[HN Gopher] Show HN: Munchy, a search engine to discover recipes
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       Show HN: Munchy, a search engine to discover recipes
        
       Author : devanflores
       Score  : 54 points
       Date   : 2021-10-15 16:19 UTC (6 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (joinmunchy.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (joinmunchy.com)
        
       | collegeburner wrote:
       | My problem with recipes is not that i cant find them, its that
       | everything has 32 million results and i dont know which ones are
       | good and which ones are crap. The "reviews" on sites never seem
       | to correlate with good vs bad recipes. If I've eaten something
       | before its kinda better but hard to find new dishes to make if I
       | dont also know the recipe is probably good. Anybody have advice
       | on good recipe sources?
        
         | symlinkk wrote:
         | https://based.cooking is my current favorite.
         | 
         | If you have a NYTimes subscription, NYTimes Cooking is decent
         | although the recipes tend to get a little over complicated and
         | pretentious sometimes.
        
         | justinpombrio wrote:
         | I hear (and have tasted) that the NYT recipes are both
         | extensive and consistently good.
        
         | slow_donkey wrote:
         | I tried solving this with a search engine that accounted for
         | reviews with some manual curation, but I realized there's
         | actually an extremely limited set of 'good' recipe sites and
         | kept returning the same 10 sites with a long tail of average
         | sites.
         | 
         | You could improve upon this by establishing site authority for
         | a topic (cuisine), but it still seemed pointless to me.
        
           | collegeburner wrote:
           | In the short term I'd appreciate some of those good recipe
           | sites as I dont know what is better or worse. Would you mind
           | sharing those 10 or so are good?
        
         | onlyrealcuzzo wrote:
         | Most of the time - the recipes are pretty similar.
         | 
         | It's usually just a difference in spices, oils (or other fats),
         | or emulsifiers. Or vegan / gluten free substitutes.
         | 
         | Nothing beats knowing your tastes and learning how to actually
         | cook - then you can look at a recipe and know which things
         | you'd rather substitute with something else and how and when,
         | etc.
         | 
         | But are there any good websites for this?
        
         | mongol wrote:
         | Yes I know what you mean. I think there should be a site that
         | realizes that there are many variants of well known dishes, and
         | they should be categorized as that. Very rarely is there an
         | original, true recipe that is the pristine source for the dish.
         | So when I search bearnaise sauce, I should not get a recipe, I
         | should get a general description, kind of like a Wikipedia
         | page. And then below that, all the different recipes, that can
         | be contributed like on a wiki. Each recipe should have a
         | feedback mechanism so the best ones gets upvoted.
        
       | jmuguy wrote:
       | Searching for your placeholder, "new york style pizza", returns
       | no results.
        
         | benbristow wrote:
         | Just searching for pizza doesn't even return pizza recipes.
         | Just pizza dough and Italian nachos (with a picture of a pizza
         | which isn't even anything like the finished product
         | apparently).
         | 
         | Meanwhile I can go to Google or Bing and find actual Pizza
         | recipes with a box at the top dedicated to recipes.
        
       | lupire wrote:
       | Half-baked recipe apps aren't meant to be published. They are a
       | TODO List app that everyone does to learn tech stacks.
        
       | lapetitejort wrote:
       | Keep in mind that people want to make those "basic" ingredients
       | that are often overlooked. Bread, vinegar, sauerkraut, even
       | butter can be made from scratch at home. They're usually more
       | labor and time intensive, and don't follow the "heat thing up and
       | add to other thing" pattern, but the recipes are out there.
        
       | devwastaken wrote:
       | I need a recipe for the best cookies that don't harden. Every
       | website does the same ingredients and they're always rock hard
       | cookies. I want recipes from actual bakeries, chef's.
        
       | tarr11 wrote:
       | Why do I have to give you my email to see a recipe?
        
         | devanflores wrote:
         | The product is still in development phase right now. I am
         | collecting emails so I can reach out to people and get their
         | feedback on the product. I'm considering removing that
         | registration wall if it poses to be too much of a nuisance
        
           | smoldesu wrote:
           | Seems like a wonderful product, but I'm with the others: I
           | probably won't be using it if you need my personal
           | information first. It's a dark pattern (not that I'm accusing
           | you of being malicious) to force people into disclosing
           | anything to use your app, so I'd recommend adding a simple
           | feature like bookmarks that signed-in users can get as a
           | bonus. Otherwise, I see a lot of red flags as a developer
           | when someone is so upfront about needing my email.
           | 
           | Regardless, keep up the good work!
        
             | devanflores wrote:
             | I just removed the registration wall, feel free to use the
             | product as you would like!
        
             | [deleted]
        
         | devanflores wrote:
         | I just removed the registration wall. Feel free to use the site
         | without signing up
        
       | abeppu wrote:
       | I think being a "search engine" but starting with a very small
       | database of recipes is not gonna help anyone. I tried searching
       | for recipes by ingredient:
       | 
       | - "bok choy" 0 results
       | 
       | - "bok choi" 0 results
       | 
       | - "arugula" 0 results
       | 
       | - "rocket" 1 result (but for oysters rockefeller, which doesn't
       | list rocket as an ingredient)
       | 
       | - "eggplant" 1 result
       | 
       | If the collection is that small, then maybe people should be able
       | to browse, rather than search?
       | 
       | But even then, it doesn't seem actually useful. The site does let
       | you "search" without entering a query at all, which at least
       | shows me a page with more than one recipe. I filtered by
       | "vegetarian" as a dietary restriction, and saw stuff, at least. I
       | scrolled until I saw a "Pasta Salad" recipe which stated it takes
       | 835 minutes! Curious as to how that could possibly be, I tried to
       | click through ... only to arrive at a page for "Mini Southwestern
       | Corn Pup Muffins with Fiesta Dipping Sauce" covered by a "Welcome
       | Back" sign-in modal. I can see under the modal that one of the
       | ingredients is "hot dogs", so in addition to taking me to a
       | different result than I had clicked on, it also seems to have
       | taken me to something that didn't match my explicit filter
       | criteria. After dismissing the modal I see that the page for this
       | "result" isn't even the recipe; I have to click through to go to
       | allrecipes. I return to my "Munchy" tab and try to go back to the
       | list, and see that on load, it cleared my dietary restriction
       | filter.
        
         | rcoveson wrote:
         | It's even worse than I thought. I simply put in their suggested
         | ingredient to search on: rice. Of the four results I clicked
         | on, only one actually used rice. The other three used rice
         | flour or rice wine vinegar. Technically correct but totally
         | misses the spirit of a useful ingredient search.
        
         | mritchie712 wrote:
         | Agreed.
         | 
         | Adding two common things also gives you 0 results (e.g. beef
         | and rice).
        
         | hunter2_ wrote:
         | > "rocket" 1 result (but for oysters rockefeller, which doesn't
         | list rocket as an ingredient)
         | 
         | Seems like an inappropriate fuzz filter. Maybe swap it out for
         | one that just does proper stem matching.
         | 
         | The _really_ weird part is that this occurs not only with the
         | regular title search, but also the ingredient search, and none
         | of this recipe 's ingredients have a fuzzy match whatsoever.
         | Wat?!
        
       | igorrek wrote:
       | I really like the idea. I have something similar, but it's only
       | my collection of excellent recipes at lindyrecipe.com
       | 
       | Much more basic idea, basically a blog with curated recipes.
        
       | languagehacker wrote:
       | Hope you're at least scraping the recipe wiki or something. This
       | just doesn't seem like enough recipes.
        
       | nikolahristov wrote:
       | Somebody's gonna invest in that I guarantee you.
        
       | blueblob wrote:
       | The search does not recognize what are individual components nor
       | what should be in the title of a recipe. If I search for "white
       | bread," I get recipes that don't include white bread as an
       | ingredient and are not for white bread. I get mussel recipes that
       | include "white wine" and say to dip bread in the broth. It's
       | ultimately not a useful search.
        
       | hichamino wrote:
       | Paid subscription
        
       | GarlicToum wrote:
       | Always good to see another recipe search engine! Curious how
       | they're doing it, but a lot of things that I search for don't
       | seem to work. It also seems to use a lot of recipe aggregators in
       | the few results I was able to find.
       | 
       | Disclosure: I'm the creator of https://garlictoum.com - another
       | recipe search engine
        
       | uneekname wrote:
       | No search results "by name" on Firefox for Android, but by
       | ingredients works great!
        
         | djbusby wrote:
         | Have to press search button twice, then wait for results to
         | load after the "no results" screen
        
         | devanflores wrote:
         | Thanks for telling me about this (and sorry for the error)!
         | It's working fine for me on ios but I'll have to look into
         | firefox causing some issues
        
       | beamatronic wrote:
       | Has anyone trained a neural net to categorize web pages
       | automatically?
        
       | hunter2_ wrote:
       | While not strictly incorrect, for those of us who do find it
       | weird to see, can you change "less" to "fewer"?
       | 
       | > Oh no! Your search returned no results. Try entering less
       | ingredients.
       | 
       | Anyway, very cool!
        
       | droptablemain wrote:
       | Cool idea, but you need more data. A search for ingredient "rice"
       | returns only 9 recipes.
       | 
       | Maybe scrape schema json-ld recipe data to help build your
       | dataset?
        
       | [deleted]
        
       | ziggus wrote:
       | Why would I use this when Google returns fantastic recipe options
       | at the top of any recipe-related search results page, including
       | pictures, ratings, and an ingredients summary?
        
         | dbcurtis wrote:
         | Because all the current recipe sites are cesspools of adverts,
         | unnecessary and distracting write-ups, and obfuscated
         | printability? They are poster children for much of what makes
         | the current web a miserable chore to use.
        
       | mattjenner wrote:
       | The database is far too small, go and really populate it & come
       | back! this is an awesome idea, when you are ready.
       | 
       | I was confused though, there appears to be no long story
       | involving a grandmother and a rat named terry who used to nibble
       | at the candles in your cabin. ETC! ;-)
        
         | [deleted]
        
       | dmitriid wrote:
       | Any recipe should have links to wikipedia articles or to a
       | descriptions of every ingredient.
       | 
       | So many times it's something like "jus use crunchy arugula flour
       | with prime undercut ribsteaks, and season with spring twigs of
       | muffinballs"
       | 
       | The world is global. And 99% of the world has no idea what it is
       | you use in that recipe.
        
       | thenayr wrote:
       | Put top recipes on the home page, actually curate some data (at
       | least 4 searches just show no results), a million other small
       | things. Honestly just looks like a "my first open-source" recipe
       | app repo on github.
       | 
       | Way too early to show off, best of luck. Recipe websites are
       | notoriously bad and there is obvious room for improvement.
        
       | mikeg8 wrote:
       | No results for "lamb". This should have been way more complete
       | before sharing here.
        
         | ABraidotti wrote:
         | searching for lamb results in: Oh no! Your search returned no
         | results. Try entering a less specific name.
         | 
         | Ungulate seemed promising, but similarly returned nothing.
         | Maybe a generic name next?
        
           | throwanem wrote:
           | I tried Eukaryota, but also didn't get anything. One assumes
           | their implementation of full taxonomic search is still on the
           | roadmap somewhere...
        
       | xwdv wrote:
       | The great thing about this is that I don't have to read (skip) a
       | fucking preamble before each recipe about why this dish reminds
       | the author of that time they spent a summer backpacking through
       | Europe with their boyfriend. Keep it up.
        
         | davestephens wrote:
         | It must be hard work to push that "jump to recipe" button that
         | features on pretty much every food blog on the planet.
        
       | pleb_nz wrote:
       | No results for kumara in either search.
       | 
       | Good luck, be good to see something like this working.
       | 
       | Be good to see recipes and ingredients from many cultures and not
       | be western heavy.
        
       | ProfAesop wrote:
       | I would appreciate a down to earth recipe database, with limited
       | advertising, and limited SEO-pre-recipe content.
       | 
       | Too bad this wasn't it.
        
       | jnsie wrote:
       | This is exactly what I need....but i searched by ingredients with
       | 'chicken breast' and 'jalapeno' and it returned 0 results. Then i
       | searched 'chicken' and 'jalapeno' and it returned 1 result. Seems
       | undercooked (pun very much intended)
        
         | devanflores wrote:
         | Hey jnsie, sorry for the poor experience. I'm still working on
         | the product and it definitely is in development mode. Although
         | this sounds unintended, this is currently how the recipe search
         | algorithm works. Because the recipe does not include the
         | ingredient "chicken breast", no results come up. However,
         | multiple recipes include the ingredient "chicken", which lead
         | to you getting a result. I'm working on developing some kind of
         | smart detection algorithm that will ensure you're getting more
         | results and a more accurate result page.
        
           | inertiatic wrote:
           | You are making a recipe search app without actually paying
           | attention to the information retrieval part of it, which is
           | arguably the most important thing!
           | 
           | Using any sort of backend that tokenizes (and why not,
           | lowercases and stems) and does the searching for you is what
           | you want as a first step. ES, or any of the newer fast search
           | engines that aren't that concerned about relevance would be
           | good first steps, then depending on how much you could grow,
           | you're going to have quite tricky but enjoyable journey to
           | optimizing for relevance!
        
           | arthurcolle wrote:
           | just use elasticsearch
        
       | marginalia_nu wrote:
       | Looks pretty promising. There seems to be quite a lot of
       | frustration with finding recipes, so I think there is a market
       | for something like this.
       | 
       | If you are looking for ways to improve the relevance of the
       | search results, try to prioritize results that contain the exact
       | search terms in the title, then some of the terms in the title,
       | and then in the description, and then in the ingredients.
       | 
       | It's pretty tricky to get right, but I don't think you are that
       | far off.
       | 
       | I'd also get rid of the email fishing popovers, it's very off-
       | putting.
        
       | chrismatei wrote:
       | Just to add my 2 cents. This is great ideea and for sure I can
       | see the use of it. But the email part, that is not somehting I
       | would do for a recipe. Next, the you can add planner and you will
       | have any nutritionist on this site giving you the emails. and
       | they can fine tune the data you have. Ofc "suggest or improve
       | recipe" is a very good ideea :) best of luck.
        
       | what_is_orcas wrote:
       | No results for "falafel".
       | 
       | I really want this to work, I love the filter options that I see
       | (assuming they work) and I'd love to use something like this
       | instead of Google/Bing (where the top-recommendations are all ads
       | or super bloggy).
        
         | devanflores wrote:
         | Hey! That's the goal. I will admit the database is small
         | because I'm adding them manually but I'm working on finding a
         | way to scrape recipes automatically. In the meantime, the
         | tradeoff for the better user experience is less recipes
        
           | what_is_orcas wrote:
           | Is there a way to help out with that? I just take screenshots
           | of recipes on my phone because I hate the modern internet. If
           | I could enter in a url and you could scrape the recipe off of
           | that page, that'd be great (for others).
           | 
           | Out of curiosity, is this a hobby-project or something you're
           | going to try to make money off of?
        
             | devanflores wrote:
             | Yeah, thanks for the idea! I'm planning on allowing manual
             | submission of recipes. I ultimately want Munchy to become a
             | company. I have a lot of other innovations planned for the
             | consumer home kitchen space and would like to see it
             | through! Making this website a successful business is the
             | first step for me to achieve that goal If you ever want to
             | share feedback or contribute, my email is on my profile so
             | you are free to reach out.
        
           | dunham wrote:
           | A lot of web sites have a chunk of json-ld in a script tag,
           | which greatly eases recipe scraping. (I think they mostly do
           | this for google search.)
        
         | Riverheart wrote:
         | I've taken to searching food manufacturer and grocery store
         | websites for recipes. Since they're selling you the ingredients
         | there are no ads, although recipes are more limited in scope.
         | 
         | For instance https://mahatmarice.com/recipes/
         | 
         | If you want falafel I'd find a falafel brand's website.
        
           | i_am_proteus wrote:
           | King Arthur's recipe collection is a treasure trove:
           | https://www.kingarthurbaking.com/recipes
        
       | devanflores wrote:
       | Hi all, after hearing all the feedback, I decided to remove the
       | registration wall behind the website. Feel free to use the
       | website as desired. If anyone is interested in contributing their
       | feedback to the product and testing new features, please feel
       | free to register as I will be reaching out to newly registered
       | users
        
         | ignoramous wrote:
         | Fun fact, Shay Bannon created Compass (precursor to Elastic.co)
         | for a recipe search engine: https://archive.is/dlrIF
         | 
         | Big shoes to fill (:
        
       | lambic wrote:
       | I used to use a recipe site that had a really good search engine
       | but they got rid of it for unknown reasons. I hope this one stays
       | around.
       | 
       | One thing that old one had was the ability to exclude ingredients
       | as well as include which came in handy when I was cooking for
       | jewish friends.
        
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       (page generated 2021-10-15 23:00 UTC)