[HN Gopher] Nobody lives here: Nearly 5M Census Blocks with zero...
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       Nobody lives here: Nearly 5M Census Blocks with zero population
       (2014)
        
       Author : sndean
       Score  : 81 points
       Date   : 2021-01-18 19:17 UTC (3 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (tumblr.mapsbynik.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (tumblr.mapsbynik.com)
        
       | walrus01 wrote:
       | It would be interesting to see this compared as a 1:1 overlap
       | with BLM land in the western states.
        
         | sethhochberg wrote:
         | For anybody not super familiar with US government departments
         | and confused by reading this after seeing other headlines
         | coming out of the country in recent years, BLM in this context
         | is "Bureau of Land Management" and not "Black Lives Matter".
         | 
         | The BLM is the federal department that oversees most
         | governmental land that isn't managed by some other department.
         | Broadly speaking, this is land which isn't run by a
         | local/state/tribal government, may not have any particular use
         | designated, and is (usually) uninhabited - or at least intended
         | to be.
        
           | walrus01 wrote:
           | Indeed, for reference, truly vast swathes of the rural
           | western states are federal government land. Not all is BLM,
           | some is national park and such, but same concept applies for
           | zero population in a census block.
           | 
           | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_lands
        
             | richardwhiuk wrote:
             | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LruaD7XhQ50 is a pretty
             | nice intro to the topic.
        
           | bananabreakfast wrote:
           | While a lot of BLM land is uninhabited, it is not all like
           | that and not necessarily intended that way either. For
           | example, the entirety of California's coastline is BLM land.
           | 
           | The BLM simply functions as the kitchen sink of land
           | management at the federal level, catching everything that is
           | not explicitly assigned to other agencies.
        
             | jeffbee wrote:
             | This is a very misleading statement. The area _off_ the
             | coast of California constitutes the California Coastal
             | National Monument. The actual land mass involved there is a
             | mere 8800 acres and nobody lives there. The other national
             | monuments in California add up to 2.5 million acres. BLM 's
             | total holdings in California are about 15 million acres, of
             | the state's 105 million acres. Most of what the BLM holds
             | aside from national monuments are grazing lands that they
             | lease out.
        
       | thanhhaimai wrote:
       | TL;DR: Blocks have zero population mostly because
       | 
       | - physically restrictive (lake, swamps, mountains, deserts...)
       | 
       | - legally/socially restrictive (commercial/industrial/military...
       | zones)
        
       | Razengan wrote:
       | > _Water features such lakes, rivers, swamps and floodplains are
       | revealed as places where it is hard for people to live._
       | 
       | Interesting..
        
       | Lendal wrote:
       | Interesting that on this map, the only state boundary revealed by
       | this data alone is North Dakota. Any ideas why that might be?
        
         | quasse wrote:
         | Looks like the author updated the article to address that:
         | 
         | >Update: On a more detailed examination of those two states,
         | I'm convinced the contrast here is due to differences in the
         | sizes of the blocks. North Dakota's blocks are more
         | consistently small (StDev of 3.3) while South Dakota's are more
         | varied in area (StDev of 9.28). West of the Missouri River,
         | South Dakota's blocks are substantially larger than those in
         | ND, so a single inhabitant can appear to take up more space.
         | Between the states, this provides a good lesson in how changing
         | the size and shape of a geographic unit can alter perceptions
         | of the landscape.
        
         | thanhhaimai wrote:
         | The author noted in the post that:
         | 
         | > I'm convinced the contrast here is due to differences in the
         | sizes of the blocks. North Dakota's blocks are more
         | consistently small (StDev of 3.3) while South Dakota's are more
         | varied in area (StDev of 9.28).
        
         | caf wrote:
         | The New Mexico / Colorado border is also somewhat visible.
        
       | ChrisArchitect wrote:
       | previous discussion:
       | 
       | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14433805
        
       | pier25 wrote:
       | I wonder if Starlink will eventually have on impact on this,
       | maybe 10 years from now.
       | 
       | Some years ago we lived in an off the grid cabin in the mountains
       | of Veracruz (Mexico) and the lack of connectivity was by far the
       | main reason we left. We now live on the outskirts of a small city
       | but I still really miss the absolute silence of living away from
       | civilization.
        
         | eloff wrote:
         | Yup, that will be one less reason to live in a city. I've also
         | theorized that work from home and self-driving vehicles are
         | other trends that may counteract the trend towards urban
         | living. If you have a self-driving vehicle (on the highway at
         | least), longer commutes may be less of an issue if you can
         | work, read, or watch tv (we're not there yet.) If you work from
         | home, commute doesn't matter at all.
         | 
         | That being said, I work from home, but I live in downtown to
         | have easy access to activities, restaurants, and supermarkets
         | without needing a car. The difference in rent is dwarfed by not
         | having the cost or hassle of a vehicle.
        
           | ghaff wrote:
           | >self-driving vehicle (on the highway at least)
           | 
           | I live about an hour outside a major city. I definitely will
           | drive in (normally) for activities like theater. With a self-
           | driving car--even just on the highways--I'd be _more_
           | inclined to go in for an early evening get-together. But I
           | wouldn 't be popping in multiple times a week even if I
           | didn't mostly need to drive myself.
        
         | cnorthwood wrote:
         | If the population is truly zero, I wonder how many other
         | infrastructure concerns will come first? Primarily road
         | connections, but also electric grid and potable water. There
         | are alternatives to the latter 2 but it is a significant impact
        
         | uncoder0 wrote:
         | I am betting that Starlink will have an impact on where people
         | live. We have tons of beautiful empty land in this country but,
         | modern life requires broadband and that's not well distributed
         | yet.
        
           | reaperducer wrote:
           | _We have tons of beautiful empty land in this country_
           | 
           | It's beautiful _because_ it is empty.
           | 
           | I think we should fill up all the vacant lots and surface
           | parking in the cities before we needlessly trample nature any
           | more.
        
             | curiousllama wrote:
             | Agreed, but also...
             | 
             | There's like SO MUCH empty land. Growing up in the US, I
             | thought the most empty things got was Ohio. But turns out,
             | we're more like Russia - with the empty siberian frontier -
             | than we are like the UK or something.
             | 
             | If everyone were evenly distributed, we'd still have <100
             | people per sq mile
        
               | jeffbee wrote:
               | Ohio has about the same overall population density as
               | Spain.
        
           | adolph wrote:
           | My knee jerk reaction was to comment that modern life also
           | requires other things like healthcare; but then I thought
           | twice in that maybe some of the lifestyle diseases that drive
           | in some measure the important placed on healthcare
           | availability, maybe those core maladies and deleterious
           | choices are encouraged by living in close proximity to large
           | numbers of folks.
        
             | jeffbee wrote:
             | Which "lifestyle diseases" are you thinking of? Both
             | obesity and diabetes are markedly more common in rural
             | America compared to urban America, but there is a
             | confounding factor of poverty.
        
               | ghaff wrote:
               | Poverty is one thing. In a rural location, you also sort
               | of have to make yourself go out for a walk/run/hike
               | because you're not going to just organically walk from
               | place to place. (ADDED: Aside from house/yard
               | work/farming/etc.) I live in a semi-rural location
               | (nothing like what we're talking about here) and there is
               | basically no reason that I _have_ to do more than a
               | minimum level of walking on a given day. (Leaving aside
               | how big a difference that makes in the scheme of things.)
        
         | Mountain_Skies wrote:
         | Highly likely. I do wonder what impact this will have on mail
         | ordering. Currently rural deliveries are subsidized by the more
         | densely populated areas. Because the ratio of subsidized rural
         | dwellers to densely populated area dwellers is so lopsided in
         | favor of density, the subsidy doesn't matter much. If that
         | ratio changes, so might the economics of companies like Amazon
         | being able to deliver anywhere, usually by piggybacking on the
         | USPS's rural delivery infrastructure. That said, I've seen
         | Amazon's own delivery vans in some pretty low density rural
         | areas so maybe it works out somehow.
        
       | DavidPeiffer wrote:
       | Another interesting uninhabited zone is in Idaho. Summarized by
       | Wikipedia:
       | 
       |  _The Zone of Death is the name given to the 50 sq mi (129.50
       | km2) Idaho section of Yellowstone National Park in which, as a
       | result of a purported loophole in the Constitution of the United
       | States, a criminal could theoretically get away with any crime,
       | up to and including murder._
       | 
       | https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zone_of_Death_(Yellowstone)
        
         | scottcha wrote:
         | I worked in that area on a SCA trail crew in 1996, in the
         | Bechlor ranger district, and its nothing we discussed then but
         | looking as the ref it seems this loophole was only noted in
         | 2008.
         | 
         | The area is very remote and while in the park not often
         | visited. Its very beautiful with meandering rivers through
         | large grasslands as well as some canyons with the Tetons in the
         | distance.
        
         | giantg2 wrote:
         | Good luck getting the government to honor that. I can't even
         | get a local court and state trooper to follow their own rules
         | of procedures defined in code or basic civil rights.
        
       | genericone wrote:
       | On android device, both portrait and landscape mode, the right
       | side of the text is cutoff. Desktop view mode fixes it.
        
         | culopatin wrote:
         | Same as iPhone. I just moved from Android and after trying for
         | 1min I couldn't figure out how to get desktop mode in Safari.
         | Sometimes I find myself fighting things like that in iOS. I'm
         | just supposed to guess.
        
           | meowster wrote:
           | I miss how websites used to work with the original iPhone.
           | Websites looked like normal desktop sites, and you could
           | double-tap on a block of text and the browser would zoom into
           | that area.
           | 
           | I just want normal websites, none of this mobile f*kery we
           | have today.
        
           | Jtsummers wrote:
           | For whatever reason the "Request Desktop Site" option is
           | hidden in Safari behind the icon in the address bar that
           | suggests it should just be about controlling the font (small-
           | cap-A, big-cap-A). I think it took me two years to finally
           | remember that consistently instead of just being frustrated
           | that I couldn't find it.
        
             | eznzt wrote:
             | Consider yourself lucky, a few years ago it was under the
             | "share" button. Yes, really.
        
               | Jtsummers wrote:
               | Yep. And I had finally gotten used to that when they
               | moved it. At least the "share" button in iOS is a bit of
               | a catch all (sharing with messaging apps, email, make a
               | bookmark, print it, add to home screen, copy, and more
               | actions), so it at least made _some_ sense. Moving it
               | behind a font control button makes _no_ sense.
        
           | mkr-hn wrote:
           | Tip you'll probably need soon: the address bar also functions
           | as the "Find in page" feature.
        
       | geraldcombs wrote:
       | Apparently people only live on the east side of the Mississippi
       | from ~ Cape Girardeau, MO to the gulf?
        
         | geerlingguy wrote:
         | Flood plains. Though... in some areas people live in them and
         | complain to the Army Corps and local government every time they
         | get flooded out.
        
       | NiceWayToDoIT wrote:
       | I am not sure how useful this map is, being uninhabited by humans
       | does not mean useless. It also does not mean "hey, lets build
       | something there".
       | 
       | What about agricultural land, forests, water, forests, wild life
       | ?
        
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       (page generated 2021-01-18 23:00 UTC)