[HN Gopher] Maine voters reject Quebec hydropower transmission line
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       Maine voters reject Quebec hydropower transmission line
        
       Author : algo_trader
       Score  : 32 points
       Date   : 2021-11-03 20:54 UTC (2 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (www.reuters.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (www.reuters.com)
        
       | throwawaycuriou wrote:
       | Another interesting tidbit of Maine news is that a municipal
       | Portland election ended in a tie in the final round of ranked
       | choice voting. Around ~19,000 votes total.
       | 
       | By state law they'll resolve the tie by drawing lots at the city
       | hall building tomorrow morning:
       | https://www.pressherald.com/2021/11/03/tied-instant-runoff-f...
        
       | algo_trader wrote:
       | This is beyond depressing (I am not a US resident..)
       | 
       | The entire New England is going brown by closing nuclear
       | reactors, fighting wind and now this.
       | 
       | IIRC, out of $1BN, about $300M was compensation and pork for
       | local residents
        
         | paleotrope wrote:
         | I have family in Maine and have spent alot of time there
         | recently. The voters up there are schizophrenic. Very little
         | makes any sense. A high tax state, high cost of living that is
         | 1/2 retirees from southern new england, 1/2 dirt poor people.
         | They vote against anything that would improve their economic
         | conditions. It's like Alaska and Florida combined without oil
         | or sun.
        
           | TrisMcC wrote:
           | This is a warped view of Maine's demographics and pretty
           | insulting.
        
         | throwawaycuriou wrote:
         | Ironically, much of the funding for 'Yes' (which was in
         | opposition to the new power lines) was provided by a nuclear
         | reactor in New Hampshire that didn't want to compete against
         | the lower electricity rates this would bring.
        
           | snsr wrote:
           | I guess Quebec hasn't heard, they are now allowed to
           | advertise a position on US ballot initiatives.
           | 
           | https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/11/02/foreign-m.
           | ..
        
             | throwawaycuriou wrote:
             | I believe HydroQuebec put in more money than anyone for
             | this referendum.
        
         | TrisMcC wrote:
         | Mainers HATE Central Maine Power. Anything that hurts them is
         | seen as a positive. The lease they got on the land for
         | transmission lines was ruled illegal.
         | 
         | We have tried (and still are trying) to create a public utility
         | to replace CMP called Pine Tree Power. It was passed in the
         | legislature but vetoed by our governor this year.
         | 
         | There was also a story about the First Nations of Quebec not
         | having their voices heard regarding the transmission lines that
         | pass through their lands.
        
           | throwaway0a5e wrote:
           | Mainers hate Massholes too. They get two give two groups they
           | hate the bird with just one vote. Of course they voted the
           | way they did.
        
         | throwaway0a5e wrote:
         | The company that wanted to build the line (CMP) spend the last
         | 20yr burning any political capitol it had. They've screwed
         | people out of lots of money while delivering crap service. Now
         | they wanna build a line to line their pockets while mostly
         | befitting Massashusetts, a state full of people that everyone
         | in Maine not employed in tourism hates (and the tourism simply
         | tolerates).
         | 
         | You don't get to do business like that and expect voters not to
         | see the opportunity to screw you back. People aren't that
         | stupid.
        
       | favorited wrote:
       | "From what I've seen, it's not going to be that beneficial to
       | Maine," said one voter[0].
       | 
       | Oh, is your end of the boat not sinking? You're probably fine,
       | then.
       | 
       | Luckily the referendum is being challenged in the courts.
       | 
       | [0]https://www.bostonglobe.com/2021/11/03/science/maine-
       | voters-...
        
         | algo_trader wrote:
         | Its still a cold/rural zone. When a carbon tax/madate is
         | inevitably enforced, they are going to end up with escalating
         | bills for heating and transport.
        
           | paleotrope wrote:
           | They are going to end up burning their precious woodlands.
        
             | algo_trader wrote:
             | No doubt they will start by cuttings up trees along the
             | transmission corridor, just to spite everyone else /s
        
         | LatteLazy wrote:
         | The problem is, to make a difference you also need to get 7bn
         | other people to do something...
        
       | CircleSpokes wrote:
       | Protecting woodlands is important but cutting through woodlands
       | for transmission lines shouldn't be a big deal. Hydro is pretty
       | clean power so it seems silly not to bring more of that in. Plus
       | they have already cut most of it..
       | 
       | "More than three-quarters of the corridor has already been
       | cleared, with about 100 poles installed, Avangrid said last
       | week."
        
         | oblio wrote:
         | The thing is, how much are they really cutting for transmission
         | line poles? Their footprint is probably really small,
         | inconsequential, really. It's not like they're building a
         | highway :-)
        
           | throwawaycuriou wrote:
           | 75 feet wide over a 53 mile section of land already owned by
           | the local power company.
           | https://www.pressherald.com/2021/10/17/qa-on-
           | question-1-will...
        
             | loeg wrote:
             | 75 ft x 53 miles is a total of 0.74 square miles. The North
             | Maine Woods are 3.5 million acres, or ~5500 square miles.
             | 
             | The total area consumed by the corridor will be about
             | 0.014% of the woods.
        
           | Gracana wrote:
           | It pretty much is like building a highway. Transmission tower
           | lines are very big and wide. We (in Maine) also suffered the
           | results of a natural gas pipeline installation, with people's
           | yards taken by eminent domain laws to make way for the
           | construction.. I'm not surprised people voted against it this
           | time around.
        
             | oblio wrote:
             | I'm confused, how could they be like a highway?
             | 
             | Don't your power lines look like this?
             | 
             | https://energytransition.org/wp-
             | content/uploads/2018/04/Wind...
             | 
             | 1 pole of maybe... I don't know, 30m by 10m, every several
             | hundred meters? That's a tiny footprint.
             | 
             | Isn't the rest just electrical cables hanging 20m in the
             | air?
        
             | fhood wrote:
             | By size maybe. Way less disruptive than a highway though.
        
         | subpixel wrote:
         | Arguments were effectively made that it's not all hydro power -
         | it's a connection to the grid not a single source of energy.
         | 
         | But in the end this was doomed by the route. If it were
         | economically possible to go around the north woods it would
         | have had little opposition.
        
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       (page generated 2021-11-03 23:00 UTC)