[HN Gopher] A $10k poker win changed how I think
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A $10k poker win changed how I think
Author : cjg
Score : 126 points
Date : 2021-09-06 18:28 UTC (4 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.bbc.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.bbc.com)
| RivieraKid wrote:
| Is anyone here familiar with current state of poker AIs / bots?
| For a long time, I've been thinking about making a multiplayer
| bot that would be able to play at a somewhat decent level but it
| seems like an extremely hard problem.
|
| I've read the Pluribus paper but it assumes fixed stack sizes and
| more importantly, would be very hard to implement. There has to
| be a simpler approach.
| jeffreyrogers wrote:
| I have an acquaintance who wrote one about a decade ago. He
| said he was profitable in small stakes play, but the average
| player was pretty bad then. I've played recently and the
| average player seems quite a bit better now.
|
| I would think that a pretty naive bot would do fine at lower
| stakes since most people there are not that disciplined, so
| just sticking to a basic strategy and not making obvious
| mistakes would probably have positive EV.
|
| Seems unlikely that anyone is going to publish a system that
| currently works though.
| btilly wrote:
| According to poker experts that I know, bots have long beat
| humans in multiplayer because they are better able to track
| what is happening with all players at the table.
|
| After https://www.deepstack.ai/ beat no-limit heads up, poker
| bots simply became better than humans.
| 58x14 wrote:
| I became very interested in both poker and machine learning when
| I happened to be present for the opening of this event:
| https://www.cmu.edu/news/stories/archives/2017/january/AI-be...
|
| Reasoning through imperfect information scenarios, and developing
| emotional resilience when unlikely negative outcomes occur, are
| two of the skills I cherish the most. I think poker is
| brilliantly analogous to both prediction markets and
| leading/lagging social trends and emotions that surround them.
| SuoDuanDao wrote:
| I read a sci-fi short story a while back where humans post FTL
| travel filled an unusual niche in the galactic ecosystem.
| Because our pursuit-predating ancestors had to anticipate the
| movements of the animals they tracked, humans were (by galactic
| standards) incredibly good at 'reading' other sentient races,
| and 'never play poker against a human' was an accepted truism
| of the setting.
| Inhibit wrote:
| Don't know if it was the book, but "Design for a Great Day"
| by Alan Dean Foster is what that reminds me of.
|
| Based off (someone elses?) short story iirc but I didn't pull
| it down to check.
| parsnips wrote:
| I wasn't aware that Jennifer Shahade got the Grandmaster title.
| fnord77 wrote:
| tangential question - can AI/ML poker players beat the best human
| players in online poker?
| Jhsto wrote:
| Playing a poker can also be an interesting mental exercise. I
| occasionally play 3-4 tables concurrently online, of which I
| ultimately focus on a single one I always-eventually get lucky in
| (it might take a dozen games but the single one usually pays the
| rest off), and the amount of exhaustion you feel after 6-7 hours
| of that is surprising. Nothing like what programming gives me. I
| have heard similar experiences from ex-professional chess
| players.
| MathCodeLove wrote:
| Just out of curiosity, where do you go to play online? I've
| entertained the idea of trying it out but then suffer analysis
| paralysis when trying to actually pick a platform to play on.
| Jhsto wrote:
| PokerStars. If you are based in the US, I have no idea what
| your options are. The format is multi-table tournament
| knockout games which heavily favors you having a bigger chip
| stack than anyone else.
| olalonde wrote:
| I used to do that towards the end of high school. I actually
| started out with "free rolls" where tournament winners would
| win ~10 cents and built up a 5 digit bankroll within a few
| months. It must have been weird for the site operators to see a
| user with a 5 digit balance that has never deposited money.
|
| I eventually quit although I was making good money (especially
| for my age) because it was too time consuming and emotionally
| draining. Plus, online poker got banned in the US, meaning that
| the level of the game got higher. The good players found ways
| to play but the "fishes" mostly didn't bother. At least that
| was my perception at the time.
| Tarsul wrote:
| she anwers the title question in the last paragraph: "curiosity
| is everything, losing is a part of playing, and our opponents in
| life are less important than the choices we make ourselves." I
| don't know why I expected more, guess I'm still prone to
| clickbait. Nonetheless, her story is interesting anyway. But she
| doesn't answer the real leading question of her story, which was
| whether she won against the misogynistic Dan B. (quick google
| search didn't help me with that..).
|
| Actually, the best advice in the article is in the middle: "don't
| play when tired, stressed or distracted."
| phkahler wrote:
| >> . But she doesn't answer the real leading question of her
| story, which was whether she won against the misogynistic Dan
| B.
|
| If you care weather she won or lost that match, you haven't
| really internalized the lessons yet.
| boomboomsubban wrote:
| They seem to have internalized the major lesson that
| "curiosity is everything," and (if the duel has happened) by
| not mentioning if she won is ignoring the lesson that "losing
| is a part of playing."
| imback wrote:
| no, "losing is part of the fun". i learned that from
| nethack.
| oh_sigh wrote:
| Almost certainly Dan Bilzerian. But that shouldn't even be
| particularly special, because he is a rich guy who plays poker,
| not a guy who got rich playing poker. (his dad is corporate
| takeover specialist/criminal Paul Bilzerian)
| [deleted]
| tedunangst wrote:
| To disambiguate, the question is who won, not who Dan is.
| Tenoke wrote:
| I believe he is a rich guy playing poker with other rich guys
| who play even worse so he's still made some money from it.
| That was at least the word in high-stakes poker circles back
| then.
| emerongi wrote:
| Doubt it. Many decent poker players have moved into areas
| where they can make money off of rich guys. From my minimal
| research many years ago, nobody knew of Dan B.
| VectorLock wrote:
| Most famously known as that dude who had the gal to ask a
| police officer for a gun during the Las Vegas mass
| shooting.
| SuoDuanDao wrote:
| I thought it was an open secret that he laundered money his
| father embezzled via poker.
| serf wrote:
| a bit more context for those that don't know the story (I
| didn't, and i'm into poker.)
|
| ( I don't know the info host nor their credibility, was
| just the top-most answer on google for 'Dan Bilzerian
| laundering')
|
| https://easy.poker/dan-bilzerian/
| Traster wrote:
| Dan B isn't a poker player, he's an instagram influencer who is
| most likely just laundering his father's money into legitimacy.
| There won't be a match.
| the-dude wrote:
| His name is all over the article. Why are you referring to him
| as Dan B. ?
| labster wrote:
| Because Dan B doesn't deserve more publicity. That's what he
| wants. The news organization has a duty to publish his name
| so we know the facts, but we have no obligation to increase
| an influencer's reach.
| agumonkey wrote:
| a subtext of that advice, don't play too big
|
| you don't feel curious if you bet your house on a poker game,
| but 50 bucks you get to enjoy the downfall
| User23 wrote:
| Risk management is the most important life skill, with
| rhetoric (persuasion) being a close second. If your risk
| management is sound then you can play as much poker or
| options trading or futures or any other hairbrained dipsy-
| doodle you like. But if your risk management isn't sound then
| you can still lose everything in a game (broadly construed)
| with an edge < 1 in your favor.
| hrhdkdlfnrne wrote:
| This ended in a cliffhanger.
|
| We need to know what happened... Did she beat the final boss?
| Twirrim wrote:
| The game hasn't happened yet, so far as I can see? Date is
| still to be determined.
| dhsysusbsjsi wrote:
| I know right! This is the equivalent of Steve Wiebe about to
| battle Billy Mitchell but at the last minute Steve gets his job
| back and goes home.
| crackercrews wrote:
| Hasn't happened yet. Wonder if they're waiting until her book
| is out, to maximize press coverage?
| teekert wrote:
| Fascinating piece.
|
| Afaik it still has to happen, but I can't find when. [0]
|
| [0]: https://www.pokerclarity.com/news/bbc-covers-heads-up-
| match-...
| tunesmith wrote:
| On her twitter feed, there's one reference from a few months
| ago that they are aiming for October in Vegas.
| bjcy wrote:
| I felt the same! The best I could find online was that the
| match-up is not yet scheduled.
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(page generated 2021-09-06 23:00 UTC)