[HN Gopher] One economist went on a long whimsical journey to pa...
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       One economist went on a long whimsical journey to pay his taxes
       with cash
        
       Author : djoldman
       Score  : 48 points
       Date   : 2023-04-15 17:06 UTC (1 days ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (fortune.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (fortune.com)
        
       | msla wrote:
       | "Whimsical" now means "making pointless work for yourself and
       | everyone else" and seems rather close to "speed-running" ("slow-
       | running"?) a bureaucracy for social media clout. Really, really
       | pitiful social media clout.
        
       | photonbeam wrote:
       | How did people do this before electronic payments?
        
         | yarg wrote:
         | With cheques.
        
         | ksherlock wrote:
         | Write a check and mail it in.
        
       | AlbertCory wrote:
       | A LONG time ago, I was at a (small) company that shared a
       | building with a phone company office. I was amazed at how many
       | people paid their phone bills in cash.
        
         | throwawaaarrgh wrote:
         | Yep. Middle class people don't really get all the ways that
         | being poor is a detriment. You often don't have credit, and you
         | may not have a bank account, so you get paid in cash, or at the
         | last minute by check, forcing you to use a check cashing store,
         | which will rape you on unnecessary fees, siphoning any cash you
         | might have saved, keeping you poor.
        
       | etothepii wrote:
       | Governments tend not to think of their citizens as customers but
       | subjects.
        
       | throwawaaarrgh wrote:
       | Writing a book on the advantages of using cash is like writing a
       | book on the advantages of using human waste as fertilizer. Even
       | if there is some advantage, I'm pretty sure everyone would just
       | rather not.
        
         | galago wrote:
         | We totally do though...
         | 
         | https://www.wbur.org/news/2023/03/30/boston-massachusetts-pf...
        
       | ThrowawayTestr wrote:
       | That was far less onerous than I expected.
        
         | DangitBobby wrote:
         | Having to make 1 appointment is unacceptable, let alone 2.
        
       | cuuupid wrote:
       | Interesting article but it sounds like all the author had to do
       | was schedule an appointment and wait 30min.
       | 
       | Also the conclusion is discouraging: rather than make self
       | payment easier, the IRS easily has the information available to
       | estimate and deduct taxes as they are due automatically or via an
       | easy online form. Turbotax and other providers lobby against this
       | for good reason, because with TurboTax you still have to input
       | information and calculate taxes whereas with the IRS they have
       | the data available already.
       | 
       | The conclusion I drew from this article is the most annoying and
       | tedious part of this process was manually calculating taxes well
       | in advance, which I'd be willing to bet took significantly longer
       | than the commute to the IRS office + 30 minute wait.
        
         | kevin_thibedeau wrote:
         | W2 withholding is set at a fixed rate at the beginning of the
         | year. If you get a raise mid year, that typically isn't
         | adjusted to zero out at the end of the year and you end up
         | overpaying. Add in all the potential deductions the IRS can't
         | anticipate and isn't really possible to make tax payments
         | exact.
        
           | dsr_ wrote:
           | Overpaying: so the IRS issues a refund. That's part of the
           | process.
           | 
           | Deductions: 86% of tax returns use the standard deduction.
           | It's OK for the IRS to assume that the standard deduction
           | will be used unless the taxpayer tells them that they want to
           | itemize.
        
             | [deleted]
        
         | DangitBobby wrote:
         | The article mentions that they were "lucky" because in many
         | places throughout the country, the physical location they would
         | have needed to visit would have no available appointments until
         | after taxes were due. Further, it wasn't a 30 minute
         | appointment, it was a 30 minute appointment made well in
         | advance, after which they (illegally?) _refused refused cash
         | payment_, followed by another 30 minute appointment a week
         | later. Except it wasn't timeboxed to 30 minutes because they
         | didn't bother to tell them (or didn't know) how long it would
         | take to make this simple transaction. Notice your options are
         | to 1) have a bank or 2) use non-traditional digital means which
         | all charge some form of "convenience fee" or 3) suffer major
         | hassle to pay cash without surcharge.
        
           | giantg2 wrote:
           | Do you technically need a bank? You should be able to head to
           | the post office or Walmart and pay with a money order.
        
             | xyzzyz wrote:
             | Money orders are $1000 maximum, and they have fee of $2.40,
             | so you might need to pay couple of dollars extra depending
             | on how much you owe.
        
               | jalk wrote:
               | He didn't tell us how much he spent on parking and gas to
               | go to the IRS office twice.
        
               | yurishimo wrote:
               | You can pay for things with multiple money orders. I used
               | to pay my rent this way.
        
           | artsytrashcan wrote:
           | You will notice that much of the de-facto mission of
           | government for the past ~50 years has been to replace a given
           | institutional function, for which there is a clear and
           | attainable path to effective implementation for the good of
           | the public, with a private middleman who may or may not be
           | friends with/former colleagues of/funding the election
           | campaign of an interested politician or bureaucrat (or to
           | prevent the reversion thereof). You may argue that this is
           | somehow more cost-effective or efficient, but it's happening
           | all the same. So much energy is invested in the great battles
           | involved in this mission that we have no time or funding to
           | address the new and pressing dilemmas which as-of-yet have no
           | solutions, public or private.
        
           | Supermancho wrote:
           | Conversely, in many locations throughout the country (Fargo,
           | ND being one of them), you can walk into the IRS building
           | without an appointment and converse directly with an agent
           | who will happily take cash, almost every day. They didn't
           | want to go somewhere else, so if cost them just over a week
           | in process. There are costs to living in bureaucratic
           | hotspots.
        
         | tester457 wrote:
         | > IRS easily has the information available to estimate and
         | deduct taxes as they are due automatically or via an easy
         | online form. Turbotax and other providers lobby against this
         | for good reason
         | 
         | It's funny how people accept this lowered quality of life
         | despite it being common knowledge that the IRS is purposely
         | worsened to benefit private corporations.
        
       | irrational wrote:
       | > If the government wants everyone to pay their taxes, why
       | doesn't it make it as easy as possible?
       | 
       | Uh, they do make it as easy as possible, as long as you aren't
       | trying to pay in cash. Even the description of how to pay with
       | cash sounded as easy as could be expected.
        
       | jsnell wrote:
       | > If the government wants everyone to pay their taxes, why
       | doesn't it make it as easy as possible?
       | 
       | Seems like they do; those easier ways are "not with cash".
        
         | diegoholiveira wrote:
         | In Brazil:
         | 
         | As a person, it's super easy to pay your taxes: download the
         | government app, double check the data and send it (it's more
         | complex to a few people, of course).
         | 
         | As a company, it's the hell on earth.
        
         | MrStonedOne wrote:
         | Not everybody is allowed to have bank accounts.
        
           | giantg2 wrote:
           | But anyone can buy a money order at Walmart or USPS.
        
       | retrac wrote:
       | Here in Canada, taxes can be paid in person at a retail bank, or
       | the post office.
        
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       (page generated 2023-04-16 23:00 UTC)