[HN Gopher] Zendesk pretends to be open source? ___________________________________________________________________ Zendesk pretends to be open source? Author : tailspin2019 Score : 111 points Date : 2022-01-14 22:00 UTC (1 hours ago) (HTM) web link (www.zendesk.co.uk) (TXT) w3m dump (www.zendesk.co.uk) | firloop wrote: | > Zendesk is an open API ticket system which means third-party | developers can build new integrations on our platform | | Clever segue from "open source", to open. | gregd wrote: | Um providing an API endpoint to a closed, proprietary system, | does not make one open source. | franciscop wrote: | Yes, they are pretending to be open source for SEO purposes and | that is not okay. They do get the definition of OSS right: | | > "Open source support ticket systems are unique in that anyone | is free to inspect, modify, and enhance the underlying code | that's used to build the ticketing system." | | But then somehow they include Zendesk in the "Top 10 open source | helpdesk ticketing systems". Can I see the code used to build | Zendesk? Obviously not. Now suddenly the definition of Zendesk is | this, which is different from the Open Source definition they | themselves quoted: | | > Zendesk is an open API ticket system which means third-party | developers can build new integrations on our platform. Unlike | other open source ticketing systems, Zendesk software offers all | the advantages of open source ticketing without your team having | to build a system from scratch. Zendesk's open API ticketing | system software gives your team all the tools they need to build | as much--or as little--as they want. | | Open API !== Open Source ticket system | | PS, archived: | | https://web.archive.org/save/https://www.zendesk.co.uk/help-... | tailspin2019 wrote: | From this page: | | > Top 10 open source helpdesk ticketing systems | | > 1. Zendesk | | > 2. etc | | Followed by: | | > Zendesk is an open API ticket system which means third-party | developers can build new integrations on our platform. Unlike | other open source ticketing systems, Zendesk software offers all | the advantages of open source ticketing without your team having | to build a system from scratch. | | And at the top: | | > Best Open Source Ticketing System | | > Open source help desk for a smarter, more agile customer | service operation. | | > Start free trial | | EDIT: Here's some _actual_ open source help desk software. Anyone | got any further recommendations? | | https://github.com/awesome-selfhosted/awesome-selfhosted#tic... | capableweb wrote: | Zendesk seems to have their own definition of what "open source" | means, contrary to everyone else: | | > An open source ticketing system is software that service teams | use to document customer issues. The system helps these teams | correctly route, resolve, and track all their customers' problems | and requests. | | But then go on to state: | | > Open source support ticket systems are unique in that anyone is | free to inspect, modify, and enhance the underlying code that's | used to build the ticketing system. [including a link to | https://opensource.com/resources/what-open-source] | | I'm interested to see where I can "inspect, modify, and enhance | the underlying code" for Zendesk? I've used it sometimes in the | past, but never seen any of the underlying code for it. | | Edit: seems to contradict themselves a couple of more times in | the article too. Here is another passage under "Cons of an open | source help desk ticketing system": | | > With a help desk like Zendesk's, all it takes is a plan upgrade | to access a whole bevy of new features. But with fully open | source systems, modifying the code can take multiple days--or | weeks if your developers are busy. | | Seems they are saying here that Zendesk is not a "fully open | source system", judging by that? | | More: | | > [...] if you have a strong development team ready to go, an | open source ticket system could be for you. | | > On the other hand, if you have a lean team, or if you want a | full feature set that's ready to go, Zendesk is your best option. | mataug wrote: | I'm sure its "open source" to employees at Zendesk | ericlamb89 wrote: | My team uses zendesk and they don't hate it, but this is enough | to make me consider the other options on their "top 10" list. | xerxes901 wrote: | Heh, yeah this doesn't look like it makes a lot of sense... I'll | go shake a few trees internally and point this out. | monodot wrote: | They're not the only company to do this. "InVideo" (a totally not | open source SaaS product) also does the same. | merrvk wrote: | When the marketing team has a bit too much free-reign | MangoCoffee wrote: | the decision makers probably doesn't even know what open source | really mean. | | they read it on cio magazine and ZenDesk have "open source" | api. | howdydoo wrote: | When a company lies in their advertising, typically you can take | them to court and get relief. | | If a car dealer advertises "free floormat with purchase", and | they don't give you a floormat, you sue them. If it makes it all | the way to the courtroom, it's an open-and-shut case. | | Based on this advertising, I bet someone with the right lawyer | could compel ZenDesk to release their source. In fact I hope this | happens, then maybe companies will think twice before making | false claims like this | chrisseaton wrote: | > Based on this advertising, I bet someone with the right | lawyer could compel ZenDesk to release their source. | | That's not even remotely how the law works. | hda2 wrote: | It should be, and I'd argue how it used to be. | howdydoo wrote: | A random outsider couldn't do it obviously. But imagine if | you had standing to sue, i.e. you signed up and paid for | ZenDesk based on this advertising, and then later realized | they were lying. | kube-system wrote: | In that case, the plaintiff would sue for the damage caused | by the lie, which would include the amount paid for the | software. | | The only case in which you might get the source code as a | result is if you _paid_ for the source code. Which is the | complete opposite claim of what is being made on this page. | howdydoo wrote: | Yeah, you're probably right. But a guy can dream, can't | he? | | https://archive.is/0Oihx | chrisseaton wrote: | Talk me through how that gets to a court order to release | source code. What legislation or precedents are there for | that? If there aren't any, how would a judge arrive at that | decision? | t0mas88 wrote: | Not at all. You can make them stop saying they're open source | and you can get a refund + maybe some damages if you claim to | have bought their product based on this false ad, but that's | all. In no way are you ever going to convince a judge to order | Zendesk to give you their code. | mrits wrote: | Reminds me how Comodo said they open sourced their EDR but in | reality it is just some code thrown around commercial libraries | and github comments about no one able to get it to compile. | Moto7451 wrote: | Based on the URL structure and the content I will venture a guess | that this is SEO keyword driven content. They likely have a list | of top keywords they're looking to rank well on and this is one | such keyword. | tailspin2019 wrote: | Yep. But IMHO the content of the page seems pretty deliberately | written to be misleading. | | I spent a good 10 minutes trying to understand what I was | reading here. | manquer wrote: | I think SEO content is just code word is for misleading | deliberately, it is either misleading the search engines or | the users or both. | riantogo wrote: | Somewhat related, last time when I posted about my forums | platform[1] that I'm trying to get off the ground, someone here | asked if it is open source so they can contribute. Now, I would | love for it to be open source and have the community enhance the | features (or even clone it for themselves), but I don't know how | to set up an open source project. I'm guessing it is more than | just zipping up the source files and making it available for | download. Any pointers on how best to go about doing it? Any best | practices? | | [1] https://discoflip.com | lkschubert8 wrote: | Do you use any version control management system like git, svn, | or fossil? If not, your first step would likely setting up your | project with one of them (most likely git) and then just | pushing it to a service like github. | E39M5S62 wrote: | Put your software in a VCS of some kind. Add an appropriate | license from https://spdx.org/licenses/ . Make the source | available on the internet. | | Most people do this all via GitHub, GitLab, etc. | songzme wrote: | you could start by creating a repository on github and gitlab, | they have resources to help you track your source code with git | and push your code to your repository. Then now you code is | available for everyone to see. | | Next, you want to create a readme file so someone new to your | project could read it and understand how the code works. You | can also start creating issues of features / bugs you plan to | do. | rplnt wrote: | Is this post another SEO attempt to make them rank higher in OSS | ticketing systems? | jasonhansel wrote: | This is the sort of article you expect to find on a "best | reviews" website full of Amazon affiliate links. | | edit: As intended, when you Google "best open source helpdesk | 2021," Google now just shows the following excerpt: | | > Top 10 open source helpdesk ticketing systems | | > * Zendesk. | | > * FreeScout. | | > * osTicket. | | > [...] | ocdtrekkie wrote: | And _this_ after the edit is the main purpose here. Tricking | Knowledge Graph into regurgitating bad info, and then claiming | that their site never states Zendesk is open source, and Google | just misunderstood. | jasonhansel wrote: | Time to write an article "Top 5 Best SEO Strategies 2022" | with the following list: | | 1. Lie to people | | 2. Get Google to lie for you | | 3. Maintain plausible deniability | | 4. Hope nobody notices | | 5. Offer token apologies if you get caught | xnx wrote: | Thanks for pointing this out. I just used the Feedback link in | that Google search result page to specify that Zendesk is not | open source. If enough people do this, it will completely | negate (or even penalize?) Zendesk's misleading marketing | attempt. | jrm4 wrote: | So cliche, but nonetheless true: | | Stallman was right. | n0n0n4t0r wrote: | And they didn't even include iTop! I guess the revamp of the 3.0 | afraid them this much! | | Disclaimer: I contributed to iTop, but I seriously consider it as | a better solution than Zendesk, especially since it is more | customizable and has an integrated cmdb. | harunurhan wrote: | I bumped into this just yesterday, it's sad that the page ranks | very high for "open source ticketing" :( | tentacleuno wrote: | I'm not really surprised. Personally, I tend to avoid these | 'comparisons' from websites that are somehow biased in promoting | their own solutions, e.g. I wouldn't go to a website selling a | text editor to find out the best text editors. ___________________________________________________________________ (page generated 2022-01-14 23:00 UTC)