[HN Gopher] Arctic World Archive Adds Latest Data Deposit in Sva...
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Arctic World Archive Adds Latest Data Deposit in Svalbard Facility
Author : infodocket
Score : 60 points
Date : 2021-09-25 16:31 UTC (6 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.datacenterdynamics.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.datacenterdynamics.com)
| Zamicol wrote:
| "QR code" is a trademark of Denso Corporation, and refers to a
| specific technology. I'm unsure why news sources continue to
| misreport that the data is stored in "QR code". The correct term
| is "2D barcode".
|
| Looking at their github, "QR code" is glaringly elided from their
| README. I'd guess they're very familiar with the standing QR code
| trademark. https://github.com/piql/boxing
|
| Piql's 2D barcode technology is called a "boxing barcode". It is
| not a QR code. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boxing_barcode
| atty wrote:
| I love the idea of archiving everything we can, but does anyone
| else feel like the arctic archive was created by people who got
| wrapped up in too much science fiction? I feel like there's a lot
| more practical short-to-mid term archiving of historical physical
| and electronic data that really needs to get done, that also has
| a much higher chance of being needed in the future. But perhaps I
| am just being short-sighted. I am also fully aware that one form
| of archiving does not mean other forms can not happen. But there
| does seem to be limited resources for this sort of activity.
| wiradikusuma wrote:
| I think somebody has to do it. It's like backup, we don't think
| we'll need it much until we need it.
|
| Imagine if we as human had started preserving our knowledge
| since Ancient Greek (and, not burning the libraries..),
| collectively we could have been at a better place.
|
| Or at least 1,000 years from know they will know there was once
| PPAP (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NfuiB52K7X8).
| cwp wrote:
| I think the main motivation for doing it in Svalbard is the
| seed vault, which benefits from the cold, dry environment in
| the permafrost. And sure, that the remote location lends its
| self to Foundation-like restore-civilization-after-the-dark-age
| scenarios, but it works fine for shorter-term back up too. If
| there's a blight that wipes out corn or something we can use
| the seed vault to replant. (Assuming we can cure the blight...
| cf the American Chestnut.)
| sc11 wrote:
| The Syrian civil war was such a scenario where it was useful
| as a short-term backup: https://www.croptrust.org/in-the-
| news/syrian-war-causes-glob...
| bsza wrote:
| This thing ain't science fiction:
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrington_Event
| woodruffw wrote:
| I heard about this facility previously due to GitHub's Arctic
| Code Vault[1], but this is the first time that I'm hearing that
| they're effectively using encoded microfilm[2][3] as their
| storage medium. Pretty cool stuff!
|
| [1]: https://archiveprogram.github.com/arctic-vault/
|
| [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microform
|
| [3]: https://www.piql.com/services/long-term-information-storage/
| wbeckler wrote:
| I always thought Svalbard was a made up place in His Dark
| Materials by Philip Pullman.
| rebuilder wrote:
| > However, future generations would need at least some level of
| technology - a camera and some compute capabilities.
|
| It does kind of make you wonder - what is the data that is worth
| backing up in a really futureproof manner? If we keep our tech
| level, we're probably not going to need to relearn how to make
| semiconductors. If we do not, we probably have bigger concerns
| than what a user with the nick rebuilder said on a nerdy forum in
| the year 2021.
| thaumasiotes wrote:
| > what is the data that is worth backing up in a really
| futureproof manner?
|
| A futureproof encoding would have to be something like images
| at a scale visible to the naked eye engraved in a substance
| that cannot be corroded or destroyed. Stainless steel is
| probably fine for the material, but you run into limits on the
| amount of space (and steel) you're willing to devote to the
| project. And most information just can't be represented
| pictorially anyway, so the theoretical possibility of
| futureproof storage isn't even there.
| fnord77 wrote:
| > The same mine complex also features the Global Seed Vault which
| preserves some 400,000 plant varieties to maintain diversity in
| crops.
|
| Isn't this the mine complex that is flooding due to melting
| permafrost?
|
| well at least with data, I'm sure they have some durable format
| that will survive flooding
|
| > Piql takes data and converts it into a QR code that is put onto
| 35mm film and stored in reels.
|
| or not.
|
| It seems insane putting this stuff in an icy hole in the ground
| on a warming planet.
|
| Why not find some geologically stable mountain or plateau that
| has a slow erosion rate in a desert and build a bunker?
| varjag wrote:
| Cooling takes energy, which is the first thing to go in a
| doomsday scenario. But you get it very much for free 1300km
| beyond the Arctic Circle.
|
| > Isn't this the mine complex that is flooding due to melting
| permafrost?
|
| The entrance hall was flooded in 2017, the seeds were not
| endangered. The entrance has been upgraded since.
|
| > It seems insane putting this stuff in an icy hole in the
| ground on a warming planet.
|
| As it is customary, all the concerns you come up with in first
| 5 minutes after reading an article on the Internet were likely
| considered by people working on the project.
| JohnJamesRambo wrote:
| > As it is customary, all the concerns you come up with in
| first 5 minutes after reading an article on the Internet were
| likely considered by people working on the project.
|
| This is beautiful.
| fnord77 wrote:
| Apparently they were not considered if they had to do major
| retrofitting.
|
| > In October 2016, the Seed Vault experienced an unusually
| large degree of water intrusion due to higher than average
| temperatures and heavy rainfall. While it is common for some
| water to seep into the Seed Vault's 100 m (328 ft) entrance
| tunnel during the warmer spring months, in this case the
| water encroached 15 m (49 ft) into the tunnel before
| freezing.[21] The Seed Vault was designed for water intrusion
| and as such the seeds were not at risk.[21] As a result,
| however, the Norwegian public works agency Statsbygg
| completed improvements to the tunnel in 2019 to prevent any
| such intrusion in the future, including waterproofing the
| tunnel walls, removing heat sources from the tunnel, and
| digging exterior drainage ditches.[22][23]
| henearkr wrote:
| They should put vaults in Antarctica though.
|
| Much safer, and the mainland Antarctica will not likely melt.
| varjag wrote:
| Norway however only has territory in the Arctic (which is
| an island that is not going to melt as well), and there
| were not any other takers.
| sgt wrote:
| Norway has claim to a huge area of Antarctica. Queen
| Maud's land. Subject to the Antarctic Treaty and also
| recognized by UK, France Australia, etc.
| vidarh wrote:
| Norway claims territory in Antarctica too, but these
| claims are only recognized by a handful of states who
| also claim land in Antarctica...
|
| The lack of recognition doesn't really preclude
| construction that can be justified as for scientific
| purposes, though.
|
| Convenience is more important.
| PicassoCTs wrote:
| But is a archive not better, when it can be seen?
|
| Imagine humanity is no more, but up there in orbit, a satellite
| similar in Size to Hubble contains all the data humanity ever
| produced. It observes the neighborhood, on the look out for
| likely orbits in the habitable zone, deduces planets. And when it
| has found a candidate, it beams a laser at the estimated position
| at arrival time, sending a cultural dump over the ocean of space
| and time. A lighthouse and a graveyard candle at the same time.
|
| And if hardened against the eventuality of failure properly,
| somewhere, sometimes in the far future, some alien might look up
| at the night-sky and see a flickering, traveling disc of light,
| seemingly flying fast with the speed of planetary rotation. That
| would be a monument with purpose. Giving others all the knowledge
| we had, as a gift, to do better.
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(page generated 2021-09-25 23:00 UTC)