[HN Gopher] Pricing a SaaS product (2019)
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       Pricing a SaaS product (2019)
        
       Author : helsinkiandrew
       Score  : 128 points
       Date   : 2021-01-28 13:23 UTC (1 days ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (www.bannerbear.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (www.bannerbear.com)
        
       | polote wrote:
       | One rule to know about pricing which is counter intuitive. (And
       | that has been repeated countless times on HN)
       | 
       |  _Your pricing is never high enough_
       | 
       | If you want your prospects/customers to take you seriously they
       | have to find you expensive. If you seem cheap they will not take
       | you seriously.
        
         | danenania wrote:
         | Another way to think about this is that even if you built a
         | product to scratch your own itch, you may not be your own ideal
         | customer. In that case, your instincts on pricing could be way
         | off.
         | 
         | You might be cost-sensitive and look for a good deal when
         | buying tools and infra to support your own projects. But buyers
         | at larger companies aren't spending their own money, so their
         | thought process is very different.
         | 
         | As long as the price fits in the budget and isn't an outlier
         | compared to other products they pay for, then it's not going to
         | be what they focus on. They'll care much more about quality,
         | trustworthiness, ease of integration, support, and things like
         | that.
         | 
         | That's why putting your price at the high end of the
         | 'acceptable' range is a win-win. You don't leave money on the
         | table, and you make an implicit commitment to high quality and
         | good service, which the customers you really want value more
         | than a bargain.
        
         | TriNetra wrote:
         | I recently read a story in the book 'Influence - The Psychology
         | of Persuasion' (by Robert B. Cialdini):
         | 
         | > I GOT A PHONE CALL ONE DAY FROM A FRIEND WHO HAD RECENTLY
         | opened an Indian jewelry store in Arizona. She was giddy with a
         | curious piece of news. Something fascinating had just happened,
         | and she thought that, as a psychologist, I might be able to
         | explain it to her. The story involved a certain allotment of
         | turquoise jewelry she had been having trouble selling. It was
         | the peak of the tourist season, the store was unusually full of
         | customers, the turquoise pieces were of good quality for the
         | prices she was asking; yet they had not sold. My friend had
         | attempted a couple of standard sales tricks to get them moving.
         | She tried calling attention to them by shifting their location
         | to a more central display area; no luck. She even told her
         | sales staff to "push" the items hard, again without success.
         | Finally, the night before leaving on an out-of-town buying
         | trip, she scribbled an exasperated note to her head saleswoman,
         | "Everything in this display case, price x 1/2," hoping just to
         | be rid of the offending pieces, even if at a loss. When she
         | returned a few days later, she was not surprised to find that
         | every article had been sold. She was shocked, though, to
         | discover that, because the employee had read the "1/2" in her
         | scrawled message as a "2," the entire allotment had sold out at
         | twice the original price!
         | 
         | > It is easy to fault the tourists for their foolish purchase
         | decisions. But a close look offers a kinder view. These were
         | people who had been brought up on the rule "You get what you
         | pay for" and who had seen that rule borne out over and over in
         | their lives. Before long, they had translated the rule to mean
         | "expensive = good." The "expensive = good" stereotype had
         | worked quite well for them in the past, since normally the
         | price of an item increases along with its worth; a higher price
         | typically reflects higher quality. So when they found
         | themselves in the position of wanting good turquoise jewelry
         | without much knowledge of turquoise, they understandably relied
         | on the old standby feature of cost to determine the jewelry's
         | merits.
        
         | loceng wrote:
         | Pricing psychology is so interesting, where there seems to be a
         | hierarchy as well; which flows into the idea or rule that you
         | should never limit how much someone can spend.
        
         | intrasight wrote:
         | "is never high enough" isn't really actionable info. I need to
         | set a price, and it will be somewhere between $10 and $1000
         | month. You could of course try to fill the area under the
         | demand curve, but that poses it's own challenges. I settled on
         | $1000/mo because for the customers that will really benefit
         | from my software, that is how much they benefit.
        
         | dubcanada wrote:
         | Do people not take Walmart seriously? Office 365 is also
         | extremely cheap compared to what you get. Do people not take
         | that seriously?
         | 
         | I don't think blanket statements like, you're SAAS product is
         | not expensive enough, work. You should take a tailored approach
         | for what works for you.
        
           | graerg wrote:
           | >Do people not take Walmart seriously?
           | 
           | Depends on what you mean by "people". For a lot of average
           | consumers/customers, Walmart _isn't_ taken seriously. They're
           | not aware (and don't care) about the incredible
           | supply/logistics magic that Walmart orchestrates behind the
           | scenes. They'll pay a premium to buy stuff elsewhere to avoid
           | the inferior goods connotations associated with Walmart.
        
             | iujjkfjdkkdkf wrote:
             | For electronics or clothes maybe, for many household things
             | Walmart had name brands and people know that. I dont go
             | there (and I assume pay a premium) because I dont like
             | places that treat customers as cattle, and would happily
             | pay a few cents extra for a shopping experience that hasn't
             | had every ounce or humanity stripped from it. Granted I'm
             | in the minority and it's hard to even find places that
             | treat their customers like people anymore.
        
           | rootusrootus wrote:
           | > Do people not take Walmart seriously?
           | 
           | I tend to think that they mostly sell cheap crap, that even
           | their brand-name stuff has been renegotiated with the
           | manufacturer so they can sell you a lower quality version in
           | order to have the lowest price. They have definitely done
           | this with some products, and at least attempted it on others.
           | 
           | So yeah, their pricing definitely affects my perception of
           | their products. I avoid Walmart.
           | 
           | Office 365 has the clout of Microsoft behind it. I don't know
           | that the general rule applies as well as it does to some new
           | SaaS company I have never heard of before.
        
             | dubcanada wrote:
             | If you have money and you want to pay more for the same
             | thing you are more then welcome to shop around. But just
             | because what ever premium brand name store you use is
             | "better" because it costs more, doesn't mean it isn't the
             | same thing as Walmart.
             | 
             | Pricing is not as simple as "charge more" because it
             | increases the premium factor by applying a this costs to
             | much for me so it must be good factor.
             | 
             | There are hundreds of other factors you need to consider
             | and I don't think applying a double my price equals success
             | to your pricing schema always makes sense.
        
               | rootusrootus wrote:
               | > pay more for the same thing
               | 
               | I think you missed the point. Walmart absolutely has
               | negotiated deals in the past for products that appear to
               | be the same but are not. Levi's jeans is one example.
               | They tried to do the same thing with Snapper, as I
               | recall, but were rebuffed.
               | 
               | If that's okay with you, great, you are matching the
               | price of the product with the quality. But as a result of
               | them doing it and not being completely transparent about
               | it, I question what other products they've done the same
               | thing with.
        
             | arbuge wrote:
             | You may avoid it, but hundreds of millions don't, so the
             | point stands. "Cheap crap" is obviously one possible way to
             | go, and companies like Walmart have grown very successful
             | that way.
        
               | bryanrasmussen wrote:
               | are there hundreds of millions of enterprise customers
               | for your SAAS product?
        
               | dubcanada wrote:
               | Sometimes shooting for enterprise customers doesn't work.
               | Some products need the little guy to survive, not global
               | international enterprise companies.
        
               | rootusrootus wrote:
               | Many people are totally fine with buying cheap crap. As
               | long as they know that going in, that's great. Walmart is
               | indicating with their prices that they're offering lower
               | quality merchandise, which many people find acceptable
               | because the cost is lower. It's honest.
        
           | ufmace wrote:
           | You're kind of both right IMO.
           | 
           | The great majority of products created by techies interested
           | in startups are priced much lower than the market will bear,
           | and so their prices should rise.
           | 
           | There definitely is a market out there for the cheapest
           | possible version of something. Usually, turning a profit
           | while moving a product at the cheapest possible price
           | involves maximizing volume, cutting quality to be bare
           | minimum, and ruthlessly eliminating overhead. Like, if there
           | aren't thousands of people on the internet complaining about
           | how crappy your quality is, you probably need to cut it
           | further. I haven't studied it, but I have a hunch that most
           | of the type of people who surf HN for business advice aren't
           | interested in being in a commodity industry where you have to
           | do these things to have a viable business. Or if they find
           | themselves in one, they aren't going to be ruthless enough in
           | the right directions to make it. They better find the right
           | place to get advice for that sort of business, or they won't
           | last long.
        
       | alberth wrote:
       | Question: is there a buyer who'd be only will to pay $49/mo and
       | not $99/mo?
       | 
       | I ask because BannerBear has 3 tiers: $49, $99, $399.
       | 
       | It seems like if you're willing to pay $49, you'd also pay $99
       | ... and as such, why not just eliminate the $49 plan.
       | 
       | https://www.bannerbear.com/pricing/
       | 
       | EDIT: Why the downvotes? It's a genuine question and if you don't
       | think so, please just comment why you don't think so to advance
       | the conversation.
        
         | rat9988 wrote:
         | sales tactics to show that you get a lot of value in that tier
         | per dollar spent.
        
         | gnicholas wrote:
         | It's well-known that people are influenced by the number and
         | relative value of options. It may be that very few people
         | purchase the $49 option, but that its mere presence makes
         | people more likely to purchase a higher tier.
         | 
         | And by having the $49 tier present, the company can advertise
         | that their pricing "starts at $49".
         | 
         | Also, there are probably some people whose purchase authority
         | is limited to $1,000/yr.
        
       | alexellisuk wrote:
       | Completely agree with the reasons. Most all of my indie company's
       | software is free and OSS - so no opportunity to capture any
       | value.
       | 
       | I created the open source tunnel project called inlets which now
       | has 8k GitHub stars, the same thing happened - lots of people
       | used it, got value and didn't pay a sponsorship or for support.
       | 
       | So seeing the problem, I then went on to create a paid version
       | which adds value and features for companies. The main issue was
       | that many developers anchored the pricing to ngrok, but ngrok is
       | not the same product, for one, it's a SaaS with rate-limits and
       | is a cloud service.
       | 
       | inlets PRO doesn't have any rate-limiting, can act as a VPN,
       | integrates natively with Docekr + Kubernetes and can be self-
       | hosted too. That's the value of it. So when asked, I advise Ngrok
       | customers to stay with what they know, they aren't the target
       | market.
       | 
       | It still makes anchoring a challenge though, and Neil Davidson of
       | Redgate talks about this in Don't Roll the Dice - another eBook
       | the author may enjoy reading - https://www.red-
       | gate.com/library/dont-just-roll-the-dice
        
         | jahewson wrote:
         | > The main issue was that many developers anchored the pricing
         | to ngrok, but ngrok is not the same product, for one, it's a
         | SaaS with rate-limits and is a cloud service.
         | 
         | You're hooking me in to an interesting pitch here.
         | 
         | > doesn't have any rate-limiting, can act as a VPN, integrates
         | natively with Docekr + Kubernetes and can be self-hosted too.
         | That's the value of it.
         | 
         | That's just some stuff it does though, not the value.
         | 
         | As an underwhelmed ngrok free user, you could probably sell me
         | this product somehow. We have lots of pain around webhooks in
         | CI, especially with parallel builds.
        
       | jFriedensreich wrote:
       | I was about to write both products went out of business but one
       | was just rebranded and still has the same higher base pricing and
       | seems to be doing well, so it seems it worked out very well.
       | Maybe increasing the pricing also played a role in identifying
       | the other roduct as too unattractive to continue and focus on
       | bannerbear sooner than otherwise...
        
       | f430 wrote:
       | Good advice but its a hard sell in overly saturated markets and
       | most people are just shopping for the lowest price.
        
       | js4ever wrote:
       | After all the good advices in the article my first idea was to
       | check where they are now after 2 years. The site is down, dead in
       | the water. So maybe the advices where not that good ...
        
         | mlboss wrote:
         | 2 days back there was an article about how they scales to $10k
         | MRR. https://www.bannerbear.com/journey-to-10k-mrr/
        
         | jwbaldwin wrote:
         | Site is still very much up and running. Even postd about a
         | recent 10k/mmr milestone.
        
           | js4ever wrote:
           | Ah I was referring to the site linked in the article
           | https://www.votemojo.com/ But it seems they changed the
           | domain
        
       | darrenwestall wrote:
       | We put our prices up by 50% to new customers this month, we've
       | see no difference in the amount of customers we've earned - just
       | a higher revenue per customer.
       | 
       | Charge more.
        
         | yblu wrote:
         | In my case, I charge $4/month for a developer tool and every
         | week or so I would receive a survey response (that people do
         | after uninstalling it) calling me names for charging money.
         | Apparently there are people who want the tool enough to
         | complete the survey and curse the creator but not enough to pay
         | $4/month for it. So for me, pricing is really hard.
        
           | jimkleiber wrote:
           | Just reflecting out loud here, as I struggle with this as
           | well.
           | 
           | The way you said it makes me think that at $4/month, you
           | might actually be competing with free, as the prices seem so
           | close. If it's $20/month, they may not say "oh but why isn't
           | it free" or even more so at $50/month.
           | 
           | At low prices, maybe it just seems too much of a hassle to
           | sign up and pay, ie, "Ugh, just $4/month? And I have to go
           | thru the burden of signing up and giving my credit card and
           | all that?" Whereas at $50/month, the paying process pain may
           | feel relatively smaller.
        
       | Michael_Sieb wrote:
       | We at Type Studio try to offer our SaaS completely free, as we
       | believe everyone should find out if the product is helpful.
       | Especially as students ourselves we don't have the possibility to
       | pay monthly fees for all the services we like to use. That's why
       | our approach is to offer a completely free version of our video
       | and make people who only want to edit 1 video a month happy with
       | it. But of course we also have to think economically and make
       | sure that our business is sustainable.
        
         | idlewords wrote:
         | My experience has been that no one can give you as much grief
         | and hostility as a free user. Even charging a buck a month
         | leads to an enormous step up in customer courtesy in my world--
         | I don't know if it applies equally to yours.
        
       | [deleted]
        
       | utdiscant wrote:
       | We use many products with low price - that doesn't make me trust
       | the products less. For me the reason to charge more is just that
       | customers are willing to pay more than you think.
       | 
       | When you double the price, it is likely that the people who
       | bought would still have bought at the new price. So you are
       | leaving money at the table by not raising the price.
        
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