having
       | the App Store on Apple. As soon as you have another way to
       | distribute apps on the iPhone, app developers will try to migrate
       | to the less privacy conscious store that lets them do all their
       | dark patterns.
       | 
       | Sometimes, let the consumer choose does not work. For example, if
       | governments did not regulate kids products and just said let the
       | consumer choose, the market would be filled with unsafe products.
       | Sometimes you need someone enforcing standards.
       | 
       | Apple's enforcement of standards is one of the big reasons why I
       | choose their ecosystem.
        
         | spideymans wrote:
         | Certain developers (ahem... Facebook) love to cry about Apple's
         | walled garden, without acknowledging that the reason that iOS
         | and its walled garden is so popular is precisely because these
         | large developers have proven to users that they are completely
         | untrustworthy. If they conducted their business more
         | responsibly, and if users could trust that these developers
         | wouldn't abuse their privacy and security, perhaps the mobile
         | software ecosystem would be more open in nature.
        
       | mensetmanusman wrote:
       | "I should still be able to view where I am on this map without
       | letting anyone know where I am"
        
         | reaperducer wrote:
         | _"I should still be able to view where I am on this map without
         | letting anyone know where I am"_
         | 
         | Seems perfectly reasonable. We used to do it before there was
         | an internet to feed our locations to. I did it on my Palm III.
         | 
         | Heck, my car does it today. And is able to show me all the
         | nearby coffee shops with zero internet connection, thus no
         | snitching.
        
       | prophesi wrote:
       | Would this also apply to forcing users to enable location for
       | content that only partially requires it? In particular, Snapchat
       | has some location-based filters, but even the ones that don't
       | require location (purely cosmetic, rewind, slow-mo, etc filters)
       | are disabled.
        
       | canadianwriter wrote:
       | "Apps should not require users to rate the app, review the app,
       | watch videos, download other apps, tap on advertisements, enable
       | tracking, or take other similar actions in order to access
       | functionality, content, use the app, or receive monetary or other
       | compensation, including but not limited to gift cards and codes."
       | 
       | Bunch of apps started doing the above "enable tracking" part
       | already - good thing Apple specifically disallowed it, should nip
       | that problem before 14 comes out.
        
       | dathinab wrote:
       | I do not think Apple should have the power to do such decisions.
       | 
       | I do not like tracking at all.
       | 
       | But I think this is something which needs to be handled by
       | governments (laws/regulations) not by apple forcing their opinion
       | about what is right onto everyone else by abusing their marked
       | positions.
       | 
       | In this case it might be beneficial for the users.
       | 
       | In others cases it was not beneficial for the users at all but
       | only for apple. Like if I remember correctly apps where not
       | allowed to state that they are Pebble compatible because Pebble
       | did compete with the Apple Watch at least theoretically, similar
       | platforms like Netflix/Amazon Prime got special terms wrt. the
       | pay cut but a Netflix/Amazon Prime for gaming wasn't allowed at
       | all for dubious reasons (with that reasons any content gateway
       | like browsers, newsfeeds, Netflix etc. would not be allowed) oh
       | and guess what it seems Apple is currently working on their own
       | Gaming/Game Streaming platform...
       | 
       | So yes anti tracking is good. But I still belive Apple is again
       | abusing their monopoly like positions for their own benefits,
       | let's not forget Apple has their own app network which likely
       | isn't affected by this.
        
         | gpanders wrote:
         | > But I think this is something which needs to be handled by
         | governments (laws/regulations) not by apple forcing their
         | opinion about what is right onto everyone else by abusing their
         | marked positions.
         | 
         | Why should governments force their opinion about what is right
         | onto everyone else? Why not allow freedom in the market so that
         | users can choose what matters most to them? Right now, Apple is
         | serving the market of those opposed to tracking and in favor of
         | greater privacy. If it turns out this is what consumers want
         | and are willing to pay for, competitors will feel pressure to
         | follow suit. No heavy handed government regulation needed.
        
         | slipheen wrote:
         | Governments ought to be the place for this level of regulation,
         | absolutely - But right now, governments aren't regulating.
         | 
         | In the mean time, I'm glad Apple is. If Apple wasn't doing
         | this, no one would be.
        
         | spideymans wrote:
         | Government regulation would be at the mercy of Google and
         | Facebook and their hoard of regulators, so I'm not convinced
         | this would protect iOS end users better than the status quo.
         | Facebook and similar developers might be happy about it though
        
       | ATsch wrote:
       | This is already legally required by GDPR but I guess it's good
       | for apple to check for it.
        
         | Nextgrid wrote:
         | The GDPR so far doesn't have any enforcement for stuff like
         | this. All the links to "enforcement tracker" (which I'm sure
         | someone will reply with down below) have been either about a
         | technicality like a badly worded privacy policy or the amount
         | of the fine was peanuts compared to the size of the offending
         | company.
        
         | matthewmacleod wrote:
         | This is not required by GDPR.
        
           | cblconfederate wrote:
           | the tracking thing is
        
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