[HN Gopher] FDA authorizes Pfizer vaccine for kids age 12 to 15
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       FDA authorizes Pfizer vaccine for kids age 12 to 15
        
       Author : jbredeche
       Score  : 66 points
       Date   : 2021-05-10 21:27 UTC (1 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (www.nytimes.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (www.nytimes.com)
        
       | vmception wrote:
       | Go USA! What is the current standard of review for these
       | authorizations since complete clinical trials are not possible,
       | and a convenient point of contention for people that opt-out of
       | taking the vaccine (most of them would move the goal post to
       | something else even with successful clinical trials with a
       | relatable list of side effects, but I was wondering about this
       | process)
        
         | vecplane wrote:
         | Isn't it reasonable to have the option to opt-out of taking
         | these vaccines, in the absence of more complete data and
         | longer-term trials?
        
           | happytoexplain wrote:
           | Sure - but the parent didn't criticize the existence of the
           | option. They criticized the decision making that many (not
           | all) people use when exercising that option.
        
           | kurthr wrote:
           | Yes, I think that at this point putting your own life at risk
           | is acceptable. You'll probably have to wear a mask since you
           | could make other people sick (who could then pass it on to
           | someone immunocompromised). Of course you could face a civil
           | suit, if someone get's sick or dies, and you can be shown as
           | the proximate cause of illness. Your employer may choose not
           | to take that risk.
           | 
           | If you're licensed in many states (e.g. medical, etc.) you're
           | already required to be vaccinated against flu/TB. With EUA
           | they've put this off, but with full authorization, why treat
           | it differently?
           | 
           | One question, what long term effect of the vaccines are you
           | concerned about, that wouldn't be far less severe than
           | actually being infected?
        
             | vmception wrote:
             | Many people are wary of the newness of mRNA technology.
             | 
             | They think a long term affect has been overlooked or is
             | unknown. Although some people make up long term effects,
             | many other people are just acknowledging the absence of
             | history to tell, and thats valid.
             | 
             | (Very few of the people opting out are distinguishing
             | between any vaccine technology though. But some are.)
        
               | Pfhreak wrote:
               | Isn't "the mRNA technology" decades old at this point?
               | Yes, this might be the first wide spread human
               | deployment, but they've been researching the technique in
               | animals for over thirty years.
               | 
               | What's the bar for when a technology is no longer "new"?
        
             | sokoloff wrote:
             | For healthy, young people, I can see many of them making a
             | not-irrational judgement that with the reports of blood-
             | clot side effects above the population expectancy [from
             | AZ's vaccine], coupled with a lack of full authorization
             | for any of them, to conclude that waiting is reasonable for
             | them. I support what I believe is their right to make that
             | choice _particularly_ in advance of a full approval for
             | use.
             | 
             | (I'm fully vaccinated as of today, just as context for what
             | I said above. I came to a different [and I believe
             | rational] calculation of my own risk-balance of
             | complications from the vaccine versus fading the COVID risk
             | unvaccinated for me and my family/colleagues and signed up
             | for the very first shot I could get, a 75 minute drive
             | away.)
        
           | sithadmin wrote:
           | In the absence of legitimate health concerns preventing one
           | from safely receiving the vaccines, it's increasingly
           | _unreasonable_ and arguably unethical to opt-out of taking
           | the vaccines.
        
             | [deleted]
        
             | bongobingos wrote:
             | Fortunately, America isn't an autocratic dictatorship.
        
         | kurthr wrote:
         | The clinical trials are actually the same (statistical power)
         | as previous vaccine trials. They've simply enrolled more people
         | faster and had a higher infection rate to evaluate safety and
         | efficacy. It is likely in the next month that Pfizer will get a
         | standard (non Emergency Use) Authorization.
         | 
         | https://www.biospace.com/article/pfizer-biontech-and-moderna...
         | 
         | The reason for EUA was that so many people were dying that some
         | more limited (<1yr clinical safety) data was accepted. Now that
         | many of the original subjects are falling past 1yr post
         | inoculation (and variants have been evaluated) a full
         | authorization in eminent. Previously, people worried that once
         | one vaccine was authorized other EUA (NovaVax, AZ/ChadOx, etc)
         | wouldn't happened, has also been resolved since the FDA
         | realizes people want choice.
        
       | mixmastamyk wrote:
       | I've recently heard a few parents talking about getting their
       | kids these shots. So I decided to take a look at the CDC numbers
       | again. There's a graph where you can select death counts per age
       | group:
       | 
       | https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm#Se...
       | 
       | Given that death rates for the elderly are in the thousands per
       | week, while those for kids jump around two to four or so, is this
       | a good idea? Typically you want the benefits of a vaccine to
       | outweigh the risks. I certainly could be missing something, but
       | it doesn't look like this is the case for healthy kids.
        
       | stevefrench93 wrote:
       | Does anyone know the case fatality rate for children in this age
       | range?
        
         | pragmatic8 wrote:
         | Yeah. Nil.
        
       | randomopining wrote:
       | Doubters are like "you don't know the long term effects!"
       | 
       | But you also don't know the long term effects of covid lol. At
       | least this has been clinically studied for a year.
        
         | abfan1127 wrote:
         | we have year old results for Covid too.
        
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       (page generated 2021-05-10 23:00 UTC)