[HN Gopher] Framework Ethernet Expansion Card is now available
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       Framework Ethernet Expansion Card is now available
        
       Author : onli
       Score  : 44 points
       Date   : 2022-09-12 18:12 UTC (1 days ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (frame.work)
 (TXT) w3m dump (frame.work)
        
       | liminalsunset wrote:
       | This is a nice throwback to the form factor of PCMCIA cards for
       | really old laptops - the original expansion card slot for
       | notebook computers. [1] The cards often had to stick out, whether
       | to host a thick connector or an antenna. Here, we see a
       | miniaturized version of that form factor...
       | 
       | Later, this was replaced by ExpressCard, but that never took off
       | as much as PCMCIA cards. Back in the day, laptops came with one
       | or two PCMCIA slots, which could be used to add full size
       | IEEE1394, USB, Ethernet, or even Wi-Fi ports. I remember having
       | to use an ORiNOCO Gold Wi-Fi card to get online back in the day.
       | I had a desktop that had a slot in the front that it plugged into
       | 
       | [1] https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ffab&q=pcmcia&iax=images&ia=images
        
         | sschueller wrote:
         | Sadly USB-C is not the same as PCMCIA or PCIe.
        
           | [deleted]
        
           | reisse wrote:
           | USB-C (as a connector) is perfectly capable of delivering PCI
           | Express via either Thunderbolt or USB4.
        
           | smoldesu wrote:
           | I would hope that we've learned our lesson after all the DMA
           | attacks we had with Thunderbolt 4.
        
       | micromacrofoot wrote:
       | transparent cases in electronics seem to be making a comeback
       | lately
        
         | HeckFeck wrote:
         | Now we just need to get them tinted in every colour of the
         | rainbow, and we're back on the hueful road we foolishly
         | abandoned.
        
       | Jiejeing wrote:
       | It does look a bit cheap, and the protruding part is not
       | aesthetically pleasing, but at least it has good specs. I wish
       | they could make it work while keeping it the same form factors as
       | the other parts.
        
         | liminalsunset wrote:
         | The problem with the protruding part is that the Ethernet port
         | itself is thicker than the laptop body itself. In this case,
         | even if they were to go the route that some thin laptops use
         | (hinged collapsible port), it would likely hit the table due to
         | the thinness of the laptop.
         | 
         | If you put the port on a little cable, you're back to the USB-C
         | dongle thing.
        
           | Jiejeing wrote:
           | Yes, I know there is no good engineering solution unless you
           | accept to have thicker expansion cards on both sides (e.g.
           | with rubber pads on the bottom) that would be used as
           | slightly elevated support for the laptop.
        
           | ChuckNorris89 wrote:
           | It wouldn't hit the table because foldable Ethernet ports
           | fold up, not down.
           | 
           | https://www.theverge.com/circuitbreaker/2017/12/8/16750574/p.
           | ..
        
             | danudey wrote:
             | More moving parts reduces reliability.
             | 
             | Also, most laptops with collapsable ethernet ports do
             | indeed fold down. I've seen dozens of them, but I've never
             | seen a port like the one you posted (probably because it's
             | a terrible idea, but maybe for other reasons).
        
       | TapamN wrote:
       | I don't understand what the advantage of an expansion card that
       | sticks out like that is over using something external on a cable.
       | 
       | The main point of the self contained expansions is that you are
       | unlikely to loose them and they can safely travel around with the
       | device. With a card that protrudes like that, if you want to put
       | the laptop in a bag, you have to take the card out, or risk
       | damaging the card and/or laptop as the protrusion gets levered
       | around. The expansion cards plug into USB-C connectors that are
       | soldered directly onto the motherboard, so the risk of damaging
       | the motherboard though the expansion card does exist (although
       | it's probably not that likely, and any damage would probably be
       | localized to just the motherboard's USB connector).
       | 
       | With a external Ethernet port, you can have the USB expansion
       | card in between the motherboard and the USB Ethernet device, to
       | prevent wear on the motherboard's connector when repeatedly
       | connecting and disconnecting the device.
       | 
       | So what's the gain by using the expansion card format, when it
       | can't permanently live in the laptop? You might as well just use
       | a cable. I guess maybe if you only carry the laptop by hand and
       | have to constantly use Ethernet, like if you're debugging a
       | network installation, it would be good? But a regular USB
       | Ethernet port seems like it would be more practical for most
       | cases.
        
         | kelnos wrote:
         | I was thinking the same thing. Sure, this is better than a
         | dongle in some ways, but is still an order of magnitude worse
         | than the normal, flush-fitting expansion cards.
         | 
         | I do recall someone on the Framework subreddit saying that they
         | carry a laptop around with them on a shop/factory floor, but
         | mostly use wired ethernet when they stop and put it down on a
         | workbench. Using a dongle wouldn't be great because it'd be
         | something that would swing around unpredictably as he'd walk
         | around a crowded room with lots of people and machines running.
         | 
         | Regardless, a retractable "XJACK"[0] from the PCMCIA days might
         | have been a better choice for this, if the hardware could be
         | made "short" enough in that dimension. Downside there is of
         | course fragility; I imagine they're easy to snap off.
         | 
         | [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XJACK
        
       | smm11 wrote:
       | Why do I think "desktop" when I see such fast-access ability?
        
         | soneil wrote:
         | I use 10gig for a dedicated link to a NAS. It drives me nuts
         | that easily-accessible networking is so far behind storage
         | speeds. SATA-I (2003) is faster than gigabit ethernet. SATA-II
         | (2004) is faster than 2.5GigE.
         | 
         | So why 2.5GigE on a laptop? So when you're at your desk, where
         | your laptop spends 90%+ of its life, your bulk storage can have
         | access speeds that are at least from this century, if only
         | just.
        
         | rektide wrote:
         | 80Gbps usb4 2.0 host-to-host connectivity is 32x faster. (2^5
         | magnitudes.)
         | 
         | Coming soon to almost all decent laptops.
        
       | sschueller wrote:
       | I'll repeat what I said in yesterday's thread.
       | 
       | I want to see SFP ports. Specifically SFP28 so I can stick in my
       | 25gbit fiber modules etc.
       | 
       | There is no way to get SFP28 on a laptop to my knowledge as USB-C
       | (yet, USB 4 could do it) is not fast enough. It has to interface
       | directly with PCIe.
        
         | reisse wrote:
         | Thunderbolt 3 to SFP28 adapters exist (though cost a fortune),
         | and TB3 is supported by a lot of existing laptops.
        
         | jbotdev wrote:
         | What would you do on one of these laptops that would take
         | advantage of a 25Gb connection?
        
           | sschueller wrote:
           | Connect it to my internet connection [1].
           | 
           | [1] https://www.init7.net/en/internet/fiber7/
        
             | alexchantavy wrote:
             | Whoa, 25Gb symmetrical for normal consumers? Is this
             | Switzerland only?
        
         | OJFord wrote:
         | > There is no way to get SFP28 on a laptop to my knowledge as
         | USB-C
         | 
         | So what do you expect to happen? Framework expansion cards are
         | built-in USB-C adapters; if USB-C can't do it, they can't do
         | it.
        
           | sschueller wrote:
           | Looks like it is possible with thunderbolt 4 which framework
           | exposes on the USB-C expansion.
        
       | ortusdux wrote:
       | Previous discussion (yesterday):
       | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32814453
        
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       (page generated 2022-09-13 23:00 UTC)