[HN Gopher] BeyondCorp is dead, long live BeyondCorp
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       BeyondCorp is dead, long live BeyondCorp
        
       Author : tptacek
       Score  : 53 points
       Date   : 2022-02-09 21:06 UTC (2 days ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (mayakaczorowski.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (mayakaczorowski.com)
        
       | jiveturkey wrote:
        
       | ogazitt wrote:
       | The last paragraph is especially salient. To me, ZT is really
       | about recognizing that perimeter security is dead, and a modern
       | approach to authorization requires defense-in-depth. A zero trust
       | access proxy is just one layer (and is inherently coarse-
       | grained). The identity provider and API gateway can provide more
       | gates. And applications themselves should implement fine-grained
       | authorization in a manner that is complementary but independent
       | of upstream access controls.
        
       | niyikiza wrote:
       | The author makes some good points here: devices and CAs are the
       | most challenging part although I think it remains feasible for
       | some types of companies(likely more so than at Google).
       | 
       | I was discussing about ZT with a friend recently and we were
       | agreeing that one of the problems with the USGov memo (and most
       | of ZT advocates) is referring to ZT as an "Architecture". The
       | memo paints a picture of ZT as a destination whereas it really
       | should be understood as a framework, culture and design
       | philosophy. And that makes it, by definition, a journey. Its
       | principles are supposed to guide your architecture design but
       | they are not the architecture i.e there can never really be a
       | point where you can call a friend and be like "Look at this, I've
       | finally 'built' a Zero Trust Architecture". And you can't have a
       | consultant come in and go back a few months later telling you
       | "Alright, here's your Zero Trust Architecture". ZT has to be
       | continuously entangled into your dev flow, ops, policies and day
       | to day technical decision making.
       | 
       | I also suspect that another important missing piece (whether you
       | look at it as a journey or a destination) is how to
       | quantitatively MEASURE progress on Zero Trust. Having precise
       | reference metrics would help in actually enforcing the goal of
       | the memo or at least being able to tell that company A has a
       | better measured ZT progress than company B.
       | 
       | I guess, like they say, "Zero Trust is like teenage sex: everyone
       | talks about it, nobody really knows how to do it, everyone thinks
       | everyone else is doing it, so everyone claims they are doing it."
       | 
       | Disclaimer: Googler but I don't work on the BeyondCorp team.
        
         | 0xbadcafebee wrote:
         | But they do want to think of it as an architecture. They want
         | some "Architecture Group" to publish a "ZeroTrust Standard"
         | which every team will be required to mindlessly implement so
         | they don't have to actually understand the underlying concepts.
         | It's like those wonderful "security karate" mandatory training
         | courses where they require you watch a video and fill out a
         | multiple choice "test", and after that every application you
         | build will be totally secure by default.
         | 
         | I think the whole DevSecWhateverOps thing fails to account for
         | the severe level of indifference large organizations have for
         | outside-the-box solutions. If you can't solve the problem from
         | your silo, it's too much.
        
         | jiveturkey wrote:
         | I think you're overselling it, but not by much. Indeed, ZTA is
         | not a destination.
        
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       (page generated 2022-02-11 23:00 UTC)