[HN Gopher] Modern Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish people fou...
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       Modern Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish people found to have
       Pictish ancestry
        
       Author : wglb
       Score  : 38 points
       Date   : 2023-05-06 04:42 UTC (18 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (phys.org)
 (TXT) w3m dump (phys.org)
        
       | truthexposed wrote:
       | [flagged]
        
       | GauntletWizard wrote:
       | I think what's surprising to me is all the people who seem to
       | think that the chief method of conquest is replacement, when it's
       | long been established that it's indoctrination. The Romans didn't
       | kill off native peoples - they subjugated them, taxed them, and
       | forced them to comply with some Roman norms. Their greater
       | success though, was getting the people to want to be Roman.
       | 
       | And who wouldn't want to be Roman when the simple words "Civis
       | romanus sum" were an effective passport through an empire that
       | stretched months of travel? When it opened commercial
       | opportunities with a large and relatively effective bureaucracy?
       | A nation that built roads and exported consumer goods, spices and
       | wines and finery, like none had ever before it? Most of Europe is
       | still interconnected by the roads the Romans paved. They've been
       | repaved with macadam, but the lines are the same.
       | 
       | People imitated the Romans because they were powerful. They
       | formed alliances and married their daughters off to Romans who
       | would keep them in relative luxury. The conquest was equally
       | about minds as of arms.
       | 
       | This has been true in all conquests. Some have been more brutal
       | about instilling their culture than the Romans, and to that end,
       | they were more effective at suppressing or destroying the
       | previous culture. But ultimately, it is the conquered people
       | taking on the aspects of their conqueror more than genocide and
       | recolonization that has succeeded in spreading cultures
       | throughout history.
        
         | Kamq wrote:
         | > The Romans didn't kill off native peoples - they subjugated
         | them, taxed them, and forced them to comply with some Roman
         | norms.
         | 
         | That's painting with a bit of a broad brush. The Romans had no
         | problems killing off large swaths of the population.
         | 
         | Depopulation was a tactic that was absolutely on the table. For
         | example, during the conquest of Gaul, ~1/3 of the population
         | was killed and another ~1/3 were sold off as slaves. The
         | tactics you're talking about were used on the remaining 1/3.
         | 
         | Those tactics, admittedly, work quite well when you only have
         | to deal with the friendliest 1/3 of a population.
        
         | thaumasiotes wrote:
         | > I think what's surprising to me is all the people who seem to
         | think that the chief method of conquest is replacement, when
         | it's long been established that it's indoctrination.
         | 
         | > This has been true in all conquests.
         | 
         | You lost it at the end there. Compare the United States.
         | 
         | Some conquests are a small group installing themselves at the
         | top of society. Others are a large group installing themselves
         | at all levels.
        
       | bbg2401 wrote:
       | Shouldn't the title read "Modern Scottish, Welsh, Northern Irish
       | and _English_ people found to have Pictish ancestry "?
        
         | naikrovek wrote:
         | well, I'm Scottish, but I was born in America, so shouldn't it
         | also say _American_?  /s
         | 
         | omission from the title does not mean that the unmentioned
         | nation has zero Pictish ancestry.
        
           | alistairSH wrote:
           | The opening of the article explicitly lists "Scotland, Wales,
           | North Ireland and Northumbria" despite leaving Northumbria
           | (which resides mostly in northern England) out of the title.
        
           | [deleted]
        
       | naikrovek wrote:
       | this stuff is so fascinating.
       | 
       | I hope that after I die I go into spectator mode, but with the
       | added ability to move myself through time so I can see all kinds
       | of stuff like this play out.
       | 
       | There are so many historical questions that I want better answers
       | to.
       | 
       | The Picts are one of those historical questions, for me.
        
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