[HN Gopher] Bell Labs Holmdel Complex (2019)
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       Bell Labs Holmdel Complex (2019)
        
       Author : zdw
       Score  : 56 points
       Date   : 2023-07-15 20:30 UTC (1 days ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (www.abandonedamerica.us)
 (TXT) w3m dump (www.abandonedamerica.us)
        
       | myself248 wrote:
       | And they're tearing down the antenna:
       | https://actionnetwork.org/petitions/save-big-bang-antenna/
        
         | cycomanic wrote:
         | The Horn antenna is at Crowford hill not Holmdel (confusing
         | because they are both in the Holmdel township).
        
       | evanelias wrote:
       | The building is featured prominently in the show Severance as the
       | hq of Lumon.
        
         | anothermoron wrote:
         | [dead]
        
         | Aloha wrote:
         | Yeah, when I watched the first episode, I was like "oh, shit
         | thats Holmdel!"
        
       | abh123 wrote:
       | I got my COVID shot there.
        
       | bediger4000 wrote:
       | Bell System buildings are the weirdest. There's art deco stuff
       | like the St Paul MN central office, or the Mountain States
       | Telephone and Telegraph building in downtown Denver, which is
       | worth venturing into the lobby to see murals like "The Wings of
       | Thought" and "The Crucible of Science" to industrial hulks like
       | the Minneapolis main central office. There's a data center at
       | 52nd and Zuni in Denver that's really 1960s.
       | 
       | Then there's buildings so bland you can walk or drive by and you
       | won't remember them, like the building at the corner of 15th and
       | Curtis in Denver. Architectural blind spot.
        
       | tomcam wrote:
       | God, it's painful to see this. So much happened there. I read
       | about it decades ago and dreamed of working there.
       | 
       | I ended up working at Microsoft's Building 2, which was just as
       | good. It was a giant plus sign, lined with individual offices and
       | nestled in a veritable forest. I worked with some of the greatest
       | minds in computer science, and they were all kind, helpful,
       | brilliant people.
       | 
       | I knew at the time it was special, knew it wouldn't last forever,
       | and cherished every day there. It's gone too.
        
       | st_goliath wrote:
       | Fascinating to see a couple recent photos and find out what
       | happened to this place.
       | 
       | The Bell Labs Holmdel Complex is something that I find myself
       | unexpectedly stumbling over on the Internet every few years or
       | so. First time some circa 10 years ago, when they uploaded a 1973
       | era training video for the computing services to `AT&T tech
       | channel`:
       | 
       | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMYiktO0D64
       | 
       | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9aVOIuKVUc
        
         | js2 wrote:
         | Raquel Welch taped up on the System 370:
         | 
         | https://youtu.be/HMYiktO0D64?t=339
         | 
         | I think it's this photo:
         | 
         | https://imgur.com/a/a0wK4sR
         | 
         | Her photo is the only personal item I see anywhere in the two
         | videos.
        
         | LegitShady wrote:
         | its essentially been turned into a funny looking mall since
         | 2019
         | 
         | https://bell.works/new-jersey/explore/
        
       | zw123456 wrote:
       | OMG Flashback memories of my internship there.
       | 
       | It really should be turned into a tech museum or something.
        
       | Scubabear68 wrote:
       | I went to Holmdel High School, and my girlfriend's dad was a
       | researcher at this facility, he invented a delta wave modulation
       | technique in the 60's that was (is?) used by NASA for certain
       | spaceship comms. I got to visit him once or twice here, it was
       | truly an inspiring building with all of the open air quality and
       | glass everywhere.
       | 
       | Really part of another era, where AT&T sunk billions into the
       | labs just for pure research. If only corporations could be a far
       | seeing today.
        
         | wslh wrote:
         | I understand they were a cash cow which put the company in
         | another league where cash flow is anormally high.
        
         | etrautmann wrote:
         | I share the sentiment but there are companies doing this - it's
         | just in different domains than telephony. Deepmind, OpenAI,
         | etc, fusion research, SpaceX. There are lots of long bets on
         | hard tech. If anything it's a proliferation, although Bell labs
         | is no longer a thing.
         | 
         | My hope is that we can establish a similar model for biology,
         | since many challenges in that domain are pre-commercial but not
         | at the appropriate scale for academic labs.
        
           | jcrawfordor wrote:
           | None of these efforts are as wide-ranging as AT&T's, though.
           | Budget comparisons are hard for a number of reasons (AT&T had
           | R&D happening in multiple places, under multiple funding
           | streams, both directly and indirectly funded), but the usual
           | thinking is that AT&T spent a larger % of revenue on research
           | than most, but not all, organizations today, with Google
           | being a notable example of a company that beats it on %
           | revenue to R&D (is this still true?). My suspicion would be
           | that that comparison wouldn't hold if you factored in the
           | directly funded DoD work but it's hard to say without some
           | pretty complex digging through accounting records.
           | 
           | The more substantial point is breadth, though. AT&T research
           | at its peak was more comparable to a university than an
           | industrial R&D institution, with both basic and applied
           | research occurring in a huge variety of fields---likely all
           | fields of physical science at various points. All of the
           | organizations you mention are essentially single-purpose.
           | Some of the major tech companies (Google, Microsoft) are
           | known for wide-ranging R&D, but they seem to have struggled
           | to produce the kind of basic advances that AT&T did, and also
           | seem to be backing off of that work.
           | 
           | Basic research is the big problem... AT&T had very little
           | problem with money going to basic research without known
           | applications, likely due to the substantial influence that
           | academia and "scientific management" had on AT&T, as well as
           | its reputation for excellent research management practices
           | that made AT&T a major part of basic physics research on the
           | behalf of the DoD for decades (Sandia National Laboratories,
           | for example, operated by AT&T until relatively recently). In
           | my opinion, accounts of Bell Labs enormous success, having
           | made major contributions to nearly every field of
           | engineering, often focus too much on the excellence of its
           | staff (which was a factor, although Bell Labs management
           | practices were not exactly modern), and downplay the role of
           | AT&T's willingness to fund basic research and ability to find
           | outside funding for basic research as well. Few modern
           | organizations seem to be willing to entertain major efforts
           | in a nascent field of astronomy, for example, on the
           | assumption that the technical work will lead to useful
           | engineering knowledge.
           | 
           | There's a lot out there about the history of Bell Labs, but
           | its own multi-volume "A History of Engineering and Science in
           | the Bell System," from the late '70s, does a good job of
           | covering the incredible breadth and scale of work performed
           | at Bell Labs. One thing to consider is that costs were quite
           | a bit lower back then, and so Bell Labs small-looking budget
           | of $3-5 billion of today's dollars per year translated to a
           | workforce in the tens of thousands working, during WWII,
           | 70-hour weeks. A two-day weekend did finally reach most of
           | the Bell Labs technical staff early in the Cold War.
           | 
           | Besides, if you read into the history of Bell Labs, you will
           | recognize vestiges of its bureaucratic structure in most
           | government and military R&D today. Its influence in
           | government and military physical research is enormous.
        
           | shortrounddev2 wrote:
           | Fusion isn't a good example. It's not getting anywhere near
           | the funding it requires. Maybe I've become cynical, but it
           | seems like all the big new technology products which have
           | come out in the last decade or two have just been software
           | products mostly designed to predict human behavior more
           | accurately to advertise to us. AT&T invented solar panels,
           | the transistor, radio astronomy, as well as computing
           | innovations that we're still using today. It's hard to
           | imagine we'll hold Google, Apple, or Facebook in the same
           | reverence 100 years from now because they created some
           | interesting consumer products which distract us for a couple
           | years before going in the trash to be replaced by the next,
           | slightly more distracting version
        
           | thevania wrote:
           | sir, i must respectfully disagree - bell labs is still a
           | thing
           | 
           | disclaimer - i work there as a senior researcher and we still
           | do world class research, so pls don't portrait us as a thing
           | of the past just yet, thx :)
        
         | graphviz wrote:
         | Whether or not AT&T was far-seeing, they had a mandate to
         | design and deliver universal telephone service, and cost-plus
         | deal to pay for it, so it made sense to buy nice expensive
         | things. Even when the mission was fulfilled and the economy
         | started to restructure the company, it ran along for at least
         | another 10 or 15 years before the real disruption started (the
         | 1996 breakup that turned Bell Labs into Lucent). And even then,
         | the labs contributed fundamental research in machine learning,
         | quantum computing and databases, to name a few areas. As you
         | say, that model of large-scale corporate R&D doesn't exist any
         | more - there's no funding model to support it.
        
           | etrautmann wrote:
           | How do you figure? The model now has been tech companies for
           | the last 15 years.
        
             | treyd wrote:
             | I can't speak for the previous commenter but it does seem
             | there is a different character to the research work
             | happening at FAANG-scale companies (which is still
             | generally in service of their corporate strategy) vs the
             | work that happened at Bell Labs back in the day (which was
             | more abstract and less directly-commercializable). Bell
             | Labs was more of a large team of brilliant researchers with
             | ample resources to support their work, and it just had to
             | be useful to somebody rather than be part of a
             | product/service that could be sold directly.
        
               | shortrounddev2 wrote:
               | You're right. The invention of the transistor was a
               | multi-decade effort by scientists working outside of
               | regular hours, essentially inventing the field of solid
               | state physics. It's hard to imagine such a technology
               | coming out of a publicly traded company like Google or
               | Apple, whose year-to-year or even quarter-to-quarter
               | behavior is as sensitive to changes in interest rates and
               | short term market conditions as a balloon in the wind.
        
         | Aloha wrote:
         | The only way this worked when was AT&T had a virtual monopoly
         | on all telecommunications (design, installation, services, etc)
         | in the US, and had their rates set using a rate of return
         | derived pricing mechanism.
         | 
         | We can probably get such things back, but they are not Free
         | exactly.
         | 
         | RCA had similar labs, but I think changes to the tax code makes
         | them less worthwhile to do today as well.
        
       | atleastoptimal wrote:
       | It's interesting how the area around NYC was the silicon valley
       | of the mid 20th century. Most of the country's tech innovation
       | was coming out of Bell and IBM. Has that area's loss of dominance
       | solely been due to all the tech industry moving to California?
        
         | shortrounddev2 wrote:
         | Tech was present in California in the mid-late 20th century; in
         | fact, Silicon Valley was founded by an ex-Bell scientist named
         | Bill Shockley, who shared a Nobel prize for the transistor. His
         | company didn't do well, but ex-employees founded Fairchild
         | Semiconductor, whose ex-employees founded Intel. This brought
         | along many other tech companies, such as Atari, Apple, and the
         | like.
         | 
         | Though Bell labs continued to innovate into the 70s and 80s,
         | the AT&T monopoly was split up, which left Bell Labs with
         | significantly less cash to invest into pure research with. IBM
         | also lost the PC wars, ironically even though the PC became the
         | international default for a microcomputer by the 80s and 90s.
         | 
         | So, yes, while tech moved west, the existing eastern behemoths
         | had their own troubles which led to their downfall, independent
         | of California. At the same time, Stanford became a major hiring
         | location for these tech companies, and its engineering
         | departments gained nationwide recognition. Companies moved to
         | California to get access to Stanford talent.
         | 
         | Source - The Idea Factory: Bell Labs and the Great Age of
         | American Innovation by Jon Gertner
        
       | rcpt wrote:
       | It's the building used in the TV show Severance.
       | 
       | I had a job offer to join Nvidia's office there years ago. Worst
       | financial decision of my life not taking it.
        
       | gttalbot wrote:
       | Yeah I worked in here for Lucent before the OG dotcom crash. It's
       | a pretty neat building. When you went in back in those days,
       | there was a big communication satellite suspended over the entry
       | lounge, with various things like telephones, transistors, etc.,
       | which were productionized here. IIUC there are antennas on the
       | property used to discover the Big Bang too. There's also a big
       | water tower in the shape of a transistor over a reflecting pool.
       | It was a rough time watching this building emptied out into
       | dumpsters during Lucent's auguring-in.
        
       | cycomanic wrote:
       | Note that the complex is now Bell Works and quite busy now. There
       | are a number of tech companies there and importantly Nokia Bell
       | Labs relocated from Crawford Hill to Bell Works ~2-3 years ago
       | (this is also the reason why there is talk about dismantling the
       | Horn Antenna, which is on the Crawford Hill site, which IIRC was
       | sold recently).
        
       | fewald_net wrote:
       | This building reminds me of one of the ones from the University
       | of Freiburg, Germany: https://ais.badische-
       | zeitung.de/piece/07/58/57/cf/123230159-...
       | 
       | Google: KG 2 Uni Freiburg
        
       | keninorlando wrote:
       | This is now Bell Works: https://bell.works/new-jersey/explore/
        
       | every wrote:
       | Nice to look at but I can hear voices, conversions and footsteps
       | echoing everywhere...
        
       | JonasJSchreiber wrote:
       | I worked there for two years. It's quite beautiful now, a bunch
       | of companies, and has a Montessori, an escape room, golf
       | simulator, and a food court.
        
       | gfodor wrote:
       | In high school I worked for Lucent in this building after school
       | and over summers. It's where I learned UNIX, vim, Perl, and how
       | web servers worked. It bums me out seeing that it now is
       | basically a big mall. Hopefully there are some cool startups that
       | come out of it.
        
       | barathr wrote:
       | Lots of good stuff like this on the author's feed here:
       | https://mastodon.social/@AbandonedAmerica
        
       | rrdharan wrote:
       | I was an intern here the summer after my sophomore year in
       | college. I just assumed all office buildings were this epic and
       | only later realized how fortunate I was.
        
       | PaulDavisThe1st wrote:
       | I worked here - my first job in the US, via a contracting agency,
       | for a few weeks until I totalled my then-girlfriend's car, broke
       | my arm, and could no longer commute from Philadelphia.
       | 
       | Worst programming job I ever had. My assigned task: change the
       | constant that limited how many forwarding steps a phone could
       | follow in one of their private telephone routing systems, from 32
       | to 64. That meant: change the macro/definition in a .h file,
       | update the documentation string.
       | 
       | Planned time for this change: 1 week.
       | 
       | There's a reason those telephone switches written in C actually
       | worked so reliably, but oh god, not the life for me.
       | 
       | Did I mention the office^H^H^H^H^H^Hcloset I had to work in.
       | 
       | Very happy to never come close to this vision of programming ever
       | again.
        
       | onecommentman wrote:
       | (2019), now Bell Works
       | 
       | https://bell.works/new-jersey/explore/
        
       | lasermatts wrote:
       | I grew up in Monmouth County and I think back fondly on all the
       | old Bell Labs folks who stayed in the area. They were my soccer
       | coaches/math teachers/friendly old folks in the neighborhood, and
       | it wasn't until I was in high school did I fully understand the
       | brilliant minds I was lucky enough to learn from.
        
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