[HN Gopher] Emily Riehl is rewriting the foundations of higher c...
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       Emily Riehl is rewriting the foundations of higher category theory
        
       Author : guerrilla
       Score  : 60 points
       Date   : 2021-03-03 21:05 UTC (1 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (www.quantamagazine.org)
 (TXT) w3m dump (www.quantamagazine.org)
        
       | amyjess wrote:
       | > I think there's more stigma attached to femininity in
       | mathematics than femaleness necessarily. As a semi-androgynous
       | queer woman, I think that I kind of fit in in the mathematics
       | community better than I would if I were a cis, straight female.
       | 
       | For anyone who would like to read more on the subject, I'd
       | recommend the works of Julia Serano. She's written extensively
       | about how feminine women are mistreated in academia, even by
       | other feminists and queer women; her most prominent book is
       | _Whipping Girl: A Transsexual Woman on Sexism and the
       | Scapegoating of Femininity_ , but she also has a number of other
       | books and essays on the subject. She's also coined the term
       | "femmephobia" to refer to the phenomenon.
        
         | munk-a wrote:
         | My sister-in-law went through an odd ostracization when trying
         | to get tenure in academia. She and my brother had decided to
         | have children while she pursued her tenure and she ended up
         | getting a lot of friction out of older women in the department
         | who had been forced, when they entered academia, to make a hard
         | choice between being a mother and being a professor.
         | 
         | There are a lot of really strange social dynamics that women
         | can get hit by in the workplace and that one was certainly new
         | to me.
        
       | munk-a wrote:
       | I can really identify with finding Ian Malcolm as inspirational
       | for the positive sides of science. In Jurassic Park the contrast
       | between the do-er scientists (those engineering the dinosaurs)
       | and the think-er scientists (the more abstract theoretical
       | scientist) was pretty starkly and, now that I've been working for
       | a while, correctly portrayed in exposing the motivations those
       | two classes of folks will tend to be working.
       | 
       | If science is a career to acquire cash then it's quite easy to
       | get compromised into focusing on the wrong motivations even if
       | your intentions are quite pure - abstract fields tend to be
       | rather "useless" and thus the same influencing power and money
       | isn't available leading those folks to have a much clearer
       | ability to ethically reason about problems. When you've got co-
       | workers depending on a project going forward to keep a roof over
       | their heads it's a lot easier to compromise morals.
        
       | generationP wrote:
       | > I'm not sure whether Lurie realized that it was possible to
       | give rigorous model-independent proofs laying the foundations of
       | infinity category theory. Part of the reason that Dom and I are
       | able to establish something along the lines that I suspect Lurie
       | would have wanted is that we were coming along later. There is
       | also a sociological component to the history. Lurie was forced by
       | the community to choose a specific model to prove theorems about
       | infinity categories, because the ideas were so new, and people
       | didn't believe the proofs otherwise.
       | 
       | Short version: Even Lurie wasn't ready to generalize from one
       | example :)
       | 
       | Nothing to be ashamed of in any other part of mathematics, I'd
       | say.
        
       | morty_s wrote:
       | I love category theory. I found out about it through Haskell and
       | as it turns out it is a branch of mathematics that I feel I've
       | been missing my whole life.
       | 
       | Since taking an interest I've worked through a couple books on
       | the topic and have listened to a ton of talks/interviews Emily
       | Riehl has given (as well as others).
       | 
       | I really enjoyed her talk at lambda world, "A categorical view of
       | computational effects" (both the content and audio/video quality
       | of this talk are very good!)
       | 
       | Stoked to see this article on HN! I can't tell if category theory
       | is becoming more popular or if I'm just living in a
       | algorithmically curated/tailored world.
        
       | masterofnone1 wrote:
       | Definitely a great article and the math part was incredibly
       | interesting.
       | 
       | At the same time, I had a bit of a nagging fear by this line -
       | 
       | > As a semi-androgynous queer woman, I think that I kind of fit
       | in in the mathematics community better than I would if I were a
       | cis, straight female. I think it also means I'm less likely to
       | get hit on, which is a horrible thing that has happened to a lot
       | of young women in fields where there aren't enough women.
       | 
       | Obviously without defining "hit on", I do not want to draw too
       | many conclusions. But as a guy, it makes me quite scared that
       | just asking a someone out for a coffee (which I do to people
       | regardless of gender / sex), might get construed as "hitting on"
       | and a horrible thing. All due respect to the people who have been
       | subjected to sexually predatory behavior though. Would like to
       | hear others opinion on the same.
        
         | dang wrote:
         | This is a generic tangent veering into outright offtopicness.
         | We try to avoid generic tangents in HN threads because such
         | discussions are more or less all the same, and replacing an
         | interesting specific discussion with a repetitive generic one
         | is a bad trade.
         | 
         | https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sor...
         | 
         | That goes 10x when the topic is an ideological one. It's clear
         | you weren't starting an ideological flamewar on purpose but
         | that's what generic ideological tangents lead to.
         | 
         | https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sor...
         | 
         | The best way to avoid this is to stay grounded in the specifics
         | of the article, especially the ones which have the richest
         | diffs from past repetitive discussion.
         | 
         | https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&so...
        
         | dundarious wrote:
         | Just asking if they'd like to go for a coffee and a chat is not
         | intrinsically "hitting on" someone. Obviously tone and context
         | can change everything, but there is no need to be paranoid in
         | general.
        
           | generationP wrote:
           | > might get construed as
           | 
           | > is not intrinsically
           | 
           | Your post does not contradict the parent.
           | 
           | For better or worse, any type of interaction (professional or
           | not) is occasionally used as a side channel for romantic
           | interests, and so risks getting misinterpreted as one. Cyber-
           | optimist hopes that online dating platforms will pull this
           | ever-present shadow out of everyday socialization, or at
           | least de-mine the workplace, have proven futile; enough
           | people _want_ the ambiguity. The only reasonable option is to
           | grow a thicker skin and learn saying no and laughing it off.
        
             | munk-a wrote:
             | I've thought on this a lot in the past and the only thing I
             | have hope of addressing it is making any sort of
             | personal/professional relationship spill overs societally
             | verbotten. When folks are at work they intend to work and
             | making any assumption against that line is just going to
             | lead to pain. I really like the team I work with, but I
             | don't ever want them to mix with the group I socialize with
             | solely due to the fact that while at work I want to work.
        
               | generationP wrote:
               | You want to avoid even social (not just romantical)
               | mixing?
               | 
               | Sorry, but I don't think this is viable with the workers
               | I know (including myself). It is in head-on contradiction
               | with the "do what you love" maxim that most people in my
               | generation are trying to follow. We aren't robots and we
               | don't want to live two completely disjoint lives (or,
               | rather, when we do, we have internet forums, video games
               | and what not for that). In order to have a job where I
               | could completely dissociate from my coworkers, I'd need
               | to find a second skill at which I'm good enough to find
               | employment yet don't care enough about to let it bleed
               | into my life. People are struggling enough with building
               | one skill...
               | 
               | There is probably some good middle ground to be found
               | (how far should my job be from my interests to avoid
               | crossing the streams too much yet allow me to keep it?
               | how much should I let my colleagues into my life?), but
               | no one seems to have invested much in finding it.
        
               | munk-a wrote:
               | There are some people who lean this way and that's fine -
               | there's nothing wrong with it - but there are other
               | people who don't. This will tend to follow an age
               | distinction (with older folks being less interested in
               | having more personal/professional crossover) but I
               | strongly disagree with it being generational.
               | 
               | Your team at work will change over time and new people
               | will join and leave, as you are forced to reconcile
               | changes of employment with the destruction of your social
               | circle I think you'll find that it's easier to move to
               | keeping the two separate. Having children and a strong
               | life partner can also contribute to this - there are a
               | lot of relationships you care deeply about outside of the
               | workplace and you don't want your time at work to be
               | complicated by drama from the fact that you don't value
               | your relationships with your coworker over that of your
               | partner.
               | 
               | Social events at work can be fun and build a stronger
               | team, but viewing your coworkers as your primary social
               | circle probably isn't a healthy long term choice since at
               | some point that relationship will be severed (hope that
               | you don't have to fire a bestie) and someone will be left
               | in an emotional lurch without a shoulder to cry on. I've
               | found it quite helpful to be able to empathize with
               | coworkers and chat about what's going on with work bits
               | in a more safe environment but going into work hoping to
               | find good relationships (social or romantic) is placing a
               | large burden on those you're working with and can end
               | pretty terribly.
               | 
               | I'd also point out that strong social bonds are a
               | reciprocal thing and that while you may be entering the
               | workplace hoping to form those bonds your coworkers may
               | not and the visible existence of cliques in work that
               | exclude some employees that may simply be uninterested in
               | such social activity can lead just as easily to drama in
               | the workplace.
        
             | dundarious wrote:
             | > might get construed as
             | 
             | The uncertainty comes mostly from the interpretation of the
             | asked.
             | 
             | > is not intrinsically
             | 
             | The uncertainty comes mostly from the way in which the
             | asker asks.
             | 
             | I believe the latter is more representative.
        
           | masterofnone1 wrote:
           | I agree, in the context of the article it means something
           | more sinister than just coffee. But regardless, does not
           | leave me with some fear. Thanks for your reply!
        
         | morty_s wrote:
         | I think there's a saying, "when in doubt, don't" or something
         | like that, but seriously
         | 
         | As a guy I kind of get where you're coming from. Sort of. I
         | think being "scared" is a bit much (or can at least be
         | portrayed as the "wrong" connotation to those that care). The
         | way I'd phrase this is, "I want to respect people's boundaries
         | and certain situations can be trickier to navigate than others
         | and I'd rather not mess it up."
         | 
         | You can't account for how someone else will perceive your
         | actions/intentions. In fact, they could probably vary (ie what
         | if someone is looking to be hit on on Tuesday but not
         | Wednesday? What if a person thinks "everyone hits on them").
         | 
         | For me, I try to treat everyone with respect. Maybe I want to
         | talk more about something, but the other person doesn't--I'm
         | aware this could be the case so I always try to
         | leave/create/make space for them (ie always provide a way out
         | of the convo for the other person).
         | 
         | I also try to ask myself if "grabbing a coffee" over some
         | conversation is necessary. Interesting people have a ton of
         | people wanting to grab coffee, so maybe a group thing would be
         | better. I also try to consider the persons time (male or
         | female); of course I'd love to steal some time from them or
         | make a professional connection, but you can't always get what
         | you want.
        
         | loopercal wrote:
         | I'm not sure of your point. You're scared of being seen as a
         | predator while women are scared of being preyed upon? So
         | wouldn't you want to try and make spaces as safe as possible so
         | that women wouldn't have to be afraid?
        
       | mkw5053 wrote:
       | I went through her book "Category Theory in Context" a few years
       | ago and loved it! It's a great introduction to the field.
        
         | breck wrote:
         | Thanks for the tip! Looks like she put the PDF of the book up
         | here: https://math.jhu.edu/~eriehl/context.pdf
        
           | guerrilla wrote:
           | From the same page:
           | 
           | > The Mathemagician's Axiom of Textbook Prerequisites: Let M
           | be the minimum actual prerequisites for an average student
           | being able to read and understand a given presentation of a
           | subject in a mathematics textbook. Let A be the author's
           | stated prerequisites. Then usually: A <<<<<<< M
           | 
           | > ... My intended audience might be described as peri-
           | graduate students, ranging from advanced mathematics
           | undergraduates, to graduate students, to perhaps even
           | research mathematicians in other disciplines.
        
             | einpoklum wrote:
             | So, you're saying a well-read Ph.D. in abstract math is the
             | pre-requisite for reading that book?
        
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       (page generated 2021-03-03 23:00 UTC)