[HN Gopher] Crypto firm Bitpanda lays off around 20% of its people ___________________________________________________________________ Crypto firm Bitpanda lays off around 20% of its people Author : brunojppb Score : 96 points Date : 2022-06-24 19:07 UTC (3 hours ago) (HTM) web link (blog.bitpanda.com) (TXT) w3m dump (blog.bitpanda.com) | jeffwask wrote: | Is it irony when you name yourself after an endangered species | and then your product becomes an endangered species? | themitigating wrote: | Giant pandas no longer endangered but still vulnerable, says | China https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-57773472 | tyrfing wrote: | 550 million raised, last round series C in Aug '21. | nikanj wrote: | I wonder how much of that was put into BTC. Might only be worth | $150 million now | gitfan86 wrote: | The smart money doesn't hold any crypto and instead take | advantage of the lack of regulations to arbitrage and front | run traders and speculators. | colesantiago wrote: | Good. There needs to be more of these layoffs in the crypto | casino sector. Hopefully in the next coming years, all crypto | firms should go bankrupt and disappear. | | These exchanges and crypto companies need to stop encouraging | customers to buy and gamble their savings and college funds into | the crypto pyramid scheme. | | This needs to end. | melenaboija wrote: | > "...crypto casino sector" | | I would not call it casino. Casinos go through regulated | scrutiny to test the games probabilities are accurate so you | play against math, crypto is a an unregulated market so you | (probably) play against or benefit of market inefficiencies. | tpmx wrote: | > Casinos go through regulated scrutiny to test the games | probabilities are accurate so you play against math | | That's only for physical games/machines, right? | melenaboija wrote: | I had in mind physical casinos so I would say yes but | testing also depends on each country regulations. If I | recall properly (I worked in the testing industry long time | ago and with slot machines) the problem with online games | for my country at that time was that there was some | confusion on which regulation to apply for them as games | where not played where they were hosted. | bluelightning2k wrote: | At the end of a casino the chips can always be redeemed. | | There is very little liquidity in crypto. And when one of the | whales breaks rank and heads for the exit every other holder | will be sitting on chips with some nominal value but | absolutely no buyers. | melenaboija wrote: | Casinos are not just games where chips are exchanged | between players and what is regulated is not how you play | (casinos per se may do that, I don't know) but that the | game is fair and you can make informed decisions, ie in | card games that all players have the same information which | means the decks are not marked, contain a known | distribution of cards,... That does not happen in | inefficient markets. | timcavel wrote: | chollida1 wrote: | Google, amazon, yahoo and Microsoft all benefited greatly from | the early 2000 tech crash in that they had a lot of cash and were | able to hire alot of really good tech talent that was suddenly | out of a job. | | Looks like FTX and Binance are about to leave their competition | in the dust in this crypto winter. | | Coinbase seems to have thrown in the towel for now. I would have | thought they would see this as an opportunity but their fiscal | situation must be alot worse than they are letting on. Which is | strange because I would have thought they were better capitalized | that they are letting on. | | We're watching as closely as we can to see if they have alot of | bad loans outstanding to failing firms. | | With Voyager about to go under, Celsius just hiring a firm to | guide them through bankruptcy and several other minor firms | already going under there will be no shortage of tech talent | available to well run firms. | | When we come out of this downturn in a year or two FTX and | Binance are going to be even larger giants than they are now. | With no real government oversite over those firms to limit their | growth, the next crypto crash could be because one of those two | gets into trouble. | | Another dark horse candidate is Goldman Sachs, they are well | capitalized. Look for them to start to buy up distressed crypto | assets and go into the next bull market in(probably 2024) as a | big crypto player for institutional clients, and possibly for | retail under their Marcus brand. | dehrmann wrote: | > yahoo and Microsoft | | Those two stagnated (at best) in the aughts. Google was taking | Yahoo's lunch, and Microsoft had no web vision and was tied up | in antitrust headaches. | radicaldreamer wrote: | FTX and Binanace will win because they actually invested in | infra and efficiency when building out their products during | the good times. They'll reap outsized benefits during the | downturn. | ditonal wrote: | Coinbase way, way overhired and way overpaid for a weak senior | leadership team. I'm not a fan personally of Brian Armstrong or | Sam Bankman but the difference in leadership skill is night and | day. Armstrong was in the right place at the right time | following the Mt Gox collapse but he's clearly in way over his | head now, but he got his money so I doubt cares. | puranjay wrote: | Coinbase is being very poorly led. They haven't innovated at | all and they're confused as to who their target customers are. | The brief mainstream retail rush has thrown them off. | | The target customers for crypto are other investors, degens, | and gamblers. Most of the money in crypto is house money, i.e. | money that was made from existing crypto investments. Just see | the transaction volume on OpenSea (decentralized ETH house | money) vs CoinBase's NFT marketplace. Retail neither cares nor | has the money for shitty jpegs. | | FTX understands the target market. Which is why it has focused | so aggressively on futures. You can short/long practically | everything on FTX with leverage. That's the | investor/degen/gambler class - the bulk of money in crypto. | | Binance doesn't do anything extremely well, but whatever it | does, it simply works. Withdrawals work, support is clumsy but | works, perps work, spot trading works, even their awful chain, | as full of scams as it might be, _works_. | Ekaros wrote: | Do they need to hire lot of people? Or should they try to run | it as lean profitable business? The big players are in multiple | things, but I'm not entirely sure that really makes sense for | everyone. | | Will be actually see end of growing head counts for sake of | growing them soon? | glenngillen wrote: | Founder of FTX has publicly said he thinks most tech | companies have way too many staff (by a couple of order of | magnitude I think he said?). FTX has something like 30 | people, and that's how he likes it. | ceeplusplus wrote: | Coinbase is probably exposed about as much to retail as | Robinhood is, and judging by Robinhood's monthly trading | volumes [1] which are down anywhere from 60-95% depending on | your reference point, Coinbase revenues have probably dropped | off a cliff. | | [1] | https://s28.q4cdn.com/948876185/files/doc_downloads/2022/06/... | fooobar124 wrote: | Retail trading in crypto is down ~90-95% at the moment. | | Source: know several of the largest market makers on the big | retail exchanges. | hrgiger wrote: | I skipped binance interview in the past when there was no | crisis, their assignment: | | Design and code a Content Management System (CMS) for Binance. | The CMS would used to post articles for the public. The current | Binance site supports up to 17 different languages. Each | article would have some translations but not all articles have | all of the 17 translations. Design and code a RESTful API for | the CMS. | | The user of the CMS would need to input the different | translations for the same article. Design a user interface to | facilitate this. We would only be looking at the | functionalities of the user interface, so do not spend too much | time on the design aspects. | | Derive your own data model as deem fit. The preferred language | for backend is Java and frontend is JavaScript though you are | free to choose any other languages as well as frameworks. | | Submit the code as a GitHub repository and make sure that the | GitHub repository is public. Remember to add a README file for | instructions on how to run the application and explanations (if | any). | jacquesm wrote: | That's beyond despicable and should take this company of the | list of companies to be hired by for any self respecting | prospective employee. Utterly ridiculous. | Animats wrote: | This was for a _job interview_? They wanted you to write an | entire content management system for them? For free? | hrgiger wrote: | Yep , didnt even answer, I had similar interviews solving | company problems but that one takes the lead, I still keep | the email, hope someone from their team will read so they | can re-calibrate their view | latchkey wrote: | https://twitter.com/iamdevloper/status/1539363132593819648 | | interviewer: if you can explain what deadlocks are, I'll hire | you | | me: hire me, and I'll explain deadlocks | ralston3 wrote: | Wow. They really weren't trying to hide the fact that (1) | They were actively building a CMS in-house at the time, and | (2) They thought they did such a good job building said CMS, | that they'd check your work vs their own no doubt | stunning/transformative in-house work. XD | roflulz wrote: | with Django (or other heavy opinionated frameworks targeting | a CMS system), this seems like a ~3 hour project for a basic | CMS. | pluc wrote: | curl -X POST https://login.wordpress.org/register --data 'use | r_login=binancecms&user_email=contact@binance.com&terms_of_se | rvices=1618205211&user_mailinglist=false' | | thank you come again | toomuchtodo wrote: | This brought me a desperately needed laugh today. Please | put something in your HN profile so I can send coffee/beer | money (buymeacoffee.com, etc). | pluc wrote: | Having a sale on laughs today; this one is on the house | jacquesm wrote: | These ones. | nikanj wrote: | Possibly they were stupid enough to get high on their own | supply, and kept operating capital in cryptos instead of USD. | | I would be terrified too, if my business lost over 50% of it's | cash reserves. Or rather they still have the BTC, but it's | worth one third of peak | Animats wrote: | _Possibly they were stupid enough to get high on their own | supply, and kept operating capital in cryptos instead of | USD._ | | This is a classic mistake of banks. When allowed to do so, | they think they can improve their returns by running trading | desks. That's why we in the US used to have Glass-Stegall, | which kept banks and brokerages separate. Because, before and | after Glass-Stegall, banks got into trouble that way. | | Nobody runs a pure crypto exchange that doesn't trade for | their own account. Crypto exchanges are depository | institutions, asset custodians, brokers, lenders, market | makers, and exchanges. All those customer assets, just | waiting to be exploited. | Animats wrote: | Unclear. The whole crypto boom may have been an artifact of low | interest rates. The junk bond part ("staking", etc.) definitely | was. | | As I point out occasionally, most retail financial scams | appeared in the 17th through 19th centuries, as newspapers made | it possible to reach large numbers of suckers. There's not much | innovation. Most of crypto is the same old scams, repackaged. | Look up "bucket shop", "blind pool", "tulip mania", | "Mississippi bubble", "Florida real estate scam", and "high | yield investment program". Those alone cover most of crypto. | | There have been overhyped tech booms many times in history, but | most actually _did_ something, such as build canals or | railroads or electric utilities or networks. The crypto | community has accomplished very little in the real world. | bogomipz wrote: | >"The junk bond part ("staking", etc.) definitely was." | | Might you or someone else explain what staking is? Is this an | overloaded term in crypto? I know that there is proof of | stake that is used for consensus but I'm guessing this is not | the same thing? Is staking a Defi offering? | Animats wrote: | "All you need to know about crypto staking"[1] | | That's what they tell the suckers. | | [1] https://hitbtc.com/blog/all-you-need-to-know-about- | crypto-st... | [deleted] | imustbeevil wrote: | "Staking" means locking your coins on a platform for some | period of time (like a year). So, Tera or Celsius offer 20% | APY for locking your coins there for a year, then when | everything tanks and they go bankrupt everyone who locked | their coins there loses everything. It's a "junk bond" | because the idea is that you only get paid at the end of | the term, and at that point the bond is statistically | unlikely to pay out. | | Like most financial schemes, it really has nothing to do | with the crypto, other than that it would be illegal to | operate platforms like this with real money, since we | created regulations _decades ago_ to protect people from | this. | bogomipz wrote: | Thanks these are helpful in understand that PoS the | consensus enables the the financial instrument known as | "staking." | | Would the following be a correct summary then? | | By holding more tokens you become a preferable verifier | node because you hold more tokens. And the way you hold | more tokens and burnish your reputation as a verifier is | by borrowing those assets from the actual owners and then | paying the asset owners double digit interest? Is this | correct? The idea is that you will make enough in | transaction fees on the network to payout something like | 18% interest to asset owner and still make a profit? | | If so this seems wildly circular. | ditonal wrote: | The person who replied to you originally is confused. | | "Staking" originally meant participating in a proof-of- | stake consensus and you get rewarded by the network with | the new blocks that are mined. | | All the Terra / Luna / NFT / exchange "staking" was | people latching onto DPoS to make their schemes sound | more technologically sound. Its an overloaded term at | this point thats nearing meaningless unless you are clear | you mean actual proof-of-stake. | [deleted] | ditonal wrote: | This is not accurate, but the problem is that staking got | way overloaded. | | Staking should mean partcipating in a proof-of-stake | network by using your stake to participate in block | validation or delegating to someone else. In most cases | you don't need to lock anything and at no point do you | hand control of your funds to someone else. | | The problem is that many grifters then came to use | "staking" to mean all sorts of different things with the | only thing being in common is, get some rewards. But I've | seen things like BlockFi get described as "staking" when | really its just giving your money to control of someone | else and earning interest on it. | imustbeevil wrote: | Since I don't want to respond to all of the cryptos | misunderstanding what staking means, you can also just | google it: | | https://www.coindesk.com/learn/crypto-staking-101-what- | is-st... | | > Similarly, when you stake your digital assets, you lock | up the coins in order to participate in running the | blockchain and maintaining its security. In exchange for | that, you earn rewards calculated in percentage yields. | These returns are typically much higher than any interest | rate offered by banks. | vba616 wrote: | I'm surprised you compare it to a junk bond. | | It sounds pretty much like a CD aka "Certificate of | Deposit" which is a product sold by banks. | | Is there an entire generation that doesn't know anyone | who ever bought a CD from a bank? | | These days they are a joke, but still shown on bank web | pages. | | Here is the list of rates from a regional bank near me: | 5 Year CD 0.10% 4 Year CD 0.10% 3 Year CD | 0.10% 2 Year CD 0.10% 18 Month CD 0.10% | 12 Month CD 0.10% | tomjakubowski wrote: | CDs are FDIC insured. If the bank goes under, you keep | your funds (up to the insurance limit). Staked | cryptocurrency accounts don't enjoy that benefit, as many | people are now learning. | | I'd also recommend anyone shop around for CD rates. Those | are hardly representative of what you can get at, say, | Ally. (2.75% APY on a 5 year) | MisterBastahrd wrote: | The crypto boom was a gold rush for the permanently online | generation. | idiotsecant wrote: | These booms have happened before, complete with distributed | finance boom and bust cycle, exploitative rugpull projects, | and community mania. They just get a little bit bigger each | time. | jjtheblunt wrote: | > Look for them to start to buy up distressed crypto assets | | What makes you think they're interested at all? | jacquesm wrote: | > When we come out of this downturn in a year or two | | That's a pretty big assumption right there. | rvz wrote: | This goes in line with the same rule that 90% of these startups | like this one will fail. As for crypto projects, the same is | true, that 90% of them will also fail and like the survivors of | the dotcom crash, only a few of them will also survive. | | So the anti-crypto and pro-crypto maximalists are going to be | both disappointed. | boardwaalk wrote: | A single data point doesn't give you any information about how | much of the industry will fail. "Goes in line" --- yeah, | because absolutely anything would fit. | | "This is good for bitcoin" | rvz wrote: | That is assuming you have been paying attention to the recent | crypto crash, which is affecting the majority of crypto- | related companies and projects from DAOs to exchanges. So it | is hardly a single data point. | | > "This is good for bitcoin" | | And who said that? | mathverse wrote: | Bitpanda was hiring like crazy before the crypto burst. They were | scaling for infinite growth i guess because laying off 20% | workforce sounds crazy. | franze wrote: | I wonder if they will survive. They hired like crazy here in | Vienna. Lots of good people which started to work there are now 2 | years later at other companies. | | I tried to sign up for their service 2 times. Both time it did | not work. One time even after the success message after the video | verification. | | Still getting Newsletters which seems to get more and more | irregular. | | Well, we will see. Maybe cutting down will solve it for them in | the long term. | puranjay wrote: | There is no real retail demand for crypto. Happens every | bullrun. Retail comes in, gets a heady rush as their $5,000 | becomes $20,000 (on paper) practically overnight. So they fomo | in more and keep holding through the top before cashing out for | less than their initial. 90% swear off crypto and never come | back. | | You can't have retail demand for something that's only meant to | go up and do nothing else. There are no "normal" users buying | NFTs because they love the art, or buying ETH because they want | to use it to get overcollateralized loans on AAVE (when they | can get undercollateralized loans for cheaper). | | I can't understand how VCs wouldn't get something every crypto | degen instinctively knows after a single bullrun. | hrnn wrote: | Didn't they or someone on their behalf even brag a few days ago | about the fact they weren't firing anyone and other crypto | companies did? I'm pretty certain there was a LinkedIn post | about it. ___________________________________________________________________ (page generated 2022-06-24 23:00 UTC)