[HN Gopher] The Long S
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The Long S
Author : bryanrasmussen
Score : 42 points
Date : 2022-09-04 12:33 UTC (10 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (en.wikipedia.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (en.wikipedia.org)
| vegesm wrote:
| I always wondered where the integral sign was coming from. This
| gives a very simple explanation: it's just the letter 's', the
| shorthand for sum!
| gumby wrote:
| It's also smoother than the sigma, which visually incorporates
| the fundamental theorem of calculus.
|
| In general I'm glad we use Leibniz's notation and not Newton's,
| because my handwriting is messy. Though I did use dot and dot
| dot in physics long ago.
| HPsquared wrote:
| And the uppercase sigma (S) used for summation is basically
| the Greek 'S' (i.e. S for "Sum"). So it's just another S.
|
| Also, the capital pi (P) used for product notation, is
| basically the Greek 'P' (i.e. P for "Product").
| akolbe wrote:
| And Greek too has two versions of the lower-case sigma: s
| (whose usage corresponds to that of the long s) and s for
| use only in the word-final position (corresponding to the
| terminal s as distinguished from the long s).
| contravariant wrote:
| Also if anyone knows an alphabet with a nice distinct 'P',
| please donate it to your local mathematician, there's a
| great shortage at the moment.
| napolux wrote:
| Came here to read the story of Esselunga ("esse lunga" means
| "long s" in italian) the first italian supermarket chain, but I'm
| not disappointed :P
| schroeding wrote:
| Fun fact from the German Wikipedia:
|
| > The ,,s" [...] is no violation of (modern German) orthography,
| since the new [...] spelling rules do not prescribe how they
| should be implemented allographically.
|
| Grossartig, but please don't, at least if you don't use
| Blackletters! :D
| akolbe wrote:
| Germans have largely forgotten the rules governing the use of
| the long s. So when they use Blackletters (Fraktur), for
| example in advertising contexts, they often make mistakes.
| johannes1234321 wrote:
| > Grossartig
|
| The ss is aligature of s and z, so maybe Groszartig, or a
| little bit different script: GrosZartig
| aaaaaaaaaaab wrote:
| So many people confuse it with an 'f'. E.g. search for the word
| "Jagermeifter" for a good laugh :-)
| tgsovlerkhgsel wrote:
| Even knowing what it is, I can't help but pronounce it as an
| "f" just for laughs and to make the spoken form sound as silly
| as the written form looks to me.
| TonyTrapp wrote:
| https://debeste.de/upload/fbe0e08ce37286b7ab60ebdeaf43c33029...
| :)
| _dain_ wrote:
| The most preftigious letter.
| TazeTSchnitzel wrote:
| The origin of the German ss is very intuitive once you know that
| S can look like s and Z can look like ZH.
| martin_a wrote:
| All hail the beloved Esszett-Schnitten!
|
| For more on the letter though:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%9F
| ogogmad wrote:
| Read the preface to the 1st edition of this thing, and prepare
| for your mind to be blown:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douay%E2%80%93Rheims_Bible
|
| Keep clicking "next" on this:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:1609_Doway_Old_Testament....
|
| In summary, they (the authors of Douay-Rheims) based their bible
| translation on Jerome's 4th century Latin translation because
| they believed that the extant Greek and Hebrew versions had been
| corrupted by "Iewes and Heretikes".
| andrepd wrote:
| Why do pages end on a line with a single word set flush right?
| pdw wrote:
| That's the catchword, the first word of the next page. It
| helps with keeping the pages in the correct order when
| binding the book. It could also be an aid when reading aloud,
| to give the reader one word of "buffer" when turning the
| page.
| pimlottc wrote:
| I would guess it is to aid a speaker reading aloud so as not
| to have an awkward pause between pages.
| anon_123g987 wrote:
| That's a preview of the first word of the next page. I guess
| it helps to switch between pages more smoothly.
| sph wrote:
| Not sure what am I looking for, but damn, the typography and
| typesetting of this 400 year old book is mind blowing.
| b3morales wrote:
| On page 3 the mix of double 'V's for 'W', 'u' for 'v', and
| 'V' for 'U' ('IESVS' at the top) is quite intriguing.
| dhosek wrote:
| W, v and j were still pretty novel letters at that point. j
| was typically used as a final form for i/j so you will see
| things like the roman numeral for 3 represented as iij. V
| tended to be used for U/V in capitals and u for u/v in
| lowercase. W was often not a letter that was part of a
| typefont and writing VV or vv was the only way to represent
| it in print. The sixteenth century was the point where u
| and i became the vowel forms and V and j became the
| consonant forms. Later Latin is inconsistent in its use of
| u/v and i/j, right down to dictionaries. I remember having
| difficulty with my pocket Latin dictionary in college
| because I would often forget that iam was listed as jam in
| it (and similar instances of an initial consonantal i).
| b3morales wrote:
| Yes, but there _are_ 'w's in the text. Mixed in the same
| sentence in one case with a 'vv'.
|
| > ...we send you here...you receiued the New...therof
| shal not now...
|
| > ...impediments, which hitherto haue long hindered this
| vvorke...
| veltas wrote:
| I would guess it's to justify the text. People would also
| add/remove unnecessary vowels to fit a line better.
| kwk1 wrote:
| Interesting to note also the use of a as shorthand for an,
| i.e. "the residue is in had" -> "the residue is in hand"
| dejj wrote:
| The rules governing long s differ between languages, see German
| Wikipedia:
| https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Langes_s#Regeln_in_anderen_Spr...
|
| The German rules are thus quite easy (contrary to the article):
|
| - never long s at the end of a syllable (mid-word or end-word)
|
| - everywhere else, use long s
|
| On a German Linux system it is conveniently mapped to Right-Alt+s
| skellyclock wrote:
| I bought a 1st edition KJV (1611 reproduction) that had these all
| throughout. I couldn't make it past the introduction by the
| 'tranflators'
| layer8 wrote:
| It always reads as if they were lisping.
| teddyh wrote:
| "translators"
| dhosek wrote:
| The oldest book in my personal library is from the eighteenth
| century and frequently talks about the Catholic church sucking
| money out of England.
| akolbe wrote:
| suck it and see?
| veltas wrote:
| My theory is typography killed the long s. It was much more
| visually distinct in handwriting, in type it just looks like an f
| without a line.
| riffic wrote:
| not to be confused with the Cool S
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cool_S
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(page generated 2022-09-04 23:01 UTC)