[HN Gopher] Iceland stops using Moderna Covid-19 vaccine ___________________________________________________________________ Iceland stops using Moderna Covid-19 vaccine Author : busymom0 Score : 43 points Date : 2021-10-08 21:24 UTC (1 hours ago) (HTM) web link (www-visir-is.translate.goog) (TXT) w3m dump (www-visir-is.translate.goog) | OrvalWintermute wrote: | I don't think we understand the true legal ramifications yet, of | forcing an experimental vaccine on so many. We knew about the | pericarditis, the myocarditis, the blood clots, and the | autoimmune disorders, the deaths, they are well documented in | VAERS, even if massively undercounted. | | And yet, our political class did not stop | | Then Delta emerged, and vaccine efficacy dropped wholesale. Work | was made conditional based on jabs. Science became a mantra, but | in actuality it was ignored as the strong evidence for natural | immunity was silenced. Bigtech previcated, and floundered, | attaching notes to obituaries and criticism. Disinformation | replaced information, as vaxxes were pushed on those with de | minimis risk of covid, the 18 year olds without co-morbidities | with 1 in 5 million chances of dying. | | And yet, our political class did not stop. | | Now, other democracies with medical systems in many cases | matching our own are halting some of the vaccine distribution. It | looks like the Chinese with their attenuated vaccines definitely | had a better approach. But there is still an active mandate in | several sectors of the economy, and an unconstituional campaign | to deny religious exemptions that will likely eviscerate | employment. Nurses are leaving in droves rather than vaccinate, | having seen the side effects up close and personal. | | When will our political class stop? | | I sincerely believe we are ahead of the curve on a wave of class | action lawsuits the likes of which this country has never seen. | Tobacco, Asbestos, and every other toxic substances could pale in | comparison to the potential payouts from the deaths, injuries, | and reduced longevity coming from these leaky, toxic vaccines. | margalabargala wrote: | >forcing an experimental vaccine on so many | | I'm not aware of an experimental vaccine being forced on | anyone, can you provide an example? | | Back when all vaccines were operating under an EUA and were | experimental, there were zero vaccine mandates. | | After a vaccine was fully approved and shown to be | unequivocally safe and effective, it was then no longer | experimental. Mandating vaccines that are shown to be effective | and safe is as old as the USA is as a country, and this is no | outlier. | bjt2n3904 wrote: | Yeah, it wasn't forced on anyone! Nobody grabbed you and held | you down and injected you... You just couldn't travel, go out | in public, work at your job, or send your kids to school | without it. | | Totally voluntary. | margalabargala wrote: | What country are you in that disallowed being in public | without a vaccine? That didn't happen anywhere in the US | that I'm aware of. | | As for the rest, again, mandating vaccination is something | the US has been doing over and over since the year 1777. | This is nothing new. | | The parent claimed that this vaccine mandate was | specifically paired with the vaccine still being in an | experimental state, which to my knowledge is not the case. | bjt2n3904 wrote: | Mandates are totally not happening! | | But if they are, it's not in the US. | | And if it is in the US, there's legal precedent, and | totally valid. | jjtheblunt wrote: | what vaccine was out in 1777? or do you mean 1776 + 1? | iammisc wrote: | There is no fully approved vaccine available in the United | States. | | Most working people now need one to work or they face | termination as loss of livelihood | | Stop pretending it's not required. We're not all trust | finders. | dragonwriter wrote: | > There is no fully approved vaccine available in the | United States. | | Comirnaty (Pfizer-BioNTech) is fully approved for those 16 | and over, and has been since late August. | margalabargala wrote: | You're mistaken. The Pfizer vaccine is fully approved and | available in the United States. Source: | https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda- | appr... | | I never claimed it wasn't required, just that what was | required was not experimental. | colechristensen wrote: | Unequivocal? There is literally no doubt as to the "safety"? | That is demonstratively not true. On several occasions, | several of the vaccines have been halted by several separate | health authorities over safety concerns. That is not zero | doubt. This story is about exactly that. | | You have to come up with a definition of "experimental" that | suits you, and "emergency authorization" doesn't sound like | very well tested and understood. | | People don't understand risks very well nor can they compare | risks very well and that has been demonstrated over and over | again. | | Covid vs vaccine risks vary quite a lot depending on what | kind of person you are. | | If you are quite old or have significant health problems, it | is pretty easy to demonstrate with high confidence that the | vaccine risk is way smaller than the Covid risk (many orders | of magnitude). | | If you are very young (say a healthy teenager) the Covid risk | is very low and the uncertainties of the vaccine risks start | to compete where it is much harder to have confidence that | for a population vaccinating is a better idea. People also | can have different appetites for risk and different appetites | for the good of the individual vs the good of the many. | | The problems with vaccination are many people pretend they | are perfect or evil who are either knowingly distorting the | truth or repeating lies or dogma. Also many people desire | authorization solutions for everyone to agree with them. | | What is actually needed are attempts to accurately represent | risks and unknowns, and comparisons of those risks and | unknowns which update over time as the unknowns get smaller. | There also needs to be the ability to acknowledge that a | crossover point may exist where on one side one decision may | be better than on the other. | | People though are being used to turn any contentious issue | into political dogma and opportunities to signal morality. | | The situation is not as simple as you and many people make | it. | orra wrote: | > Then Delta emerged, and vaccine efficacy dropped wholesale. | | This is bollocks. | | Pre-Delta, if double vaccinated the vaccines are about 95% | effective against severe illness and death. Post Delta, about | 92%. | | That's still incredible, and actually pretty high as vaccines | go. | stock_toaster wrote: | Further, even in cases of "breakthrough" infection, mortality | rate is significantly reduced with the vaccine vs | unvaccinated. I think people just assume that a | "breakthrough" means "didn't work", but that isn't | necessarily the case! | Sohcahtoa82 wrote: | Yup! | | Breakthrough infection and breakthrough disease are | entirely different things. | | Ask any ICU nurse what percentage of their COVID patients | are unvaccinated. Every article I've seen reports at least | 90% are unvaccinated, and of the remaining 10% that were, | they were either very old or had a severe immune | deficiency. | monksy wrote: | Depends on the vaccine you're referring to. Pfizer dropped | quite a bit. | | This is the CDC study that confirmed this (plus | summarization): https://twitter.com/drericding/status/1436389 | 153533464597?la... This cross validates the finding from the | MN DPH and Israel MOH report on pfizer from June. | | Moderna came on top with a VE of 95% under delta. | | If you didn't read this: You should still be vaccinated. If | you're under Pfizer wear KN95s, KF94s, and N95s. This not an | arguement against vaccination. | paganel wrote: | Vaccine is the only thing that can (and does) make this | pandemic manageable. I write this comment from Bucharest, where | vaccine hesitancy (among other factors) have made it so that | only about 30% of the adult population is vaccinated. We have | ambulance queues in front of most of the Covid hospitals, | patients are "deposited" (for lack of a better word) on | hospital hallways, the luckier ones on make-shift beds, the | more recent ones on chairs, hanging on to an oxygen tube | between their legs. Almost all the other European countries | have higher vaccination rates than us, they do not have our | current problems. | stock_toaster wrote: | Autotranslated article, and really thin on details. | | A confusing passage: | | > According to the [Chief Epidemiologist], the Moderna vaccine | has for the past two months been used almost exclusively here for | stimulation vaccinations after the Janssen vaccine and after two- | dose vaccinations for the elderly and immunocompromised. Very few | individuals are said to have received the second dose of the | basic vaccine that started with Moderna. | | Any Icelandic readers here? Is my reading correct that they were | using Moderna as a booster after a vaccination with either | Janssen or a two shot series of Phizer? | graeme wrote: | I read that a few times and yes, came to the same conclusion as | you. Moderna as a booster after either J and J or two dose | series (which were both moderna and pfizer or az) | aazaa wrote: | > According to the epidemiologist, the Moderna vaccine has for | the past two months been used almost exclusively here for | stimulation vaccinations after the Janssen vaccine and after two- | dose vaccinations for the elderly and immunocompromised. Very few | individuals are said to have received the second dose of the | basic vaccine that started with Moderna. | | Assuming the translation is correct, this could be a problem in | itself. I'm unaware of a single study on the safety or efficacy | of mixing vaccine types like this. | solarpunk wrote: | I think there's like a half-dozen countries doing heterologous | vaccination regimens. Here's a Wikipedia link about it | https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_vaccine_clinical_re... | stinky613 wrote: | The part that confuses me the most is that the two 'vaccine | side effects' in question are the swelling of muscles in or | around the heart... But side effects of (even mild[1]) COVID | infections include _damage_ to muscles in or around the heart. | | It seems like halting the use of a flu vaccine because of the | flu vaccine causing flu-like symptoms. | | [1]https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases- | conditions/coronavirus/i... | grillvogel wrote: | it almost seems like we needed to wait to get more data before | forcing people to take experimental vaccines in order to keep | their employment | bongcloud420 wrote: | FoLlOw ThE sCiEnCe | Lammy wrote: | Are we already into 2027 on the SPARS timeline? Hopefully that | means this will be over soon and we can all stop hating each | other quite so much :) | https://stars.library.ucf.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=10... | [deleted] ___________________________________________________________________ (page generated 2021-10-08 23:01 UTC)