[HN Gopher] We're closer to 'engineering' blood vessels
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       We're closer to 'engineering' blood vessels
        
       Author : geox
       Score  : 81 points
       Date   : 2023-08-05 18:55 UTC (4 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (pursuit.unimelb.edu.au)
 (TXT) w3m dump (pursuit.unimelb.edu.au)
        
       | formvoltron wrote:
       | sounds great, but is it a good idea to use polymers inside the
       | body? can't they degrade into sub-cellular sized particles which
       | could then damage cells? And when those cells apoptose their
       | insides come out, including the polymers and those polymers go on
       | to damage another cell.
       | 
       | I've got a sneaking feeling that nanoparticles of plastic are
       | going to be a major health problem in the future. I hope I'm
       | wrong.
        
         | tomrod wrote:
         | Depends whether they are inert. I suspect lack of internal UV
         | light might help a bit. I'd reckon something breaking polymers
         | down internally won't stop until the nanoparticles degrade.
        
         | tmccrary55 wrote:
         | Beta problems
        
       | JimtheCoder wrote:
       | Well, since I'm still quite young, I can look forward to getting
       | all of my internal plumbing replaced for my 65th birthday...
        
       | tmccrary55 wrote:
       | I wonder how long a human brain could survive, if all of its
       | support systems could be maintained indefinitely?
       | 
       | Wayland-Yutani vibes
        
         | tux3 wrote:
         | New neurons cannot be created in an adult brain (only new
         | synapses), so over the years it's a very slow process of brain
         | atrophy where neurons that die for any reason cannot be
         | replaced. That already makes indefinitely untenable in a messy
         | living system, since many of the inportant bits can't
         | regenerate.
         | 
         | And then neurodegenerative diseases are really hard bugs to
         | fix, those are the fast brain atrophies where you get motor
         | problems, amnesia, impaired cognition, dementia, and so forth.
         | 
         | Avoiding stroke and hypoxia is one thing, but keeping the cell
         | and protein machinery running and self-healing forever without
         | any deadly bugs is a tough ask. It's only optimized to
         | reproduce, not to live forever
        
           | falcor84 wrote:
           | That isn't strictly true. New neurons do get heated in adult
           | humans, in at least two regions of the brain, but probably
           | more. There is even some evidence of cannabis potentially
           | contributing to this process.
           | 
           | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adult_neurogenesis
        
           | nine_k wrote:
           | Adult brain can grow new neurons, at least in hippocampus:
           | https://www.nia.nih.gov/news/new-hippocampal-neurons-
           | continu...
        
         | HappySweeney wrote:
         | There was a Quirks and Quarks episode about 35 years ago aabout
         | that and concluded that the brain would only last 300 years due
         | to bacterial erosion.
        
           | BurningFrog wrote:
           | Pretty sure mine would die of boredom long before.
           | 
           | What would you do without a body?
        
             | falcor84 wrote:
             | VR in the metaverse and/or controlling a robotic body in
             | regular meatspace.
        
         | falcor84 wrote:
         | Wayland-Yutani? I can't seem to recall they did that? What
         | film(s)?
         | 
         | My thoughts on the other hand immediately went to the heads in
         | jars in Futurama.
         | 
         | https://futurama.fandom.com/wiki/Heads_in_Jars
        
       | wheelerof4te wrote:
       | It's kind of ludicrous how complex the blood vessels are.
       | 
       | Considering their role, whoever or whatever created the
       | "blueprints" for them must have been very inteligent.
        
         | smallnix wrote:
         | *intelligent
        
         | tomrod wrote:
         | Certainly if credit needs to be given for the design of blood
         | vessels, I'll take all that credit, thank you!
         | 
         | /s
         | 
         | Let us not assume creation and intelligent design with
         | biological evolution does fine. Too many malicious people claim
         | moral superiority/right to rule when you mix in a claim to a
         | creator of life with evolution. Parismony!
        
           | wheelerof4te wrote:
           | Oh, I wasn't thinking about _that_ creator.
           | 
           | The creators I believe in are much closer to actual science
           | than religion.
        
         | yieldcrv wrote:
         | falsifiable science relies on adjusting to new evidence, so if
         | an invisible being that doesn't interact in our world in any
         | way was able to be quantified in a reproducible experience or
         | experiment, the science would change to accommodate its
         | existence and all fundamental assumptions about reality
         | 
         | Unfalsifiable things are distinctive, in that there is no
         | evidence that would change the assumption. its working
         | backwards to support the unfalsifiable view, as opposed to
         | working forward and adjusting to any result even if it doesnt
         | match the view
        
           | prmph wrote:
           | If the invisible being doesn't interact with our world in any
           | way,then by definition it cannot be quantified or subjected
           | to experiment?
           | 
           | Also, if the being is super intelligent and running us in a
           | simulation, can you really subject it to experiment?
           | 
           | That would be like processes running in a container going
           | rogue and demanding evidence of their host environment.
        
             | yieldcrv wrote:
             | and its existence cannot be relied upon to substantiate
             | anything else
             | 
             | the hypothesis wouldn't present itself at all without
             | hearsay, or just be invalidated by all experiments and
             | useless for building upon, compared to just using the
             | substantiated resources at hand: in your analogy that would
             | be all of the other RAM and computational resources to your
             | benefit.
             | 
             | whereas if you play hide and seek with a friend that says
             | theyre going to hide in a magical land you cant access,
             | then you cant play with that friend anymore and thats the
             | totality of the observation, compared to the friend thats
             | ultimately just another process hiding in RAM.
        
           | wheelerof4te wrote:
           | > so if an invisible being that doesn't interact in our world
           | in any way was able to be quantified in a reproducible
           | experience
           | 
           | No invisible beigns here. Our creators are either extinct
           | (killed by a world-altering catastrophe, perhaps) or are
           | somewhere far away where they can observe their creation.
        
             | pigeons wrote:
             | So we can't see them?
        
               | wheelerof4te wrote:
               | Can ants "see" us?
               | 
               | But no, not directly. You did give me a good chuckle.
        
         | gcheong wrote:
         | Or maybe if you get enough rolls of the dice over billions of
         | years you don't need intelligence.
        
           | ttymck wrote:
           | Same thing?
        
             | pessimizer wrote:
             | Yup. Pretty sure trained LLMs are functions of the dice
             | rolls provided by the input. What we are now is a function
             | of the dice rolls provided by terrestrial physics.
        
             | barbazoo wrote:
             | How?
        
               | wheelerof4te wrote:
               | Because someone did the initial rolling of the dice?
               | Someone bought the dice in their version of LA casino.
        
           | wheelerof4te wrote:
           | Who did the rolling of the dice?
           | 
           | But I digress. Arguing with people who believe in world-
           | building RNG Tetris is pointless.
        
             | revolvingocelot wrote:
             | Oh, I imagine we'll keep trying. Each one of us, shaped by
             | both the differing environments we were nurtured in, and
             | our individual genetic nature, will try different ways and
             | means of addressing it with you. Perhaps eventually one
             | argument will succeed, news of its efficacy will spread,
             | and it will come to dominate...
        
               | wheelerof4te wrote:
               | Just to be clear, I wasn't thinking about some biblical
               | God...
        
             | tomrod wrote:
             | I'll take the blame. Dice, rolled.
             | 
             | /s
             | 
             | Let us not assume creation and intelligent design with
             | biological evolution does fine. Too many malicious people
             | claim moral superiority/right to rule when you mix in a
             | claim to a creator of life with evolution. Parismony!
        
       | agumonkey wrote:
       | Great for surgery, what about restoring non invasively ?
        
       | ccity88 wrote:
       | So just of the top of my head, things that have made mainstream
       | news in the past ~week;
       | 
       | - A Small molecule oral cancer drug kills 100% of solid tumors
       | across 70 evaluated cancer types - LK-99, potentially the first
       | ever room temperature ambient pressure superconductor (unverified
       | as of yet)
       | 
       | Things are looking up
        
         | rwc wrote:
         | Don't forget growing teeth:
         | 
         | https://www.euronews.com/next/2023/08/05/a-drug-that-makes-t...
        
           | Gibbon1 wrote:
           | Growing teeth likely would improve peoples lives more than
           | anything else mentioned.
        
           | agumonkey wrote:
           | odontogenesis is very fascinating...
           | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_tooth_development
           | 
           | even after reading a bunch of articles about many aspects,
           | the cell organisation to produce mineral rods support as
           | scaffold for mineral/enamel surface layers is .. really
           | something
        
           | darkclouds wrote:
           | That story has been around for at least a decade now.
           | 
           | 2011 https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/03/1103301010
           | 38.h...
           | 
           | 2017 https://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/damaged-
           | teeth-reg...
        
           | ben_w wrote:
           | Had teeth growing in petri dishes a while ago; I wonder what
           | happened to those...
        
         | formvoltron wrote:
         | Are you talking about the City of Hope discovery: AOH1996
         | inhibitor of PCNA?
        
         | bobmaxup wrote:
         | What about the record high ocean temperatures and antartic ice
         | loss?
        
           | formvoltron wrote:
           | robots building robots installing solar panels.
        
           | ChatGTP wrote:
           | They forgot to add the "for humans" postfix.
        
           | JimtheCoder wrote:
           | Measurement errors of course...\s
        
           | tomjakubowski wrote:
           | you win some you lose some
        
           | tomjen3 wrote:
           | At this rate of change anything twenty years out is
           | essentially impossible to estimate.
           | 
           | There are commercial companies working on Fusion power. We
           | may have electrified everything by then, we may have painted
           | the dessert white or we may be totally doomed.
        
           | NoZebra120vClip wrote:
           | Now we can replace the ice with blood vessels.
        
         | lm28469 wrote:
         | It's like that every week tbh, you forgot the alzheimer cure
         | (in mice models) and the new revolutionary battery (that we
         | will never hear about again)
        
         | submeta wrote:
         | More and more, I'm starting to believe that we are witnessing
         | one of two phenomena. Either we're observing an emergence, in
         | which humanity is making quantum leaps in scientific
         | advancement, or indeed, some form of intelligence is subtly
         | guiding us toward solutions for humanity's most pressing
         | problems.
        
           | bobmaxup wrote:
           | Why would you believe that an intelligence is pushing
           | humanity that way?
           | 
           | For instance, LK-99 was discovered in 1999. Why would an
           | intelligence who pushed someone to make this tell them to
           | study it for decades and to patent it before they made a
           | publication?
        
           | SubiculumCode wrote:
           | Used to be a brilliant mind could learn all there was known
           | about science. Now its too much, and our minds have a hard
           | time grasping what millions of minds working on a million
           | problems for untold hours can accomplish.
        
           | gochi wrote:
           | Or the alternative: after several years of media coverage
           | almost exclusively being about either the pandemic effects,
           | covid, layoffs, or wars; we've gone "back to normal" by
           | relying on these _revolutionary_ studies /concepts that
           | struggle to ever make it to full availability for clickbait.
        
       | lukko wrote:
       | Quite a while ago now, but I used to work at a tissue engineering
       | lab in London. I was interested in how techniques from procedural
       | design and architecture could be brought across, as actually the
       | design of many of the TE scaffolds seemed very crude.
       | 
       | Blood vessels grow according to growth factors that are released
       | in response to hypoxia, I wanted to try and model them as a space
       | colonisation. I never quite got around to producing the actual
       | structures, but some more details here:
       | 
       | https://www.rcseng.ac.uk/-/media/files/rcs/standards-and-res...
        
         | beedeebeedee wrote:
         | Oh neat- your scaffolding reminds me of Erwin Hauer
        
       | trallnag wrote:
       | I'd love to get replacements for my defective and missing
       | lymphatic vessels...
        
       | go_prodev wrote:
       | I'm eagerly awaiting cyclodextrin based treatments, that can
       | potentially remove the plaque and cholesterol buildup.
       | 
       | There's so much to be positive about at the moment.
        
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       (page generated 2023-08-05 23:00 UTC)