[HN Gopher] How to Set Low Expectations at Your Two Remote Jobs
       ___________________________________________________________________
        
       How to Set Low Expectations at Your Two Remote Jobs
        
       Author : oriettaxx
       Score  : 65 points
       Date   : 2021-12-23 21:44 UTC (1 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (overemployed.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (overemployed.com)
        
       | revskill wrote:
       | There's a time i worked like 4 jobs at the same time. Such a
       | nightmare and my advice is, just keep at most 2 jobs only.
       | 
       | The key to success to me, is to kill procastination as fast as
       | possible, seeking for help as soon as possible. Relax well, eat
       | well. The job is getting the job done, not broken.
        
       | lanevorockz wrote:
       | Americans are finally catching up to Third World standards. It's
       | pretty common to work two jobs and juggle between them, it's just
       | that you used to be able to have a decent life with one revenue
       | stream. It seems that after covid this will no longer be the
       | case. ;)
        
       | dreyfan wrote:
       | Only two? [1]
       | 
       | [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27454589
        
       | vnchr wrote:
       | As a remote manager, I find this list of red flags helpful for
       | future reference.
        
       | mise_en_place wrote:
       | Just be careful what you wish for. One coworker of mine at a
       | previous company did this and burned out really quick. He had a
       | family (16 year old son and 9 year old daughter) and could never
       | use vacation to spend time with them. He would use vacation time
       | at one company to catch up on work from the other. He offered me
       | once to join a team to have two remote jobs but I declined. But I
       | did admire his tenacity and sacrifice for his children.
        
       | herpderperator wrote:
       | My expectations were pretty low. The website delivered:
       | https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaiipqmos484ojs/low_expectations.p...
        
       | synergy20 wrote:
       | The page is inaccessible now, resource limit reached.
       | 
       | for any given hi-tech job these days, the employee agreement
       | always states this is your sole job per contract and all your
       | inventions belong to your employer too(not just the 40 hours per
       | week), especially for full-time w-2 jobs. How could you have two
       | in parallel? are we violating the hiring contract here?
       | 
       | Assuming two jobs have no conflict of interests of course,
       | otherwise it's illegal in most cases and nobody wants to do
       | that(other than it's too unethical)
        
       | novok wrote:
       | A pattern I've noticed with double job workers:
       | 
       | 1. They tend to work double jobs at frankly lower tier companies
       | with lower standards and significantly lower pay. Because the
       | companies are lower tier, they stagnate in their career growth
       | because the company is not teaching them good skills. And you
       | cannot put both jobs in your resume, only one on top of that, and
       | this will show up in future background checks.
       | 
       | 2. Because of double working, they are pretty much guaranteed to
       | not get promoted beyond the standard terminal level.
       | 
       | 3. They think that promos (like this article), are at most only
       | %10, while promos are more like a x1.5 to x2 of your income.
       | 
       | 4. You cannot work at proper startups and learn a ton, because
       | the workload would be way too high for this strategy.
       | 
       | Real example: One person I know has 2 $150k jobs for a total of
       | $300k. If they joined as a jr engineer at a FANGMULA or
       | equivalent, they would be making $300k, not be fucking stressed
       | about the duplicity that is working 2 jobs, learn more because
       | it's a better company and get promoed to sr engineer within a
       | year or two and make $400-500k instead. If they have ambition,
       | they can cross the leadership rubicon (either through becoming a
       | staff engineer or manager) and make even more, reaching up to
       | $700k-$1M eventually.
       | 
       | Maybe if your having a hard time breaking into startups or
       | FANGMULA and your just starting out, this might be an ok
       | strategy, but beyond that, it's not a good idea.
        
         | odonnellryan wrote:
         | For a short time I was "working two jobs" as part of a
         | transition (everyone was aware) and I found it almost
         | impossible to even manage one or two meetings a week at each
         | job - conflicts were crazy.
         | 
         | What are you supposed to do when you have a conflict, if you're
         | keeping things secret? "that time doesn't work for me" "uh,
         | why? I just hired you. You have another meeting?"
        
         | redisman wrote:
         | This is kind of an absurd counter. Not everyone can just choose
         | to become a high level engineer at the handful of the most
         | selective companies in the world.
        
         | endisneigh wrote:
         | > Real example: One person I know has 2 $150k jobs for a total
         | of $300k. If they joined as a jr engineer at a FANGMULA or
         | equivalent, they would be making $300k, not be fucking stressed
         | about the duplicity that is working 2 jobs, learn more because
         | it's a better company and get promoed to sr engineer within a
         | year or two and make $400-500k instead. If they have ambition,
         | they can cross the leadership rubicon (either through becoming
         | a staff engineer or manager) and make even more, reaching up to
         | $700k-$1M eventually.
         | 
         | Sometimes I wonder if the people saying this stuff really even
         | work there. It's not impossible, but the kind of person who
         | would be promoted that fast wouldn't be working two crappy jobs
         | to begin with.
         | 
         | Not to mention even if you were promoted you wouldn't go from
         | $300K to $500K. You think getting promoted at FAANG gives you
         | an over 50% increase in total comp?
         | 
         | You should join one if you're not already there and read about
         | how people are complaining about less than 6.7% (last inflation
         | report) raises during company meetings and less than 10% even
         | when promoted.
         | 
         | lol
        
         | Aeolun wrote:
         | > They think that promos (like this article), are at most only
         | %10, while promos are more like a x1.5 to x2 of your income.
         | 
         | This is not true in most of the world I believe.
        
         | GnomeSaiyan wrote:
         | Nobody is making $300k as a junior engineer. And certainly not
         | getting promoted to senior engineer within a year on top of
         | that. Stop talking out of your ass.
        
         | olingern wrote:
         | > and this will show up in future background checks.
         | 
         | I'm not interested in working two jobs, but can you provide
         | some sort of reference around this?
         | 
         | My last two background checks included no employment info and I
         | was fairly certain private sector jobs have no reporting
         | outside the IRS, hence ridiculous interviews.
        
       | picodguyo wrote:
       | AKA How to end up with zero remote jobs.
       | 
       | Seriously, don't do this. Just because you can exploit a system
       | doesn't mean you should.
        
       | HPsquared wrote:
       | It's ironic that a site about working two simultaneous jobs has a
       | "resource limit exceeded" error.
        
       | [deleted]
        
       | meirelles wrote:
       | OMG, again? Are we going to see this every week now? This guy has
       | two jobs already and still has time to brag about and promote his
       | blog. Please don't ruin the remote work for us.
        
       | throwaway5371 wrote:
        
       | jiveturkey wrote:
       | disagree with the overcommunication. overcommunication means your
       | boss has too much sense of where you are or where you are
       | claiming to be. and more work will be tossed over to you. always
       | accept new work and just drop 50% of it without further reporting
       | on it.
       | 
       | otherwise, yeah I always set low expectations. On day 1, I show
       | up late to orientation. always. It's worked great for me over a
       | long career. (single jobs, not dual, although in school I always
       | maintained 3-4 concurrent part time gigs)
       | 
       | website worked for me but the menu part didn't load correctly. it
       | looks quite poor. too bad it's not intentional.
       | 
       | there's only 1 time of year when you perform. the 2 months before
       | perf eval.
        
       | xwdv wrote:
       | This is a litmus test. If your mentality is that you are paid for
       | your time, not for your value, then I guess you will always carry
       | guilt about working multiple jobs.
       | 
       | If however you feel zero guilt, it is because you have
       | internalized your true self worth. It shows you understand the
       | value you bring to a company and the value of a company having a
       | fully onboarded developer hot and ready to go whenever a crisis
       | happens. You are not merely an ass sitting in a chair.
       | 
       | Once you learn that your value as a developer has no relation to
       | time and space, you can truly ascend to the next level of social
       | class.
        
       | bellyfullofbac wrote:
       | Haha, the error message is a bit ironic when talking about
       | working 2 full time jobs:
       | 
       | Resource Limit Is Reached - The website is temporarily unable to
       | service your request as it exceeded resource limit. Please try
       | again later.
        
         | zekenie wrote:
         | Hilarious
        
       | bearbin wrote:
       | Archive:
       | https://web.archive.org/web/20211117171239/https://overemplo...
        
         | kuyan wrote:
         | Redirect loop for me but I can load the page if I disable
         | Javascript.
         | 
         | Here's a copy of the text (keywords: mirror, archive):
         | 
         | > How To Set Low Expectations At Your Two Remote Jobs > On
         | April 12, 2021 By Chloe T. In Corporate Life, Multiple Remote
         | Work, Tactics
         | 
         | > One of the keys to success while working two remote jobs is
         | communications and setting low expectations with your boss. You
         | want to give the perception of meeting standards while striving
         | to overachieve in your primary "keeper" job. You want to set
         | yourself up for success, and by success, we mean keeping the
         | two remote jobs for as long as possible. Naturally, with
         | working two jobs, one job will be more demanding than the
         | other. The strategy is to set the workload low in at least one
         | of the two jobs so you can navigate spikes in workload.
         | Remember, the end goal here is to have dual income streams and
         | reach financial freedom sooner.
         | 
         | > Why Is Perception And Setting Low Expectations Important For
         | Remote Work
         | 
         | > We've heard it before, perception is everything. This HBR
         | article illustrates a great example of how perception matters
         | at the end of the day, not the real story. The fact is if
         | you're perceived as a hard worker, it doesn't matter what you
         | do behind the scenes. In the two job game, you want to be
         | perceived as someone who meets expectations. While in reality,
         | your aim is to do the minimum and get by; don't get fired while
         | secretly hoping to get laid off. A strategy to achieve a
         | positive perception (and outcome) is accomplished by setting
         | low expectations with your manager.
         | 
         | > Why Setting High Expectations With Your Boss Is A Waste Of
         | Time
         | 
         | > Let's first start by going over what everyone tells you to do
         | - set high expectations, get promoted. Yes, this leads to more
         | money. That's great. But let's look at the ROI because all
         | great employees and MBA's should care about the ROI on behalf
         | of the company.
         | 
         | > But what about your Personal ROI's? Indeed's research
         | concluded that the average employee raise is 3%. It may be a
         | bit higher in tech, so let's say 5 - 10%.
         | 
         | > You might need to put in 30% more hours, more stress, more
         | work to get a minimal increase in your salary. To me, setting
         | those high expectations to get a promotion is a waste of time.
         | You can get a second job and easily give yourself an 80%
         | "raise" for your work. Also, I'm a good employee by being
         | mindful of ROI's, my own.
         | 
         | > What I've Learned About Setting Low Expectations From Years
         | of Working
         | 
         | > What I've learned is expectations need to be set from day 1.
         | I once worked with a new senior manager who always left at five
         | o'clock since his very first day. New hires usually stay late
         | to ramp up quickly. Not this guy. He set the expectation that
         | he would leave the office by five and stuck by it every day. It
         | was genius. A year into the job, he's still shutting down at
         | five while the rest of us kept working.
         | 
         | > For managers, it's typically hard to have that conversation,
         | "can you put in more hours?" If your manager adds new tasks,
         | just be clear you cannot complete them in the timeframe given.
         | If you're labeled as the "guy who leaves at five," people won't
         | give you more work knowing you can't get to it. More work is
         | assigned to you once you do a great job, and it is an endless
         | circle. This story is just one example, but the lesson is to
         | set expectations early and set them low. That way, the only
         | place to go is up.
         | 
         | > Once you set high expectations, you're always going to fail
         | if you don't meet them. Like the concept behind the HBR
         | perception article, you can have done great work but once you
         | fail to meet the expectations that's what people remember. How
         | many times you think you did a great job, but when you have
         | your review, your boss mentions all the "failures" and missed
         | expectations. Sound familiar?
         | 
         | > How To Set Low Expectations At Work With Your Manager
         | 
         | > Let's get into how you can set low expectations while working
         | your two remote jobs. As we mentioned, set these expectations
         | early.
         | 
         | > Be The One To Drive The Conversation
         | 
         | > Don't ask what your boss's expectations are; set them
         | yourself. Instead of going into the conversation by asking what
         | their expectations are, set and communicate them to your
         | manager. By asking what their expectations are, you are putting
         | yourself in a corner. In developing your own low expectations
         | and communicating them, you are placing the burden on your boss
         | to have that difficult conversation with you to say otherwise.
         | Psychologically, it's harder to say no, than to say yes. Let
         | your boss be the one to say no to you. As a new employee,
         | you're most likely to slide by for the first review cycle with
         | this method.
         | 
         | > Communicate Often And Early
         | 
         | > Being a great communicator can be a great asset. Think about
         | those who do great work and are not great communicators. What
         | about those who do mediocre work but can communicate. Who do
         | you think will be looked upon more favorably? Set your
         | expectations and make them visible to everyone to know what to
         | expect. Take this as an opportunity to improve your
         | communication skills. With practice comes mastery.
         | 
         | ...
         | 
         | > As you can see from this example, the employee
         | overcommunicating comes across as more trustworthy and in
         | control. That's the perception you want to convey. Even though
         | something is not on track, or you haven't started at all, just
         | the fact you are communicating the details along the way,
         | people are more comfortable. Also by communicating frequently,
         | you can soften the blow of the miss.
         | 
         | > Explain The Reasons Behind Your Low Expectations
         | 
         | > While setting expectations is excellent, if you can back up
         | your thought process to come to those expectations, you have a
         | better case. Always come to the table with your examples of how
         | you thought through your goal-setting process. For example, if
         | you are new to a particular field, you can put the small
         | milestones to achieve "xyz" goal. With each milestone, you can
         | explain how difficult it was to reach that milestone and drag
         | out the timeline to the next set of milestones to achieve "xyz"
         | mastery.
         | 
         | > Good communicators always over-communicate. They are
         | perceived to be in control, even what's said is the same
         | message just repeated many times. If you have project updates,
         | and the updates are the same for weeks, you're still being
         | perceived as a good project manager since you are visible and
         | proactive in communicating. Again it's about perception. Like
         | the deft hands of magicians, mastering resetting expectation is
         | just as important as setting low expectations at the beginning.
         | Leverage Your Newbie Card In Setting Low Expectations
         | 
         | > Being new has its advantages. No one knows you, so you start
         | off with a clean slate. You can take advantage by setting low
         | expectations with your manager for your first review cycle.
         | There are many barriers to mastering your remote jobs, such as
         | ramp-up time, company culture, new systems, and different
         | procedures. Let these barriers shine in setting your low
         | expectations - and all the more reasons to have unambitious
         | goals.
         | 
         | > Leverage The Review Cycle
         | 
         | > Understand when the review cycle starts and ends. Set and
         | time your goals to the review cycle. Usually, people set goals
         | for the year, but keep in mind you're evaluated on review
         | cycles. There's no use in setting goals for eight months when
         | the review is only four months away.
         | 
         | > Be A Follower Not A Leader
         | 
         | > Realize that not everyone needs to be a leader in every job.
         | Everyone is different and it takes employees of all types to
         | make the company hum. There's nothing wrong with being a
         | follower and doing what's expected. Remember, there are no
         | leaders if there are no followers. Avoid the slippery ladder in
         | your career. Take the side door instead.
         | 
         | > Setting Low Expectations And The Two-Job Game Plan
         | 
         | > The game plan for two remote jobs is to set the expectations
         | low with your manager and prolong your hustle until your exit
         | to another job or you're laid off with a severance. For the
         | second non-primary job, you're there for one reason only, to
         | collect a paycheck. A paycheck that is 500%+ more than a raise.
         | The goal is to keep the paycheck going for as long as you can
         | with minimal effort.
         | 
         | > 30 days - The first 30 days are easy due to ramp up but are
         | critical to set low expectations. Set yourself up for success
         | in working two jobs. Be that guy or girl who always logs off at
         | five o'clock (even better at four), and let people know. Once
         | you start extending yourself, answering emails and messages
         | after hours, your co-workers will see that as the norm and more
         | work will creep up on you. If you're never available after a
         | certain time, your colleagues won't message you because they
         | know you won't respond.
         | 
         | > 60 days - In the 30-60 day window, you should set goals with
         | your boss if that's not already done. Drag out the newbie card
         | and claim slow ramp-up time. Identify what absolutely needs to
         | be done, communicate that as your goal, and meet them. Again,
         | it's all about the perception that you meet expectations, not
         | the work you've actually done. You can do little work but as
         | long as you met the communicated expectations you're golden.
         | 
         | > What If You Don't Feel Right Low Balling Expectations At Work
         | - Put The Ego Aside
         | 
         | > We're primed at a very young age to be the best we can be. We
         | look up to leaders in society. If your ultimate end goal is
         | financial freedom, you have to strategize and optimize for that
         | and put your ego aside. You're aiming to be a leader in your
         | personal life and the truly ambitious one land two jobs. Who
         | cares if you're not a leader in the public eye of a workplace.
         | You can channel the guilt, if any, towards donating the extra
         | money to a good cause, like the YMCAs. Go do something you care
         | about. Work is just means to an end. Join us in the
         | counterculture towards work.
        
         | bdidicn wrote:
         | This is an endless redirect loop for me on mobile
        
         | pph wrote:
         | Unfortunately that site seems to keep reloading forever (/e/
         | Browser which is a Chromium/Bromite fork). I haven't been able
         | to check the original site though, so the issue might be
         | present there as well.
        
           | bearbin wrote:
           | Ah, uMatrix saved me from that... Reader mode seems to work
           | well on Firefox to stop the redirection as well.
        
       | codelord wrote:
       | Encouraging people to take two full-time jobs by lying and
       | cheating their way around is such a terrible advice even if you
       | only look at purely based on self-interests with no moral
       | considerations.
       | 
       | Negotiate well when starting a new job (If you haven't find a new
       | job and negotiate well). Do great work. Use the extra time to
       | invest on yourself: read, exercise, learn new skills, etc. You'll
       | be happier and more successful in the long run.
        
       | bonestamp2 wrote:
       | It says a lot about our work culture when leaving at 5pm is
       | considered setting your boss's expectations "low".
        
       | omosubi wrote:
       | I love that we are collectively acknowledging that we're all lazy
       | as hell. First that askHN about lying about working and now the
       | HN hug of death for this article
        
         | Sebguer wrote:
         | In case anyone was curious about the AskHN re: lying about
         | work, and missed it like I had:
         | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29581125
        
       | starklevnertz wrote:
       | If you're a developer, your employer is using git checkins as the
       | primary measure of whether you are working.
       | 
       | You'll need a script to automate credible git activity.
        
       | xupybd wrote:
       | Or believe in the work you do and get satisfaction from working
       | hard and delivering above and beyond.
       | 
       | I've burnt out before and lost motivation. It's horrible. I'd
       | much rather buy into the company vision as much as possible.
       | 
       | I'd hate to have two jobs that are purely about time in equals
       | money out.
       | 
       | I want one job where leadership inspires me to work hard and get
       | more done than I would have without them.
        
         | rokob wrote:
         | I really agree with what you are saying, but counterintuitively
         | buying "into the company vision as much as possible" seems to
         | result in the most burnout for me when reality eventually hits.
         | 
         | I've been trying to figure out how to temper my natural
         | tendency to go all-in with the reality that everything has some
         | shit that sucks. I can understand the hope that there might be
         | some psychological ease associated with dissociating yourself
         | from the vision.
        
           | redisman wrote:
           | I can only control small parts of the tech side of a company.
           | It's silly to worry about things outside of your control so I
           | definitely don't "buy into the company vision". I just
           | deliver good software and hope everyone else knows what
           | they're doing so I don't need to find a new job.
        
         | xwdv wrote:
         | So basically you want to be worked hard like a horse and feel
         | satisfied at the end of the day when you lay your head down to
         | rest that you have made a difference, don't even care much
         | about the money because the work is it's own reward.
        
       | brosky117 wrote:
       | This is how you ruin remote work for everyone. Remote work is
       | about trust.
        
         | VRay wrote:
         | Not to mention that working two jobs poorly is a lot more work
         | and a lot less money than boostrapping a decent SaaS
        
           | newnamenewface wrote:
           | I actually agree with you over the other comments. I think
           | the idea of industriously trying to be the worst worker you
           | possibly can (while not being fired) is one of those self-
           | defeating efforts to do less work where you actually do more
           | work in a lot of ways. You've got to justify to yourself
           | continually that you're not being a drain or a bad person.
           | You've got to juggle context switching between two roles
           | during an overlapping period, making both more difficult than
           | they would be individually and leaving yourself worse able to
           | focus generally. (I suppose you could probably block your
           | schedule to make this work better but I can't see a silver
           | bullet solution for all the time.) You've got to
           | compartmentalize your jobs and your interaction with
           | coworkers. I know that with my personality, these factors
           | would be major drags on my mental and emotional well-being. I
           | would feel like a fraud for a long time before getting used
           | to something like this.
           | 
           | With a business, while you deal with some similar issues
           | (compartmentalization, context-switching), I expect they'd
           | feel far less invalidating (again, to me/those with similar
           | personality types) because you'd know you were actually
           | applying yourself to do the best you could.
        
           | hwers wrote:
           | Successfully boostrapping a decent SaaS sounds way more
           | challenging in my eyes, got any tips on resources to read to
           | make that be as obvious a task as it seems to be in your
           | eyes?
        
             | andrewxdiamond wrote:
             | There's a ton of content out there, but the best advice
             | I've seen is simple.
             | 
             | 1. Find a (ideally large) group of people you care about
             | 
             | 2. Find a problem they have
             | 
             | 3. Solve it
        
           | granshaw wrote:
           | Oh wow if only any old dev could bootstrap a $400k SaaS - way
           | easier said than done
        
         | twa999 wrote:
         | it's about getting paid.
        
           | literallyWTF wrote:
           | No man don't you understand? It's better to not be paid and
           | dedicated your life to the ethos posted on the 'About' page
           | of the company than it is to play the system.
        
         | zer0354 wrote:
         | Remote work won't be ruined by this. In fact, it's perfect.
         | 
         | The premise is that the average person puts in 10x the effort
         | for a 1% return on investment. You are an employee, sure, but
         | are "investing" the company in terms of life-hours you could
         | spend elsewhere. Naturally, you want to therefore minimize work
         | and maximize salary. The ultimate situation being getting
         | regular raises by doing 20-50% less than is expected to you.
         | 
         | If employers don't want this the solution is simple. It's not
         | finding these people and firing them. It's paying people
         | commensurate to their effort like a real meritocracy would.
         | 
         | If someone can hold 2 jobs working at 50% brain capacity then
         | they are obviously very talented and quite crafty. You pay this
         | person enough, they will dedicate 100% of their brain to your
         | project. The employer side of the equation is JUST as
         | exploitative as the employee side. It's just far, far, far more
         | common for the employee to be exploited. For example, via
         | pagerduty, poor hiring practices leading to overwork, or
         | overtasking.
         | 
         | This is wonderful. Anyone who is truly a libertarian should be
         | encouraging this. It's the perfect free market solution to
         | exploitative labor. You dont get paid past 40 hours for your
         | salary. Why should you reduce YOUR OWN worth to make a
         | company's bottom line bigger? Unless you hold ITM options in
         | the company the answer is you don't and shouldn't. You should
         | be exploiting them at every turn.
        
           | [deleted]
        
           | throwaway75787 wrote:
           | Isn't this keeping jobs from those of us who are limited to
           | normal brain capacity, but need to make the rent?
        
             | zer0354 wrote:
             | Contractors don't really take away jobs from people and I
             | see this as no different. The people capable of this are
             | relatively small in number even in an industry full of
             | talented people.
        
             | planetsprite wrote:
             | Sorry but the silicon valley ethos is that only geniuses
             | matter. Everyone else, the 99% non-savants, aren't relevant
             | and can be discarded when needed.
        
             | oriolid wrote:
             | No, it's creating jobs for the unlucky ones who have to
             | clean up the mess the one 200% employee made.
        
             | imgabe wrote:
             | There's not a limited number of jobs. Anybody who is
             | capable of providing a positive ROI on their salary is
             | worth hiring.
        
               | throwaway75787 wrote:
               | I wish I could just be a corporate cog for a few days a
               | week and then do my own thing. Unfortunately, at least
               | judging from the interviews I've had the last few months,
               | HR/hiring is still looking at things from a full-time
               | headcount perspective. Somebody complained about having
               | to do paperwork for each employee, which I can't wrap my
               | head around because it's their job to do employee
               | paperwork. But it seems to still be about extracting 40
               | hours and then overtime from any vaguely professional
               | position. One manager told me that they are limited in
               | headcount for their department.
        
       | raincom wrote:
       | Good advice even for one job--whether remote or in-person. Why
       | put in 30% more effort, when you are not getting paid 30% more.
       | That's why stick to the average pace of your team.
        
         | ithkuil wrote:
         | May ai suggest a different spin? Try to put 30% more effort,
         | but into learning stuff for your own sake. This will make you a
         | better engineer. As a side effect you may be more worth to the
         | company you work for and/of get a better job somewhere else
         | later.
        
           | raincom wrote:
           | That is possible for some people, also depends on the culture
           | of the team one is part of. An average guy needs good
           | mentors, good team mates who can teach, etc. Such teams are
           | very hard to find. So, in that case, one has to be driven to
           | learn on his own without any aid.
        
         | jacobr1 wrote:
         | The classic advice is for career advancement. For promotions
         | and raises and for internal political capital to promote the
         | projects you want, or the implementation you think best. Sure,
         | if you just want to a be a cog in the machine, without broader
         | responsibility (and the historically much higher compensation
         | for that) then don't do more than the is necessary to ensure
         | you remain employed.
         | 
         | But it probably is more lucrative to achieve some success, and
         | then leverage that to the next thing (which might need to be a
         | different company).
        
       | Sosh101 wrote:
       | I hate it.
        
       | narag wrote:
       | I expected this to be a version of the underpromise overdeliver
       | thing, but it seems more like oversleep under a rock.
       | 
       | It was sad to see the epic 10x programmer die, now it's the time
       | for the hillarious 0.1x pretender.
        
       | civilized wrote:
       | > Resource limit exceeded
       | 
       | Ironic, isn't it?
        
       | screye wrote:
       | I genuinely don't get the point of 2 remote jobs. The tech wage
       | scaling is absolutely bonkers right now and the value proposition
       | of this system is not clear to me.
       | 
       | Assuming you only work 20 of your 40 hrs/week in each job, you
       | are still working a fulltime job with 2x your salary. If someone
       | is competent enough to sustain 2 jobs, they will also get quickly
       | promoted to 2x their salary if they are working one job.
       | 
       | Now work a couple of years in this job, and soon you'll be able
       | to complete its responsibilities in 20ish hrs/week. Every job
       | gets easier overtime in that sense.
        
         | Roritharr wrote:
         | I don't know what world you live in, but I have yet to see a
         | company which let's anyone reach 2x of their starting salary in
         | less than a decade.
         | 
         | Might be because I'm european, but the idea sounds crazy to me.
        
           | bspammer wrote:
           | I'm sure it's harder to get when you're more senior, but I
           | started working as a graduate in London for PS30k 3 years ago
           | and am now on PS60k. I think this is pretty typical in
           | London.
        
           | tibbetts wrote:
           | Depends when in your career, and what the company is doing. I
           | went from my first starting salary of $72k at age 23 (in
           | 2003) as engineer #2 to $150k as chief architect about 5
           | years later. After another 5 years we sold the company, and I
           | was making better than $300k salary plus bonus in 2013. So
           | that's two doublings in 10 years. But it's also probably the
           | exception that proves the rule.
        
           | who_me_qmark wrote:
           | I've more than doubled my salary every 4 years in Silicon
           | Valley. I'm 11 years in and 16x my starting salary my first
           | year out of college. Yes this includes equity comp, but this
           | is not dominated by appreciation. My current employer stock
           | performance hasn't been great or even mediocre. But my career
           | growth has ensured that doesn't matter.
        
         | rokob wrote:
         | You don't get 2x your salary quickly via promotion for doing
         | the same job unless you are starting at the very bottom.
        
         | nicolashahn wrote:
         | > If someone is competent enough to sustain 2 jobs, they will
         | also get quickly promoted to 2x their salary if they are
         | working one job
         | 
         | Haha, at what company? I've met few people who've been able to
         | work at a company long enough (and for the company to be
         | successful enough) to double their salary. Apparently, it's
         | much faster to just get two lower paying, easy jobs.
        
         | raincom wrote:
         | "If someone is competent enough to sustain 2 jobs, they will
         | also get quickly promoted to 2x their salary if they are
         | working one job."
         | 
         | Between the two extremes (mediocre and rockstar/10x), there are
         | many 'competent' people who can't get promoted to their 2x
         | salary jobs. And these people are competent in a particular
         | niche, not like those who aced programming olympiads, compiler
         | gurus, kernel hackers, etc.
        
         | dqpb wrote:
         | > If someone is competent enough to sustain 2 jobs, they will
         | also get quickly promoted to 2x their salary if they are
         | working one job.
         | 
         | Nope
        
         | endisneigh wrote:
         | I know for a fact that at Meta (Facebook), even if you
         | literally are a genius and were promoted twice in 2 years you
         | wouldn't be doubling your total comp.
        
         | fffobar wrote:
         | > they will also get quickly promoted to 2x their salary
         | 
         | That's only the case if they were underpaid to begin with. It
         | will plateau very quickly.
        
         | MattGaiser wrote:
         | Where are these mythical promos with 2x salary? I have never
         | met someone who got one. Heck, where are the companies that
         | even keep up with market rate for devs? Every company has short
         | tenures now.
        
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