[HN Gopher] Evidence that the evolution of mammals began in the ... ___________________________________________________________________ Evidence that the evolution of mammals began in the Southern Hemisphere Author : kalimanzaro Score : 245 points Date : 2022-12-19 13:39 UTC (9 hours ago) (HTM) web link (www.australiangeographic.com.au) (TXT) w3m dump (www.australiangeographic.com.au) | Konohamaru wrote: | No wonder mammals are afraid everything's trying to kill them and | think everything's poisonous. | aussiesnack wrote: | Our biggest animal dangers here are humans, horses, and cows. | In that order. | nomel wrote: | There's a theory that snakes pushed the evolution of our visual | cortex: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snake_detection_theory | greggsy wrote: | I have a lot of respect for Professor Tim Flannery - he's a great | science communicator and hosted a heap of shows in the early | 2000's. | | He fronted a parliamentary hearing on climate change some time | around 2010, where a heroic Liberal minister stated something | along the lines of 'you're a palaeontologist, not a climate | scientist, so you're argument is invalid'. It was pretty sad to | see. | | Even being a climate scientist back then was cause for your | credentials to be brought into question, let alone one from a | cognate field. | poulpy123 wrote: | > Liberal minister | | Not being familiar with Australian politics, is it liberal in | the US meaning or the european meaning ? | gloryjulio wrote: | But even in US meaning, liberals are central right. Dems are | central right. There is no labor or left party in US. The | closest u can find is Bernie who is a social dem. | andrewmutz wrote: | In the US the democrats are not center-right relative to | the US population. | gloryjulio wrote: | They r central right acedemically even in US. The | difference is that the public might perceive them as 'the | US left'. Isn't relative definition more confusing? Isn't | it easier to put everything on the same scale so that | there is no confusion? To say US dem party is liberal is | exactly right. Liberals are central right | kortilla wrote: | There is no "scale". What is considers "left" in Europe | just looks like authoritarian nationalism from citizens | of countries with a completely different set of | priorities. | gloryjulio wrote: | Mixing up Russia style commies and Europe social Dems | never fails to amuse me. Why would ppl keep doing such | things? | dragonwriter wrote: | > But even in US meaning, liberals are central right. | | In the US, different people use "liberal" to mean: | | (1) Everything to the left of center of institutional power | of the Republican Party, or | | (2) Everything to the right of their preferred viewpoint | (common among the US's small number of actual leftists.) | | (3) People who agree with their particular take on pro- | capitalist econonic policy (often prefixed with | "classical".) | | Among other uses. | gseggset wrote: | Why do American users keep repeating this rubbish? Have you | all read the same book / blockpost making this ridiculous | claim? | mindslight wrote: | First past the post voting has given the two party | duopoly a death grip on American politics. People | generally have a latent party, and ascribe anything that | they disagree with as part of the opposing political | camp. To answer your question, someone in the blue tribe | (latent Democrat) will see the big-business-supreme legal | regime and blame it on overwhelming right-leaning | politics. Meanwhile someone in the red tribe (latent | Republican) will look at the same freedom-destroying laws | and their poor outcomes, but lay the blame at | overwhelming leftism. In reality, the grassroots of both | parties want similar things, but are herded into violent | disagreement by the corporate-sponsored political | machine. | | (This isn't to say the two parties are the same, | especially post ~2018. Just that the main dynamic is very | similar) | gloryjulio wrote: | I don't understand ur logic. Won't American say Dems are | left? and non-Americans would say there is no left in | America acedemically? Isn't that the opposite of what u | saying? | kortilla wrote: | > and non-Americans would say there is no left in America | acedemically | | "left" isn't a thing academically because there isn't | some line that actually captures the wide variety of | political positions. | | This meme of "there is no left in America" is just a | childish way of saying, "I don't like the current | majority opinion of the Democratic Party". | firsttimebigboy wrote: | No, it means when compared on the international stage the | American left is no more like the global center-right. | | Also, the majority of American citizens don't like the | opinions of the democratic party. They works for the | corps, not the people. | gloryjulio wrote: | Political science is an actual subject. I would suggest | everyone to take look just to learn bit. Why do u think I | don't like Dems? The only thing I said is that they r not | left. Which is true. I stated it like I say cold or hot. | Did I ever mention I prefer which? | coldtea wrote: | > _"left" isn't a thing academically because there isn't | some line that actually captures the wide variety of | political positions._ | | Well, for Europeans (and I'd guess Canadians, Latin | Americans, etc.) there is a line, and the Dems never cut | it. A fuzzy line (a spectrum if you will on the left) | doesn't mean there isn't one, and one can be of either | side. Dems are not, and have never been, even close to | the fuzzy "border" part of that line, always to the right | of it. | | Centrist is the more accurate term for Dems (and even | that's charitable). | | It's basically center-right (Dems), and right-to-far- | right (GOP). | | Sure, for some Americans, Democrats might be called | "left", but then again other Americans also considered | Swedish style social democracy as "communism". | | > _This meme of "there is no left in America" is just a | childish way of saying, "I don't like the current | majority opinion of the Democratic Party"._ | | No, it's more like saying "America never has had a left | party, just a party more to the left than the other". | | Not in any historical sense of the term as developed and | still currently used in Europe, at any rate. | klipt wrote: | Giving how hard it is to find affordable housing in | Stockholm, I have to wonder if Swedish style social | democracy is so great after all, if it can't even solve | the fundamental human need of housing by building enough | for everyone. | bjelkeman-again wrote: | That feels to me like a straw man. | | Poverty rate in Sweden is, like in most of Western | Europe, low. [1] whilst the cost of living is lower than | in the USA as an example. [2] At the same time schools, | university, healthcare, social services, is accessible to | everyone. There is a shortage of housing, only 0.8% of | rental properties are availbe for rent[3] but it isn't | necessarily only a failure of government as the housing | market is largely commercial, only 19% of housing is | owned by the government [4]. | | [1] https://data.oecd.org/inequality/poverty-rate.htm | | [2] https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of- | living/rankings_by_country.js... | | [3] https://www.scb.se/en/finding-statistics/statistics- | by-subje... | | [4] https://ternercenter.berkeley.edu/wp- | content/uploads/2020/11... | klipt wrote: | No I mention housing supply because it is an issue that | cuts orthogonally across the popular left-right | dimension. | | Japan is very capitalist but builds lots of housing | because landowners can build up with little zoning | restrictions. | | The USSR was very communist and they also built a lot of | housing because the government just went in and did it. | | But the USA and Europe seem to easily get stuck in NIMBY | traps where nothing gets built, and then when prices go | up due to lack of supply people will reach for solutions | like rent control, which almost 100% of economists will | tell you is bad for longterm housing supply because it | discourages new construction. | | I've heard Stockholm's rent control is especially stupid | because while the landlord is forced to rent to the | primary tenant at a low, below market rate, that primary | tenant can turn around and _sublet_ their entire unit at | a much higher, market rate to a secondary tenant. So the | primary lease is basically a capital asset with perpetual | returns. The unit ends up renting for market rate anyway | to the secondary tenant, while the primary tenant | collects free money. | davidgay wrote: | > Well, for Europeans (and I'd guess Canadians, Latin | Americans, etc.) there is a line, and the Dems never cut | it. | | This is overly simplistic. For instance, the US (left?) | has been ahead of Europe on issues like accessibility for | the disabled or same-sex marriage. | coldtea wrote: | Those are plain old shared with bourgeois / social | democracy concerns, not specifically left concerns (left | is about class issues, and focuses on the economic | substrate and equality, which is sees as more fundamental | and where all others are mere derivatory or pale in | importnace. Marx even considered these kind of things | "bourgeois rights" and somewhat dismissed them. | | In any case, it's not like the right is against | "accessibility for the disabled". | | Similarly, same-sex marriage is not about left vs right | but about progressive/liberal (in the in favor of | invididual rights sense) vs concervative. | | An anarcho-capitalist can be all about same-sex marriage | without being left (the opposite), where even communists | were known to be socially conservative in several cases, | or pioneering such rights in others. | arethuza wrote: | _" There is only one party in the United States, the | Property Party ... and it has two right wings: Republican | and Democrat."_ | | Gore Vidal | ClassyJacket wrote: | In any other western country and most of Europe, American | Democrats would be considered insane right wing | extremists. They don't even support having a healthcare | system or banning guns. | klipt wrote: | In America, the anti-Romani and anti-immigration stances | of many "left" European parties would be considered right | wing. | | It's almost like not all issues fit neatly on a single | left/right dimension. | | Also the Democrats created Obamacare which is similar to | the Swiss system of mandated insurance, so they obviously | do care about healthcare. | | And in many states, Democrats _have_ passed gun control | at the state level. | throwawaylinux wrote: | > They don't even support having a healthcare system | | That doesn't sound right. | | > or banning guns. | | In which other western country or part of Europe are guns | banned? | adamc wrote: | It isn't right, but also... in the US, parties are | institutionally weak. People do not (cannot) vote for | parties, but for individual representatives. Ergo, | different Democrats (or Republicans) run on issues | perceived to have saliency locally. From such a | collection of elected individuals, it is much more | difficult to craft a "party" position -- because in some | districts, supporting healthcare/gun control/whatever is | not a winner. | | Increasing partisanship and gerrymandering are making | this less true, but it is still a significant force, | particularly for Senate seats. | | Strong parties, that run on a policy platform and where | they have much more control over their members, just | isn't a thing in the US, and couldn't be, without a lot | of constitutional changes. | Izkata wrote: | > They don't even support having a healthcare system | | Democrats are the ones pushing for universal healthcare: | https://democrats.org/where-we-stand/party- | platform/achievin... | | > or banning guns. | | Yep, they're the ones pushing for gun control too: | https://democrats.org/where-we-stand/party- | platform/healing-... | ecshafer wrote: | I don't see how one could read socialist literature and | not come to that conclusion. Read Kropotkin, Marx, Mao, | Engels, Proudhon, and you can not come away thinking that | both major US parties are to the right. I think one would | be hard pressed reading just economics and coming away | with that conclusions. They are pro-capital, pro- | imperial, pro-free trade parties. That sure sounds like a | right-wing party. | xxpor wrote: | Minor nit: free trade isn't right or left wing in the | traditional sense, it's isolationist vs globalist. Marx | was generally in favor of free trade because he thought | at the time protectionism bred more industrialists: | | >The question of Free Trade or Protection moves entirely | within the bounds of the present system of capitalist | production, and has, therefore, no direct interest for us | socialists who want to do away with that system. | | >Indirectly, however, it interests us inasmuch as we must | desire as the present system of production to develop and | expand as freely and as quickly as possible: because | along with it will develop also those economic phenomena | which are its necessary consequences, and which must | destroy the whole system: misery of the great mass of the | people, in consequence of overproduction. This | overproduction engendering either periodical gluts and | revulsions, accompanied by panic, or else a chronic | stagnation of trade; division of society into a small | class of large capitalist, and a large one of practically | hereditary wage-slaves, proletarians, who, while their | numbers increase constantly, are at the same time | constantly being superseded by new labor-saving | machinery; in short, society brought to a deadlock, out | of which there is no escaping but by a complete | remodeling of the economic structure which forms it | basis. | | From this point of view, 40 years ago Marx pronounced, in | principle, in favor of Free Trade as the more progressive | plan, and therefore the plan which would soonest bring | capitalist society to that deadlock. But if Marx declared | in favor of Free Trade on that ground, is that not a | reason for every supporter of the present order of | society to declare against Free Trade? If Free Trade is | stated to be revolutionary, must not all good citizens | vote for Protection as a conservative plan? | | >If a country nowadays accepts Free Trade, it will | certainly not do so to please the socialists. It will do | so because Free trade has become a necessity for the | industrial capitalists. But if it should reject Free | Trade and stick to Protection, in order to cheat the | socialists out of the expected social catastrophe, that | will not hurt the prospects of socialism in the least. | Protection is a plan for artificially manufacturing | manufacturers, and therefore also a plan for artificially | manufacturing wage laborers. You cannot breed the one | without breeding the other. | | https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1888/free- | trade/ | photochemsyn wrote: | Politicians are subservient to the entities that fund them, | and in Australia? | | > "Coal is mined in every state of Australia. The largest | black coal resources occur in Queensland and New South Wales. | About 70% of coal mined in Australia is exported, mostly to | eastern Asia, and of the balance most is used in electricity | generation. In 2019-20 Australia exported 390 Mt of coal (177 | Mt metallurgical coal and 213 Mt thermal coal) and was the | world's largest exporter of metallurgical coal and second | largest exporter of thermal coal." | | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coal_in_Australia | | The fact that Australia has been experiencing severe climate- | change-related whipsaws from extreme flooding to extreme | drought and fire hasn't changed this dynamic, as the | Australian government cheerfully reports: | | > "Coal export volumes have grown at an average annual rate | of 2.5 per cent from 285 Mt in 2010-11 to 363 Mt in | 2020-21... In 2020, Australia held 14 per cent of the world's | coal reserves (black and brown), ranking third behind the | United States (23 per cent) and Russia (15 per cent)." | | It's the same in the USA, although here we have two fossil- | fuel-owned parties, Dems and Reps, but the former lie about | their climate agenda while the latter are honest about it. In | reality, both are owned by Wall Street interests who invest | heavily in fossil fuels. | | At least they could be honest about the science, instead of | trying to hide the reality. | erklik wrote: | Liberal party in Australia is the centre-right party. I am | guessing they'd still be left of the US right-wing but that's | beside the point. | tw1984 wrote: | I personally won't label the Liberal party as a centre- | right party or left of the US right wing when it is | currently led by Peter Dutton who is a typical far right | element in modern politics. | | I also struggle to categorize its recent former leader Tony | Abbott and his close mate Joe Hockey who was the Treasurer | as "centre-right". We are talking about a priest who was | famously & accurately labelled by the only female | Australian Prime Minister as a misogyny - that speech was | voted for the No.1 moment in Australian TV history! These | two are the people who want everyone to believe that it is | a life style choice when people don't buy & drive ferrari. | | Oh, let's also don't forget what happened to Liberal's | actual centre-right leader Malcolm Turnbull. He was | replaced by a bulldozer PM who is responsible for the use | of automated machines to force the most vulnerable people | to fork out billions of $ to cover their non-exist debts so | his federal budget can look better to his supporters. Is | this centre-right? | robbiep wrote: | The Liberal party, for all its recent decade plus of | derangement, is still clearly a center right party on an | international scope. It would, for example, be anathema | to degrade the level of services we experience in this | country (and the Libs did pump a lot of money into | services over the last few years, even whilst favouring | private schools and clawing back robotically cash from | those unable to fight back) | [deleted] | moffkalast wrote: | That's especially funny since almost all we know about the | climate's long term behaviour has been dug up from the ground. | mistrial9 wrote: | first mistake - you take the words of a politician, at one | stroke, against a lifetime of disciplined study and speaking. | permo-w wrote: | this article takes a spectacularly long time to get to the point | of what the actual discovery was | psychphysic wrote: | legostormtroopr wrote: | > You like lock them up, sterilise them, use them for | experiments. | | Not withstanding that your commentary has nothing to do with | the article, as an Australian I am going to request some more | information on this. | | Australia is by no means a perfect country, but your phrasing | suggests that First Nations people are _currently_ sterilised | or used for experiments. That may have been the case, but hasn | 't been for many decades. | | Additionally, First Nations people have access to substantial | government programs, including free higher education, welfare | and housing programs, and specialised medical support. So | please, with less inflamatory rhetoric and more fact, how can | you possibly compare Australia with District9 (which was itself | more accurately a reflection of apartheid South Africa, not | Australia)? | psychphysic wrote: | I'll abstain from engaging as the original comment was | flagged. | | Guess not a topic for HN. | Nifty3929 wrote: | "Currently taking it with a massive heap of salt as potential | biased source" | | You probably mean a tiny grain of salt. As in: "There is very | little meat here, so I'll only need [to take it with] a tiny | bit (a pinch) of salt." | delecti wrote: | My understanding of that idiom (and how I see it most | commonly used) is that the skepticism is proportional to the | salt. Slightly suspect things only get a bit of salt and | skepticism, hugely unproven things get a lot of salt and | skepticism. Given that, an unproven but large claim would | need a lot of salt and skepticism | | Based on the supposed origin of the idiom, I think salt and | skepticism being proportional is a bit closer to the original | meaning, than them being inversely proportional, though | neither is especially close. | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grain_of_salt | psychphysic wrote: | Thanks for the link! Very interesting read I'd assumed the | salt was to make something more palatable seems vaguely | right. | vouaobrasil wrote: | There is strong evidence that a lot of bird evolution occurred in | Gondwana as well. A good book for that is Tim Low's "Where Song | Began". | AlbertCory wrote: | (Disclosure: been to Oz three times & I love it) | | I hate to get all _ad hominem_ here, but the fact that it comes | from an Australian journal is just a tad bit self-interested. It | reminds me of the Chinese scientists who keep insisting that | humans evolved in China, not Africa: | | https://www.news.com.au/technology/science/evolution/chinese... | MichaelDickens wrote: | I don't know anything about the subject itself, but I don't | like that the article makes hyperbolic claims like | | > Together this weighty band of experts has just published a | paper in the scientific literature that's likely to be seen as | landmark in our understanding of life on Earth. | aussiesnack wrote: | So I take it you'd be equally suspicious of all the prior work | from the Northern Hemisphere that claimed mammalian origins to | be there? I guess that's reasonable. Western Europeans and | North Americans are the default humans/scientists after all, | and are completely objective about their central place in | everything, even pre-human evolution. | somishere wrote: | Point taken, but where would you expect Australians to publish | re a fossil found in southern Australia? In a North American | Journal? | AlbertCory wrote: | Are there not international journals? Peer review by non- | Australians? | somishere wrote: | It's peer reviewed by Australians? | twobitshifter wrote: | I got the same feeling, the critical fossil is a type of tooth | discovered by the author many years ago. | AlbertCory wrote: | Aside from the truth or falsity of this theory: | | Why is it a matter of regional pride whether mammals (or humans) | originated in your region? | | Usually there was no nation or culture there at the time, and in | this case, not even any humans. | escapecharacter wrote: | I need to know when we start the Mammals vs Birds game in the | World Cup who to cheer for | zoklet-enjoyer wrote: | People are proud of all kinds of things that they have no | control over/didn't do. Race, nation, sports teams, etc | aaron695 wrote: | Map of the Earth - https://dinosaurpictures.org/ancient-earth#120 | (Display Options -> "equator" for better context) | | DOI - https://doi.org/10.1080/03115518.2022.2132288 | justinator wrote: | Amazing. I wish the dropdown menu was sorted in chronological | order. | barbazoo wrote: | This is fascinating. | guerrilla wrote: | So then, all the invasive species are actually indigenous there* | ;) | | * This is a joke; I know how it works. | personjerry wrote: | I hate how the article asserts the new theory as fact | analog31 wrote: | It also refers to the previous theory as "dogma." | sesm wrote: | Kurzgesagt recent video was about quasi-stars, a very exotic | hypothetical object described in just couple of papers with 0 | proofs of existence. It's so marginal, that even Wikipedia has | a 'no recent papers on subject' badge on corresponding article. | Still, an entire video was made, as if they were describing an | established scientific concept. | russdill wrote: | The video made it clear that they are hypothetical, with a | lot of, "if they exist" | marmetio wrote: | From the video about 45 seconds in: | | "but if they existed, they would solve one of the largest | mysteries of cosmology" | | Is that not enough? | xenotize wrote: | This video might give you some insight on why they use the | research that they use, or rather, the lack of research they | use. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HjHMoNGqQTI | Dylan16807 wrote: | Okay, what billionaires want propaganda about weird star | objects? | | This kind of thing is important with relation to _some_ of | their video topics, but what 's the connection here? | whatshisface wrote: | Unless he said they were real in the video I don't see the | problem. | JoeAltmaier wrote: | Isn't it possible to compare dna between marsupials, mammals and | monotremes and figure out which is 'earlier'? The paper described | depends entirely on fossils which is good but not a smoking gun. | masklinn wrote: | Sure is, that's the principle of a (time-scaled) phylogenetic | tree. | | But it does not tell you anything about where they came from. | adrian_b wrote: | Marsupials and placentals are more closely related than any of | them is related to monotremes. This is what has been determined | from the DNA comparison. | | Neither marsupials nor placentals are "earlier", they both have | a common ancestor. This paper is about that common ancestor, | more precisely about the continent where it lived, which now | appears to have been Gondwana, in contradiction with earlier | suppositions. | | Gondwana is the former union of Africa, South America, | Antarctica, Australia, Madagascar and India. The evolution of | mammals has been influenced much more by the breaking and | fusion of the continents than the evolution of other animals, | because for mammals travel across seas was much less likely to | be successful. | hinkley wrote: | I assume you mean compared to birds? Ferns, wasps and slugs | don't like ocean voyages much, either. Coconuts are adapted | to them (and yet the Polynesians had to bring them along to | many places they now exist). | JoeAltmaier wrote: | After hurricanes, frequently giant rafts of detritus can | travel across the ocean. These sometimes have all sorts of | life on them. It is conceivable that would include all of | those creatures? | MichaelDickens wrote: | This article talks about something called the "Sherwin-Williams | Effect", but DuckDuckGo doesn't turn up any relevant results. | Does anyone know what it is? | kthejoker2 wrote: | I think it's just an in joke about the Sherwin Williams paint | company logo, which shows paint running down the Earth from the | Northern Hemisphere. | | http://penguinology.blogspot.com/2011/01/fossil-hunt-in-anta... | masklinn wrote: | Hasn't that been pretty well established for a while? | | I thought it well grounded that mammals had evolved on Gondwana | (the southern part of Pangea) during the process of it splitting | away from Laurasia, and had settled Laurasia from Gondwana | | Gondwana was composed of now South America, Africa, India, and | Australia. | ttyprintk wrote: | National Geographic covered it about a year ago: | | https://archive.vn/YHs1H | WelcomeShorty wrote: | Fascinating article. | | "Many paleontologists angrily reject the DNA findings, | arguing there must be something wrong with the molecular | clocks the geneticists use to date their findings. The | geneticists counter that paleontologists just haven't found | the right fossils yet." | | And that should make clear it is not that clear cut as I | (with ZERO background knowledge in either area) thought it | was. | olddustytrail wrote: | > Many paleontologists angrily reject | | Just this quote immediately put me off the article. Weasel | word "many" to start with (how many? Four or five? Half of | them?) and followed up with emotive language (how angry | were they? Perhaps they were just bored with shoddy | justifications?) | brightball wrote: | I think there are certain things that we're simply never | going to be able to know with certainty, but it sure it fun | to talk about. | | That Ancient Apocalypse show in Netflix is really | interesting along those lines. | JoeAltmaier wrote: | Hm; I thought that Ancient Apocalypse had been debunked | here, as a collection of old myths that had been | thoroughly discredited, but now presented as current | issues. Just an invented-content money grab kind of | thing? | CommitSyn wrote: | Graham Hancock says that it hasn't been truly debunked, | but that 'establishment archeologists' are programmed to | dispute it, or something. | | 'Establishment archeologists' say it's a bunch of BS. | | Mr. Hancock studied sociology for a while before | switching gears to journalism. | | It's fun to think about, but as far as him being the | modern day Galileo, I'm not personally buying it. | over_bridge wrote: | You can always tell a conspiracy theory when it relies on | some nebulous group of villains to prop it up. "They | don't want you to know what I'm telling you". Tell me | clearly who 'they' refers to. | | Big archeology? Could we get some names? Maybe an | interview with some of them? No, just imagine them like | the illuminati but dirtier and poorer, and extremely | tribal for some reason. | | People just aren't as good at organising as the theories | demand they are. They would 100% break ranks if there was | a chance to make a major discovery and be famous for it, | group loyalty be damned. | rhodorhoades wrote: | Well... the whole 'ancient apocalypse theory' might be | discredited, but the sites they visit date back extremely | far into our ancient history. It also shows that pockets | of architectural knowledge rapidly advanced and then | receded all across the known world. One thing is for | sure, the human story is far from a ladder, with periods | of around 1000 years of advancements and then everything | collapses for a couple generations. | | I think it goes back to the OP's original point... there | are some things we cannot ever know for sure but they are | fun to learn and talk about. | ummonk wrote: | You're making it sound like everything advanced and then | receded at the same time across the world. This hasn't | been the case since the end of the last glacial period. | There have been recedings of local civilizations | scattered throughout history, as well as some large scale | regional disruptions (e.g. late bronze age collapse, | decline of the roman empire), but nothing like periods | where everything collapses globally. | nomel wrote: | With "pockets of", I read this | | > It also shows that pockets of architectural knowledge | rapidly advanced and then receded all across the known | world. | | as "individual pockets, all around the world, advanced | and receded." | ummonk wrote: | Oh, you're right. My objection was based on my own | misinterpretation of "pockets" as referring to time | periods and/or specific architectural knowledge rather | than to particular locations. | ordu wrote: | _> Ancient Apocalypse show in Netflix is really | interesting along those lines._ | | https://www.sapiens.org/archaeology/ancient-apocalypse- | pseud... | ChrisMarshallNY wrote: | _> That Ancient Apocalypse show in Netflix_ | | I started to watch it, then figured out that I didn't | really want to. | mkehrt wrote: | Uh, that show is horrific pseudoscience nonsense; you | know that, right? | ummonk wrote: | Apparently even on HN some people fall for History | Channel type nonsense. | beaned wrote: | Don't understand why you guys characterize these things | this way. The person who brought it up would probably | just say that it stimulates thought and make you think. | In your response, you assume one who shares the show has | "fallen for" it - like definitely believes it, without | doubt. | | Never heard this type of pushback about Ancient Aliens, | which is even more ridiculous. I feel like the replies | are going to be "but nobody took that seriously anyway." | Firstly, I dunno about that. Secondly, not sure anyone's | taking Ancient Apocalypse more seriously. | | The show presents a theory, it's not claiming a fact. | It's so bizarre that out of all the media out there that | walks the line between history, science, and outlandish | ideas, this one very specific show, for some reason, gets | all this hateful focus. Very weird. | ummonk wrote: | If someone posted about Ancient Aliens or any other | pseudoscience show on here and said it's "really | interesting" in a discussion about history (rather than, | say, fantasy or entertainment), we'd characterize it the | same way. I don't know why you think Ancient Apocalypse | is being singled out when I explicitly said "History | Channel type nonsense". | labster wrote: | Ancient Apocalpse is quite entertaining horrific | pseudoscience nonsense. You just have to come at it from | the right perspective. | | For me, it's fodder for modern TTRPG campaigns and a | Sailor Moon prequel fanfic, as well as letting me know of | the existence of ancient sites I never knew about. ___________________________________________________________________ (page generated 2022-12-19 23:00 UTC)