[HN Gopher] Build your own SPARC workstation
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       Build your own SPARC workstation
        
       Author : marcodiego
       Score  : 55 points
       Date   : 2021-08-05 18:18 UTC (4 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (learn.adafruit.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (learn.adafruit.com)
        
       | neilv wrote:
       | One of my greatest bits of luck was getting access to these and
       | other Unix workstations&servers as a teen.
       | 
       | If you run old SPARCstation OSes, a few points of interest...
       | 
       | If you get the OpenWindows era with Open Look look&feel, one of
       | the things that were newish around then is the pinnable menus and
       | dialogs. You could sometimes tear off a menu and turn it into a
       | persistent window that's more like a toolbar (which was also
       | emerging then).
       | 
       | Open Look (or Sun) was also introducing small rectangular
       | drag&drop target widget on windows, when drag&drop was new. Which
       | I don't recall seeing later, so maybe it was a mix of less
       | drag&drop than we thought we might have, and more an expectation
       | of the user to learn what things could be dragged and where they
       | could be dropped.
       | 
       | Behind Open Look also a number of different toolkits and window
       | system backends that might be behind a given Open Look
       | application and desktop. My favorite toolkit was XView, and it
       | was very easy to work with in C, and used varargs sorta like GTK
       | later did. Desktop-wise, besides X, there was the XNeWS server,
       | which supported a kind of display PostScript on steroids, and you
       | could write entire applications in PostScript (though their
       | OpenLook widgets looked poor early on, compared to the pixel-
       | perfect XView result).
       | 
       | Maybe the key thing to notice about OpenLook... At the time, the
       | other main X GUI look&feel that workstations were moving to was
       | Motif, which was mostly just rectangles. Someone once posted
       | screenshots of a dialog in Open Look and then another in Motif,
       | with all the text removed, and, in Open Look, you could pretty
       | much tell what all the familiar widgets were, and you immediately
       | knew how to interact with all of them. That was considered
       | valuable at the time. (Though HCI in general has moved more
       | towards brochure-like and magazine-like motivations in the
       | interests of the creator, and away from motivations we had
       | before, for new-user and power-user usability in the interests of
       | the user.)
       | 
       | If you go back a little further with your workstation, to SunOS
       | 4.1.x or 4.0.x, you can forget about X and NeWS, and see
       | something a bit different: SunView. This was a monochrome GUI,
       | maybe sorta like an old Mac, but without all the things the Mac
       | had, and backed by much more sophisticated workstation/server OS.
       | People did powerful things with it, on a workstation with a
       | megapixel display and 8MB of RAM. The GUI toolkit was the
       | predecessor to XView, and similar.
       | 
       | For workstation application programs (like my employer
       | developed), it wasn't unusual to implement your own portable GUI
       | layer, including an entire window systems. So, our stuff and
       | Interleaf's, for example, would create a native window for
       | whatever workstation desktop was in use, and implement our own
       | desktop within that. And they were all different, and often
       | innovative, sometimes in ways that have been lost.
       | 
       | I didn't see how all the different CAD, EDA, etc. packages
       | worked, but sometimes the workstation was pretty much an
       | appliance for running a single program, and on occasion would
       | even be branded with a physical badge for the application
       | software on it.
       | 
       | You can rediscover some of the same flavor _still alive_ by
       | looking at UI innovations by, for example, Blender, where (last I
       | used it) they built UI from scratch, and they seemed to innovate
       | in the interests of the users, including power users. Maybe more
       | accessible to us on HN, some IDEs are places that get creative
       | innovations often in the interests of power users.)
       | 
       | You'll also see innovations less-familiar in some other
       | workstations, like Apollo Domain. (A lot of Sun stuff might be a
       | little too familiar, because they sorta won, albeit in the form
       | of Linux and the BSDs today. SunOS was also arguably the easiest
       | out-of-box platform for building GNU-ish software on the
       | Internet, before Linux was sufficiently ready, so that's another
       | regard in which they both influenced and were influenced.)
       | 
       | Also, if you end up trying a real-metal vintage workstation
       | experience, don't forget to hit the degauss button on your 21"
       | CRT, be startled by the sounds and the ray behavior, and each
       | time wonder in the back of your mind whether there's any health
       | risk to be standing near it each time that happens. :)
        
       | abeyer wrote:
       | > For added fun, a Sun Type 5 keyboard converted to USB
       | 
       | We must have _very_ different definitions of fun. The pile of
       | mush that was the Type 5 is up pretty high on my list of "never
       | again" keyboards. I was a full on Sun fanboy, but even I was the
       | first to admit that their input devices could be pretty awful.
        
         | jeffrallen wrote:
         | Sun optical mice were a pain in the ass too.
        
           | adrianmonk wrote:
           | Hey, I'm moving the mouse but the pointer isn't going much of
           | anywhere! What's wrong?!
           | 
           | Oh yeah, _the mouse isn 't CORRECTLY ALIGNED with the mouse
           | pad_! I'd better check if the mouse pad has moved out of its
           | proper position on the desk. And pay a bit more attention to
           | how I'm holding the mouse so that I don't introduce too much
           | rotation about the vertical axis.
           | 
           | That alignment was something I never had to worry about with
           | any type of mouse I used before or after. On the other hand,
           | it worked pretty well when it was lined up right. It really
           | seemed to track motion more smoothly and accurately than
           | mechanical mice.
           | 
           | For those who don't understand why it had to be aligned,
           | Wikipedia has an article
           | (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mouse_Systems) with two good
           | photos.
           | 
           | Mouse: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mouse_Systems#/media/Fil
           | e:Sun_...
           | 
           | Close-up of grid: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mouse_Systems
           | #/media/File:Mous...
        
           | wyldfire wrote:
           | The ones w the reflective metallic mousepad?
        
             | abeyer wrote:
             | yup, and the marks were painted on, so started wearing off
             | (and thus losing mouse resolution) the second you started
             | using it.
        
               | hughrr wrote:
               | This thread brings me pleasant memories of drunken post
               | student union bar C hacking sessions in the 90s. Apart
               | from the mice. And openwindows. Fuck both of them!
        
               | cmrdporcupine wrote:
               | What's wrong with openwindows? Always like it.
        
         | neilv wrote:
         | I don't know whether to blame the Type 4, something about our
         | desks, or something in the water... but our entire development
         | team were getting RSI problems, like I haven't heard of before
         | or since.
         | 
         | (Fortunately, there was chatter on the Internet about this
         | problem at the time, and I learned the very simple workstation
         | adjustments that worked for me. Ever since, I've been able to
         | type like crazy, with no discomfort. To this day, I give
         | everyone The Talk about typing RSI injuries, the set of usual
         | culprits I know about, so you can adjust and see what works for
         | you, and the absolute necessity of not working through typing
         | pain. And if someone is noticing typing-related pain, they need
         | to get a referral to a specialist(s), they need to keep on the
         | specialist so they don't fall through the cracks, and they need
         | to do what the specialist says.)
        
       | crawdog wrote:
       | Now all you need is a license for ATG Dynamo and you can setup
       | your own circa 1998 ecommerce website.
        
       | tyingq wrote:
       | You can get 6 LEON/Sparc boards for $36:
       | https://navspark.mybigcommerce.com/navspark-mini-6pcs-pack/
       | 
       | Though I suppose 200k of RAM might be a barrier :)
        
         | mrlonglong wrote:
         | Cluster them for more ram !
        
       | mrlonglong wrote:
       | I've used most of the SPARC stations during the late 90s. 4, 5
       | and 20. They were a lot better than the Pentiums in use. Moved up
       | to the UltraSPARCs, my last one was a Blade 2000. Linux was a
       | champ on those architectures. But I don't miss the blasted bus
       | errors not one bit. AMD is where it's at nowadays, ARM will be
       | next within the next few years.
        
       | ttul wrote:
       | As a teenager, I scored a sweet job installing new SPARC 5
       | workstations at an electronics company for a few weeks during an
       | otherwise quiet summer. Man, those were some amazing computers.
       | The cases opened with a thumbscrew and were so easy to work with.
       | Elegant design. Super robust. For a kid who had only ever worked
       | with cheap PCs, Sun hardware was an absolute dream.
        
         | icedchai wrote:
         | I had a Sparc 5 at home when I was in my early 20's, probably
         | 1996 or 97. That was my main desktop for about 4 or 5 years.
         | Great machines.
        
       | mrlonglong wrote:
       | Oh and I thought OpenWindows was cool
        
       | johndoe0815 wrote:
       | You can also implement a Sparcstation 5 on an FPGA (and not only
       | in qemu) thanks to temlib: http://temlib.org/site/
        
         | chrisBob wrote:
         | > Operating range : (altitude < 18km) or (speed < 515m/sec),
         | both not exceeded simultaneously
         | 
         | Is that a limitation so that you don't use it for missile
         | guidance?
        
           | packetslave wrote:
           | Yep. Same reason your phone's GPS won't work above a certain
           | speed and/or altitude.
        
       | bifftastic wrote:
       | Tempted to try this with SunOS 4.1.3 for the sake of nostalgia -
       | the first Unix I ever used.
        
       | usr1106 wrote:
       | Read the article but it did not mention anything about the
       | software licences. Have these old versions been released for free
       | in the meantime?
       | 
       | Copyright expires 7O years after the death of the author. Not
       | really suitable for software lifecycles. Nothing from the 1990s
       | has any commercial value any more.
        
         | NexRebular wrote:
         | Sadly there are no free releases of these old versions
         | available. Not even sure it's legal to install from authentic
         | media if the hardware is not real SUN hardware...
        
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       (page generated 2021-08-05 23:00 UTC)