[HN Gopher] Fishing gear accounts for an alarming amount of plas...
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       Fishing gear accounts for an alarming amount of plastic in oceans
       (2021)
        
       Author : sweetheart
       Score  : 72 points
       Date   : 2022-08-09 20:03 UTC (2 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (www.nature.org)
 (TXT) w3m dump (www.nature.org)
        
       | epistasis wrote:
       | To place this in context, it's 50,000 tons/year of fishing waste,
       | versus 200,000 tons/year of microplastics from car tires:
       | 
       | https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/jul/14/car-tyre...
       | 
       | Further, microplastics enter the ecosystem far easier than the
       | bulky big plastic from fishing gear, so the tire microplastics
       | should be far more concerning to people.
       | 
       | It's really weird how cars get a pass for so much. Try to live a
       | life without a car, and people think you are weird, and pass laws
       | preventing you from building a community that is accessible
       | without a car (at least in the US). And that's before we get to
       | the violent deaths caused by car crashes, or the wheezing deaths
       | caused by COPD, or the quality years of life reduced by asthma
       | from cars...
        
         | kohanz wrote:
         | I'm not sure if it was your intent, but that comparison makes
         | the fishing output seem even more outsized to me, given the
         | size of the auto industry.
        
           | [deleted]
        
         | notch656a wrote:
         | Do you need recommendations on places in the US you can work in
         | tech without a car and still enjoy the community? Because I can
         | speak from many years of experience, it's not a difficult life
         | to setup for yourself.
        
           | [deleted]
        
           | zonotope wrote:
           | I'd love to hear these recommendations. I know you thrive
           | without a car in New York and Boston, but I would love to
           | hear about other places like that in the US.
        
       | bsedlm wrote:
       | by this point, being able to eat (like in crimes of the future),
       | or at the least, resist eating plastics and other toxic
       | ubiquitous substances (PFAS) seems like the most viable strategy.
        
       | taeric wrote:
       | Lest the headline not be obvious, this is industrial fishing
       | gear.
        
         | digdugdirk wrote:
         | Just to expand for those who haven't read the article - These
         | types of nets are specifically designed to catch and trap sea
         | life, so cause outsized damage to ecosystems than their
         | size/weight/volume might suggest.
         | 
         | The images you might see of a turtle with a 6-pack ring around
         | a flipper are nothing compared to the damage a torn off chunk
         | of a trawler's net might cause.
        
       | painted-now wrote:
       | This was also my key takeaway from watching "Seaspiracy" on
       | Netflix
        
       | csmpltn wrote:
       | What about boats with fiberglass hulls?
        
         | picture wrote:
         | Hulls of boats generally don't just go missing or left behind.
         | And, the fiberglass doesn't cause as much damage as high
         | surface area fishing nets. I remember reading that the paint
         | can be an issue though, as there are added particles to get the
         | aesthetic glimmer that will get into the water over time
        
           | speed_spread wrote:
           | Anti-fouling paints applied to hulls contain organometallic
           | chemicals that are, by design, toxic to marine life. This is
           | to prevent algae and molusk to attach to the hull, slowing
           | the boat over time and requiring extensive cleanup. You can
           | imagine the effect these paints have when they chip off.
        
             | notch656a wrote:
             | Anti-fouling paint chipping off seems better than going
             | through 3x as many hulls after they
             | delaminate/rust/disintegrate and become unsalvageable,
             | tossed into the ocean by 3rd world vessel scrappers.
        
       | dark-star wrote:
       | It is so obvious, and has been known for years, yet the EU banned
       | plastic straws because of the waste in the oceans, so now every
       | drink tastes like a schoolbook. Well done EU...
        
         | chefandy wrote:
         | If only there was a way to convey liquids from handheld
         | containers to your mouth without using a little tube!
        
           | anm89 wrote:
           | This sounds pretty complicated
        
             | RajT88 wrote:
             | Sippy cups are underrated.
        
         | [deleted]
        
         | ksaj wrote:
         | There are starch-based "plastic" utensils that look/feel like a
         | slightly more matte version of the plastic most people are used
         | to. The school my partner works at used them as a trial for a
         | year. They had straws, spoons, forks, knives and plates made
         | from it. The problem is they are more expensive than regular
         | plastic or paper/cardboard, and people in general seem to be
         | unwilling to pay that bit extra to keep non-biodegradable waste
         | down. So everyone ends up with paper-based straws, etc, or
         | sticking with plastics instead.
         | 
         | In this case, they literally get what they pay for, because
         | after the trial, they're complaining about all the paper
         | products instead of budgeting to continue with the starch-based
         | solution that was so very much better.
        
           | 01100011 wrote:
           | I wonder how they break down outside of a compost
           | environment? My company uses "compostable" plastics which
           | feel like normal plastic. I've used the same compostable
           | clear plastic cup for months on end and it isn't showing any
           | signs of degradation. I suspect it would break down in a
           | proper compost pile(high temps and such) but outside of that
           | environment it seems as durable as traditional plastic.
           | Hopefully in an environment like the ocean it would be
           | susceptible to bacteria and fungi but I wonder if that is
           | sufficient.
        
             | pfdietz wrote:
             | Our local composting company explicitly excludes
             | compostable utensils and food containers. Compostable
             | doesn't mean biodegradable. For example, compostable
             | cardboard food containers may be coated with perfluoro
             | compounds to prevent liquids from soaking into the
             | cardboard. These don't biodegrade.
        
               | ksaj wrote:
               | Yes, that also goes for paper cups with the wax coating.
               | They don't biodegrade and they aren't recyclable because
               | of the wax. That's probably the same coating you mention.
               | It seems that this solution just replaces one problematic
               | material with another when it coats something that would
               | otherwise be biodegradable.
        
             | ksaj wrote:
             | My understanding is that they are starch and cellulose, so
             | I'd expect them to eventually completely degrade like any
             | other plant material. I'm not an expert, but that seems to
             | be the point of products made with it.
             | 
             | Our liquor store (LCBO) used to have bags made from the
             | same stuff. When our provincial premiere got everyone to
             | charge 5c for each plastic bag, they just stopped using it
             | entirely and went to paper bags. I liked those original
             | compostable/recyclable ones because they were less stretchy
             | and therefore less likely to break than normal plastic
             | grocery bags, and way easier to carry because of the
             | handles.
             | 
             | But the same reasoning applied - it was more expensive than
             | paper bags, so that's all they use there now, too.
        
         | hh3k0 wrote:
         | > [...] yet the EU banned plastic straws because of the waste
         | in the oceans, so now every drink tastes like a schoolbook.
         | Well done EU...
         | 
         | Issues are not the Highlander: there can be more than one.
         | Single-use plastics just happen to be a problem as well.
         | 
         | And, for what it's worth, people who complain about paper
         | straws remind me of sulky toddlers. Just FYI.
        
         | pas wrote:
         | if there were a post with "Single use plastics account for an
         | alarming amount of plastics in the oceans" would you think
         | otherwise?
         | 
         | both are a problem. the industrial fishing nets degrade slower,
         | the microplastics (that then likely bioaccumulates) comes from
         | all sources.
        
           | [deleted]
        
           | Alupis wrote:
           | The data the plastic straw bans were based on was entirely
           | made up by a 9 year old[1][2][3] for a school report.
           | 
           | Entirely made up, based on nothing. Yet... here we are with
           | plastic straw and bag bans...
           | 
           | Let's think about that for a minute while we contemplate all
           | of the similar "data driven" bans we endure.
           | 
           | [1] https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2018/07/18/anti-
           | straw-mo...
           | 
           | [2] https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/19/business/plastic-
           | straws-b...
           | 
           | [3] https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/factcheck-no-
           | evidenc...
        
             | washbrain wrote:
             | Wait, the article you linked said he called manufacturers
             | to get a range of daily production/market estimates of
             | straw production. Hardly seems fair to say based on
             | "nothing".
        
               | Alupis wrote:
               | He called a couple manufacturers who gave him round
               | estimates of production, not consumption and certainly
               | nowhere near accurate enough to extrapolate across the
               | entire country or world. It also doesn't provide any
               | metric to which to gauge this made up consumption rate
               | against - is his number expected, high or low?
               | 
               | So... entirely made up.
        
       | recycledmatt wrote:
       | It is 50,000 tons per year. In plastic recycling terms, not that
       | much volume. A very large plastic recycling facility can do about
       | 200,000 tons in a year. http://intelligentliving.co/worlds-
       | largest-climate-neutral-p...
       | 
       | A tractor trailer hauls roughly 20 tons - so all the sea nets in
       | the world in a year could be hauled by 2,500 trailers. Not that
       | much in the scheme of things.
        
         | dakr wrote:
         | From the article:
         | 
         | "Unlike other forms of marine debris, fishing gear is
         | specifically designed to catch marine life. Under certain
         | conditions, derelict gear can continue to catch and kill
         | organisms for years."
        
         | fleddr wrote:
         | Maybe you missed the part where it's IN THE OCEAN.
        
           | notch656a wrote:
           | floating recycling center then. Believe there's a video
           | somewhere of one in the Charles River or something.
        
       | hairofadog wrote:
       | If you'd like to see anecdotal impacts, you can watch the sad yet
       | thrilling and satisfying YouTube channel Ocean Conservation
       | Namibia, which features a team that captures seals and untangles
       | them from fishing gear:
       | https://www.youtube.com/c/OceanConservationNamibia
        
       | dakr wrote:
       | Not to minimize the impact to ocean life and the environment, but
       | lost fishing gear costs money. The upside of which is that there
       | is direct financial incentive to recover lost gear. I know
       | nothing about this space, but a former coworker started a company
       | about ten years ago in part to allow fishers to track and recover
       | their gear: https://www.blueoceangear.com/
        
         | RajT88 wrote:
         | One report I read was that much of it was discarded as it got
         | too damaged to use. So hardly an accidental loss.
        
         | dmurray wrote:
         | I would say the bigger incentive is not to lose the gear in the
         | first place, but even that doesn't seem to be enough.
        
       | albatross13 wrote:
       | You guys haven't seen anything yet:
       | https://www.nhm.ac.uk/discover/news/2022/august/pandemic-fac...
        
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       (page generated 2022-08-09 23:00 UTC)