[HN Gopher] Typography in Alien (2014)
       ___________________________________________________________________
        
       Typography in Alien (2014)
        
       Author : tosh
       Score  : 238 points
       Date   : 2021-08-12 10:32 UTC (12 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (typesetinthefuture.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (typesetinthefuture.com)
        
       | mwaitjmp wrote:
       | Not sure what it is about this film, the aesthetics, story,
       | atmosphere, the acting? I think it's perhaps my favourite film.
       | The first 20 mins or so in particular are outstanding.
       | 
       | I'm sure many know but the idea of having the mundane industrial
       | theme transferred to space was supposed to have come from a
       | student film called Dark Star[0].
       | 
       | Alien Isolation is also fantastic though hard to fully enjoy the
       | atmosphere for the most part as it's fairly terrifying.
       | 
       | There was a piece on hacker news a while back where a programmer
       | talked through how he was asked to code up the graphics for the
       | landing sequence.(3D terrain wireframe).
       | 
       | [0] https://lewtonbus.net/editorials/dark-star-chest-alien-
       | burst...
        
         | monkeycantype wrote:
         | Something that I love about alien is the way John Hurt's
         | character as the 'face into danger, get things done' soldier
         | resolves the problem of horror movies - why do people do these
         | stupid things that put them in danger? Hurt's character is
         | smart and professional, and doing exactly what he has been
         | trained to do, to put himself and his team into danger in
         | service of a larger agenda. He's no an idiot, he doesn't waver
         | near the danger, he charges straight into it. He's doing his
         | job, as retconned in later movies the xenomoph is valuable
         | asset, worthy of risking the nostromo and its crew for.
        
       | ape4 wrote:
       | I expect real mining spaceships and colonies will just have the
       | same regular fonts we use now. They're the most readable. Not
       | space/future fonts.
        
         | _moof wrote:
         | If SpaceX has anything to say about it, it'll be Lato.
        
           | cratermoon wrote:
           | Let's hope nothing safety-critical depends on being able to
           | tell the difference between the l and the I.
        
         | JoeAltmaier wrote:
         | I expect they will be cost-effective conglomerates of many
         | manufacturers, possibly refitted multiple times. They may
         | likely be a pastiche of decades of decisions about fonts and
         | styles!
        
         | otikik wrote:
         | The Corporation has decided that disembodied brains don't need
         | fonts of any kind in order to perform their required function.
        
         | mumblemumble wrote:
         | I didn't notice a single stereotypical space/future font in
         | there. Lots of Helvetica and suchlike, plus a few display
         | typefaces in spots where it makes sense to use a display
         | typeface. And, of course, a bunch of computer fonts that look
         | retro-futuristic now, but would have just been all they had to
         | work with, because that sort of styling was what you had to do
         | to make text legible on a vintage 1979 low DPI CRT display.
        
         | dfxm12 wrote:
         | Alien was made in the 70s and at the time and was set in some
         | time in the distant future. What fonts were _we_ using back
         | then? Will we be using the same fonts hundreds of years in the
         | future? What fonts were the people in the setting using?
         | 
         | On top of that, part of the draw of sci-fi is to imagine a new,
         | different world. That includes different fonts.
        
           | codazoda wrote:
           | One thing that comes to mind is freeway sign fonts in the US.
           | They have recently started to change and I certainly don't
           | like the new ones as well as the old ones. But, maybe that's
           | just my human emotions avoiding change.
        
         | hyper_dynamics wrote:
         | Yeah sure...
         | 
         | "Can you make it look more futuristic? We're building a mining
         | spaceship colony and it must attract the investors"
        
           | sizzzzlerz wrote:
           | Well, then, make sure it has an iPod interface and lots of
           | cup holders.
        
         | regularfry wrote:
         | Interestingly, there's a font designed (relatively recently)
         | for air traffic control use, where misreading glyphs can be
         | catastrophic. I tried it as a terminal font.
         | 
         | It is awful.
        
           | _moof wrote:
           | > I tried it as a terminal font. It is awful.
           | 
           | In fairness, a shell is a very different use case from a
           | flight deck. (You note below that this is a flight deck font,
           | not an ATC font.) An aircraft cockpit is mostly using type to
           | display small pieces of isolated information, e.g. a speed or
           | a list of 4-6 letter approach names, not a big wall of text
           | (ACARS messages notwithstanding).
        
             | regularfry wrote:
             | Yes, but I had initially thought that the selection
             | pressures would be similar enough, particularly around
             | disambiguation, that good for one would be good for the
             | other. Either that was untrue, or... they didn't do the
             | design particularly well.
        
               | _moof wrote:
               | Yup, entirely possible. I haven't used it myself.
        
           | blue1 wrote:
           | Can you remember the name of this font?
        
             | regularfry wrote:
             | I had misremembered. It's not for air traffic control, but
             | for aircraft cockpits. It's this: https://b612-font.com/
             | 
             | In particular I suspect that the '()' and '[]' glyphs are
             | far more common in source code and terminal use than in
             | cockpits. I found them far, far too similar. Also there's
             | little distinction between 'O' and '0' , and between 'I'
             | and '|'. Other than those problems, it's mostly fine - 'l'
             | and '1' are usefully distinct, for instance - but the
             | friction from those particular difficulties was enough to
             | make me hate it.
        
               | cratermoon wrote:
               | Trivia: B-612 is the name of the asteroid home of the
               | Little Prince of the eponymous story. That name is
               | derived from the name of the aircraft flown by author
               | Antoine de Saint-Exupery. Saint-Exupery was a pilot.
        
               | bryondowd wrote:
               | Makes sense that a cockpit wouldn't need a clear
               | distinction between brackets and parenthesis, or |. But I
               | am surprised about the similarity of 0 and O. I recall
               | when I went to the ATC academy they really drilled in
               | using a horizontal slash through zeros when hand-written.
               | Also had to underline the letter S in any case where it
               | could be ambiguous with the number 5 (as in a plane's
               | tail number). I think we also had to put a horizontal
               | strike through the letter Z to distinguish it from a 2.
        
               | _moof wrote:
               | Probably more important in an ATC context than a flight
               | deck setting. Tail numbers come to mind, as you said.
               | Although I could see Part 91 operators mixing up airport
               | identifiers with O and 0, airlines don't fly to airports
               | where that matters... intersections and navaids are all
               | alpha... approach names aren't going to have any
               | ambiguity... so I _guess_ one could argue it 's ok?
               | Still, you're right, it was a weird choice not to
               | disambiguate them.
               | 
               | (Also, I'm super jealous you went to the ATC academy. By
               | the time I seriously considered it, I'd aged out.)
        
       | ourmandave wrote:
       | Reading that reminded me of the ending, with the slow pan on a
       | now sleeping Ripley.
       | 
       | And the music (Sinfonia No 2 The Romantic) takes one last moment
       | to jump scare you with the horn (2:31 in this video).
       | 
       | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfyg_sE85kQ
        
       | msla wrote:
       | Am I the only one who finds this website hard to read?
       | 
       | Low contrast, huge margins, just not legible.
        
       | coldacid wrote:
       | I actually bought the book some time ago, based off the strength
       | of this article and the one on 2001.
        
       | jdc wrote:
       | Man, what I wouldn't give to have Berthold City Light as my
       | virtual console font!
        
         | cratermoon wrote:
         | No way. The 0 and the O are essentially identical (with O being
         | slightly larger but only distinguishable next to the 0), and
         | the l, 1, and I are close enough to be easily confused.
        
         | bartvk wrote:
         | Is there someone who can point to a mono version of this font?
         | I tried it in iTerm but forcing a proportional font into mono
         | looks pretty bad.
        
       | Andrew_nenakhov wrote:
       | Oldie but goodie. My favourite bit is this:
       | 
       | "The five minutes to destruction are _typographically
       | uninteresting_. Ripley makes it to the escape shuttle with no
       | sign of the alien. "
        
       | specproc wrote:
       | An oldie but a goodie. Love this piece.
        
       | causi wrote:
       | _That's not just a factor of ten out - it's also an entirely
       | different unit of measurement._
       | 
       | This is not a problem for multiple reasons. Firstly, if you work
       | in a mechanical field you know that machines regularly combine
       | metric and imperial parts. You may have to use a 3mm hex wrench
       | and then sixty seconds later a 3/32 hex wrench. Right now you're
       | using an OS that labels storage in one unit and storage devices
       | labeled in another, gigabytes and gibibytes.
       | 
       | The second reason is even simpler: the display on the Nostromo's
       | computer is in-universe and the title card for the movie isn't.
       | The title card could label the cargo of the Nostromo as 11.7
       | trillion pennyweights of ore and it wouldn't matter.
       | 
       | Also I don't know why he thinks "old man" as slang for father is
       | British. It was in common use in the US in the 90s.
        
         | hef19898 wrote:
         | The only case I know of is old British cars, from before they
         | fully transitioned to metric. Some parts on Land Rovers, prop
         | shafts for example didn't for a _long_ time.
         | 
         | Anyway, mixing is just bad engineering. Which shows us that bad
         | engineering is a thing for space craft of the future. Just why
         | Weyland-Yutani's logisticians would cope with this mix of units
         | for refinement capacity and / or payload is beyond me...
        
           | kwhitefoot wrote:
           | The gearbox casing on my 1965 Volvo Amazon was secured with
           | Whitworth bolts! I've forgotten what size. In 1980 it was
           | difficult to find the right ones.
        
           | PaulDavisThe1st wrote:
           | The bolts on the handlebar stem of one of my bikes (a Surly
           | Straggler) have metric threads and _SAE hex heads_. Can it
           | get more insane?
        
             | oriolid wrote:
             | There are several threads on bicycles that have metric
             | diameter and TPI thread pitch. Off the top of my head, at
             | least Italian bottom bracket and freewheel threads and
             | French lock ring thread are like that but I'm sure there
             | are more.
        
           | causi wrote:
           | _The only case I know of is old British cars_
           | 
           | It's fairly common in the US for machines which aren't
           | produced in large numbers. Specialized factory and scientific
           | machinery especially. I encounter it with agricultural
           | machinery and textile analyzers.
           | 
           |  _Just why Weyland-Yutani 's logisticians would cope with
           | this mix of units for refinement capacity and / or payload is
           | beyond me..._
           | 
           | ...they don't. The title card is not in-universe. To the best
           | of my knowledge there is no depiction of Weyland-Yutani
           | themselves using imperial units.
        
           | dharmab wrote:
           | Old Harley Davidson motorcycles used only SAE parts. Newer
           | ones have global suppliers and have a mix of metric and SAE.
        
         | spfzero wrote:
         | It was common in the US in the 70s too.
        
       | riffraff wrote:
       | The whole blog (and book, I suppose) is worth a read, it's just
       | beautiful and funny.
       | 
       | Also, you will not be able to avoid recognizing eurostile in
       | every single evil future corp once you're done.
        
       | dcolkitt wrote:
       | > Furthermore, this screenshot shows that the Nostromo has a
       | refinement capacity of "200,000,000 tonnes", and not the
       | "20,000,000 tons" mentioned in the Foreshadowing Inventory.
       | That's not just a factor of ten out - it's also an entirely
       | different unit of measurement.
       | 
       | "Haha. Boy, I really hope somebody got fired for that blunder."
        
         | [deleted]
        
         | spfzero wrote:
         | One is the capacity, the other is the load they actually were
         | carrying?
        
         | jayd16 wrote:
         | I wonder if its plot relevant. Its an empty tanker ship. You'd
         | risk that over a full one.
         | 
         | This was also the last leg of the contract for the crew. Does
         | that mean that Wayland-Yutani is actually exporting more
         | minerals from Earth than importing?
        
           | hef19898 wrote:
           | Good catch! And a very nice fun fact. If so, or if that run
           | was a bust, I wonder why WY was pissed at Ripley for blowing
           | it up. Insurance money is good.
        
           | codazoda wrote:
           | Ahem, Waylan Yutani. :P
        
             | smcl wrote:
             | You're actually both mistaken. It was referred to both as
             | Weyland-Yutani and Weylan-Yutani (note: wEy not wAy). It's
             | an easy mistake to make :)
        
       | cratermoon wrote:
       | This article repeats the story about the loss of the Mars Climate
       | Orbiter because of a mix-up in units. That's not really the
       | story. The navigation team had figured out the problem well in
       | advance, and requested an additional course correction maneuver
       | that would have put the spacecraft back where it should have
       | been. Their concerns were either ignored or overruled by
       | management. https://spectrum.ieee.org/why-the-mars-probe-went-
       | off-course
       | 
       | See also "A critical flaw was a _program management_ grown too
       | confident and too careless, even to the point of missing
       | opportunities to avoid the disaster. "
       | https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/809121
        
         | outworlder wrote:
         | From the article you linked:
         | 
         | > But managers demanded that worriers and doubters "prove
         | something was wrong,"
         | 
         | I have no productive words to convey my astonishment.
        
           | tantalor wrote:
           | Sure, wait for the thing to crater. There is your proof.
        
       | BonitaPersona wrote:
       | I didn't know about this website and book, so I'm glad you
       | decided to share it today even if it has a few years.
       | 
       | Definitely recommend the whole blog, and not only this article.
       | 
       | Thank you!
        
       | murat124 wrote:
       | I'm fascinated by the work that was put into making this
       | legendary movie. Is there a specific genre name given to movies
       | that have only a few people throughout the entirety of the movie
       | in a closed environment? If there was, Alien would definitely top
       | the list.
        
         | barrkel wrote:
         | It's very common in plays with small casts converted into
         | movies, for obvious reasons.
        
           | tillinghast wrote:
           | This led me to the following tangent: framing 12 Angry Men as
           | an MITH is an interesting thought experiment.
        
         | brnt wrote:
         | Its why I like Oz (series) too. There is something to be said
         | for understanding the boundary conditions in full. Funny thing
         | is that my partner hates this kind of thing :/
        
         | psuter wrote:
         | "huis clos"? It's commonly used in French at least.
         | https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/huis_clos
        
         | pklausler wrote:
         | The late Blake Snyder wrote a couple of books ("Save The Cat!",
         | recommended) on screenwriting with the hypothesis that there
         | are only ten basic story paradigms, and _Alien_ is the classic
         | "Monster In The House" example, along with _Jaws_.
         | 
         | In short, a MITH movie has our heroes trapped in a space due to
         | a sin not of their making, there's a monster, and at least one
         | character who is a wounded half-man harbinger of doom.
         | 
         | Once you know the ten categories, movies become pretty
         | predictable after the first reel or so, so maybe you don't want
         | to learn them.
        
           | stnmtn wrote:
           | Predictable movies are always predictable, but knowing the
           | categories and Save the Cat structure is fun because then you
           | can see when truly talented people subvert it and twist those
           | "rules".
        
             | pklausler wrote:
             | The tenfold categories are also a way to rescue a bad
             | movie-watching experience, because you can at least debate
             | whether (say) _Ad Astra_ was a ROP or something else
             | instead of just bitching about the science violations.
        
         | codazoda wrote:
         | It's not _Alien_ but I think it fits in the (unknown) category
         | really well... Buried, with Ryan Reynolds. It 's a pretty good
         | flick that's filmed almost entirely in a small dark box with
         | only him in it.
        
           | jimmygrapes wrote:
           | And perhaps one of the only movies without the standard Ryan
           | Reynolds quips and sarcasm! (I just watched The Hitman's
           | Wife's Bodyguard and was a little put off by just how often
           | he still does this, knowing that he has acting chops that
           | don't necessitate it)
        
         | dragonwriter wrote:
         | > Is there a specific genre name given to movies that have only
         | a few people throughout the entirety of the movie in a closed
         | environment?
         | 
         | I seem to recall ebcountering one that is somewhat more
         | specific than TV Tropes' "Closed Circle" [0] but less specific
         | than "Ten Little Murder Victims" [1] that fits this, but can't
         | put my finger on it right now.
         | 
         | [0] https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ClosedCircle
         | 
         | [1]
         | https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TenLittleMurderV...
        
         | CharlesW wrote:
         | > _Is there a specific genre name given to movies that have
         | only a few people throughout the entirety of the movie in a
         | closed environment?_
         | 
         | In TV this form is often referred to as a "bottle episode"[1],
         | and there's at least one article describing Alien as a "bottle
         | movie"[2]. Presumably, this was done to maximize what could be
         | done with its $11M (!) budget.
         | 
         | [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bottle_episode
         | 
         | [2] https://www.giantfreakinrobot.com/ent/alien-disney.html
        
         | ben7799 wrote:
         | Michael Crichton loved writing books on this trope.
         | 
         | e.x.
         | 
         | Jurassic Park - Stuck on an island full of dinosaurs
         | 
         | Congo - Stuck in a lost city full of deadly intelligent apes
         | 
         | Sphere - Stuck in an alien ship on the bottom of the ocean
        
           | daveslash wrote:
           | Westworld, stuck in a theme park with a killer robot _(the
           | 1973 movie, I haven 't seen the new show)_
        
             | folli wrote:
             | First season is worth a watch IMO. It handles topics
             | addressed by the movie in greater depth (sentient robots, a
             | bit like the story of Pinocchio).
             | 
             | The other seasons are made confusing seemingly on purpose
             | without adding to the story.
        
           | cratermoon wrote:
           | Andromeda Strain - stuck in a high-security bio-research
           | facility with a deadly alien pathogen.
        
             | ben7799 wrote:
             | I struggled with whether or not to include that one..
             | haven't actually read it and wasn't sure.
             | 
             | The whole genre is "Lost World" and goes all the way back
             | to King Solomon's Mines in the 1800s.
        
               | cratermoon wrote:
               | In Andromeda Strain, there's a bit of a twist in that as
               | the situation with the pathogen in the lab deteriorates,
               | the automatic safety systems start locking it down even
               | more tightly. The lab is made up of multiple levels, with
               | the lowest level (underground) being the most controlled.
               | For plot reasons, one of the researchers has to try to
               | get from the lowest level to an upper one and the
               | security systems actively try to stop him.
        
       | 1MachineElf wrote:
       | This article inspired a keycap set for mechanical keyboards, G20
       | Semiotic, back in 2016:
       | https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=85525.0
       | 
       | It's one of my favorite sets. Unfortunately, it isn't available
       | to purchase anymore. Signature Plastics said it would be coming
       | back, but that was before the pandemic, and nothing's been said
       | about it since.
        
         | stuart78 wrote:
         | Love it, i'd be hitting that w two or three times a day.
        
         | gedy wrote:
         | I have this set, and added it to an old Motorola terminal for
         | patrol cars: https://postimg.cc/N5GLsQ9X
        
           | OoOOo wrote:
           | That's a thing of beauty!
        
           | 1MachineElf wrote:
           | Looks like a salvaged piece of equipment from the Nostromo.
        
       | akkartik wrote:
       | Previous thread from 2016:
       | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11977909
        
       | qwerty456127 wrote:
       | Although the "Moon"'s font is less boring, it almost shouts
       | "don't read me" when more than a couple of words are displayed
       | with it. And it also seems grotesquely unrealistic - nobody would
       | use such a font to display anything useful in real life, even in
       | future.
        
         | sidpatil wrote:
         | That's the OCR-A font. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OCR-A).
         | As you can guess from the name, it was designed for readability
         | by both humans and computers.
         | 
         | These days it looks like that font is more popular for graphic
         | design than it is for actual OCR applications.
        
           | jhbadger wrote:
           | See also that weird font still used on many US paper checks
           | (E-13B). Half the movies in the 1970s used that as the
           | default computer/future font.
           | 
           | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetic_ink_character_recogni.
           | ..
        
             | atombender wrote:
             | The sci-fi font that showed up in the 60s was not MICR, but
             | a bunch of typefaces inspired by it. Chief among these was
             | Westminster [1] and Data 70. They were inspired by MICR,
             | but the latter only has digits and a few control
             | characters.
             | 
             | [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westminster_(typeface)
        
         | crispyambulance wrote:
         | OK, but it's not about legibility here.
         | 
         | It's about creating a feeling. Fonts like other graphic
         | elements CAN communicate feeling in addition to whatever they
         | spell out.
         | 
         | The case of Moon and Alien, it communicates a non-empathic
         | "Company" that has a lot to hide. A company that is literally
         | cryptic to it's own employees, of course they're going to have
         | unreadable user-hostile fonts.
         | 
         | A real-life analogy might be something like UI's from Oracle
         | EBS (enterprise business suite): Horrific, outdated, grey-blah
         | swing interfaces from the 90's that have tentacles in every
         | aspect of employee work-life from vacation-requests to
         | procurement, to bonuses and customer relationships.
        
           | qwerty456127 wrote:
           | By the way I always loved Swing interfaces and always felt
           | like they are incredibly cozy, emotionally warm and also tidy
           | at the same time.
           | 
           | Here[1] is a picture of Oracle EBS. To me it seems beautiful
           | (literally).
           | 
           | And if I look at the more classic Swing style here[2] I
           | almost feel urge to run around naked and scream about how
           | damn beautiful it is. I certainly want every app I use and
           | the OS itself to be entirely in this design and I would even
           | pay just for that (because I feel like that would boost my
           | psychological well-being and productivity).
           | 
           | So, given our perception of this same UI is on the opposite
           | extremes I conclude this is _highly_ subjective.
           | 
           | [1] https://cdn.app.compendium.com/uploads/user/e7c690e8-6ff9
           | -10...
           | 
           | [2] https://docs.oracle.com/cd/E37069_01/html/E37073/figures/
           | ide...
        
             | jhbadger wrote:
             | While I don't share your enthusiasm for Swing, I understand
             | it in principle because I really love the NextStep UI with
             | its 3D effects and yet I've met people who think it is
             | ugly.
        
             | crispyambulance wrote:
             | Understood... yes, it's all subjective, even if that
             | screenshot makes me vomit a little!
             | 
             | FWIW, you aren't showing that text often overflows it's
             | textbox and you can't actually see what's in it without
             | putting your cursor in and moving it to the end of the
             | text. They didn't have the concept of expanding to fit
             | content back then? or maybe most corporations can't afford
             | the oracle consultant that will do it for them ! :-) It's
             | OK though, most of the time you can just export to excel
             | with a few clicks.
             | 
             | Of course, such applications require lots of tuning, and
             | though they might have been cozy 20 years ago, they seem
             | harsh and burdensome today because no one bothers to change
             | stuff any more. You're just supposed to conform to it.
        
               | lazide wrote:
               | You can totally expand to resize based on content, among
               | many other tricks. That would require someone to care to
               | do so, which is probably the bigger problem.
        
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       (page generated 2021-08-12 23:00 UTC)