[HN Gopher] Always look down in London: Pavement oddities ___________________________________________________________________ Always look down in London: Pavement oddities Author : zeristor Score : 217 points Date : 2023-01-14 09:29 UTC (13 hours ago) (HTM) web link (londonist.com) (TXT) w3m dump (londonist.com) | stevesearer wrote: | I have a hobby of posting these sorts of things around Santa | Barbara while out running: | https://www.instagram.com/santabarbaradetails/ | | Most are survey markers, contractor stamps, road names, etc... | Hani1337 wrote: | And most importantly, because the streets are very slippery and | the people look unhappy regardless. | _a_a_a_ wrote: | The 'Wood-block paving' I know of as wooden cobbles. Iron-shod | horses apparently made a lot of noise on stone and IIRC | experiments were done to reduce this, the best results being from | using wood not stone for cobbling. So it was a noise reduction | thing in essence. | | One of my locals is a coaching inn that goes back centuries. | Where the coaches would have entered is covered by the building | above and under that, where people now sit and drink, there are | still wooden cobbles. I doubt they're from the original horse- | time (which is only a century ago, or less), but there they are. | ttyprintk wrote: | Victory against fatbergs is impossible in the near term. As | cities mature, and the use of flushable wipes becomes more | accepted, fatbergs will appear in UK and the colonies. | bell-cot wrote: | A very easy, reasonable step would be to heavily tax wipes | which made claims like "flushable", but failed to disintegrate | (as toilet paper does) in the sewer. | quadrifoliate wrote: | It's trivial to stop the fatbergs caused due to flushable wipes | if city administrations spend a few minutes thinking about | _why_ people use flushable wipes instead of spending time and | money in celebrity campaigns [1] against them. | | The conclusion is obvious - wiping with dry toilet paper is an | inefficient, unhygienic, and sometimes painful way of cleaning | yourself after defecation. Hence, people use wet wipes to "feel | fresher", as the advertisements euphemistically put it. | | The solution is also quite straightforward - go all the way and | replace most uses of toilet paper with bidets or washlets, | following the lead of smart nations like Japan. Wet wipe usage | will automatically plummet. City planners all over the world | should be running campaigns promoting bidet usage and | partnering with washlet companies instead of sternly wagging | their fingers at wet wipe users. | | ---------------------------------------- | | [1] https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2019/oct/14/andy- | serkis-p... | ttyprintk wrote: | We're way past talking anuses; we're in class-action lawsuit | territory against being able to market the term "flushable". | | The buyers and users of wipes are changing diapers on little | kids and old people, not on-the-go busy professionals. The | immense concentrations in sewers are not correlated with | office worker productivity. Wipes are convenient to do that | in public. Only a few countries have enough trash cans nearby | for the occasion. | | So, if someone is going to market the term flushable, I want | them to be responsible for plumbing fiascos when it is. | europeanguy wrote: | I agree with your solution. However, changing such an | ingrained habit isn't trivial at the society scale. | lordnacho wrote: | What are the weird bell-shaped things you find on the curb? | | https://www.google.com/maps/@51.5073443,-0.1227047,3a,75y,82... | | I've seen them in many places, can't think of what they're for. | FartyMcFarter wrote: | Probably just to prevent cars from driving over that area. | Oxidation wrote: | To stop vehicles driving over them. Often on corners[1] to stop | HGVs cutting the corner off and driving the back end over the | pavement. | | [1]: | https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4860115,-0.102246,0a,42.9y,1... | retube wrote: | They're normally on the corners of junctions, I always assumed | they were to stop vehicles turning too sharply and cutting over | the pavement. | | Occasionally have seen a car stuck on top of one :) | andylynch wrote: | I unironically recommend following the World Bollard | Association if you enjoy seeing these at work. | OJFord wrote: | Keeping cars to the road, they're just bollards essentially as | far as I know - just more decorative. | andylynch wrote: | Bell bollards- they aren't just more handsome - they are also | what's used when normal bollards aren't enough, they are able | to stop heavier vehicles and far more resistant to damage. | | They are especially good at stopping trucks cutting corners | and enforcing width restrictions. | _Wintermute wrote: | Originally to push any HGV trailers back onto the road if they | cut the corner [0]. They also work really well at beaching | drivers looking at their phones who would have otherwise | mounted the pavement. | | [0]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6FiV023ktLM | unwind wrote: | Here, HGV is probably "heavy goods vehicle" [1]. TIL etc. | | [1]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Large_goods_vehicle | gokhan wrote: | Check Ben Wilson's chewing gum art on the Millennium Bridge as | well. https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox- | b-d&q=millenniu... | jlarcombe wrote: | And dotted around the rest of London too! A lovely man, Muswell | Hill legend. | makingstuffs wrote: | Thought it was going to say because the councils have no funding | and our roads/pavements are so battered that you'll likely fall | over and break your ankle if you're not careful. | oedenfield wrote: | And because the pavements are almost always uneven and made with | many stones/pavers rather than poured asphalt or concrete. | 2dvisio wrote: | Nice to see Harrow in there. The wavy double yellow lines are | down the corner from where I live and I always thought they would | be a common thing... | zeristor wrote: | Not much love for Mr Benn, I just though an episode might | explain: | | https://youtu.be/R3XVJ17uysM | yardshop wrote: | One could accompany this with the track "Looking Down on London" | by the perfect pop band Komputer from their 90s album The World | Of Tomorrow, if one liked Kraftwerk inspired electronica. | | It's not really about the same thing, just similar sounding | titles, and a nice excuse to mention one of my old favorite | albums! | | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAk4D3Lszdo | BerislavLopac wrote: | Just looking at the first item I absolutely now have to share the | amazing "Rivers of London" series of novels, comics and even a | TTRPG: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Grant_(book_series) | jonatron wrote: | Barnmead Road ( https://goo.gl/maps/uGXKSum8azGJLbU29 ) has | particularly terrible roads and pavements. It's actually | deliberate, because it's a conservation area. | doublesocket wrote: | This isn't about being in a conservation area but rather the | road being unadopted and therefore not maintained by the | council. Beckenham is full of them. | | https://www.barkergotelee.co.uk/who-is-responsible-for- | maint.... | the_mitsuhiko wrote: | I lived in Beckenham right next to such a road and it was | absolutely ridiculous. Cabs refused to drive on it because | the potholes were so bad. | jonatron wrote: | https://assets.ctfassets.net/vval1fkv4s9j/L8XTFNyvaSewQWSMOw. | .. | | > Some 19th century street furniture also remains, enabling | the road to present an excellent understanding of the | appearance of many residential areas in the era of horse | transport. The council will promote the retention of the | original street surfacing and furniture in the conservation | area. | doublesocket wrote: | I stand corrected. There are still various other roads in | Beckenham that are not inside a conservation area that are | unadopted (and consequently in an absolute state). | ljm wrote: | Croydon has a bunch too. A friend was showing me around there | a while ago and at one point we were walking down a wide road | with no pavements, large-ish semi-detached houses on each | side with decent front gardens. | | Was something I normally expected in upmarket rural areas and | traditional villages. | harywilke wrote: | In Athens, Greece my favorite example of this is where you walk | over the ancient city walls. | | There is a section of wall revealed by a dig in Kotzia square[1]. | The nearby paving traces the walls, and further on the National | Bank is raised up so you can see the wall continuing on.[2] | | [1] | https://www.google.com/maps/@37.9818329,23.7288448,120m/data... | [2] | https://www.google.com/maps/place/Acharnian+Gates/@37.980860... | jphoward wrote: | The hydraulic power utility is fascinating - the sheer amount of | water lost via leaks from water piping in this century is huge, | and so keeping a high pressure system running back then must have | been tremendously difficult. Especially given a similar sized | leak will have a much larger impact in a higher pressure system. | dcminter wrote: | I recall reading that during aome street works in the circa | 1990s they discovered some 16th Century (?) _wooden_ drinking | water piping still in use... | | The development of the water supply and sewerage in London is | super interesting. See e.g. The New River Company and also The | Great Stink. | Spooky23 wrote: | My wife did some work at a municipal water utility and they | did find some wooden pipes in service in the early 2000s. The | active ones are all gone, but they still find buried ones, | especially around an old reservoir that was in the downtown | area. | kijin wrote: | On the other hand, a leaking high-pressure pipe is extremely | noticeable [1], so any damage was probably fixed asap instead | of being neglected for ages. | | [1] | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_New_York_City_steam_explo... | readthenotes1 wrote: | The "<--LOOK RIGHT" painting is genius. For person who only had | one job, they took it to 11. Could be shocked if most people who | see that note don't look both ways... | twelve40 wrote: | This is awesome! Didn't make it to London this past year, but | everywhere from Paris to Barcelona to Istanbul had space invaders | painted on houses. But i guess it doesn't count as "look down" | zeristor wrote: | I've seen space invader mosaics on walls in London | alehlopeh wrote: | These are done by an artist that goes by Invader. They're in | a lot of cities. | Jdstanhope wrote: | Don't forget to look for the pieces of gum that have been painted | everywhere. https://theculturetrip.com/europe/united- | kingdom/england/lon.... | [deleted] | am_lu wrote: | There are markers on pavements where it crosses the Greenwich | Prime Meridian line. Got one right outside my house. | | https://goo.gl/maps/d3pAJqGTJS1W4agT9 | tomhoward wrote: | My favourite feature when looking down in London (as a foreigner | who has only visited a few times, briefly)... | | The Stanton Warrior drain cover: | https://www.google.com/search?q=stanton+warrior+drain+cover&... | | They were produced by Stanton Ironworks in Derbyshire, which | closed in 2007 | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilkeston#Stanton_Ironworks. | | Many of them must have been replaced with a different brand since | then as I noticed fewer had the Stanton Warrior brand when I was | last in London in 2019. | | The British electronic music producers The Stanton Warriors took | their name from these covers - | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanton_Warriors. | | (Also, at adds with the old Google interview brain-teaser, "Why | are manhole covers round?" - they're rectangular. So I guess it | they don't care so much if these ones fall in the hole, probably | because they're not holes that workers go down into). | kurthr wrote: | Also recommend this in Tokyo! | | Great artwork and interesting stuff with many remaining ones | effectively unique as they were put in by a particular locality | for a time and then others have been removed. | antihero wrote: | Also grime artist Newham Generals were named after the | hospital. | jimnotgym wrote: | Manhole covers are round if they cover a pipe and square if | they cover a brick built manhole. | | Your note about them not falling in makes me wonder if Google | had a different answer? | SECProto wrote: | > Manhole covers are round if they cover a pipe and square if | they cover a brick built manhole | | This is inaccurate as a generalization - in the three | jurisdictions I've worked in, they're round if they're newer | than ~1990, and mix of round and square (or two triangles | that go together to make a square) if they're older than | that. The frame and cover are replaced independently from the | MH structure itself so the cover doesn't tell you anything | about the makeup of the structure. | jimnotgym wrote: | Not quite true. The cover itself has to be supported by a | structure. The frame itself is insufficient. If you put a | round cover on a square hole it would cave in if a truck | ran over it. | SECProto wrote: | Catch basins in my jurisdiction have round covers on a | square structure. The cast iron frame is square with a | circular hole in the top. | | Edit: for example | https://maps.app.goo.gl/m8rR4vrPHBPTyXxo9 | TomWhitwell wrote: | This is my favourite 'always look down in London' | https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/the-buried-remains-of-li... - | an old road running well below street level but visible through a | grate | Foobar8568 wrote: | I always look down when walking just for one reason, dog shit (if | lucky). | cmehdy wrote: | I genuinely read the title as "always look down on London" and my | French mind was as vindicated as it was puzzled by it. The | article however is much more interesting and full of those little | things that make living in old and beautiful cities worth it. In | Paris I found that looking at walls (and decorations), street | layouts and names, could offer similar journeys. | jansan wrote: | People from Berlin are used to look down all the time in order to | avoid dog shit on the pavement. | | When I was looking for an appartment in Berlin, at one viewing | appointment there were about 20 other people interested in the | same appartment. It was quite nice, but there was an insufferable | stink everywhere inside that appartment. After we left I noticed | that I had stepped into dog poop before and the reason for the | smell was the dog shit stuck to my shoe. I applied and | surprisingly there were almost no other applications, so I got | accepted. The appartment never smelled that bad again :) | [deleted] | FastEatSlow wrote: | I'll be keeping this in the back of my mind, just in case. /s | Growtika wrote: | Great article. Made me search for cool stats about manhole. | Apparently there's a site dedicated only for manhole from around | the world | | https://manhole.co.il/ | paganel wrote: | Really cool project, bookmarked. | | For those interested, for Bucharest there's this [1] blog-post | with a few photos of some old manholes. In here [2] there's a | list of links from the same project to posts that present some | old stuff from and around Bucharest (the text is in Romanian, | but there are lots and lots of photos that are self- | explanatory). | | [1] https://www.simplybucharest.ro/?p=36671 | | [2] https://www.simplybucharest.ro/?page_id=12112 | krsdcbl wrote: | Made me think of this Berlin based artist: | https://raubdruckerin.de/ | | She uses manhole covers to create prints, "Raubdruck" means | "pirated edition" but literally it's "stolen print" | Broken_Hippo wrote: | I've been taking pictures of manhole covers for around 10 years | now. Well, manhole covers, drainage gates, square access | covers, and so on. | | Locally, the challenge is an interesting, somewhat artistic, | usually (but not always) urban picture. I've already taken a | picture of most designs I see, after all. In any other city, | I'm catching the design first. (Tromso, Norway has a reindeer!) | | I'm not all that surprised there is a website to catalogue them | and am always kind of happy to be reminded that others have the | same fascination. | PaulRobinson wrote: | Other things to look out for: | | - Every tube station has a "labyrinth" to find. | https://art.tfl.gov.uk/labyrinth/about/ | | - Vehicles drive on the left hand side in the UK. Except at the | entrance to the Savoy, where road markings make it clear they | must drive on the right. | | - We love roundabouts. Londonist has a nice article on some of | the weird things you can find on some of them here: | https://londonist.com/london/secret/the-strange-things-you-c... | | - When using transport, the normal rule of thumb is that the | underground will be quicker than a bus or even a taxi on many | journeys, but sometimes walking beats even that. TfL has a tube | map that helps you figure that out (check out Covent Garden to | Leicester Square - a 90 second tube journey that takes at least | 8-10 minutes due to the depth of the line): | https://content.tfl.gov.uk/walking-tube-map.pdf | js2 wrote: | > We love roundabouts | | "Look kids, there's Big Ben! Parliament!" | | _National Lampoon 's European Vacation_ (1985): | | https://youtu.be/iAgX6qlJEMc | atonse wrote: | I don't know why this scene is so memorable. My older brother | and I last saw this movie 30 years ago and we still remember | and laugh about this scene when we think of London. | dylan604 wrote: | Chevy Chase's laugh/cry moments of utter hysteria and | derangement have always made me laugh at/with those scenes | even more so as I've gotten older as I can totally relate. | PebblesRox wrote: | The Savoy entrance on Google Maps, in case anyone else is | curious. | | Does anyone know why they have drivers enter on the right | instead of the left? Does it make valet parking faster or | something? | | https://www.google.com/maps/@51.5106158,-0.1210778,3a,17.4y,... | xvedejas wrote: | It makes it easier for the driver/chauffeur to get out and | open the passenger's (rear, driver-side) door. | Maursault wrote: | That may be true, but it's not quite that. | | _In Savoy Court, vehicles are required to drive on the | right. This is said to date from the days of the hackney | carriage when a cab driver would reach his arm out of the | driver 's door window to open the passenger's door (which | opened backwards and had the handle at the front), without | having to get out of the cab himself. Additionally, the | hotel entrance's small roundabout meant that vehicles | needed a turning circle of 25 feet (7.6 m) to navigate it. | This is still the legally required turning circle for all | London cabs._[1] | | [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Savoy_Hotel#Savoy_Court | pbalau wrote: | Hackney carriages still exist. And a great deal of them | made the move to electric. That's just another name for | car for hire or taxi. | | That was a til for me too, i though that means the shape | of the vehicle. | extraduder_ire wrote: | > That's just another name for car for hire or taxi. | | There's a legal distinction between taxis and hackneys. | Taxis can be taken from a taxi rank or flagged down, but | hackneys must be called to collect you. I'm sure there | was a reason for the distinction at some point, but it | remains. | midasuni wrote: | A hackney cab is a type of taxi (one used in london), and | can be hailed. A mini cab must be pre booked, like Uber | or Addison Lee. | rahimnathwani wrote: | There's also a geographically accurate map: | https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/224813/response/56039... | | https://tfl.gov.uk/corporate/transparency/freedom-of-informa... | europeanguy wrote: | > We love roundabouts | | Context for our American friends. This isn't specific to | London. Everywhere I've lived in Europe is more roundabout- | heavy than the USA. Because, you know, they're objectively | superior ;-) | classichasclass wrote: | Just got a new one near our house. Greater Los Angeles. My | wife, an Aussie, is delighted. | PaulDavisThe1st wrote: | They are also spreading in the USA. New Jersey has had them | for quite a long time, and is building more. I've been | surprised to see them as an apparent new default for new | intersections in central Wisconsin where my wife's family is | from. There are even some new ones being added around Santa | Fe where I live. | coyotespike wrote: | Yes, I agree both that they are objectively superior and | that happily they are spreading! | | At first I would see people treat them like a slight curve | in the road and blow through them, but we seem to have | figured them out now | kevin_thibedeau wrote: | The ones in Indianapolis suck because heavy traffic flows | can blow through as a train, completely blocking entry | from other directions. | gorgoiler wrote: | Any SF-based Adobe employee will attest to the novelty of | working next to The City's only rotary. | tedd4u wrote: | Many of the ones popping up in San Francisco at 4-way | intersections RETAIN four stop signs ... <facepalm> | xvedejas wrote: | The ones I've seen are really more of a half-hearted | traffic-calming measure than proper roundabouts. The | intersections I can think of, they're in residential | neighborhoods and there's just some new island in the | middle of a four-way stop. It might be impossible to widen | these into proper roundabouts due to the houses up to the | property lines? | antisthenes wrote: | >objectively superior* | | *Given that the roundabout is fed by single-lane streets with | low traffic and excellent visibility and no stop signs before | entry, which would otherwise negate the advantage of quicker | entry. | LarryMullins wrote: | Single-lane roundabouts aren't very uncommon in America. | Maybe not as common as in the UK, but they're definitely | around and virtually every driver in America should be | familiar with them. There will always be a few fools who | don't grok them, but the same can be said for any aspect of | driving. | | I think when Americans say they're baffled by UK | roundabouts, they're almost always talking about the huge | multi-lane roundabouts. Those, to me, are nightmare fuel. | bigmattystyles wrote: | My French relatives are always impressed with the (mostly) | civil behavior at 4 way stop signs in California and claim | they would never work in France. It's funny to me because | every time they visit, they comment on them. I left France | too young to know if they are right though. | mytailorisrich wrote: | How do they work in California? | | I think what your relatives mean is that if everyone has a | stop then it'll be messy because everyone will try to go | first after they have stopped... | | Here in the UK they have installed 2 stops and 2 give ways | at a nearby crossing and it's already quite dangerous | because no-one is sure what to do: those with give-ways | think they should go before those with stops, those with | stops think they should go first if they arrived first... | honking ensues very often. If you're lucky it ends in a | very British "you go first, no you go first" contest, which | is not very practical, either. | bigmattystyles wrote: | you stop and go in the order you arrived to the stop | line. | kergonath wrote: | That sounds dangerous. It's not uncommon for different | people to order events differently, I can see two cars | crossing at the same time, each driver convinced to be | first. | kevin_thibedeau wrote: | For near-simultaneous arrivals the right of way goes to | the driver on the right. | serf wrote: | given that people _generally_ don 't spin their tires off | the line from a stop sign, it's fairly safe. If it's | obvious that two people are going at the same time then | one that has advanced less far in that time will | _generally_ ease off the throttle and let the more | advanced party continue. | | there are accidents, of course, but i'm not sure of any 4 | way traffic junction that's infallible. | | and as others stated, right-of-way rules are observed | atop the social norms. | bigmattystyles wrote: | It does lead to quite a few 'what the f.. arms up.. | stares' when there is a perceived violation but it works. | Probably because the cars within the stop signs are going | relatively slow. | post-it wrote: | Europe is definitely heavier on environmental design to | enforce behaviours rather than signs, as nobody will obey a | sign if they can get away with it. | LarryMullins wrote: | I think most people obey 4-way stop-sign intersections | because they're afraid of getting T-boned by another car, | not because they obey signs for the sake of obeying | signs. People ignore signs when they can get away with | it, but a 4-way stop-sign intersection is not such a case | to anybody but the suicidally reckless. | eropple wrote: | New England sits back smugly with our _rotaries_ and judges | you all. Politely--but we do. | throwaway1777 wrote: | They are increasingly common in new developments in the US, | but no one is spending money to retrofit old intersections | (rightly so I think) | ganjatech wrote: | No one except beautiful Portland, Maine. And probably loads | of other towns in New England. | andrepd wrote: | They do take a huge amount of space, unfortunately. | gorgoiler wrote: | London traffic lights are all equipped with PCATS -- pedestrian | countdown at traffic signal. It's the timeout signal that shows | how many seconds you have left to cross the road. | | The implementation is very hacker friendly. The PCATS counter | is literally bolted onto the side of the existing lights and | learns the pattern of the system to which it is attached by | monitoring its behavior. There is basically all but an air gap | between the counter and the lights themselves, and the counter | is making an informed guess. They start their installation- | lives having no idea how much time will be left. | | As such, each counter is equipped with a 4 bit error display to | indicate its status -- out of sync, could not sync, faulty | lights, etc. Keep your eyes peeled for little LEDs telling you | something about the internal status of the system. | | Example: https://uk.yunextraffic.com/portfolio/traffic-signal- | control... | | Error codes shown here, on page 7: | https://content.tfl.gov.uk/PCaTS-Note-4-Technical-Specificat... | sbuk wrote: | Another cool feature of of pedestrian crossings (and I think | this applies to the whole UK) is the accessibility aids. | We're all used to beeping traffic signals, but did you know | that on the underside of the control box there is a tactile | cone that rotates when the green signal is active? | | https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/pedestrian- | facilities-b... | ranit wrote: | > Vehicles drive on the left hand side in the UK. Except at the | entrance to the Savoy, where road markings make it clear they | must drive on the right. | | Similarly on Palatino bridge (Ponte Palatino) in Rome, vehicles | drive on the left side. ___________________________________________________________________ (page generated 2023-01-14 23:00 UTC)