[HN Gopher] Archaeologists Discover Lost Civilization in Guatemala
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       Archaeologists Discover Lost Civilization in Guatemala
        
       Author : 8bitsrule
       Score  : 70 points
       Date   : 2022-12-24 08:38 UTC (2 days ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (www.vice.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (www.vice.com)
        
       | Herodotus38 wrote:
       | Obligatory direct link to the paper:
       | 
       | https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/ancient-mesoamerica/...
        
         | blakesterz wrote:
         | There are some really cool images there.
        
           | gordondavidf wrote:
           | +1 to this. Strongly recommend a glance of the paper for the
           | images.
        
       | NelsonMinar wrote:
       | If this interests you, read Charles Mann's book 1491.
       | https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/39020.1491
        
       | ownlife wrote:
       | Cool TED Talk on LiDAR - "Let's scan the whole planet with LiDAR"
       | 
       | https://www.ted.com/talks/chris_fisher_let_s_scan_the_whole_...
       | 
       | YouTube link - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6rIUxHZ9f4
        
       | jonnycomputer wrote:
       | I really don't like the title of this submission. It is
       | unnecessarily sensationalist. And why link to Vice.com when there
       | is an open paper you can link to instead [1]?
       | 
       | Here is the abstract of that paper:
       | 
       | LiDAR coverage of a large contiguous area within the Mirador-
       | Calakmul Karst Basin (MCKB) of northern Guatemala has identified
       | a concentration of Preclassic Maya sites (ca. 1000 b.c.-a.d. 150)
       | connected by causeways, forming a web of implied social,
       | political, and economic interactions. This article is an
       | introduction to one of the largest, contiguous, regional LiDAR
       | studies published to date in the Maya Lowlands. More than 775
       | ancient Maya settlements are identified within the MCKB, and 189
       | more in the surrounding karstic ridge, which we condensed into
       | 417 ancient cities, towns, and villages of at least six
       | preliminary tiers based on surface area, volumetrics, and
       | architectural configurations. Many tiered sites date to the
       | Middle and Late Preclassic periods, as determined by
       | archaeological testing, and volumetrics of contemporaneously
       | constructed and/or occupied architecture with similar
       | morphological characteristics. Monumental architecture,
       | consistent architectural formats, specific site boundaries, water
       | management/collection facilities, and 177 km of elevated
       | Preclassic causeways suggest labor investments that defy
       | organizational capabilities of lesser polities and potentially
       | portray the strategies of governance in the Preclassic period.
       | Settlement distributions, architectural continuities,
       | chronological contemporaneity, and volumetric considerations of
       | sites provide evidence for early centralized administrative and
       | socio-economic strategies within a defined geographical region.
       | 
       | [1] https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/ancient-
       | mesoamerica/...
        
       | Gabriel_Martin wrote:
       | I find LiDAR scanning through canopies super fascinating, but I
       | ended up going down a different rabbit hole while reading this. I
       | found the petition linked below after a cursory look into the
       | doctor of archeology mentioned within this article. I wonder how
       | this work fits into the aspirations mentioned within it.
       | 
       | To me that petition brought up thoughts about how one might
       | manage projects like this with respect to local population, and
       | if/how efforts like this can aspire to maximize positive impacts
       | for local populations, relating to economic mobility. It also
       | brought up concerns about the worst parts of colonialism/neo-
       | colonialism, namely the looting and suppression of local
       | populations for the economic interests of foreign or state
       | related interests. I wonder how the archeologist in question
       | changed his methodologies (if at all) in response to the
       | petition.
       | 
       | https://www.change.org/p/society-for-american-archaeology-re...
        
         | AlotOfReading wrote:
         | I wish Hansen would go into a quiet retirement somewhere. He's
         | notorious in the American archaeological community and frankly
         | something of a political bogeyman for many of the political
         | groups in Central America. He's been accused of everything from
         | being involved with human/drug trafficking groups, to rigging
         | elections, to pursuing shadowy mormon illuminati goals. He
         | hasn't done any favors to his reputation by associating with
         | unsavory individuals like Mel Gibson for funding and helping to
         | produce whatever the hell _Apocalypto_ was. The Mirador basin
         | his project is named after is widely considered to be
         | nonexistent and not an isolated geographic region in its own
         | right.
         | 
         | I don't personally believe much of the stuff that's been said
         | about him (having never met the guy) because it's so
         | cartoonishly evil, but he's so politically radioactive that
         | anything he might try to do to benefit local communities is
         | _never_ going to get their support.
        
       | groffee wrote:
       | Lost to who? Ask the locals and they'll know all about it.
        
         | kshahkshah wrote:
         | Exactly, my buddy who used to regularly visit Guatemala has
         | paid drivers to bring him out to still-covered ruins and
         | explore for the day. The locals know about this stuff.
        
         | college_physics wrote:
         | Yes but they dont have a fancy lidar so why bother.
         | 
         | Reminds me of this story (here simplified and from memory :-)
         | about ancient Maya script that was deciphered once the
         | brilliant code breakers had the inspiration to talk to the
         | locals (who were still talking the script)
        
       | ks2048 wrote:
       | There's long been a serious problem with looting at Maya sites. I
       | wonder how that affects what they publish with these surveys.
        
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