[HN Gopher] Starting a food co-op: Year 1
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Starting a food co-op: Year 1
Author : qrush
Score : 201 points
Date : 2022-10-10 12:45 UTC (10 hours ago)
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| oldandboring wrote:
| So much enlightening info in these comments about the economics
| of these stores and the truth behind the sourcing of the food.
|
| I've been a co-op member for almost 20 years; back before I had
| kids and lived really close to the store we used to go there
| almost every day. The biggest draw was always the quality of the
| food; the chain stores were only selling conventional and mass-
| produced products and if you wanted a better and/or local
| product, the co-op was your place. But then in the mid-2000s we
| got Whole Foods, Trader Joes, and and an organic/specialty aisle
| in all the supermarkets. Eventually the organic aisle disappeared
| and it was just organic products on the regular shelves. When we
| moved away, our new city also had a co-op but it was a 15+ minute
| drive from home and there was very little draw for us: it was
| largely the same products we could get at our local stores, but
| 20% more expensive. The only reason to go there is if we happen
| to be in the area and/or if there's something we want that we
| know they only sell there, but that's no different than the 3
| big-chain stores in our town.
| smeagull wrote:
| The one thing my local co-op does is being able to buy a random
| box of seasonal fruit and veg for cheap. That's ended up being
| cheaper than our supermarket.
| chiefalchemist wrote:
| > The only reason to go there is if we happen to be in the area
| and/or if there's something we want that we know they only sell
| there, but that's no different than the 3 big-chain stores in
| our town.
|
| Actually, there is a difference. The dollars spent at a co-op
| are far more likely to stay in the local community. On the
| hand, give it to the big chain, and it's far more like to make
| it back to HQ (and the shareholders). Not your local community.
|
| "Local Dollars, Local Sense" by Michael Shuman was an
| enlightening read for me.
|
| https://www.thriftbooks.com/w/local-dollars-local-sense-how-...
| neilv wrote:
| This seems to be in the Boston, Mass., area.
|
| Some related local background is that there was the Harvest Co-op
| chain until a few years ago:
| https://www.boston.com/food/food/2018/10/04/harvest-co-op-ma...
|
| There's also the Market Basket for-profit regional chain, where
| employees and customers successfully stood up against some family
| business maneuvers to force out the head, and it's once again
| generally well-regarded AFAIK (including profit-sharing for
| employees).
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Market_Basket_(New_England)#20...
| jpm_sd wrote:
| Given that Harvest shut down "after years of financial
| instability", what's the strategy for this new co-op to
| survive? If you can't run a successful co-op in Cambridge,
| Massachusetts, where can you?
| weeblewobble wrote:
| In Seattle we have PCC, which is at least successful enough
| to have a bunch of different locations since my childhood.
| https://www.pccmarkets.com/about/
| socialismisok wrote:
| Most places I've lived on the west coast have grocery co-ops.
| Often they stand out in the market by carrying high quality,
| locally produced, or "hippie" food.
|
| Some folks prefer to shop there because they like the model -
| co-op businesses generally seem to be more invested in local
| communities.
| jpm_sd wrote:
| Yes, you are accurately describing the Harvest Co-op which
| operated in Cambridge, Massachusetts, and failed to thrive.
| Aka "the People's Republic of Cambridge"?
|
| I dunno, maybe it was mismanaged due to excessive
| ideological community involvement? Or maybe operating costs
| were just too high in one of the most expensive cities in
| the nation?
| seibelj wrote:
| I went to the one in JP a lot before it closed. Our main
| issue was that the produce was often rotten / moldy and
| there were flies inside a lot. It's hard to justify
| higher fees and being "more healthy" when all your food
| is spoiled. We went because it was a 5 minute walk but
| now we use Whole Foods for everything.
| derekbaker783 wrote:
| Syracuse, NY apparently: https://www.syracuse.coop/
| nominusllc wrote:
| The co-op in Gays Mills, WI has been going strong since the
| 80's. All you need is a homogeneous community and some
| hippies. It's hard for one side to get one over on the other
| side when everyone shares the same corner store, pool, pub,
| and one-eyed barber. Love that place. You can smell the
| spices and herbs about 20ft from the door and it's just
| amazing. Like a spicy masala with a little skunk to it.
|
| I think co-ops work in more rural areas because it's not a
| fad to be there, it's the smart choice. Places in Cali are
| competing with an entire world of food on the same 10 square
| miles.
| candiddevmike wrote:
| Kickapoo exchange? Driftless folks on HN?
| nominusllc wrote:
| Yep you know the one. It's on the other side of the
| street from the barber shop and knicknack place the
| barber's wife owns. the one with those welded metal
| sculptures of people made from forks and scrap iron and
| stuff. You from around the area?
| candiddevmike wrote:
| La crosse area, love going down to viroqua during this
| time of year though.
| nominusllc wrote:
| Lots of great memories having malts at the viroqua dairy
| :)
| germinalphrase wrote:
| Driftless adjacent.
| mcdan wrote:
| One of the oldest food coops is in Park Slope Brooklyn,
| which is not rural but sure does have a bunch of hippies.
|
| https://www.foodcoop.com/
| tomcam wrote:
| That was super informative except for the term "one-eyed
| barber"
| kjbreil wrote:
| Seattle area has the nations largest and oldest grocery co-op
| - https://www.pccmarkets.com. 16 stores and generally doing
| well. The answer to how to keep it going is to run it like a
| grocery chain with experienced leaders and good board
| governance. In my experience a lot of the smaller coops I've
| seen have a problem separating the ideology from the need to
| run a business, grocery is notoriously low margin so a little
| waste is all that is needed to sink the buisness. Check
| https://www.ncg.coop/find-co-op to find a co-op near you.
| itake wrote:
| pccmarket prices are sooo insanely expensive. I wonder who
| can afford to shop there :-/.
| posguy wrote:
| Whole Paycheck shoppers
|
| On a more serious note, the Seattle Median Income is
| $120,907 for 2022, see page 4: https://www.seattle.gov/do
| cuments/Departments/Housing/Proper...
| losteric wrote:
| > The answer to how to keep it going is to run it like a
| grocery chain with experienced leaders and good board
| governance.
|
| PCC is also known to treat employees relatively poorly,
| just like grocery chains. There are also complaints about
| an "old boys" culture, familiar to anyone that worked
| retail long-term.
|
| In the Seattle area, there are better coops like Central
| Co-op, with similar prices and better worker treatment
| (since all employees are owners in addition to opt-in
| shoppers)
|
| At this point, PCC is just Whole Foods with higher
| prices...
| nwsm wrote:
| They are all over. There is a co-op in my college town of
| Fayetteville, AR. I was not a member but it's successful.
| giantg2 wrote:
| We have some CSAs and a couple health food stores that focus
| on local agricultural products. I don't think any of them are
| true coops though.
| jt2190 wrote:
| I mean... Stop and Shop is _literally_ two blocks from where
| Russo's was [1] so I'm not sure what relevance Harvest or
| Market Basket bring to this conversation. (Edit: I'm not trying
| to be dismissive, but it's not really clear why these other
| stores are relevant. Are you suggesting that perhaps labor is
| being treated better than at the big chains?)
|
| Russo's was definitely a high-end, premium prices place: Fancy
| imported cheeses, a large bakery, fresh-made pasta, and a large
| selection of fresh fruit and vegetables. I have no idea if the
| workers were paid better or treated better than anywhere else.
|
| A co-op feels like a different beast altogether, so I'm not
| sure that the patrons of Russo's will suddenly just move to
| shopping there en masse, especially since the market for
| groceries around here is well served. It really feels like the
| coop would mostly _not_ be about the food.
|
| [1]
| https://www.google.com/maps/dir/570+Pleasant+St,+Watertown,+...
| forgotmypw17 wrote:
| I was able to figure out it's in the Boston area by the 617
| area code and the name, but after spending 5 minutes looking
| for its actual location, I still can't find it. It doesn't seem
| to be on the website, and it's not on Google Maps either.
|
| Does anyone know where this is actually located?
| AaronM wrote:
| Vermont has a fairly successful Co-op in Burlington.
|
| https://www.citymarket.coop/
| DFHippie wrote:
| The Brattleboro co-op is quite successful.
|
| A co-op has a lot of positive externalities: better customer
| experience, better benefits, pay, and job satisfaction for
| the employees than at non-co-op grocery stores, the community
| it fosters, etc. If these things matter to you, they can
| outweigh the premium the co-op has to charge to provide them.
|
| I worked in the Lexington Co-op in Buffalo back in the 90s.
| It was a great job despite the meager pay and benefits (at
| the time) because I didn't feel like I was the lackey of the
| customers or my bosses but their friend and neighbor. I was
| in graduate school, which was depressing and alienating. I
| found the co-op a far nicer place to live my life than
| academia. It's been many years, but it's still one of the
| best jobs I've had. I met my wife there. My pay is better
| now, but I still shop at co-ops when I can.
| twunde wrote:
| Vermont has a number of successful co-ops.
| https://nfca.coop/vt/ has a list of them.
|
| Most food co-ops belong to co-op partnerships and many will
| cross honor memberships at other co-ops ie the Putney co-op
| will give you a member discount if you're a Brattleboro co-op
| member
| mym1990 wrote:
| I kind of love the old styler website and the .coop domain to
| booot!
| carride wrote:
| Here are more details are the year before harvest shutdown.
| Summarized to say that all the unique organic and varieties of
| healthy food they were once known for, can now be found at most
| other grocery stores. https://archive.ph/NEc4o
| carride wrote:
| This could have been pre-pandemic thinking in 2018
| mustafabisic1 wrote:
| Oh my, this thread is full of positivity!
|
| Cheer y'all.
| orzig wrote:
| I live in that area and would love to start getting involved.
| I'll reach out!
|
| Anyone else who's on the fence about getting involved: If you
| value building community (even aside from food in specific), your
| public involvement now will only snowball in impact; strike while
| the iron is hot!
| ricardobeat wrote:
| Can anyone shed more light on why it takes 7-10 years to get to
| an actual store?
|
| In my head you'd start signing up suppliers / farmers, find a
| suitable place to rent, get some more funding, build out the
| store, hire, and start it up. What makes it slower than other
| businesses?
| Kalium wrote:
| Coops often find it harder to borrow and they cannot sell
| equity. This makes the every "get some funding" step harder
| than it sounds. Going over the list I see a lot of people-
| organizing and community-outreach efforts. These are definitely
| going to be more time-intensive than setting up an LLC owned by
| a single person and running with that.
| luckylion wrote:
| Why can't they sell equity? I live in a housing coop, and
| they do sell equity. I own 100 shares.
| sct202 wrote:
| There's a long capital raising period where the co-op will need
| to raise a substantial amount of capital in the form or
| preferred shares and owner loans. The co op near me says they
| need a certain percentage of capital to come from owners in
| order to secure commercial loans, and they've recently
| completed raising capital after signing up owners for the last
| 9 years.
| dylan604 wrote:
| As a kid, my family was part of a co-op. I grew up in the
| boonies, and there was one local grocery store that had horrible
| selection. The larger chains required long drives to get to, but
| even then they did not have the produce selections that is the
| norm now. Instead, each weekend a member of the co-op would visit
| the farmer's market in the Big City. We were no where near the
| size of the co-op in the TFA, but it made a big difference in the
| selection of produce we had. Now, that farmer's market is no
| longer, but now a series of condos with Farmer's Market as part
| of their name are there. I just never though that a co-op would
| be a viable thing in 21st century, so it was definitely
| interesting reading about how that's not the case.
| hinkley wrote:
| Ace hardware is technically a co-op, but that would be a
| surviving one more than one for the 21st century. REI is also a
| co-op but I couldn't explain how to save my life.
|
| However, Organic Valley definitely is a co-op, and while they
| started in 1988 they didn't seem to get serious traction until
| around 2000, and now they're everywhere on the west coast,
| which is not bad for a Midwest company.
| dylan604 wrote:
| Interesting you mention Ace. It is truly one of my favorite
| places to visit in new cities. No two Ace stores are the
| same. One in my area focuses on homesteading, and is known as
| the place to get your baby chicks to start your chicken
| raising experiment. They also carry other items that are in
| this line vs just your typical selection of tools and what
| not. Then another Ace in Flagstaff saved my butt while on a
| video shoot as they had some items I had never seen in a
| local Ace, but were the perfect fit for the off the wall
| rigging I needed.
|
| Ace is the place!
| xsmasher wrote:
| There's one in Berkeley California with a fully stocked
| model train department filling 1/4 of the floorspace.
| nullrecursion wrote:
| Yeah the one in downtown Berkeley is fantastic!
| Semaphor wrote:
| I wish I could follow this, but the blog sadly lacks any
| (discoverable) RSS feeds. So qrush, any chance of that changing?
| qrush wrote:
| Good question. I moved away from Jekyll/GitHub Pages a while
| back and onto Notion/Super.so. A good feature request, but I'll
| just post again here next year :)
| kthartic wrote:
| Not to be rude, but I don't think I've seen the term "RSS" in
| over ten years. I'm sure there's probably a niche group of
| people that still use them (maybe disproportionally higher
| amongst HN users), but I think OP can be forgiven for not
| including one.
| Semaphor wrote:
| Which is the advantage of technologically boring WordPress
| blogs: They get them by default without the author ever
| having to worry.
| daxvena wrote:
| I kind of feel like you're missing out then.
|
| I was pretty young when RSS was "popular" and didn't really
| get into it back then. I started using it in the past couple
| of years, and I find it's one of the best ways to keep up to
| date with multiple things I want to follow (without being
| tied to a specific platform).
|
| I would also be pretty surprised if you haven't heard of
| podcasts in over ten years. I feel like a "podcast" isn't
| really a podcast if it doesn't have an RSS feed.
| kthartic wrote:
| My point wasn't whether or not I like RSS feeds - it was to
| explain why OP can be forgiven for not wanting to put the
| effort in creating one. I'm sure they're wonderful.
| WaitWaitWha wrote:
| I read the article, but it is not clear what _kind of_ co-op they
| want to create.
|
| Is it a brick & mortar, delivery? Is it making deals with local
| farmers & homesteads, or buying from large distributors at
| discount?
|
| I have participated in co-ops that were delivery only, local
| only. It was not always the cheapest, but for planning meals it
| worked out. The quality was almost always better if I just walked
| down to the large chain grocery store.
| WaitWaitWha wrote:
| > The quality was almost always better if I just walked down to
| the large chain grocery store.
|
| edit: The quality was almost always better * _than*_ if I just
| walked down to the large chain grocery store.
| qrush wrote:
| We're definitely aiming towards a brick & mortar - but we are
| still figuring out distribution and more (and will continue to
| do so until we're open for business)
| WaitWaitWha wrote:
| I have also seen co-ops where members could opt to do labour
| for both membership and food.
|
| And, although co-ops on the surface sound democratic, they
| can never achieve full democratic votes.
|
| I have participated with where I get to pick what I wanted
| from a pre-determined list that I had no immediate input to
| (the co-op "buyers" were), and I have also seen the list
| extended to "for the future".
|
| There was one where I got what I got, and had zero choice in
| what was in the basket.
|
| There was one where my "basket content" could be exchanged
| with anyone else within co-op, e.g. I had too much sugar
| beets and member X had too much kohlrabi. We wanted what the
| other had, bam! exchange made _prior to delivery_. This also
| helped with waste reduction.
|
| Good luck!
| bombcar wrote:
| So I've seen a couple of different kinds:
|
| 1. The one they're working on results in a "grocery store" when
| done - it's coop run and handles working with distributors,
| etc. It often ends up "feeling" like a Whole Foods or similar,
| as the "non-direct" farm products end up sourced from similar
| distributors.
|
| 2. The "farmer's market" type - where you end up with basically
| a continual farmer's market - this one can grow into being more
| of a "grocery store" but is often quite limited on the products
| available; think almost entirely local farm produce and nothing
| much else.
|
| 3. The "community supported agriculture" type - where you pay a
| flat fee and get a box every week/month/whatever, but don't
| really have much choice what's in the box. These can be the
| "closest to the farm" as you're literally getting boxes of
| whatever they're harvesting. However, they're often only active
| during harvest periods and you don't control what's in them.
|
| The third one is the only one I've seen be consistently _higher
| quality_ (and if I had to rank them it would go 3,2, 1) because
| the farmers pick the super ripe stuff for the CSA because they
| know it will be delivered and eaten in a day, not packed into a
| truck for travel across the country. You can also end up with
| strange fruits you 've never heard of before, but still exist.
| the-printer wrote:
| This may be an ignorant question. I'm sure I can search for it
| myself. But the commenters here sound well informed and
| experienced. Here it goes.
|
| I understand the process of establishing the food co-op, _but how
| did they get the food_??
| qrush wrote:
| Most co-ops pair with local distributors and national ones (the
| most prominent being National Co-op Grocers - https://ncg.coop)
| to actually get the food, but tons of steps to do before we are
| ready for this!
| kjbreil wrote:
| Just to clarify NCG is not a distributor but an overarching
| organization which helps Grocery Co-ops nationwide to run
| their business.
|
| A generally used distributer would be UNFI along with using
| local distributers.
| the-printer wrote:
| Wow. So this is a process. I can understand that when the
| goal is likely sustainability, scale and longevity. Thank you
| for sharing this with us.
| artec wrote:
| How do you all keep it truly democratic with (eventually) 1000+
| owners? Who decides on major decisions like, where it will be
| built, what funding sources you'll accept, who will do what work
| etc.
| miclill wrote:
| Cool, I've been a member of a Coop for about 10 years now.
|
| Website of our Coop (in German):
|
| https://foodcoop-karlsruhe.de
| Aachen wrote:
| I had never heard of this concept before seeing this article.
| Great to hear it's in Germany also! Would you know if there is
| a list of co-ops in Germany somewhere, to see if there is one
| closer to me than Karlsruhe?
| Symbiote wrote:
| Try REWE, the second largest supermarket chain in Germany.
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Cooperatives_in_Germa.
| ..
|
| A little north, we have Coop Danmark, also the second-biggest
| retailer (runs the supermarkets Kvickly, Brugsen,
| SuperBrugsen, Fakta, Irma).
| luckylion wrote:
| ReWe is very different from that though.
|
| There are two things named Cooperatives: One is a coop that
| is owned by those it serves, e.g. a housing coop is owned
| by those who live in the flats, a food coop is owned by
| those who buy the food. The other is the coop as a legal
| form of corporations where you have essentially no
| difference between a regular corporation, a LLC or a
| cooperative, and the cooperatives will usually own other
| entities with different legal forms for actually run the
| business.
|
| ReWe is the latter, and has nothing in common but the name
| of the legal form with what is discussed here.
| brnaftr361 wrote:
| I'm kinda curious are there any protections in place to mitigate
| somebody (ostensibly nefarious) wresting control of the consumer-
| owner representatives? I know one of the aspects of Mondragon's
| foundation is that there is zero outside influence and all
| control is within the shareholders, which are exclusively workers
| because these sort of buyout risks have actually played out.
| bombcar wrote:
| Co-ops themselves usually have a particular setup that's
| similar to a non-profit (and so they're not really "sellable"
| but can merge with other co-ops).
|
| The "nefarious" entities don't care; they will control the
| suppliers as that's where the money is made anyway; grocery
| stores are cost centers.
|
| The main protection I'd look for is avoid long-term and
| exclusive contracts. Anything that prohibits you from sourcing
| from other suppliers is highly suspect.
| Melatonic wrote:
| If you have not checked out a real CSA in your area I highly
| recommend it (Community Supported Agriculture) - its basically
| the convenience of a farmers market without you needing to
| dedicate the time to it. Plus you are getting the absolute
| freshest produce from a local farm directly.
|
| Definitely avoid though the big name giant ones that claim to be
| a "CSA" but are a giant national org
| oldandboring wrote:
| I love the concept of a CSA. We've tried it a few times. It's
| such a great idea and I want these things to succeed. For us,
| we canceled after a few weeks each time because the ones we
| joined were all setup similarly: once every week or so, you get
| a bag of food, whatever's in season. That leaves us having to
| figure out what to do with all this stuff we don't normally
| cook and don't have recipes for, and that the kids aren't used
| to eating. These are all solvable problems but I guess there
| was too much friction in adapting our lives to it. I'm not sure
| if it's actually easier to make shopping lists and drive to the
| store to buy exactly what we need, but it's what we were used
| to.
| Melatonic wrote:
| That is kind of the whole point of a CSA though - you adapt
| each week or month or whatever. How things used to be
| basically before the advent of the super grocery store and
| global supply chain.
| silexia wrote:
| Most areas don't have co-ops because not many people are willing
| to do a ton of work and not get any benefits from it. This is why
| capitalism works so well... Entrepreneurs take a ton of risk and
| do a ton of work and sometimes get windfall profits from it.
| _chap wrote:
| What an incredible legacy you're creating Nick. Keep dropping
| those breadcrumbs for the rest of us to follow!
| debacle wrote:
| There is a local group trying to "disrupt" coops in this way:
| find members to shell out $$, have a steering committee, do a lot
| of marketing, all before the coop even has a location in mind.
|
| Meanwhile there are actual coops (though they don't call
| themselves that) with skyrocketing membership who are doing, not
| planning, and slowly growing to encompass more than just produce.
| One of them now has a year-round greenhouse.
|
| I haven't been impressed by the style of coop the author writes
| about. It seems like the doers are much more successful. Just
| this past year a new farmers market started in an urban food
| desert with two vendors in a church parking lot. Now they are
| trying to find new space because they have 20+ vendors weekly. To
| my knowledge, they raised zero dollars to get started.
| socialismisok wrote:
| Where do the "doers" get the capital to create greenhouses and
| raise vegetables?
| phphphphp wrote:
| Do you need to create greenhouses and raise vegetables from
| the start? My understanding is that a coop (like any
| business) is a means to an end and so you can start out by
| leveraging what is effectively group buying to source high
| quality fresh produce and then, once established, gradually
| iterate towards total self reliance. Does that not work for
| this model?
| socialismisok wrote:
| It could, but where do you get the capital to do the group
| buying?
|
| My point is that the parent is likely simply not aware of
| the organizing that went into creating the group of "doers"
| they are praising.
| bombcar wrote:
| Around here the "doers" (we have farmer's markets and
| similar) are spouses/children of actual farmers, and even
| though their main product may be fifty five billion
| bushels of ethanol wheat, the family grows some crops for
| personal use, and they have been "roadside standing" the
| excess for years; the farmers market starts as an
| extension of that and from there can grow.
|
| You'll note that they already were farming for the big
| players.
|
| The other half are often "hobby farm" hobbyists who may
| or may not grow to be an actual business (there are at
| least two or three honey providers that have done this
| around here - starting small and obviously not the
| primary income to being large enough to have employees).
| yojo wrote:
| I've shopped at a couple worker owned co-ops. None of them
| grow their own food, though some do value-add preparation
| (e.g. prepared salads).
|
| I think there are farming co-ops, but that does not seem to
| be what the article is about.
| boole1854 wrote:
| Having seen the inside workings of a local farming co-op, I
| can tell you that they _they_ also do not necessarily grow
| their own food. Some produce is literally sourced from
| major chain grocery stores in town and resold with markup
| by the farmers at the farmer 's market. To be fair, the
| sellers usually do sell some of their own produce as well,
| if it's in season, but some of them don't hesitate to also
| simply resell grocery store produce to bulk out their
| product offerings.
|
| (And frankly, the grocery store produce often just looks
| more fresh than the produce actually grown by the vendors
| themselves.)
| bombcar wrote:
| There's one trying to get off the ground here, and it's a
| similar story - it has been more than five years and nothing
| has actually happened except marketing whatever it is they're
| doing.
|
| Meanwhile at least two different actual grocery stores have
| closed, and two more changed ownership; they could have bought
| either of them (I daresay a fundraiser would have worked) and
| kept them running.
|
| Some farmer's markets are hilarious, however, in that they
| don't actually involve any farmers, just people buying from the
| same massive supply firms that feed the grocery stores and
| selling it in little stalls.
| trelane wrote:
| Yeah, similar where I moved from about 8 years ago. We
| joined, they reached their numbers, and then.. nothing
| happened. We moved away, and it seems to be the same as when
| we left it. Still no store, but got a website etc.
| sct202 wrote:
| The type of coop that is in the article will end up partnering
| with UNFI for sourcing of products, and will end up with worse
| pricing than all the other places that UNFI supplies (Whole
| Foods is their largest) for the same products.
|
| The coops in my city all used the same consultants that are
| listed in the article and follow the exact same playbook.
| PaulDavisThe1st wrote:
| One problem with the "doers" just doing is that they don't
| build up the same level of social capital. When times get tough
| (and as long as we have capitalism, and likely after that too,
| they will get tough), they tend to fail out much harder and
| faster than the more traditional style of co-op that can fall
| back on more solidly established local goodwill.
| debacle wrote:
| The local farmer's market that I patronize (not a coop) has
| been around for 60 years. The one nearer me (a coop, the doer
| kind) has grown to multiple gigantic facilities, a few
| satellite locations, and regional name recognition for
| quality.
|
| I think they'll be okay.
| micromacrofoot wrote:
| They're just two different ways of approaching risk. The so-
| called "doers" are taking on much more up-front risk than this
| type of grassroots attempt. Ultimately the goal is the same.
| argiopetech wrote:
| I'm not sure that's true. "Doers" by definition, are putting
| their effort solely into providing food for a populace. If a
| company becomes necessary to do that, so be it, but it's an
| obstacle to be overcome. "Planners" (in this case, at least)
| are focused on building an organization which meets the 7 + 1
| coop goals linked at the end of the article and will, when
| complete, allow the provision of food to a populace. One is a
| bottom-up approach, the other is top-down. They share _a_
| goal, but they have different aims.
| nelsondev wrote:
| With the loss of the community grocery store, it seems the
| author is working on replacing the "community", and not yet the
| "grocery store".
|
| I too am wondering if there is a way to make incremental
| progress on getting groceries here, without needing to get
| enough momentum to build a giant store.
|
| Maybe there are 10 most common fruits/vegetables, and the coop
| with the existing 400 members can bulk purchase those? CSA
| models ostensibly seem a viable alternative.
| socialismisok wrote:
| I love this! Thanks for sharing the details. The world needs more
| co-ops.
|
| The US needs to make it easier to incorporate co-ops. As someone
| who looked into building both a software co-op and a housing co-
| op, getting the paperwork in order was such a larger hassle than
| seeing up an LLC.
| the_lonely_road wrote:
| What made it a hassle?
|
| I abandoned Ember for React even though I liked the former a
| lot more because the community was tiny meaning there were few
| resources and it was practically impossible to hire anyone that
| could hit the ground running. It turned out to be a great
| decision. I have set up a number of LLCs over the years and
| it's dead simple, but I know nothing about setting up a co op.
| Seems like it shouldn't be much more difficult except for how
| rare it is so I'm curious to hear your pain points.
| davidjfelix wrote:
| It depends a lot on the state that one resides (or
| incorporates) in. With LLCs they mostly all follow the same
| pattern and if you're the sole owner they can be done without
| charter, initial incorporation docs, etc. With coops, some
| states follow uniform common law LCA (limited cooperative
| association) laws and allow worker-owned coops pretty easily
| (although lawyers are generally less familiar as they're
| rarer). Other states only allow certain kinds of coops and
| require charters and organizational documents. Basically, any
| time you involve more than one person, there is some
| paperwork (LLC or otherwise). Coops have this, plus the added
| difficulty of not being uniform around the US.
|
| Last I looked, Colorado and IL had a lot of coop options to
| choose from, but nothing was as straight forward as an LLC
| where you just file 1 notice with the state and pay 100
| bucks. LCA states are close, but you still have the "many
| people" issue.
| thinkcontext wrote:
| I belong to 120 person food co-op. Its operated out of the
| basement of house since the 80s. We're a different model than
| described here, its a hybrid of a buying club and a grocery
| store. All of the labor is unpaid, you must be a member to shop,
| it has limited official open hours but everyone gets a key and
| can shop themselves whenever they like. Most people pay a 20%
| markup on goods but people that have extra responsibility pay
| less.
| dugmartin wrote:
| The article mentions no open food coops in central or eastern
| Massachusetts but there are quite a few here in western Mass. Not
| sure why the difference but maybe it's due to greatly cheaper
| rent?
| tacostakohashi wrote:
| It tends to work in places where a for-profit supermarket would
| be marginal (at best), but people still need their groceries,
| fuel, etc.
| M2Ys4U wrote:
| The vast majority of co-ops _are_ for-profit enterprises, so
| I 'm not sure why you'd phrase it like that.
| tacostakohashi wrote:
| Because their primary goal is to provide goods and services
| to their shareholders, rather than profits and dividends.
| bombcar wrote:
| And look how much the land sold for - $36 million! In rural
| areas the land is basically free, and even then many of the
| "for-profit" grocery stores are just family owned businesses
| that have more in common with a coop than you might expect.
| wpietri wrote:
| I love the playbook mentioned here. I think it's part of this
| library: https://fci.coop/business-development/
|
| Seems reminiscent to me of the open-source ethos or the
| (declining?) community spirit in tech startup land. Except where
| organizations compete directly, collaboration makes a lot of
| sense.
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