[HN Gopher] The most underused browser feature: reader mode
       ___________________________________________________________________
        
       The most underused browser feature: reader mode
        
       Author : frenkel
       Score  : 690 points
       Date   : 2021-08-24 09:09 UTC (1 days ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (frankgroeneveld.nl)
 (TXT) w3m dump (frankgroeneveld.nl)
        
       | rock_artist wrote:
       | The title is maybe a little misleading? TL;DR - you can overcome
       | so frustrating cookie permission popups and some invasive visual
       | elements by using reader mode.
       | 
       | However if we focus on the title, Reader Mode is a great feature
       | (and I'm pretty sure many others followed by this title agree
       | with that observation).
       | 
       | I use it mostly on my mobile devices and it can greatly improve
       | readability of something by controlling the text-formatting.
       | 
       | Having said that, still many times (at least for me) it can
       | resolve wrong translation for the content due to:
       | 
       | * ignoring some divs in the page * in-ability to move to next
       | pages (eg. hyperlinks) * bad RTL support
       | 
       | I wish I would be able to use it more often. :)
        
       | jrochkind1 wrote:
       | I had no idea this was an option in Chrome, you just had to turn
       | on a flag to enable it!
       | 
       | I am interested... also interested in if it gets past various
       | paywall attempts....
       | 
       | Is there any way to get it on Android stock Chrome?
        
       | SubiculumCode wrote:
       | I love reader mode and use it a lot, but my biggest complaint is
       | that sites seem to be able to control when the option appears in
       | the browser, or if not, it seems to only appear after the site
       | has finished loading.
        
       | jraph wrote:
       | I use it from time to time but I would probably use it more often
       | if reader mode was automatically restored on websites where I
       | used it a first time (and didn't switch back).
       | 
       | If the page is "good enough" when blocking ads (and I also have
       | JS disabled by default), I won't bother using reader mode.
        
       | Razengan wrote:
       | While we're on this subject, why the hell is HN so hostile to
       | readability?
       | 
       | No dark mode, minuscule font, easy to mistap the tiny "buttons",
       | and no support for Reader Mode
        
         | dredmorbius wrote:
         | HN is managed very conservatively from a UI/UX perspective.
         | 
         | I share several of your concerns. You can contact the mods
         | directly at hn@ycombinator.com
         | 
         | One suggestion that is apparently in the pipeline is for a
         | user-provided custom CSS which could be used to fix font,
         | contrast, and other aspects.
         | 
         | The underlying structure of HN pages (nightmare table-based
         | layout) makes more substantial revisions difficult.
         | 
         | There are numerous alternative-interface projects using the HN
         | API as well.
        
       | vanderZwan wrote:
       | This doesn't even mention one of my favorite features of Firefox
       | Android: if you bookmark a site in reader mode it gets saved as
       | an off-line version
        
         | severine wrote:
         | Unfortunately, as others have pointed out, that feature is
         | deprecated in newer versions.
        
           | vanderZwan wrote:
           | Aaargh, it really feels like they're actively making their
           | product worse lately
        
       | tangoalpha wrote:
       | I have been using reader-mode on Firefox and Chrome for long.
       | 
       | Not just for better readability, but also most content behind
       | paywalls is accessible with readermode.
       | 
       | (May be because, most of the paywalls on news websites load all
       | initial content, and then either truncate the content or hide the
       | content using javascript, and hitting the paywall renders the
       | page again without a lot of the CSS and JS that is used for
       | hiding the content behind the paywall).
       | 
       | Hopefully, this content doesn't have those paywall service
       | providers to start working around reader modes.
        
       | hollerith wrote:
       | The main reason reader mode is "underused" is that for a
       | substantial fraction of pages, it does not work.
       | 
       | Because of the way the human motivational architecture works, if
       | there were a reader mode that always worked, its rate of usage
       | would be many times higher than the usage rates of the current
       | crop of reader modes.
       | 
       | But of course, there is no way to create a reader mode that works
       | for all web pages -- and that fact is one of the main arguments
       | for _competing_ with the web rather than trying to _improve_ or
       | _fix_ the web.
       | 
       | By "competing with the web", I mean creating online services that
       | take the attention of users away from the web for _some_ subset
       | of things the web is used for, e.g., consuming static textual
       | content, also known as reading.
       | 
       | Gemini would be an example of an attempt to compete with the web,
       | and it has the property that every page is essentially
       | automatically in reader mode.
       | 
       | The trick is to find some desire that the web is currently bad at
       | satisfying, then improving Gemini to cater to that desire. For
       | example, TOR was created (many years ago) by the US military to
       | give its employees a way to browse the web without revealing
       | their browsing history to the spy agencies of the US's enemies.
       | But maybe Gemini's much greater simplicity would enable it to
       | make a stronger guarantee of user privacy than the web is able to
       | guarantee. (The more complicated a web browser gets, the harder
       | it becomes to make privacy or security guarantees -- particularly
       | guarantees of interest to only a small fraction of the web's
       | users.) If that were the case, then whoever needs that stronger
       | guarantee would tend to become avid users and proponents of
       | Gemini. Getting very small numbers of avid users is considered an
       | effective way to start increasing the number of users of a new
       | online service.
       | 
       | The idea I just described is probably a bad idea: there are
       | probably other desires that Gemini or some other non-web service
       | could cater to that are much more effective ways of creating avid
       | users of that non-web service. (For example, the idea I just
       | described has the disadvantage that even if the proposed improved
       | version of Gemini _could_ make stronger privacy guarantees than
       | the web can (which seems unlikely to me) good luck convincing the
       | average user who is not a security professional of that fact.)
       | 
       | Finding them is hard! But trying to find one is a more potent way
       | to try to improve things IMO than trying to fix or improve the
       | web is.
        
         | spideymans wrote:
         | >But of course, there is no way to create a reader mode that
         | works for all web pages -- and that fact is one of the main
         | arguments for competing with the web rather than trying to
         | improve or fix the web.
         | 
         | Web developers go out of their way to break Reader Mode. What
         | incentive would they have to create content for a platform that
         | competes with the web, which actively limits their ability to
         | deliver ads and degrade the reading experience?
         | 
         | In any case, I imagine that a ML powered Reader Mode engine
         | would perform significantly better than a semantically powered
         | engine. It should be fairly straightforward to train a ML model
         | to make a visual distinction between the actual content, and
         | the ads and other garbage that pollutes webpages. Crowdsourced
         | training data would increase the accuracy even further, while
         | limiting the ability of developers to defeat the reader mode.
        
         | zzo38computer wrote:
         | Depending what you are making, different protocols can be good
         | (Gemini may be good for some things, NNTP may be good for some
         | things, IRC may be good for some things, etc).
         | 
         | Gemini file format also could be usable independently of the
         | protocol, although I do not know of any implementations.
         | 
         | I think that sometimes you might want to use Gemini without TLS
         | (it is good they have it, but I am not sure that requiring it
         | is so good), so my proposal is to make the new URI scheme
         | "insecure-gemini:" for this purpose. In this mode, client
         | certificates won't work, so TLS will still be required if you
         | want to use client certificates.
         | 
         | Also, unfortunately curl is not implementing Gemini protocol;
         | adding that might help to increase its usage too, since then
         | you can at least download files from it easily. However, I have
         | seen discussions and some of them are valid concerns. For
         | example, I think -k should not be the default; doing it
         | different for different protocols doesn't seem like good to me.
         | You can still specify -k yourself if you want to do. Also the
         | patch does not implement redirects, even if -L is specified; it
         | ought to be fixed to allow -L to work. Allowing longer URLs
         | might also help.
         | 
         | Furthermore, a better web browser will need to be made,
         | excluding half of the stuff and implementing the other half of
         | the stuff differently, before adding some more.
        
         | kixiQu wrote:
         | https://gemini.circumlunar.space/docs/faq.gmi
         | 
         | > Gemini is not intended to replace either Gopher or the web,
         | but to co-exist peacefully alongside them as one more option
         | which people can freely choose to use if it suits them. In the
         | same way that some people currently serve the same content via
         | gopher and the web, people will be able to "bihost" or
         | "trihost" content on whichever combination of protocols they
         | think offer the best match to their technical, philosophical
         | and aesthetic requirements and those of their intended
         | audience.
        
       | Lio wrote:
       | Best thing for me about Reader mode is banishing annoying
       | scrollback menu flaps.
       | 
       | Nothing worse than trying to position a long form text article
       | and a pointless menu flap popping up to obscure the text. So you
       | then have to perform another round of up/down to get the page in
       | the right place.
       | 
       | It's not even as if modern browsers, either desktop or mobile,
       | don't give you a way to quickly jump to the top of the page where
       | you can see the menu.
        
       | mperham wrote:
       | My advice to bloggers: if your blog readability is improved by
       | activating Reader mode, you have a styling bug to fix. Two
       | universal improvements:
       | 
       | 1. Bump up your font size. 2. Increase contrast.
        
         | bityard wrote:
         | Honestly, I see way more blogs with a font size 20% to 50%
         | bigger than what I consider readable. Pro-tip: if the text is
         | so huge that only like 10 words can fit on a line in a non-
         | maximized browser window, your font size is way too big.
         | 
         | It's like they are formatted for reading by teleprompter or
         | something.
        
         | ducttapecrown wrote:
         | And add margins!
        
           | reaperducer wrote:
           | A little line-height: 1.2em goes a long way, too.
        
         | nicbou wrote:
         | 3. Remove all the crap that isn't the article the user came for
         | 
         | I don't use Reader mode for readability, but to remove all the
         | clutter on the page.
        
           | dredmorbius wrote:
           | It's not absolutely necessary to remove it, but _when reading
           | the article_ it should not be front-and-centre on the page.
           | 
           | That means:
           | 
           | - Single-column layouts. Sidebars suck.
           | 
           | - No fixed-position elements. _Especially_ not headers or
           | footers, though fixed sidebars are also almost always a
           | mistake. (There can be some benefit for reference  / tools,
           | but only about one time in a thousand that they're actually
           | used.) On desktop, I disable all of these with either CSS
           | (Stylish) or uMatrix element blocker. I've given up on any
           | nuance here. If it's a choice of fixed header/footer or none
           | at all, it's none at all.
           | 
           | - A _static_ set of nav or informational links _above or
           | below the main article text_ is acceptable. It 's present,
           | but doesn't interfere with the reading flow.
           | 
           | - Put in a motherfucking scrollbar already.
        
             | FabHK wrote:
             | > Especially not headers or footers
             | 
             | What drives me insane: website with floating header and
             | footer, and I read, then hit space to scroll down to the
             | next "page", but it doesn't take into account what's hidden
             | behind header and/or footer, so now I'm missing two lines,
             | and have to grab mouse/arrow keys to scroll back up two
             | lines. It just works and then you put in extra work to make
             | it not work thank you very much arghhhhhh
        
             | omaranto wrote:
             | > - Put in a motherfucking scrollbar already.
             | 
             | You mean you want two scrollbars? One from the web page and
             | one from the browser window. That seems like an odd choice.
        
               | dredmorbius wrote:
               | Presently the fashion appears to be none.
               | 
               | Worse: the scrollbars which do exist are indicator-only,
               | they cannot be used to actually navigate on the page.
               | 
               | On the four mobile devices I routinely have access to,
               | none has an actual grabbable persistent scrollbar for
               | navigation.
               | 
               | https://ello.co/dredmorbius/post/0hgfswmoti3fi5zgftjecq
               | 
               | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21356511
        
             | nicbou wrote:
             | I'm curious to hear your thoughts about the layout on
             | allaboutberlin.com. I built this website to be as pleasant
             | as possible for the readers, but perhaps I've been staring
             | at it for too long...
        
               | dredmorbius wrote:
               | Pretty good, at a glance.
        
               | rhn_mk1 wrote:
               | I'm following a similar philosophy as the parent (kill
               | fixed elements, disable CSS in extreme cases), and your
               | web page manages to look stylish and readble at the same
               | time.
               | 
               | The fixed side bar on the "visiting" page is barely
               | enough to fit on the display, and when I shrink the
               | window (or increase the text enough), bottom items get
               | cut off without recourse.
               | 
               | The banners on most pages are so big that I usually see
               | only 1 line of an article, which is mildly annoying.
               | 
               | Note: disabling JS is a required part of making the web
               | readable for me, and that's how I perfomed the review.
        
               | UntitledNo4 wrote:
               | Not the poster of the original comment, but I just
               | visited your website (I live in Berlin), I found it very
               | informative, pleasant and readable. Well done.
        
       | binkHN wrote:
       | I might be the minority here, but this is why I use Edge on
       | Windows. It's, basically, Chrome with a reader mode.
        
         | EMM_386 wrote:
         | Chrome apparently has a flag for this under
         | chrome://flags/#enable-reader-mode
         | 
         | I tried flag in Brave ("brave://") but it is not working. Works
         | great in Firefox.
        
           | asicsp wrote:
           | > _Chrome apparently has a flag_
           | 
           | And even then the options were confusing: 'Enabled' and
           | 'Enabled available in settings'
           | 
           | I first tried with Enabled, didn't work. Then tried the
           | settings option, which showed reader mode option under
           | 'Appearance'. After turning on this setting, the icon shows
           | up.
        
           | thenanyu wrote:
           | works now in brave, the setting is extremely confusing, you
           | have to set it to "enabled and available in settings"
        
           | binkHN wrote:
           | I know this has been an on and off thing with Chrome, but,
           | yes, it does appear to be back and works now.
        
       | neebz wrote:
       | In Safari you can set reader mode turned on for specified
       | websites. I have done it for all the sites which I visit
       | frequently. Unfortunately there is no way to to turn it on at
       | global level.
       | 
       | The only minor gripe I have is the slide-above animation when
       | reader mode turns on. It's jarring when you keep getting that on
       | each navigation.
        
         | Jakob wrote:
         | You can turn it on globally by selecting:
         | 
         | Preferences > Websites > Reader > When visiting other websites:
         | On
        
       | markus_zhang wrote:
       | I always choose reader mode on mobile if applicable. I'm
       | wondering why some websites don't have reader mode.
        
         | npteljes wrote:
         | It's based on the browser detecting whether Reader Mode is
         | applicable for the content. If it's neatly organized into
         | headers, paragraphs, etc, then it will be available. If it's
         | unorganized on a technical level, the browser might not pick it
         | up correctly.
        
           | markus_zhang wrote:
           | Thanks that's probably the case!
        
       | hhsbz wrote:
       | I never use it because I know the process is automatic and I'm
       | always afraid I will be missing part of the text or the pictures.
       | 
       | I've found ad blockers to be more or less competent in removing
       | the stupid European banners, but they are far from flawless. Some
       | sites get stuck without a scroll bar for example
        
         | aerojoe23 wrote:
         | I use it for the text to speech in Firefox a lot. When there
         | isn't a pay wall in the way I'll open the page in another tab
         | while reader read's it to me.
         | 
         | This way I can see the text and pictures the way they intended
         | it to be.
         | 
         | Another downside is that text content for other articles on the
         | site that aren't part of the article, will be in the content.
         | On the full site they'll be links or something and you just
         | skip them with out thinking. In text to speech reader mode, it
         | reads them off.
        
         | frenkel wrote:
         | You should give it a try, I've never noticed any important
         | parts missing.
        
           | kzrdude wrote:
           | Sometimes images are missing. Especially banner images, of
           | course, and sometimes those illustrate the story, but I think
           | also background-level images (that are used for non-
           | background purposes, if you miss them, of course).
        
           | q-rews wrote:
           | I use Safari's reader mode on Medium and it fails to load
           | lazy-loaded images (unsurprisingly) so if I want to see
           | those, I have to scroll down first _and then_ enable the
           | mode.
        
         | dredmorbius wrote:
         | There's no risk in invoking Reader Mode. If it doesn't render
         | or omits text, you can simply toggle it off / navigate back to
         | the native page.
         | 
         | Images in online articles are irrelevant the overwhelming
         | majority of the time --- 75%--95% or more. At best they're eye-
         | candy or distractions. They occasionally provide context. Some
         | serve as a contextual reminder. I'd suggest that _information-
         | critical graphics_ (there 's information in the image that's
         | not available from the article itself) are in the neighbourhood
         | of 1% of all images. These tend to be graphs, plots, charts, or
         | maps.
         | 
         | They're also generally rendered by Reader Mode, unless the site
         | is very poorly designed.
         | 
         | TL;DR: This is an irrelevant concern.
        
         | perryizgr8 wrote:
         | This is exactly why I don't use it either. Sometimes I have
         | noticed that diagrams/images are stripped out. Sometimes a
         | couple paragraphs at the end will be omitted.
        
           | sidpatil wrote:
           | I've noticed the same thing. Nowadays I quickly check the end
           | of the article before switching to reader mode, to make sure
           | it's still there.
        
         | hlasdjlfhalwjk wrote:
         | > I'm always afraid I will be missing part of the text or the
         | pictures
         | 
         | As for missing pictures, my argument is, either the text is
         | referring to an image that cannot be seen in reader mode, then
         | I'll notice and switch back to normal mode to see the image, or
         | the image is not relevant to the text, so I just don't care for
         | it.
        
       | specproc wrote:
       | Also a neat way to scrape some sites, big love for readability.
        
       | tyingq wrote:
       | Just tried it on chrome mobile. The only way to make it always
       | there is to change the triggering mode to always. Which means an
       | annoying popup at the bottom. And the output of it is usually not
       | helpful. Only works on (some) things that look like an article.
       | Otherwise, it's truncated content.
        
       | sprkwd wrote:
       | Not in my house it's not. A lot of sites are practically
       | unreadable without reader mode these days.
        
       | jrochkind1 wrote:
       | The "first example"[1] now 404s. Weird. So can't actually see the
       | demo the OP wanted to demo....
       | 
       | [1]: https://techdows.com/2015/02/enable-test-reader-mode-
       | firefox...
        
         | Raineer wrote:
         | Well I'm sure it's seeing a lot more traffic than the website
         | intended.
        
       | dusted wrote:
       | I love reader mode, but I can't for the life of me get it to work
       | everywhere on my site, and there's no way to hint to the browser
       | that I want to support it, or supply additional helpful metadata.
        
       | therealmarv wrote:
       | Did not know that there is a reader mode in Chrome. It has only
       | one bug: It does not work together with Google Translate :(
       | 
       | I used in the past mainly Reader View because it does not need
       | access/injection to all your web pages
       | https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/reader-view/ecabif...
       | another extension I used (which worked better sometimes) was a
       | local copy/fork of Rocket Readability
       | https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/rocket-readability... I
       | forked it because I code reviewed it and it needs access to all
       | your web sites. I don't want any surprise update happen with that
       | extension. Seems I still need it for foreign articles+Google
       | Translate.
        
       | [deleted]
        
       | timwis wrote:
       | I always worry about missing bits like code samples in iframes
       | when switching to reader mode :/
        
       | robotburrito wrote:
       | Reader mode is awesome and it makes a lot of the web actually
       | usable.
        
       | kazinator wrote:
       | I started making more use of reader more upon discovering that it
       | can get around paywalls in many cases.
        
       | jeromenerf wrote:
       | Dammit, don't tell everyone, they will notice it.
        
       | larodi wrote:
       | one little known feature of reader mode, no matter if firefox's
       | or safari/mobile is that more often than you would expect, it
       | kind of magically goes through pay-walls. so you get to see
       | articles that require subscription or payment or else, with a
       | single click.
       | 
       | this happens so often that makes one wonder whether is due to
       | some devs being lazy (hiding the actual content) or is by intent
       | kept for savvy readers.
       | 
       | also does great job getting through nasty full-screen cookie
       | consent banners.
       | 
       | basically is a glitter of hope for the web as a whole.
       | 
       | btw, was thinking about article like this one for some weeks now.
       | great minds think alike, right :)
        
         | GrinningFool wrote:
         | The less we talk about great things like reader mode, the
         | longer it will be before it's broken by default on the websites
         | that need it most.
        
         | subscribeNOW wrote:
         | > whether is due to some devs being lazy or is by intent kept
         | for savvy readers
         | 
         | Neither, the business value isn't there, not enough people use
         | Reader Mode to warrant spending the dev time to close the hole.
         | It's coming soon though, and I'm building it. Sorry!
        
       | fergie wrote:
       | I always assumed that Reader Mode was used pretty heavily.
        
         | w0m wrote:
         | i have read a total of 5 articles with it since introduction
         | decade(s?) ago. The switch is just jarring
        
           | dev_tty01 wrote:
           | You mean the switch away from useless eye candy, advertising,
           | link farms, popups, slide down flaps, useless multi-page
           | clicks, cookie consent popups and banners, ...? Yes, it is
           | jarring, but in a good way. To each their own I guess.
        
       | DangitBobby wrote:
       | > When available for a website, it is displayed as an icon at the
       | end of the url bar in Firefox
       | 
       | This is the only problem. When I really want it, it's often not
       | available. archive.is is pretty bad on mobile because they are
       | archiving desktop pages. Reader mode is not available there.
        
       | k1m wrote:
       | Any developers who'd like to contribute to improving how article
       | content is extracted from web pages should check out Mozilla's
       | Readability repository: https://github.com/mozilla/readability
       | 
       | I'm currently trying to bring the PHP port up to speed here:
       | https://github.com/fivefilters/readability.php
       | 
       | We use an older version as part of our article extraction for
       | Push to Kindle: https://www.fivefilters.org/push-to-kindle/
        
         | mft_ wrote:
         | O/T, but thanks for Push To Kindle. I found the browser version
         | so useful I bought the iPhone app - both to use and also to
         | support you. Brought a whole new field of usefulness to my
         | Kindle
        
           | k1m wrote:
           | Thank you! That's really nice to hear. (Appreciate the
           | support too.)
        
         | freediver wrote:
         | Another robust solution is Tranquility reader which exists as
         | an extension and has better accuracy than Readability at the
         | expense of speed.
         | 
         | https://github.com/ushnisha/tranquility-reader-webextensions
        
           | Tarsul wrote:
           | yes! I use this addon for firefox all the time. Usually I
           | click on my "Tranquility!" button the moment the cookie
           | notification pops up, no cookies needed ;) (good for articles
           | via HN, also possible to circumvent _some_ paywalls)
        
         | infogulch wrote:
         | ArchiveBox is a tool that downloads web pages and saves them in
         | various different formats: warc, pdf, rendered png, plain text.
         | I wonder what it uses for plain text extraction and if the
         | readability repo would be useful for that purpose.
         | 
         | Edit: Oh neat it does actually.
         | https://github.com/ArchiveBox/ArchiveBox/wiki/Configuration#...
         | 
         | > Archive method SAVE_READABILITY
         | 
         | > Extract article text, summary, and byline using Mozilla's
         | Readability library. Unlike the other methods, this does not
         | download any additional files, so it's practically free from a
         | disk usage perspective. It works by using any existing
         | downloaded HTML version (e.g. wget, DOM dump, singlefile) and
         | piping it into readability.
        
           | jrochkind1 wrote:
           | That's pretty amazing it already does it.
           | 
           | ArchiveBox and the other stuff from the "DIY no-credentials
           | don't-care-about-the-rules" web archiving community, like
           | ArchiveTeam.... continues to astound me with it's quality and
           | "professionalism" (as a credentialed professional in the
           | field of digital library stuff... they are often outdoing the
           | actual credentialed professional community).
        
         | up6w6 wrote:
         | I believe the Instant View[1] crowdsourcing model where people
         | write templates for each website could boost a lot these
         | parsers (hope they open source it soon). Its just impossible to
         | make these extensions work for every single website with some
         | simple heuristics.
         | 
         | Check the codebase of some popular parsers:
         | 
         | Firefox (already mentioned):
         | https://github.com/mozilla/readability/blob/master/Readabili...
         | 
         | Google Chrome: https://github.com/chromium/dom-distiller
         | 
         | Mercury parser: https://github.com/postlight/mercury-parser
         | 
         | [1] https://instantview.telegram.org/
        
           | nyanpasu64 wrote:
           | Is it possible to utilize the database of Instant View per-
           | site parsers in a web browser or extension's reader mode?
        
           | bspammer wrote:
           | Another cool crowdsourced thing I discovered recently is
           | SponsorBlock [1] which is an extension to automatically skip
           | sponsored content in Youtube videos. Users contribute timings
           | to the database that everyone else uses. It works remarkably
           | well, any recent video with more than about 50,000 views is
           | pretty much guaranteed to have timings submitted.
           | 
           | [1] https://sponsor.ajay.app/
        
           | k1m wrote:
           | Thanks for mentioning Instant View, I hadn't come across
           | that. We actually maintain something similar here:
           | https://github.com/fivefilters/ftr-site-config
           | 
           | We use these in our own tools and also get contributions from
           | others, including Wallabag users:
           | https://github.com/wallabag/wallabag
           | 
           | Before it was sold, Instapaper used to have something
           | similar. A public database of its site-specific extraction
           | templates. We used that as the starting point for our
           | repository.
        
             | freediver wrote:
             | Thanks to both of you for expanding my 'readable web'
             | toolbox.
             | 
             | What do you fallback to if the rule is not present or
             | doesn't work?
        
               | k1m wrote:
               | In our case, we try to match using the XPath selectors
               | that we have for the site. If we don't have any, or they
               | fail to match anything for the title, author, or body, we
               | then go to Readability and let it do its thing to try and
               | extract whatever we're missing.
        
               | freediver wrote:
               | Makes sense. What does 'prune' and 'tidy' instruct parser
               | to do?
        
               | k1m wrote:
               | Prune instructs the parser to remove any elements within
               | the extracted article block that look superfluous. This
               | can result in false positives, so we tend to disable it
               | when we've gone to the trouble of creating site-specific
               | extraction rules.
               | 
               | Tidy determines if the source HTML should be cleaned up
               | first with HTML Tidy - https://github.com/htacg/tidy-
               | html5. If you're parsing the source HTML with an HTML 5
               | parser, as we are now, it shouldn't be necessary any more
               | (I think we actually ignore it now). We used it more
               | before when we relied on libxml parsing, which often
               | trips up on modern HTML.
        
             | benzible wrote:
             | FYI your API pricing page doesn't seem to load
             | https://rapidapi.com/user/fivefilters
        
         | mdoms wrote:
         | Just reading through that code it seems like readbility is only
         | intended to work on English language websites? Like it checks
         | for nodes with class names matching
         | /and|article|body|column|content|main|shadow/ and uses a
         | minimum length of 140 characters for matching nodes that are
         | reader-able. Seems a bit lazy for a company whose stated
         | mission is "to ensure the Internet is a global public resource,
         | open and accessible to all".
        
         | dredmorbius wrote:
         | My suspicion is that there are an increasing number of
         | publishers who are intentionally severing compatibility with
         | Readability.
         | 
         |  _Washington Post_ , I'm looking at you mofos. Chief reason
         | I'll seek out any alternative news site for archival. It's been
         | this way for about a year, if not more.
        
         | jamil7 wrote:
         | I wrote a Swift port of it last year for my app but it deviates
         | from readability a fair bit as I tailed it a bit to my needs,
         | I've considered cleaning it up and open sourcing it regardless.
         | I know there is an Objective-C port floating around.
        
           | freediver wrote:
           | Do not clean it up just put it up there and let others do it!
           | I'd be very interested in it, please reach out when you do.
        
         | guessmyname wrote:
         | I ported Mozilla's Readability library to Go a couple of years
         | ago [1] and use it every day to power a custom RSS feed of
         | Hacker News via Reeder [2]. This is not a novelty, many people
         | have ported Readability to different programming languages over
         | the years.
         | 
         | [1] https://github.com/cixtor/readability
         | 
         | [2] https://github.com/cixtor/rssfeed
        
       | agumonkey wrote:
       | On i remember how often I used printfriendly just for that.
       | 
       | Also I find the irony of reader mode quite funny. Lets build the
       | most dynamic and capable presentation system so we can go relive
       | bbs
        
       | ZachSaucier wrote:
       | Shameless plug: I maintain a cross-browser reader extension that
       | is like reader mode with some additional features. It's called
       | Just Read: https://justread.link/
        
         | freediver wrote:
         | Looks great! What does this use underneath? How is it different
         | than Readability.js in terms of parsing output?
        
       | yepthatsreality wrote:
       | I wonder if low usage will lead it to eventually be removed (for
       | example no one cares to maintain the feature code), much like the
       | previous "reader mode" feature: RSS support.
       | 
       | Will we say "that's fine browsers should only focus on one
       | thing"?
        
       | dredmorbius wrote:
       | I'm a huge fan of Readability Mode and use it often. It's proof
       | that Web design isn't the solution, Web design is the problem.
       | 
       | For those who are using e-ink devices, or even just standard
       | tablets, EInkBro is another immensely useful tool. Yes, it's a
       | standalone browser, not a mode on Firefox, Safari, Vivalti, etc.
       | 
       | https://github.com/plateaukao/browser
       | 
       | (Available through Google Play, F-Droid and other sources.
       | Android-only, sorry iOS fans.)
       | 
       | What it offers over standard browsers is that it's optimised for
       | e-ink displays. That is, it favours pagination over scrolling,
       | runs to full-screen, can easily adjust font size up or down (no
       | more itsy-bitsy-teen-weenie-yellow-polka-dot HN fonts), bold
       | text, and has its own reader mode as well.
       | 
       | Even on a standard tablet, some of these features are a huge step
       | above and beyond the mainstream browsers.
       | 
       | The feature-set is limited, some of the UI is a bit rough, and a
       | few things are just plain broken (if you need to edit entries in
       | the JS or Cookie enabled/disabled sites ... you have to delete
       | all data and start over again).
       | 
       | That said, my usage is evolving from sending individual pages to
       | EInkBrow when I want to do long-form reading, to using it at
       | least part-time as a primary browser. (Mozilla Fennec Fox is my
       | first choice, still.) The browser _is_ stable and very much
       | usable despite this. The developer is responsive to requests and
       | bug reports.
       | 
       | What's most refreshing is that the design principle is
       | _readability of Web content_ , as determined by the user, and not
       | by the page author or publisher.
        
         | amelius wrote:
         | I wish somebody would create a DL/GAN/style-transfer tool to
         | automatically change the style of any website into
         | https://motherfuckingwebsite.com/
         | 
         | (regardless of how the website is structured, so deleting the
         | CSS doesn't count)
        
           | dredmorbius wrote:
           | On emissive / colour displays, this still is my preference:
           | 
           | https://codepen.io/dredmorbius/full/KpMqqB
           | 
           | On e-ink, the off-white / off-black colour palette is
           | actually something of a probem, though the page otherwise
           | remains highly readable.
           | 
           | From the original page, the lack of margins is a problem.
           | Text running straight into the gutter is a readability
           | problem.
        
         | dredmorbius wrote:
         | Checking installing on an older tablet: EInkBro works, though
         | having it display colour is ... slightly disconcerting.
         | 
         | But if you want to get a sense of the app, it's possible to do
         | so.
        
         | jabroni_salad wrote:
         | Thanks for linking that, I'm going to try it on my reader when
         | I get home. I like my boox for most things I try to use it for,
         | but right now the pain point is all the royalroad webnovels I'm
         | addicted to.
        
           | dredmorbius wrote:
           | I have both Mozilla Pocket and EInkBro on the BOOX.
           | 
           | My preference is to read in EInkBro.
           | 
           | Pocket's craptastic pagination is endless frustration.
           | 
           | (I still use Pocket to save/tag content. But for what's
           | supposed to be an enhanced readability tool, it's
           | increasingly insufficient.)
        
         | [deleted]
        
         | fouc wrote:
         | I'm guessing this won't work with Remarkable.
         | 
         | Or what are some good e-ink devices for this I wonder?
        
           | dredmorbius wrote:
           | Any Android-based device.
           | 
           | Potentially in future, Linux-based devices which can run
           | Android apps.
           | 
           | I'm not a particular fan of Android. Its application
           | ecosystem is a bonus though.
           | 
           | Again, this is installable through F-Droid.
        
           | Groxx wrote:
           | Depending on how far you want to go, there are VNC
           | clients[1], toltec has opkg-installable stuff including at
           | least one browser[2] known to work, and there are full OS
           | replacements that let you run a full linux GUI[3] which can
           | almost certainly run a normal-ish desktop browser.
           | 
           | So while this one won't work, there are options.
           | 
           | [1] https://github.com/reHackable/awesome-reMarkable [2]
           | https://toltec-dev.org/ [3]
           | http://www.davisr.me/projects/parabola-rm/
        
         | peterlk wrote:
         | How can I implement my website such that it is optimally useful
         | for browsers like this? Just avoid flashy stuff? Is there any
         | way to list my blog somewhere as a friendly place to read? I'm
         | spinning it up again after a year off for reasons that I will
         | probably write about :)
        
           | dredmorbius wrote:
           | I've just poked through both the GetPocket site
           | (https://getpocket.com/publisher/) and Mozilla's Readability
           | Library GitHub page (https://github.com/mozilla/readability)
           | without seeing obvious guidelines.
           | 
           | My general suspicion is that adhering to a simple HTML5
           | documemnt structure, and possible use of microformats
           | (https://microformats.io/) goes a long way.
           | 
           | Update: there's some discussion here:
           | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28301113
        
             | k1m wrote:
             | I haven't seen guidelines lately, but Readability.com,
             | before it was shut down, did have a page that's archived
             | here: http://web.archive.org/web/20160301180825/https://rea
             | dabilit...
        
       | bogomipz wrote:
       | Could someone explain how Reader Mode on iOS devices is able to
       | bypass login walls for new sites?
        
       | tomiplaz wrote:
       | My favourite and often used browser feature (Firefox).
        
       | mvanbaak wrote:
       | It's the only way to visit sites like medium.com ;P
        
       | AlexCoventry wrote:
       | Is there a keyboard shortcut for reader mode, in chrome?
        
       | andy_ppp wrote:
       | It's good for night time reading too (i.e. it obeys dark mode),
       | it's a shame hacker news doesn't seem to work with Safari's
       | reader mode though I guess it's designed for article pages!
        
       | acsigen wrote:
       | An even cooler feature which the reader has in Edge for Windows
       | is that it can read the articles aloud with a natural voice. Also
       | useful to listen to PDFs
        
       | zzo38computer wrote:
       | I would want to use my own styles or just the default HTML
       | styles, as one (I don't want it to use big font sizes, narrow
       | text, etc; I want to use my own settings please, and you can use
       | your own settings please). But also, will wanting ARIA view,
       | where the accessible tree is formatted (this would also allow
       | forms, etc to work). However, the accessible tree seems to be
       | missing some important information too, such as whether or not
       | text is fixpitch, strong, emphasis, etc (as far as I can tell it
       | is missing, anyways; trying a simple web page with different
       | formatting and displaying the accessible tree seems to lose this
       | information). Sometimes simply disabling CSS and JavaScripts
       | fixes it a lot, and avoids a lot of annoyances. Some forms don't
       | work if CSS is disabled, because they replace the widgets with
       | their own (I really don't like this); the ARIA attributes are
       | there though, which is supposed to allow it to display it
       | properly even if the styles are disabled, but simply disabling
       | CSS won't do that; it is necessary to parse the ARIA attributes
       | too. But to do better might require both the accessible tree and
       | the DOM tree.
        
       | inetknght wrote:
       | I used reader mode for a long time and liked it but stopped using
       | it because it still let javascript run.
        
       | black3r wrote:
       | I use this all the time on mobile just to bypass pop-ups, videos
       | and other annoyances I don't want to see when reading articles.
        
       | bambax wrote:
       | > _The same is true for Chrome, but you first need to enable it
       | at chrome: //flags/#enable-reader-mode_
       | 
       | Oh... I didn't know that! I mosty use FF and reader mode is a big
       | reason why.
       | 
       | Reader mode is so much better for reading text... Also on mobile.
       | 
       | The only weird behavior (on FF) is that it's a step forward in
       | history; whey you press "back" you don't go back to the previous
       | page, but to the current page in normal mode (with zero info in
       | the url bar or anywhere else (that I could find)).
        
       | funnyThing7 wrote:
       | "I believe not a lot of users know about this button, especially
       | because Chrome doesn't want to show it by default."
       | 
       | Damn right. You can bet you ass Google doesn't want to actively
       | push users away from bloated pages filled with ads.
        
       | Narishma wrote:
       | I use it daily to deal with the epidemic of hard to read too low-
       | contrast websites, which this article is ironically guilty of.
        
       | 627467 wrote:
       | Underused? I wish I could set the browser to be always in reader
       | mode so I can save taps every day. Reader mode along with private
       | mode is great paywall circumventer.
       | 
       | In opera mobile you can save reader mode pages in mhtml, it's
       | great alternative to webarchive
        
         | severine wrote:
         | SevenSigns posted an addon to do that here
         | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28287190 and there's an
         | alternative here
         | https://addons.mozilla.org/en/firefox/addon/automatic-reader...
         | 
         | I don't use the automatic addons, but one that lets me right
         | click and open directly in reader view, works a treat!
         | https://addons.mozilla.org/en/firefox/addon/reader-view
         | 
         | Try them out!
        
       | emaro wrote:
       | I love the reader modes accross the different browsers.
       | Especially Safary Mobile does a really good job, i.e. even
       | expands the partitioned articles from golem.de into one single
       | page.
       | 
       | What slightly but consistently bothers me, is that the reader
       | view in Firefox has very little customization options and (in my
       | eyes) doesn't look very appealing. They should let a designer
       | improve the stylesheet. You also cannot force the reader mode
       | like in Pocket.
       | 
       | I also want to mention the instant view feature of Telegram [0].
       | It can be used as a reader view as well.
       | 
       | [0] https://instantview.telegram.org/
        
       | blunte wrote:
       | I use it on my phone all the time. It almost makes phone browsing
       | tolerable. It's great for getting rid of Medium crap and other
       | FUBAR sites. Plus it typically makes the text larger, so I can
       | read it without glasses.
        
         | lowercased wrote:
         | same here - it will default to a good size font and high
         | contrast dark mode. i've found myself using it... a lot over
         | the last few months. i picked up a new 12 mini, and as I was
         | developing new habits, this became one of them. if something is
         | more than one screen of text, i reach for reader mode.
        
       | pre wrote:
       | I press it as soon as I see a popup about cookies or login or
       | sales or basically anything at all.
       | 
       | I press it when there's a paywall.
       | 
       | I press it when the site doesn't do dark-mode.
       | 
       | I press it when adverts become annoying.
       | 
       | There also exists an auto-reader-mode plugin that you can tell to
       | always open that site in reader-mode in future.
       | 
       | Reader mode is great. Hope it doesn't become popular so website
       | start trying to stop it working.
        
       | ldenoue wrote:
       | Agreed 100%. Because in Safari it doesn't work on all websites, I
       | made ReaderView, an app that does and also saves articles for
       | later plus lets you highlight passages. Give it a try
       | https://www.appblit.com/readerview
        
       | Forge36 wrote:
       | The flag doesn't exist on mobile. There is another, but i didn't
       | see it do anything.
       | 
       | chrome://flags/#reader-mode-heuristics
       | 
       | Accessibly has a "show simplified view" which seems comparable
        
         | kzrdude wrote:
         | Firefox for Android has reader mode.
        
           | x-sp wrote:
           | As does Opera
        
             | neop1x wrote:
             | and Brave (after enabling it in Settings)
        
       | corentin88 wrote:
       | I'm a huge fan of the reader mode on Safari for iOS. Probably the
       | feature that I'm using the most, right after password
       | autocompletion.
        
       | bvm wrote:
       | I really love the reading the codebases for these, the original
       | Arc90 Readability bookmarklet was really quite...readable when
       | unminified.
        
         | janandonly wrote:
         | I still use that JS script to make a pdf with all links written
         | out fully at the bottom <lovely>
         | 
         | Also, I usually use Printfriendly.com to turn this page into a
         | small pdf for saving. That is if it's worth saving, of course.
        
       | puttycat wrote:
       | My workflow in case of a long article I want to read on my Kindle
       | without distractions:
       | 
       | View in reader mode --> Save as PDF --> Send to Kindle email
       | address --> Sync Kindle.
       | 
       | I wish this could be automized.
        
         | jtth wrote:
         | Instapaper has this, and can even be set up to send a weekly
         | digest.
        
       | beervirus wrote:
       | I use reader mode all the time on Firefox at home or on Safari on
       | my phone. I'm forced to use Chrome at work though, and I always
       | thought it didn't have this feature. Good to see it can be
       | enabled.
        
       | BeetleB wrote:
       | Reader mode really helps me in printing as well. Old comment of
       | mine:
       | 
       | Printing is something I started to do some months ago. Instead of
       | keeping the tab open for weeks, I decided I'd print anything I
       | want to read and place it a physical "inbox".
       | 
       | Some tips: I print 2 pages to a side, so 4 pages per printer
       | paper. Even long articles don't use too much paper, and for my
       | eyes it's still readable (there are a few articles where I need
       | to enlarge first). I print using either Firefox's "Simplify Page"
       | feature or its "Readability" feature. This removes almost all the
       | noise: No ads, no menus, etc. It's just the article and relevant
       | images. Similar to reading a physical newspaper.
       | 
       | It's been a game changer. I can now read wherever I want. Going
       | to the mechanic? I just take some of these printed articles with
       | me. I find myself taking notes on the paper - something I would
       | not do well on the computer screen. My eyes get a lot less
       | strain. Once you get used to this, there's no going back. Now
       | when I see an article through a web browser, it's just ugly. Too
       | many distractions. Even the menus are annoying. I didn't realize
       | I'd been putting up with filth for so long.
       | 
       | I initially worried that my inbox would get full and I'd have the
       | same mental angst, and my plan was that if it happens, I'll take
       | a random bunch and throw it in the recycle bin. But it never came
       | to that - I still manage to read everything I print. Somehow, the
       | physical inbox weighs less on my mind than the virtual one. I
       | don't feel I need to deal with this inbox. It's OK if it just
       | sits there collecting dust.
       | 
       | Bad for the environment. Good for the brain.
        
         | jrochkind1 wrote:
         | This is really interesting, I might try it. I miss the printed
         | newspaper/magazine reading I used to do (although I still do
         | some).
        
         | dang wrote:
         | Please don't copy-paste comments on HN
         | (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27921786). It lowers
         | signal-noise ratio and isn't really how curious conversation
         | works.
         | 
         | If you want to refer to another post, that's fine of course,
         | but in that case use a link and perhaps add some new info if
         | any is relevant.
         | 
         | https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...
        
           | BeetleB wrote:
           | Hi dang,
           | 
           | Is this a new rule? I often find people copy/pasting older
           | comments of theirs that is relevant to the current
           | conversation.
        
             | pvg wrote:
             | https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=2&prefix=true&qu
             | e...
             | 
             | Six years of nopaste exhortations
        
         | mesh wrote:
         | When I was in graduate school way back in the 90s, I had an old
         | dot matrix printer that I would use to print out the daily RFE
         | / RI (Radio Free Europe) email news reports from Eastern
         | Europe.
         | 
         | Its a huge waste of resources over time, but I find its much
         | easy to focus and take in the information sitting at a table
         | and reading over printed word.
         | 
         | I wonder if e-ink / paper devices might be able to replicate
         | this now.
        
         | ouid wrote:
         | Paper isn't really that bad for the environment, right? That
         | was an ad campaign to sell plastic or something. Paper trees
         | are grown as crops and basically just fix carbon. The pulping
         | has some local undesirable effects, but I don't think they have
         | anywhere near the lasting impact of other human waste.
        
         | S0und wrote:
         | I straight up stopped reading. Just listen. I'm using
         | NaturalReader extension, which has a good voice in the free
         | tier. Even tho I use Firefox everywhere i just open an Edge,
         | copy-paste a link and just listen to the article.
        
         | rafael_c wrote:
         | You can do similar on the Kindle or any other ereader. There's
         | a chrome extension called 'send2kindle' that sends a simplified
         | version of the webpage you have open directly to your device.
         | 
         | I'll just open tabs on the browser of whichever articles or
         | texts will consist of my morning reading diet that day and send
         | them all to my Kindle. Very practical device to read and no
         | more falling in a trap of continuous clicking on more and more
         | links, while lending a crappy level of attention to the actual
         | reading.
        
         | vilified wrote:
         | > Bad for the environment. Good for the brain.
         | 
         | That's just bad for the environment two times lol
        
           | fnord77 wrote:
           | underrated comment
        
         | saurik wrote:
         | > I can now read wherever I want. Going to the mechanic? I just
         | take some of these printed articles with me.
         | 
         | To be fair, I can (and do) do the same thing with my phone.
        
           | BeetleB wrote:
           | Off topic w.r.t Reader mode, but reading on paper is much
           | better than on the phone. Actually, _anything_ is better than
           | the phone. My hierarchy is:
           | 
           | Paper > ereader > monitor > phone
        
         | jrgaston wrote:
         | I like reader mode but lately I'll send an article to pocket
         | (which cleans it up a lot) then I print it to a pdf which is
         | saved in a folder in Dropbox and which is synched with my Kobo
         | Elipsa, and with the Elipsa I can mark the articles up with its
         | stylus. (Writing this out makes it sound a bit complicated
         | which I guess it is.)
        
         | fnord77 wrote:
         | I'm the exact opposite - I love having books and articles on
         | devices. Physical clutter is a problem for me so this is
         | liberating.
         | 
         | reading on my iphone or kindle doesn't seem to strain my eyes.
        
           | marvindanig wrote:
           | I read all my books on the iPad. No hassle at all.
        
         | pkulak wrote:
         | > Bad for the environment.
         | 
         | Psst. Paper is a renewable resource and easy to recycle at
         | least a couple times.
        
           | marvindanig wrote:
           | That's a spurious claim! Pulp harvesting often destroys the
           | native flora and fauna, and the cost of lost forests and
           | animal habitat cannot be recovered.
        
           | yodsanklai wrote:
           | https://www.theworldcounts.com/challenges/consumption/other-.
           | ..
        
             | somedude895 wrote:
             | > Each ton of recycled paper can avoid the use of 17 trees;
             | 1,440 liters of oil; 2.3 cubic meters of landfill space;
             | 4,000 kilowatts of energy and 26,500 liters of water.
             | 
             | > Paper is quite simple to recycle, yet 55 percent of the
             | global paper supply comes from newly cut trees.
             | 
             | You can buy recycling paper too, it's not pretty but at
             | least you know it's made from recycled materials.
             | 
             | Also, that page says we'll run out of fresh water in 18
             | years and the source is literally a single quote from one
             | person. Seems a bit sketchy.
        
         | ratioprosperous wrote:
         | Doing exactly this with a large format e-ink tablet has been
         | revolutionary for me
        
           | eagleislandsong wrote:
           | Which e-ink tablet would you recommend?
        
             | abyssin wrote:
             | ReMarkable isn't perfect but I use it to read web articles.
             | The issue I haven't solved with my ReMarkable is finding an
             | alternative to the default synchronization system. I'd love
             | to use Plato for reading on the ReMarkable, but then I'd
             | lose the synchronization.
        
             | mariusor wrote:
             | Kobo devices have out of the box integration with Pocket,
             | which Mozilla supports natively.
        
               | marvindanig wrote:
               | Proprietary tablet vs. a browser feature on the open web-
               | which option would you take?
        
               | BeetleB wrote:
               | Kobo lets you install your own SW. There are open source
               | reader SW for the Kobo, and they're better than Kobo's
               | own reader.
        
               | dredmorbius wrote:
               | What reader(s) do you like / recommend?
               | 
               | I've used FBReader, PocketBook (who sell their own ebook
               | readers as well apparently), the NeoReader (default Onyx
               | software), and have some familiarity with Kindle.
               | 
               | PocketBook enables some (but insufficient) metadata
               | editing. The NeoReader has an excellent UI/UX generally
               | on BOOX devices, but has no management capability.
               | 
               | I tend to have a large number of documents on my devices
               | (1,000s). Management is critical.
        
               | mariusor wrote:
               | I'm not sure what exactly you're arguing against.
        
             | dredmorbius wrote:
             | I'm pretty happy with the Onyx BOOX.
             | 
             | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27521248
             | 
             | Turns out I was wrong about security. _Password recovery_
             | requires a separate cloud-based account. Setting a password
             | does not.
        
         | ameminator wrote:
         | I'll be honest, this is my favourite feature of my Kobo - using
         | Pocket to save webpages and articles and read them offline. It
         | seems to accomplish a similar goal to what you do here -
         | without the need for all that paper.
        
           | Otek wrote:
           | I doubt he will print as much, so your e-reader will have
           | less environmental impact. All that plastic and components
           | are certainly the equivalent of several, if not hundreds of
           | reams of paper.
        
             | dredmorbius wrote:
             | Cost is a _very rough_ indicator of footprint.
             | 
             | A modest e-book reader runs about $200. That's the cost of
             | about 3 cases of 20# letter-sized paper (10 reams/case), or
             | 15,000 sheets of paper.
             | 
             | At ~300 pages/book, that's about 50 books cost equivalent.
             | 
             | Note that _printing_ output tends to run higher, at $0.01
             | -- $0.25 per page (higher for colour inkjet and laserjet).
             | 
             | Depending on ones reading patterns, the cost (and
             | environmental impacts) of an ebook reader could well come
             | out ahead. It's also generally easier to carry such a
             | device than the equivalent number of printed books or
             | documents.
        
               | Thrymr wrote:
               | And the marginal cost of adding articles to a device if
               | you are already using it to read books is very low.
        
               | dredmorbius wrote:
               | Correct, up to storage limits.
               | 
               | That's not a minor consideration from me as I can easily
               | fill 64--128 GB of total storage (about 30GB seem to be
               | system + apps).
               | 
               | That's not all books --- I keep a fairly large number of
               | podcast episodes downloaded. But at about 5 MB/book, even
               | an apparently generous storage quickly shows limits.
               | 
               | I passed on the ReMarkable as its 16 GB storage (about
               | 8GB available) only permits 1,600 books at 5 MB/book.
               | 
               | (And that's without podcasts or audio.)
               | 
               | The BOOX has a 64 GB onboard storage, maximum. I've got
               | that near capacity in about 6 months, though a large
               | share of that is podcasts. My preference would be 256 GB.
               | Plus far better content-management capabilities on the
               | device itself. I _think_ I could live within that.
               | 
               | Retail cost is $20, falling by about half every 2 years.
               | The minimising of eBook storage makes absolutely no
               | economic sense.
        
             | rpadovani wrote:
             | I don't think he bought the Kobo only for reading webpages
             | tho, so you cannot really do a direct comparison like this.
        
             | canadianfella wrote:
             | > hundreds of reams of paper.
             | 
             | How did you come to this conclusion?
        
           | 5faulker wrote:
           | It's a nice compromise.
        
           | BeetleB wrote:
           | I have a Kobo and I used to do this. And while I enjoyed
           | ereaders for many years, paper is still king. The Kobo's
           | resolution is still not good enough, and being able to flip
           | pages is still more convenient.
           | 
           | The nice thing about the Kobo is you can install your own
           | software, so there's still hope for a better interface.
        
       | stuartd wrote:
       | You can set iOS Safari to default to reader mode for all websites
       | in Safari/Website settings/Reader/All websites
       | 
       | Then for sites you don't want to use reader mode in, you turn
       | 'User reader automatically' off in the site settings.
        
       | ximm wrote:
       | > The web has been plagued by cookie consent popups and banners
       | since the General Data Protection Regulation (GDPR) has come into
       | effect.
       | 
       | It has become obvious that no user would willingly consent to the
       | overuse of cookies since the General Data Protection Regulation
       | (GDPR) has come into effect.
       | 
       | Here, I fixed that for you.
        
       | pmontra wrote:
       | A useful feature of Firefox reader mode on Android is that if you
       | bookmark a page from inside reader mode, Firefox saves it locally
       | and you can go back to it from the bookmarks even when you are
       | offline. I used it to read long web pages (usually fiction) on
       | planes or in the middle of nowhere.
       | 
       | Edit: it works only on older Firefox versions. This feature was
       | removed sometime in the last months.
        
         | alkyon wrote:
         | Interesting, but doesn't seem to work for me.
        
           | pmontra wrote:
           | You're right. I checked with the new Firefox (the one with
           | the "too many taps" GUI from one year ago) and it doesn't
           | work anymore.
           | 
           | I'm using the old Firefox on my main phone and it explicitly
           | says "Saved offline" when I bookmark a Reader Mode page. The
           | new Firefox on the backup phone says "Bookmark saved".
           | 
           | One more reason to stay on the old Firefox.
        
             | _1a wrote:
             | This was one of the features I was actually sad to see go
             | when I updated Firefox.
             | 
             | I used this feature a lot as it was mainly manuals that I
             | was saving.
             | 
             | They also replaced the default start page to be Collections
             | instead of bookmarks, which b of course for me was empty.
             | 
             | I think I've got used to the new layout that I probably
             | won't downgrade just for the offline capabilities.
        
             | morsch wrote:
             | Yup, it didn't make the transition to Fenix. That was such
             | a cool feature. Maybe I should downgrade.
        
         | spupy wrote:
         | That sounds almost exactly like the functionality that Firefox'
         | Pocket provides. The app downloads a reader view of everything
         | you put in there so you can read offline.
        
           | codq wrote:
           | Pocket sometimes fails to save the article locally, and
           | forces 'Web View', rendering it useless unless loaded with a
           | data connection.
           | 
           | I feel like Pocket could use some updates, it seems
           | underloved from the Mozilla team, especially for an app that
           | purportedly generates revenue for the company.
        
             | dredmorbius wrote:
             | That forced-web-view thing is absolutely maddening.
             | 
             | I'd actually prefer a placeholder "we couldn't render
             | this", which leaves the tagging tools available, to
             | redirecting to the remote site.
        
         | Veen wrote:
         | Safari's Reading List feature does something similar. Or it's
         | supposed to. In my experience it often fails to save articles
         | so you can read them offline.
        
       | spullara wrote:
       | This is my most loved feature of Safari missing from Chrome by
       | default. Edge has added it recently.
        
       | zelphirkalt wrote:
       | I use it on a daily basis. Without it a lot of websites are
       | unusable for me. I just want to read the content, I do not wish
       | to see the ads or interactive whatever. I want content. It is
       | especially helpful, when websites manage to become unreadable
       | without loading JS, because somehow they screwed up their CSS so
       | badly, or it does not exist, without loading JS. Reader mode
       | basically saves those websites from becoming instantly closed
       | tabs.
        
         | Kim_Bruning wrote:
         | I recently started using this too.
         | 
         | Now why can't websites just be written to work this way in the
         | first place?
        
       | shandor wrote:
       | My most wanted feature for Firefox right now is the ability to
       | right-click (or long-press on mobile) the link and choose "Open
       | Link in Reader mode" exactly like they already offer for "open
       | Link in New Private window".
       | 
       | I think that would be even more important than the Private
       | shortcut, with the amount of unnecessary crap the websites try to
       | cram on your screen.
        
         | classichasclass wrote:
         | I implemented this for TenFourFox and it's a real godsend for
         | certain sites. Meanwhile, there's this, but not Android-
         | compatible: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-
         | US/firefox/addon/reader-view/
        
           | dredmorbius wrote:
           | Thank you.
        
           | shandor wrote:
           | Thanks for the addon!
           | 
           | Just for the sake of curiosity, what do you think it would
           | take for your addon to be ported to work also on Android?
        
             | classichasclass wrote:
             | Not mine, so I haven't looked at it closely. In general,
             | however, I think there are many more addons that _could_
             | work, and _should_ work on Android.
        
             | CodesInChaos wrote:
             | Afaik firefox mobile only allows a small number of
             | whitelisted extensions.
        
               | nick__m wrote:
               | there is a way1 to install other addon (if you use
               | firefox nightly) but it is downright user-hostile.
               | 
               | 1- https://www.ghacks.net/2020/10/01/you-can-now-install-
               | any-ad...
        
         | satellite2 wrote:
         | Exactly, as some sites will remove content too fast and the
         | reader mode button disappear before any possible attempt at
         | clicking it
        
           | shandor wrote:
           | Yep. I also wouldn't care at all if "forcing" reader mode
           | like this would most certainly break some pages. I wouldn't
           | want to stay on pages like that anyway, so I would lose
           | nothing.
        
         | [deleted]
        
         | [deleted]
        
       | [deleted]
        
       | egypturnash wrote:
       | Honestly now that I think about it it's kind of surprising that
       | Chrome has a reader mode button at all; why would a company whose
       | business is mostly "serving ads" want to make it easier for you
       | to get rid of them?
        
         | HeckFeck wrote:
         | Sssh, a Chrome PM might be reading!
        
           | fsflover wrote:
           | So more people will switch to Firefox, good!
        
       | thrower123 wrote:
       | The only time I ever use reader mode is when the iOS Twitter app
       | automatically launches Safari in that mode for links that I open.
       | Sometimes it's helpful, more often the website is hopelessly
       | broken and I have to try disabling it and going back to normal
       | mode a few times - it seems to toggle back to reader mode about
       | half the time when I disable it. Or I give up and copy the url
       | and open it in Brave instead.
        
       | [deleted]
        
       | underdeserver wrote:
       | I read this post on reader mode.
        
       | beyondcompute wrote:
       | Reader mode in mobile Safari is basically one of the two things
       | that keep me on iOS (the other one is dictation).
        
       | classichasclass wrote:
       | Reader View is excellent on low-spec systems. On TenFourFox you
       | can try any page in Reader View, not just what the browser thinks
       | will work. I also implemented sticky reader view, where going to
       | links stays in reader mode even on different sites until you
       | explicitly leave reader view (see
       | https://tenfourfox.blogspot.com/2020/09/tenfourfox-fpr27b1-a... )
       | and auto reader view by domain or by domain subpages (
       | https://tenfourfox.blogspot.com/2021/03/tenfourfox-fpr31b1-a...
       | ). Combined with a right-click to Open in Reader View menu
       | option, this means you can jump right in and spend less time
       | waiting for pages to load on older computers.
        
         | freediver wrote:
         | "Sticky Reader View" is an excellent idea!
         | 
         | Perhaps there is no need for both sticky and auto reader view
         | settings. As soon as the user enabled auto reader view, you
         | assume Sticky mode and enable auto reader view on any domains
         | they subsequently visit (and render in reader mode successfully
         | at least once?)
        
           | classichasclass wrote:
           | TenFourFox uses sticky mode by default anyway. But you make a
           | good point for others who might implement such a feature.
        
       | midjji wrote:
       | Nice
        
       | kixiQu wrote:
       | I gotta go back and figure out if I can submit a PR to fix
       | footnotes, though [1]. I don't like using Reader Mode when I know
       | there might be stuff missing, so I itch to go and check.
       | 
       | [1]: https://github.com/mozilla/readability/issues/654
        
       | vermaden wrote:
       | Today's web is unusable without these two:
       | 
       | - uBlock Origin
       | 
       | - I Do Not Care About Cookies
       | 
       | The latter can also be configured for uBlock:
       | 
       | https://majkiit.github.io/polish-ads-filter/#i_dont_care_abo...
        
       | nayuki wrote:
       | Firefox's reader mode can bypass paywalls on many news sites
       | (e.g. The Economist). It's simple to activate; press F9 and then
       | F5.
        
       | matthewfelgate wrote:
       | I discovered Reader Mode on Chrome a few months ago and have used
       | it a lot since. I use it everyday and it makes it much easier to
       | read articles.
        
       | robinoh wrote:
       | reader mode shortcut on ff: ctrl-alt-r
        
         | inanutshellus wrote:
         | TIL!
        
         | noman-land wrote:
         | You are a god.
        
         | arepublicadoceu wrote:
         | > reader mode shortcut on ff: ctrl-alt-r
         | 
         | F9 on Windows
         | 
         | I use it all the time.
        
         | perilunar wrote:
         | command-alt-r on Mac/FF
         | 
         | command-shift-r on Mac/Safari
        
       | everdrive wrote:
       | I use this all the time and it's wonderful! It's not underused
       | here.
       | 
       | A LOT of the time a webpage will be completely broken / filled
       | with ads / javascript / and other useless garbage. One click and
       | I'm in reader mode, and all that junk is gone and I just have
       | nice clean text, and perhaps a couple of images. Makes me wonder
       | if I can set reader mode automatically for certain pages.
        
       | clipradiowallet wrote:
       | I'm a huge fan of reader mode! On a few sites that the adblocker
       | can't work on - or sites that won't work _because_ of the
       | adblocker...reader mode is usually the only way for me to see the
       | content. Example, wall street journal and some other mainstream
       | news sites will obscure the article with a paywall, but reader
       | mode shows it in entirety.
        
       | jonplackett wrote:
       | Does no one else user reader mode?
       | 
       | I've found it the only way to stay sane on sites where ad
       | blockers don't work.
        
         | oefnak wrote:
         | Which adblocker do you use? With ublock origin I almost never
         | encounter sites where ads are visible.
        
           | jonplackett wrote:
           | Only happens on mobile sometimes, and when a site forces you
           | to turn it off to function. I'm on ublock too any other time!
           | I feel a deep sense of pity for anyone still surfing the web
           | unprotected!
        
       | obscuren wrote:
       | I've always been puzzled by the "You accept these cookies"
       | banners. Some have an 'accept' and 'don't accept/let me choose'
       | and some even come with a 'X' to close the banner.
       | 
       | So what does it mean when I either click the 'X' or simply do
       | nothing and leave the banner there while I read the article? What
       | does it mean when I use reader mode and basically ignore the
       | question whether I accept them or not?
        
       | dijit wrote:
       | I think I have to share my incredulation; I always use Reader
       | Mode on Safari iOS: lots of sites are quite literally unreadable
       | otherwise.
        
         | schlupfknoten wrote:
         | Unfortunately, I have recently started encountering more sites
         | where Safari just doesn't offer the Reader Mode option.
        
           | asdff wrote:
           | The arms race continues
        
             | spideymans wrote:
             | If you have to actively circumvent the efforts of your
             | users to make your webpage more readable, you may have a
             | massive problem with your underlying design culture.
        
         | opdahl wrote:
         | Quick tip on Safari iOS Reader View:
         | 
         | Click and hold the 'aA' button on the address bar and it will
         | go straight to reader view without you having to go through the
         | menu and selecting it.
        
           | interpol_p wrote:
           | And if you tap "Website Settings" from the 'aA' popup (this
           | is iOS 15, not sure where the setting lives in iOS 14, but
           | it's somewhere there too), you can toggle "Use Reader
           | Automatically" for the domain
        
         | FabHK wrote:
         | And, in both macOS and iOS Safari, you have a per-website-
         | setting to request reader view automatically. It's great.
        
         | punnerud wrote:
         | Hardpress on the AA in the URL-bar and you activate it directly
         | (if it's available).
         | 
         | Possible new safari feature: Make the text bold if reader mode
         | is available
        
         | fckthisguy wrote:
         | I exclusively use reader mode on Firefox when reading news
         | articles. So many site are borderline unusable otherwise due to
         | all the ads, popups, cookie policies, and subscription promps.
        
           | LegitShady wrote:
           | ...I just use adblockers.
        
             | mywittyname wrote:
             | This isn't as effective as it was in the past now that
             | anti-adblocking is practically universal.
        
               | LegitShady wrote:
               | Haven't noticed any issues but maybe I don't visit the
               | same websites as you.
        
         | rodolphoarruda wrote:
         | Yes, and it gives you -- Firefox -- the chance to fine tune
         | your reading experience to that very moment. Sometimes you need
         | a larger font size or more text/background contrast depending
         | where you are. It's really useful.
        
       | Meph504 wrote:
       | I use it all the time to avoid a lot of modal popup article
       | blockers and the like.
        
       | rodolphoarruda wrote:
       | I'm an absolute heavy user of reader mode in Firefox, not only
       | for reading content per se, but to clean up content before I
       | copy/paste it into Evernote. I just love the feature.
        
         | ryanianian wrote:
         | I find Evernote's web clipper (browser extension) to usually do
         | a job either comparable to or better than Firefox's web
         | clipper. Clipper > Clip Format > Article.
         | 
         | It used to be pretty bad but they've made it a lot better in
         | the past few months.
         | 
         | It also has the benefit of storing the source url in the note
         | and creating the new note from scratch which you don't get by
         | copy/pasting into a new note.
        
       | SevenSigs wrote:
       | Haven't tried it but there is an addon to automatically enable
       | reader mode:https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/auto-
       | reader-v...
        
         | frenkel wrote:
         | That's super useful for some known bad sites that I use.
         | Thanks!
        
       | AdmiralAsshat wrote:
       | > I believe not a lot of users know about this button, especially
       | because Chrome doesn't want to show it by default.
       | 
       | What? The browser made by the company that derives 90% of its
       | revenue from ads doesn't want to show you a button that can
       | remove the ads? I am shocked!
        
       | soheil wrote:
       | I use Reading List feature to save articles that I want to listen
       | to later during a run or workout. I made https://per.quest to
       | listen to any URL. I wish there was a rss feed provided by the
       | browser for Reading List feature so I could listen to articles
       | one after another.
       | 
       | I also stopped using reader mode for sites with insane
       | ads/videos/js/popovers that hog the browser and just open them
       | with per.quest/read/[URL] to extract just the article text.
        
       | abrowne wrote:
       | Personally, I found reader mode missed just enough -- like images
       | loaded with js or footnotes referenced in an article -- that it
       | was more trouble than it was worth. And as much as I liked the
       | "readability", I missed missed seeing the different designs,
       | fonts and so on. (Who would want to read all books with exactly
       | the same layout and typeface!?)
       | 
       | Now I have a collection of user stylesheets I use with Stylus to
       | improve sites I read a lot. I especially often remove fixed
       | toolbars and adjust font size and line height. I also use the
       | browser zoom feature a lot to get one-off sites to a better
       | reading text size.
        
       | Saint_Genet wrote:
       | You also get around many paywalls by activating reader mode.
        
       | aimor wrote:
       | Firefox USED to allow accessing reader mode by prepending the url
       | with 'about:reader?url='. This doesn't work anymore and I don't
       | know what to use instead. There is a reader mode button that
       | toggles it on and off, but some websites redirect or change the
       | content before I can click the button. Sometimes the button just
       | doesn't appear (why not, reader mode usually works fine).
       | Refreshing the page sometimes works, if the website doesn't
       | redirect or change the address.
       | 
       | Is there some other way to force reader mode before the page
       | load?
        
       | maddyboo wrote:
       | I love reader mode but I don't use it when reading technical
       | content because it lacks syntax highlighting. I've also often
       | encountered bugs where certain graphics that are core the the
       | article won't be shown and I will be confused until I turn off
       | reader mode and see what I was missing. But for non-technical
       | articles, it usually works fine.
        
       | eurasiantiger wrote:
       | Many sites already work around this, and reader mode only shows a
       | blank page or the contents of the disavow human rights box.
        
         | eganist wrote:
         | > Many sites already work around this, and reader mode only
         | shows a blank page or the contents of the disavow human rights
         | box.
         | 
         | Refresh while in reader mode. The DOM with most paywalls is
         | destroyed post-render, not before it reaches the web browser.
         | Refreshing in reader mode prevents client side scripts from
         | executing and rewriting the DOM. I'm presuming this is to be
         | search engine friendly, but I'll leave it to the SEO experts to
         | educate me.
         | 
         | This is what I do with most sites.
        
           | eurasiantiger wrote:
           | With iOS, for example, refreshing npr.org just turns off
           | reader mode.
        
             | nojito wrote:
             | As you refresh it should change the address bar saying
             | reader mode avaiable and you should be able to quickly hit
             | the Aa icon on the top left.
        
               | eurasiantiger wrote:
               | They redirect to another subdomain, so I don't think this
               | will work. Thanks anyway!
        
           | subscribeNOW wrote:
           | > The DOM with most paywalls is destroyed post-render
           | 
           | This has changed for most major sites. Users behind the
           | paywall are served a "truncated" version of the article that
           | _never_ included a full version of it. The days of  "press
           | Esc before it finishes loading!" are coming to an end it
           | seems.
           | 
           | The truncated version is still more SEO-friendly than a blank
           | page as it has the headline and partial content.
        
           | OJFord wrote:
           | Disabling JS also often works for the same reason. (But
           | reader mode is great, nothing against it.)
        
       | chrismorgan wrote:
       | In Firefox this is implemented as about:reader?url=..., and you
       | can use that URL to load reader mode even on pages that aren't
       | detected as compatible (so that the reader mode toolbar button
       | doesn't appear).
       | 
       | This used be the URL on Firefox for Android as well, but if I
       | recall correctly (I seldom use reader mode) it got changed in the
       | Fenix world so that it's a moz-extension:// URL.
        
         | classichasclass wrote:
         | I used to enter about:reader URLs all the time for pages that
         | Firefox Android wouldn't show the button for. Do you know where
         | the moz-extension:// incantation for this is? I would think
         | it's a constant UUID, so maybe I just need to page through the
         | source.
         | 
         | There really should be an option for "always let me try Reader
         | Mode."
        
       | stiltzkin wrote:
       | Highly recommend Instant View on Telegram:
       | https://instantview.telegram.org/
       | 
       | You can make your site and pages compatible with Instant View,
       | also there are bots which can export pages to Telegra.ph which
       | are also Instant View compatible.
        
       | lastgeniusua wrote:
       | Sadly Tridactyl (vim keybindings for Firefox) doesn't work in
       | reader mode, which really breaks the flow of my usual
       | scrolling/tab-switching with vim keys. This, and the pdf reader
       | tabs kill me because of it
        
         | bovine3dom wrote:
         | How much do you care? There's an open pull request you could
         | give a little time to that would fix it by integrating a reader
         | mode into Tridactyl here:
         | https://github.com/tridactyl/tridactyl/pull/3306
         | 
         | : )
        
           | lastgeniusua wrote:
           | don't really have much experience with JS or TS, but might
           | try this later, thanks!
        
             | bovine3dom wrote:
             | If you're familiar with CSS, writing a decent stylesheet
             | for it would be a big help. If you've no interest in JS/TS
             | you could leave that part to me.
        
       | ChrisMarshallNY wrote:
       | I use it often. Lots of sites have become wise to its use for
       | bypassing paywalls, but it does work, occasionally, to get past a
       | required sign-in.
       | 
       | It's good for downloading sites as PDF.
        
       | sysadm1n wrote:
       | How does a browser's reader mode carve out the bit you want to
       | read and ignore menus and other cruft? Does it scan for semantic
       | elements like `<main> / <article>` or something and then serve up
       | the 'meat' of the article?
        
         | js2 wrote:
         | More or less. Here's various implementations:
         | 
         | https://github.com/masukomi/arc90-readability
         | 
         | Original JS library:
         | 
         | https://github.com/masukomi/arc90-readability/blob/master/js...
         | 
         | Specifically see here:
         | 
         | https://github.com/masukomi/arc90-readability/blob/master/js...
        
       | CrlNvl wrote:
       | On FF, is there an extension that automatically turns on reader
       | mode when you are reading an article?
        
         | gizdan wrote:
         | Yes. I've been using Automatic Reader View[0]. Though, to be
         | honest, this should be an option directly in Firefox.
         | 
         | [0] https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/automatic-
         | rea...
        
       | refracture wrote:
       | Reader mode on Firefox for iPad OS is wonderful, gets rid of
       | everything but the text I want and it feels like reading an
       | eBook.
        
       | kjr247 wrote:
       | Doesn't work on Chromium Brave. /tries not to cry /lays on the
       | floor and cries alot
        
       | aerojoe23 wrote:
       | I love reader mode in Firefox. It will also do text to speech for
       | you.
       | 
       | The voices seem to dependent on something built into the OS. They
       | sound okay on windows and I haven't figured out how to get them
       | to sound good on linux. On windows the voices sound good, but I
       | Wish I could get it to go a little faster. The voices don't sound
       | human so it takes some getting used to.
       | 
       | On linux the voices just sound more harsh. To the point I don't
       | want to use it. If anyone knows a switch to flip or how to
       | install additional voices to make them sound better, that would
       | be great.
        
         | q_andrew wrote:
         | I use Microsoft Edge exclusively for its read aloud function --
         | it doesn't require reader mode to be activated and has
         | integration with Microsoft's 'natural voice' which is almost
         | indistinguishable from regular speech. Also it will instantly
         | start reading from whatever word you click on which helps with
         | backtracking. The downside, of course, is having to use Edge.
        
           | woldemariam wrote:
           | +1 for Edge. Use it on my Macbook and love how it highlights
           | the sentence it is currently reading and scrolls the page
           | down automatically. It is not as good as Google Assistant on
           | android. Google Assistant on android knows to skip past image
           | captions and ads, and it knows when it has reached the end of
           | an article; Edge simply reads everything it sees.
        
             | q_andrew wrote:
             | You'd think google would use the same architecture for
             | chrome! I haven't found it to be nearly as useful.
        
               | ygra wrote:
               | I guess those parts are where Edge cannot use the same
               | services Google uses anyway (since they're not allowed
               | to). And if they have to provide their own TTS anyway,
               | they can just as well improve over Chrome at that point.
        
             | badhrink wrote:
             | How to activate this in Google Assistant? Is there a
             | special application or something? Or do we just have to say
             | "Ok google read this <URL> " ?
        
         | franciscop wrote:
         | Oh that must be new but it looks so useful. I had eye laser
         | last year and looked a lot for exactly something like that for
         | my 3-4 days of literally just laying down and not doing much,
         | but couldn't find anything like this. My plan was to open the
         | Gutenberg project HTML books (or plain text) and have the
         | browser read them, but nothing satisfied me (specially since
         | there was no "pause/scrub" in the ones I did find). Ended up
         | listening to audiobooks in youtube and that was good enough.
        
         | stuaxo wrote:
         | Wow, never tried the voices before and they are hilarious on
         | Linux (tried en-GB).
        
         | jayknight wrote:
         | I just wish Firefox Focus had reader mode. It's my default
         | browser on my phone, which gets me around free article limits
         | on some sites, so having to open it in another browser can
         | defeat that purpose.
        
         | SquishyPanda23 wrote:
         | Do you know how to enable this in Linux? I don't see a TTS
         | option in reader mode on Firefox.
         | 
         | EDIT: I figured it out. I needed to install speech-dispatcher.
         | 
         | On Ubuntu
         | 
         | > sudo apt install speech-dispatcher
        
           | NAHWheatCracker wrote:
           | It's available on Linux for me. I'm on Pop! OS 21. The
           | "listen" option is a set of earphones at the top left of the
           | page.
           | 
           | The voices are awful to listen to, though.
        
             | stuaxo wrote:
             | Hilariously bad.
        
         | barbinbrad wrote:
         | For web developers, one thing to keep in mind with text to
         | speech is that you can use the aria-hidden attribute to prevent
         | things (like menus or ads) from being read.
         | 
         | https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/Accessibility/A...
        
         | isaac21259 wrote:
         | The text to speech goes through speech dispatcher which by
         | default probably uses espeak. I believe there are better text
         | to speech engines like festival which you should be able to
         | have speech dispatcher use quite easily but I've never tried
         | this.
        
         | illegalmemory wrote:
         | One of the little feature of reader mode I love is, if you time
         | it correctly (before loading all javascript of the page) you
         | can skip a lot of prompts ( subscribe to read / monthly limit
         | reached and so on )
        
           | ethbr0 wrote:
           | Try hard refreshing the page _after_ you 're in reader mode.
        
           | mywittyname wrote:
           | It's only a matter of time before sites start rolling out
           | anti-reader mode "features."
        
             | nsxwolf wrote:
             | I stopped using these modes years ago because of
             | inconsistent results that I assume must be from reader-
             | blocking tech.
        
               | marssaxman wrote:
               | I stopped using those sites, instead. I figure that if
               | they're so far up in themselves that they want to employ
               | such user-hostile design, I'm probably not missing much
               | if I just move on and read something else.
        
             | matheusmoreira wrote:
             | It's already happenning. Just like adblockers, anything
             | that makes life better for users is actively fought
             | against.
        
             | egypturnash wrote:
             | It's already been done. Wired, for instance, only shows you
             | the first paragraph of a story until you've made an account
             | and logged in, even in reader mode.
        
               | rawling wrote:
               | Surely that's just any halfway-competent pay/sign-up
               | wall, rather than specifically anti-reader mode?
        
               | satellite2 wrote:
               | Not necessarily as they still want to be referenced
               | properly.
               | 
               | The workaround was to whitelist Google's spider ips and
               | remove the paywall for those but with the progress of
               | other search engine / social nets it's more complicated
               | to paywall without hurting SEO.
        
               | matheusmoreira wrote:
               | > The workaround was to whitelist Google's spider ips and
               | remove the paywall for those
               | 
               | Isn't that against Google's own policies? I think they
               | call it cloaking.
        
               | dredmorbius wrote:
               | For sites dependent on link-aggregator sites (such as HN,
               | Tildes, Mastodon, Diaspora, etc.)[1] for spreading and
               | sharing content, hard paywalls tend to very strongly
               | discourage further readership and sharing.
               | 
               | I'm aware that HN has multiple levels of penalties
               | applied to sites / domains, for various reasons. Users
               | may also flag inaccessible content. (I certainly do.)
               | 
               | ________________________________
               | 
               | Notes:
               | 
               | 1. If you've determined that "etc." is doing much heavy
               | lifting here, congratulations. The resources listed are
               | highly encouraged.
        
               | egypturnash wrote:
               | If you wanna split hairs, sure. "Breaking reader mode" is
               | a component of an access wall. For a while a lot of sites
               | didn't have that, so reader mode would work to skip all
               | that.
        
         | morsch wrote:
         | No tts in Firefox for Android, sadly. That'd be really useful.
         | Is there no way for Android apps to use the built-in system
         | tts?
        
           | prirai wrote:
           | Yes, there is. Styx Browser on Fdroid has implemented it and
           | also many other powerful features. Give a try, won't look
           | back.
        
         | kzrdude wrote:
         | There seems to be some ways to do it in linux, but haven't
         | tried myself yet: https://askubuntu.com/questions/953509/how-
         | can-i-change-the-...
         | 
         | I'm not super fond of having to run any particular background
         | service for this.
        
         | busymom0 wrote:
         | For anyone interested, my hacker news app HACK does both reader
         | node as well as read text to speech. It's brand new so any
         | feedback is welcome:
         | 
         | https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.pranapps.h...
         | 
         | It's available on iOS too which uses the built in reader mode
         | of safari.
        
           | AlexAndScripts wrote:
           | Just tried it out. I usually use Harmonic, and in general I
           | much prefer the UI - it's more minimalistic, lower contrast,
           | and I prefer the font (Product Sans). It also has a built in
           | ad blocker. However, I appreciate the various filtering
           | options / different feeds and the archive access seems like a
           | really useful feature.
           | 
           | On the whole I think I'll stick with Harmonic, but it looks
           | like it has some potential.
        
             | busymom0 wrote:
             | The settings in my app can be customized to make it as
             | minimalist as needed (like hide favicons, hide the
             | metadata, only show titles etc). There's also settings for
             | color choices and a setting to use lower contrast text.
             | Font sizes and paragraph spacing can be changed to make it
             | more compact. My app has a built in adblocker too for the
             | built in browser.
             | 
             | My app has reply push notifications too which I don't think
             | any of the other HN apps have.
             | 
             | As for the font, Product Sans is not legally allowed to be
             | used by third parties as far as I am aware:
             | 
             | https://graphicdesign.stackexchange.com/questions/102262/ca
             | n...
             | 
             | My app allows you to change fonts too and it supports
             | Montserrat font which looks visually similar to Product
             | Sans.
        
           | onkoe wrote:
           | Please consider putting this on F-droid. Many people here
           | don't use Google services and you're likely missing out on
           | many downloads (including mine)
        
             | busymom0 wrote:
             | Thanks for the idea. I will research F droid and put it on
             | there.
        
       | mastrsushi wrote:
       | I use reader mode anytime I come across an informative webpage.
       | That being said, I always use it as the precious feature it is,
       | presuming it will be removed either over lack of use and support
       | or effect on ad market.
        
       | GrumpyNl wrote:
       | The icon doesnt show on chrome latest version.
        
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       (page generated 2021-08-25 23:00 UTC)