[HN Gopher] A new history of Byzantium reveals the inner working... ___________________________________________________________________ A new history of Byzantium reveals the inner workings of a late antique empire Author : mr_golyadkin Score : 111 points Date : 2022-03-13 18:51 UTC (4 hours ago) (HTM) web link (thecritic.co.uk) (TXT) w3m dump (thecritic.co.uk) | [deleted] | Uehreka wrote: | This sounds fascinating. I almost want to get it just so I can | learn what is meant by "The cursus publicus was hailed for its | efficiency, at least until Justinian got his hands on it. " | atdrummond wrote: | A modern analog would be the USPS historically and what it's | turned into under recent administrations, especially | accelerated under DeJoy's administration. | hetspookjee wrote: | Imagine an analogous overlay much like you provided but | continuous for such historical texts. That would be | something. Like a Google translate from historical or | cultural texts to your own contemporary culture, or a battery | of footnotes. | | On a tangent. The latest version of Candide on Gutenberg has | such footnotes spread throughout to explain some obscure | mentions in the text. An absolute recommender. | thaumasiotes wrote: | A battery of footnotes, commentary, and other marginalia is | the norm for historical texts. The commentary is frequently | more significant than the primary work. | Koshkin wrote: | > _cursus publicus_ | | Didn't the Byzantians speak Greek (rather than Latin)? | Veen wrote: | They did, but the cursus publicus was inherited from the | Western Empire. It's demosios dromos in Greek. | mr_toad wrote: | Early on, the official language was still Latin. The | population of Constantinople spoke Greek natively. Later on, | Greek became common in official business as well. | doctor_eval wrote: | This is fascinating. | | "The cursus publicus (Latin: "the public way"; Ancient Greek: | demosios dromos, demosios dromos) was the state mandated and | supervised courier and transportation service of the Roman | Empire, later inherited by the Eastern Roman Empire. It was a | system based on obligations placed on private persons by the | Roman State" | | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cursus_publicus | dr_dshiv wrote: | Isn't it wild that the Roman Empire lasted until the 1400s, only | to finally fall to the Ottoman Empire? | | But as the Empire fell, a large set of manuscripts were brought | by the great Plethon to Cosimo d'Medici. Marsilio Ficino's | translation of Greek classics into Latin--like the complete works | of Plato and the Hermetica--helped kindle the European | Renaissance as we know it. | canjobear wrote: | Why was it hard for people in Western Europe to get Greek | manuscripts before the fall of the Byzantine Empire? It's not | that far from Rome to Athens. Seems like you could just ride | down to Brundisium and then get on a boat, get to Athens and | ask around. Before 1054 there wasn't an East-Wests schism so | the clerics in Greece wouldn't be hostile. | | Was the political situation really so chaotic and crazy that | you couldn't take that trip? Or was no one interested? | xavxav wrote: | The manuscripts weren't in Greece. These works were written | centuries ago, many of them _before_ the rise of the roman | empire. As books were expensive back then, they would often | be found in wealthy cities like Rome, Alexandria or | Constantinople and often taken as spoils after conquests. The | fall of the Western Roman empire additionally meant no one | had time or resources to go collecting old dusty manuscripts, | but the rising Arabic empires did. Later in the medieval | period, notably after the crusades and moor conquest of | spain, monks began (re)translating the arabic copies of these | works, bringing them back west along with many other novel | works, commentaries and inventions. | dan-robertson wrote: | One thing to note is that the Greek works likely could not have | survived medieval Europe if they had left Constantinople a lot | earlier. There were two great advantages to renaissance | scholars: | | 1. The works were still in their original Greek (rather than | translations into Latin done long ago, or the translations from | Greek to Arabic (and then to Latin) that came in through | moorish Spain). | | 2. Religious attitudes allowed the works to be studied close to | their original form. Early Christians were basically of the | opinion that if a book disagreed with the bible it was heresy | and should be destroyed, and if it agreed with the bible it was | unnecessary and could be destroyed. That was less the case in | the eastern side of the church and of course a big exaggeration | too: there were old Latin translations of eg Plato however they | had been quite bastardised to conform with Christian theology | (I understand Aristotle was a little less bastardised as early | Christian theology was itself quite Aristotelian). By the | renaissance less bastardisation was required (if translating to | Latin rather than the vernacular). | | Without being transferred so late to the west, the works may | never have made it to modern times in such a complete form. | throwawaycities wrote: | Well there was also The Holy Roman Empire (Translatio imperii) | following the fall of the Eastern Roman Empire and currently | the See of Rome where the Pope holds title as bishop of Rome as | just 1 of a handful of absolute monarchs recognized under | international law. ___________________________________________________________________ (page generated 2022-03-13 23:00 UTC)