[HN Gopher] Whois: Fragile, Unparseable, Obsolete
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       Whois: Fragile, Unparseable, Obsolete
        
       Author : ementally
       Score  : 83 points
       Date   : 2022-09-24 15:14 UTC (7 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (www.netmeister.org)
 (TXT) w3m dump (www.netmeister.org)
        
       | LinuxBender wrote:
       | Does anyone here run their own whois for their own domains using
       | srv records? If so, how many hits per day do you get? I'm curious
       | because I have never seen anyone request _srv _nicname_.tcp._
       | from my nameservers.
        
         | duskwuff wrote:
         | > Does anyone here run their own whois for their own domains
         | using srv records?
         | 
         | I don't think that's possible. WHOIS, by design, is controlled
         | by the domain registry, which may delegate it to registrars --
         | the owner of the domain may have some limited control over the
         | contents (like the registrant information), but they don't get
         | to control it fully, and I've certainly never seen a registrar
         | delegate WHOIS to the domain owner.
        
           | LinuxBender wrote:
           | Makes sense. I've only ever seen it delegated when I would
           | swip out a cidr block to a b2b customer and even then the
           | people I interacted with never asked to run their own whois,
           | only custom PTR delegation.
           | 
           | I can not find any whois clients that support this expired
           | ietf draft [1] so I assume it was abandoned.
           | 
           | [1] - https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-sanz-whois-
           | srv-0...
        
       | [deleted]
        
       | cdubzzz wrote:
       | Here's a random thing I made for RDAP a long long time ago. It
       | has lots of bugs but has come in handy from time to time:
       | https://rdap-explorer.chris-wells.net/
        
         | indigodaddy wrote:
         | Interesting, was not aware of RDAP, thank you.
        
         | sedatk wrote:
         | This IP address breaks the service: https://rdap-
         | explorer.chris-wells.net/144.122.199.20/results...
        
           | cdubzzz wrote:
           | Lots of IPs break it haha. Maybe now I'll take some time to
           | look in to that...
        
       | zanethomas wrote:
       | once upon a time i wrote a whois server
        
       | Fileformat wrote:
       | I ran into the same issue but worked around it slightly
       | differently: have my code use RDAP, and then have an RDAP->WHOIS
       | proxy [1]. There are usually rate-limits on WHOIS, so public
       | instances won't survive long, but it works for me and you can run
       | locally.
       | 
       | I also hunted (s/whois/rdap/g) around for undocumented RDAP
       | servers and found a few. There are still a lot of TLDs without
       | RDAP though [2].
       | 
       | [1] https://rdap.redirect2.me/ (source at
       | https://github.com/redirect2me/rdap-proxy)
       | 
       | [2] https://resolve.rs/domains/rdap-missing.html
        
       | superkuh wrote:
       | Whois was killed off by the European Union passing the GDPR. It
       | really changed how I use the internet for the worse. In the old
       | days I could always at least send an email to a domain hosting a
       | service. Now there's no default contact information and
       | everything is behind walled gardens.
       | 
       | Email was the great communicator. Removing it from WHOIS made the
       | web more fragile and broken. But whois doesn't have to be that
       | way and the problems are not intrinsic to whois. They are
       | stemming from political interference done with good intentions
       | but bad outcomes.
        
         | dredmorbius wrote:
         | Mentioned in TFA FWIW:
         | 
         |  _the ICANN [contact disclosure] requirement now does indeed
         | conflict with modern privacy laws, such as the EU 's GDPR,
         | meaning all domains registered by European registries are in
         | violation of either GDPR or ICANN's requirement._
        
       | dvh wrote:
       | In a similar way ftp clients are guessing what is filename when
       | they parse the output of "dir" command.
        
         | teddyh wrote:
         | FTP solved this in 2007 with RFC 3659, which includes the MLST
         | command.
        
         | tptacek wrote:
         | One of many reasons FTP is moribund.
        
       | alexott wrote:
       | Yes, 100%. I'm trying to use registration information for
       | cybersecurity stuff, and it's a mess. Some TLDs just doesn't
       | provide that information or provide it only to registered
       | accounts or only inside their country. Parsing is a mess. Many
       | have rate limits, like .au has 20 requests/day, .cz - 100 day,
       | but with delay of 3 minutes between requests, ...
        
       | gayn1gga wrote:
        
       | cloudyporpoise wrote:
       | It's sad we can't improve and build modern APIs that can support
       | load and querying and exactly why companies exist whose main
       | business function is scraping services like WhoIs, Social Media,
       | or Sites behind cloudflare.
        
         | tptacek wrote:
         | As the article observes, we can and are doing that: that's what
         | RDAP is.
        
       | brightball wrote:
       | A few years back I tried building my own Whois parser and you're
       | right, it's a mess. Before you even factor in all the fun rate
       | limiting.
        
       | illuminerdy wrote:
       | I can't get the page to load for some reason, but I don't think
       | whois is obsolete. I used it via command line to search for
       | available domains when I was creating my blog. It was simple and
       | effective for that purpose.
        
       | billpg wrote:
       | Why do domains have WHOIS records anyway? I get why IP blocks
       | have it because machines actually _do_ things from behind IP
       | addresses, but the only thing I 'm _doing_ from a domain name is
       | stopping other people from using it.
       | 
       | Someone is hosting copyrighted content? Look up that machine's
       | IP-WHOIS.
       | 
       | Someone is trying to DDOS me? Look up that machine's IP-WHOIS.
       | 
       | Someone is holding a domain I want? If their answer is going to
       | be anything other than a straight "no", they'll happily provide a
       | way to be contacted.
       | 
       | Please tell me how I'm wrong.
        
         | tooltower wrote:
         | It probably made more sense in the pre-web Internet, when not
         | all domains were necessarily serving web traffic. Or had any
         | obvious or standardized way of serving a "contact us" page.
        
           | akira2501 wrote:
           | The DNS SOA record has an RNAME field that is available to
           | convey this information.
        
             | teddyh wrote:
             | See also the RP (Responsible Person) record; RFC 1183:
             | https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc1183.html
        
         | layer8 wrote:
         | A single IP can host many domains, each of which may have
         | separate technical and administrative contacts. Conversely,
         | different subdomains (and MX for email) can live on different
         | IPs. If I use dyndns, there isn't any fixed relation between IP
         | and domain at all. I happen to own several domains, but I don't
         | own the IPs where they are hosted.
        
       | openasocket wrote:
       | Once worked on a whois scraping project and ran into a bunch of
       | issues.
       | 
       | One particularly fun story is how we might have broken a whois
       | server. It was the country TLD server for some West African
       | nation, I think Senegal but I'm not sure. We hit their server
       | with like a hundred queries in rapid succession (to test what
       | rate limiting approach they used) and requests started hanging.
       | We switched IP addresses ... and still requests were hanging. We
       | tried multiple IP addresses in totally different networks, all of
       | them hung or timed out, even for a single request. A day later we
       | retried and all of a sudden it started working again! From that
       | point on we made sure to never do more than a couple requests a
       | second to that particular domain.
       | 
       | Also, any queries to one cc TLD (either Egypt or Ukraine, can't
       | remember which) just returned "we don't provide information in
       | whois requests" or something to that effect.
       | 
       | GoDaddy didn't do traditional rate limiting. If you exceeded
       | whatever their limit was they didn't just return an error
       | message, they would blacklist your IP and for any query say
       | "visit our website for information", and their website gated
       | things behind a captcha.
        
       | indigodaddy wrote:
       | Speaking of fragile perhaps..
        
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       (page generated 2022-09-24 23:00 UTC)