[HN Gopher] The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge ___________________________________________________________________ The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge Author : graypegg Score : 525 points Date : 2023-09-02 07:12 UTC (15 hours ago) (HTM) web link (tylervigen.com) (TXT) w3m dump (tylervigen.com) | sscarduzio wrote: | > not really the kind of place you would need to walk to | | As an European, the amount of cringe on reading this sentence | went through the roof. | OfSanguineFire wrote: | Fellow European here, and also an OpenStreetMap editor who maps | a lot of warehouses like what the article describes is | presently at one end of the bridge and "not really the kind of | place you would need to walk to". Even in a European context, I | wouldn't consider consider that Grainiger facility any | significant destination for people on foot. | dang wrote: | Please don't break the site guidelines, which include: | | " _Don 't be snarky._" | | " _Eschew flamebait. Avoid generic tangents._ " | | https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html | keiferski wrote: | Plenty of places in Europe are not in places that you "would | need to walk to." | omnibrain wrote: | Worst experience was at Stansted airport. We had a very early | flight home so we decided we can drop off our car at the | airport in the evening and stay at the Holiday Inn Express | (worst hotel experience ever, but that's another story) ~500m | away from the car rentals. There is no footpath at all. You | would have to frogger over the airport access road after | walking on the curb. So we had to take the bus from the | rental yard back to the terminal and pay 5 pound each for the | transfer bus to the hotel. | dingus9001 wrote: | And yet, walk to them you still can | keiferski wrote: | You can walk to the same sorts of places in American cities | too... | tylervigen wrote: | I agree that walkability and the culture around cars and | walking is abysmal in the United States. | | However, I should clarify that this particular location is | primarily a warehouse for industrial equipment for use at the | airport. Most of its business is from trucks that use the dock. | It would be great if the area was more walkable, but if we made | it more walkable we would not prioritize this specific | business. | | (Context: I am the author of the article.) | hum3hum3 wrote: | Amazing dedication and I did read to the end. | einpoklum wrote: | [flagged] | dang wrote: | Please don't post flamewar comments. We're trying for something | else here, and we've had to ask you this more than once before. | | https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html | YeGoblynQueenne wrote: | This man has no self control. He just had to know. He had. to. | know. | | So many respects! You'd make an excellent bug hunter, mister. | mrsofty wrote: | this was a real pleasure to read. I had just made my coffee and | saw the title. I liked the way that the author followed the | thought process you would go through AND took the time to find | the actual evidence to prove or disprove a theory. Well done! I'm | sending it to my colleagues as, given our Edward Debono training, | a brain refresh. Thanks so much for posting | Angostura wrote: | A great find, OP thank you for posting. I'm in awe of the | author's dedication. I wish someone close to the bridge would | post a note with the URL on it. | UncleSlacky wrote: | Or a sticker with a QR code linking to the URL. | nerdponx wrote: | I hope a local library, government, or historical society keeps | a physical printed copy on paper. Or at least an offline | digital copy somewhere. | sbierwagen wrote: | There's a mysterious pedestrian bridge over I-5 in North Seattle, | with nothing like it for miles. After reading this post I looked | it up in google maps, and sure enough, it's right next to an | elementary school. | https://www.google.com/maps/@47.7639358,-122.3249609,554a,35... | And two similar ones over I-405 | https://www.google.com/maps/@47.6594203,-122.1842507,174a,35... | https://www.google.com/maps/@47.6768724,-122.187362,187a,35y... | colinchartier wrote: | Reminds me of this video about the origin of the name Tiffany: | https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9LMr5XTgeyI | | "I didn't fly across the Atlantic to... Of course I did" | tylervigen wrote: | Ha, then you might enjoy this anecdote: In that Tiffany video, | there is a chart that appears on screen for a fraction of a | second at 7:39 (the correlation "People drowning in swimming | pool <> Films with Nicholas Cage"). That chart is from Spurious | Correlations, and was made by the author of the bridge article. | | Source: Am that author. :) | whoopdedo wrote: | > The best search terms were not road names, they were people's | names. | | Demonstrating once again that it's not what you know, it's who | you know. | nkrisc wrote: | There's a bridge near where I live, identified as "Farm Rd". It | looks like any other bridge over the interstate but I'd never | heard of that road before. Generally any road around here that | would warrant a bridge over the interstate is one I'd have heard | of. One day I looked satellite images of it and on one end it | immediately ends in a grassy field, and the other side is, | unsurprisingly, what looks like a working farm. | | My guess is when the interstate was built it bisected private | farmland and the bridge was built so the landowner could still | access the rest of their property. There's no "going" around any | other way for many miles. | | I always wondered how I could find out for sure and this article | gave me some ideas on how to even begin searching. | mindcrime wrote: | There's a curious one lane bridge[1] over I-40 outside of | Raleigh that leads to a gravel road that serves about 4 houses, | and then leads into the back side of Umstead State Park. We | always joke about it being the "bridge to nowhere" and ponder | "who had the political connections to make _that_ happen? " | | But I imagine it's something like you were saying: probably | when I-40 was built, the land acquisition process resulted in | those homes being cut off from everywhere else, _unless_ that | bridge was built. And probably it was cheaper / easier / more | politically viable to build the bridge than buy out the | remaining land-owners. | | Or maybe there was more to it. This area is also adjacent to | RDU airport: a lot of the land you can see near "Old Reedy | Creek Road" on the map, north of I-40, belongs to the airport, | even though it is undeveloped (aside from bandit MTB trails). I | _suppose_ the argument for the bridge might have involved | providing better access to the airport, then or in the future, | for emergency crews or something of that nature. The additional | access to Umstead Park I wouldn 't expect to be a big factor, | because the next exit down on I-40 is already one of the two | major entrances to the park. | | Anyway it's always interesting to look at stuff like this and | wonder how/why certain decisions were made. | | [1]: | https://www.google.com/maps/@35.8400772,-78.7819125,75m/data... | mannyv wrote: | One interesting takeaway was his note about influence at the end. | Nuns and their ilk could have a tremendous impact back in the | day...informally speaking. And there's no documentation. | | Influence != authority. But with authority alone you can't | necessarily answer "why here instead of there?" | quickthrower2 wrote: | Great read. I love the obsession and I will now look out for | things in the urban landscape that seem a bit unusual! | cutups wrote: | I wonder how many "Bloomfield Bridges" there are in the world. I | saw this headline and wondered if it was about the Bloomfield | Bridge in Pittsburgh, PA. I clicked on the article and saw the | pedestrian bridge, which looks extremely similar to a pedestrian | bridge that ends right by the Bloomfield Bridge in Pittsburgh, | but clearly just happenstance | owgevub wrote: | [flagged] | smitty1e wrote: | Thanks. This article points out how fragile information is; how | important a minor obsession can be; and what a great site HN is | for the occasional random treasure. | [deleted] | tylervigen wrote: | If anyone will appreciate this, Hacker News will: this page is | un-monetized, has no ads, no cookies, no Google Trackers, and | loads no external scripts. You can check! I (the author) don't | even know how many people are on the page (except that it is a | lot because it's linked here). | | The images do load from a different domain (tylervigentest.com), | but that is for a different reason. I was overwhelming my webhost | with more DNS requests than it could handle.[0] I went to move my | domain, but it got locked in the process (I don't know why). | Offloading the images was the only way I could think to reduce | the strain on the current DNS server. | | [0]See, for example, the comments section of the submission here | a few days ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37318295 | [deleted] | greatgib wrote: | This is really a fascinating piece to read, even for a non | American or not living in this area. | | Also I like very much the way that it is written in a straight to | the fact way despite it being very long. I did read it in one | time like a book. | | I wish that newspaper articles (like NYT and co) still had that | quality of investigation and writing. Instead of flooding us with | useless half-invented context facts to fill pages. I would | subscribe more. | stuaxo wrote: | Weird they don't have a proper sidewalk and just end it on grass. | scarlson wrote: | The cities would have been responsible for building sidewalks | to the bridge. If you look around where the bridge is on modern | maps you'll see that a lot of the residential area on the North | side of the bridge (Richfield) just doesn't have sidewalks. | tylervigen wrote: | It's even weirder than that! Residents of Richfield at the | time saw the lack of sidewalks as a feature, not a bug. They | wanted to distinguish themselves from Minneapolis, so they | protested the building of sidewalks because "how would people | know we are a suburb if we have sidewalks?" (This is a real | quote from a real, very politically active resident at the | time. Seriously.) | | Context: I wrote the article linked in the OP. | TheJoeMan wrote: | I read the whole article, it's enthralling to me because of how | heartwarming the impact was from the engineering to the users. | The part about the foresight to add the little bike gutter just | makes me tear up. Such a simple piece of steel, and yet it | enabled so many good memories for those children writing in. I'm | thankful the author didn't get his answer from his couch either! | tylervigen wrote: | Me too! I would have missed out on all the fun if I had learned | the answer on day one. | nrawe wrote: | Very funny article, watching him follow the rabbit hole. Glad he | got to a resolution. I'm now more informed than I ever thought I | could be about a bridge | nedt wrote: | I would have guessed the bridge was built for future development, | which then wasn't done. In Vienna there is a bridge that's a bit | similar that for a long time was just leading to an empty field. | It goes across Grenzackerstrasse, which could be rathly | translated to field border street. It took some time for housed | to be built on the other side. There would have been the | possibility that there would be just industry on both sides and | then it would have been mostly useless. | sohkamyung wrote: | I'm a bit surprised that no mention was made of Tyler Vigen's | other 'pet' project: Spurious Correlations, which includes the | hilarious spurious correlation that the number of people who've | drowned in swimming pools is positively correlated with the | number of films Nicholas Cage has appeared in. :-) | JoeAltmaier wrote: | Amused at the disgruntled Grainger folk who don't want the bridge | now - litter and foot traffic annoy them. | | Very human response. But hey Grainger, the bridge was there | first! You don't like it, put your business somewhere else. The | bridge is for the kids, always has been, so suck it up. | boomboomsubban wrote: | To be fair, it doesn't sound like they were trying to complain | about it or get rid of it. Somebody came to them for their | opinion and they don't like it. There are plenty of things I'll | complain about if asked that I generally suck it up and deal | with. | achr2 wrote: | I found that funny from the perspective of it invalidating the | claim that the bridge was disused. It's like a Yogi Berra | adage. | pnw wrote: | Such a great read. I've done similar historical research and it's | always so satisfying to get that final document that solves the | puzzle. It's amazing what you can find online and in archives, | and how helpful people are along the way. | | In retrospect, it's not difficult to guess that the bridge was | likely built for the school, because the school and church | property is quite large, and there is a footpath on the side with | the housing development. But it's always much harder to see | things like that in context at the time. | SanderNL wrote: | Exceedingly interesting and impressive amounts of dedication. | | There is also a lesson in there about endless chasing of | technical details instead of going straight to the source of all | mysteries: power and the people that hold it. | | Many software challenges can be looked at through the same lens. | Why is this project even a thing and why, o, why is it $25M over | budget and getting nowhere? (Hint: nothing technical) | lchengify wrote: | That was one of my takeaways as well. Nothing beats primary | sources and aligned incentives. | | Also just as a practical matter: Professionals are required to | track the money and engineering, so there's bound to be a paper | trail. No one has a good reason to write down the "why" unless | it's a cool story to retell. Even then, the details behind the | story wouldn't be included. | CrzyLngPwd wrote: | This is a great example of if at first you don't succeed, try and | try and try and try again. | | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37344146 | | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37318295 | | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37317859 | | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37312700 | tylervigen wrote: | Ha! Author here. I actually posted it here right after I | published it earlier this week. I thought it was more Hacker | News material than Reddit material. But no one saw it at the | time. Guess it didn't get the good numbers from the algorithm. | | For the record: none of the other repostings of it were from | me. | dang wrote: | I know it looked like that, but it was weirder--a failure mode | I ran into last night, and the process of correcting it was a | rabbit hole that maybe would be interesting to share. | | The article was posted 27 (!) times (see | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37364657 - in addition to | any that may have been deleted) but they were killed because | the domain was banned. Yikes! how could such a great site be | banned? Well, before this article existed, there was only the | author's page of Spurious Correlations, which is fun and clever | but not quite suitable for HN, and it was posted so often (see | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37364947) that a mod must | have banned it back when nothing else was coming in from that | domain. Alas, when a ban like that fails, it can fail | catastrophically, because the next thing to come in from that | domain, after 85 Spurious Correlations, was a once-in-several- | years-I-would-say classic. | | I ran across all those [dead] submissions last night, realized | this was an awesome article for HN and promptly unbanned the | domain. That left the problem of what to do with 27 past | submissions - which should 'win'? Which user should get credit? | (Eventually we want to build a karma-sharing system to solve | this, but that's not done yet.) | | In such cases--i.e. when a good article has been submitted | multiple times but not had attention yet--we often go through | the submission feeds of the accounts involved, looking for any | other good-but-overlooked submissions that we might invite them | to repost instead. That usually means looking at 2 or maybe 5 | submission feeds (not 27)! but I spent about an hour last night | looking through most of them and finding other articles to | invite. For fun, here are the ones I found: | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37317859 (obviously) | | _Recursive Racks [video]_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37200556 | | _Early performance results from the prototype CHERI ARM | Morello microarchitecture_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37082504 | | _Show HN: Shaq, a CLI for Shazam_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36894144 | | _A GPT-4 capability forecasting challenge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36846030 | | _A plot to steal the secret Coke can-liner formula_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36171374 | | _Lego 3-axis styrofoam cutter [video]_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35931960 | | _Webb Mirror (2022)_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33608752 | | _Contexto: Guess a word based on its AI-sorted context_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33412895 | | _The Craft of Experimental Physics (2015)_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25876989 | | A few of those have already been reposted and are currently on | the front page. Invited reposts get put in the second-chance | pool (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26998308), meaning | they get a random placement somewhat low on HN's front page. | Most soon fall off, but the ones that spark readers' interest | can go on to do well. You can see the list of invited reposts | here: https://news.ycombinator.com/invited. | | When deciding who to invite to repost the original thing (in | this case, the bridge article), we go by a few heuristics. | Earlier submitters are preferred to later ones. Submitters who | have never had a story hit the frontpage are preferred to those | who have; and those who haven't had a 'hit' for a long time | (years, in some cases) are preferred to those who've have had | one recently. Submitters who've posted less, or not for a long | time, are preferred to HN titans (ColinWright, we love you but | that's why https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37312700, | despite being early, 'lost'). Accounts for which we have no | email address necessarily 'lose', though I sometimes try to | work around that: https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0& | prefix=true&que.... | | Oh, and when one of the previous submitters is clearly the | article's author, we usually _don 't_ invite them to do the | repost. That way two people can have some dopamine instead of | just one. | | Sometimes I do this search recursively*: when in someone's past | submission feed I run into an article so good I wonder who else | has posted _that_ , and which of _them_ should 'win', so I | look through all _their_ histories for yet other articles that | deserve reposting, hopefully without losing my place in the | previous search. I can 't handle a stack depth of more than 2 | or 3 before my brain explodes and then I usually bail until | next time. (* Depth-first or breadth-first? I've tried both | ways to figure out which allows me to hold more state before | capsizing, but I'm unsure. Both involve opening a lot of tabs, | but in a different order, and both get unwieldy) | | This is a great way to meander through the archives (the | catacombs?) and find obscure, interesting things. It would be | worth writing software to support it one of these years. HN is | in a rare sweet spot where, just out of business interests, it | makes sense for YC to fund it simply to be interesting (https:/ | /hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&so...), and | obscure overlooked submissions are among the most interesting | things on HN--so the archives should only grow in value and | this can hopefully keep going for a long time. | | I got tired partway through last night--a recursive search with | 27 inputs was just too much. I can't remember why graypegg | 'won'--I think I just threw an exception. That left a bunch of | submitters who didn't get a repost invite, but I've added these | now: | | _Show HN: SkyFi - Command satellites on demand_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34468803 | | _The Curious Case of Hybrids in Watchmaking_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34584488 | | _The New York Nobody Knows: Walking 6,000 miles in the city_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37119695 | | _Home Assistant Door Chime via Sonos_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24740283 | | _The Hunt for the Giant Squid (2004)_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37344191 | | If anyone else wants to dig for worthy ones, I'd love to see | the links! People frequently email us asking for second chances | for their own material. That's...ok I guess, but it doesn't | make my eyes light up. Random finds for no other reason than | just-because* are the real treasures here. (* Which is also why | the current article is such an instant classic.) | dang wrote: | I don't want to bloat the parent comment so I'm going to | macroexpand parts of it here. | dang wrote: | [1] For the curious, here they are. Most won't be visible | unless you have 'showdead' turned on in your profile: | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37355607 - Sept 2023 | (0 comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37355390 - Sept 2023 | (0 comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37354254 - Sept 2023 | (0 comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37351991 - Sept 2023 | (0 comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37349283 - Sept 2023 | (0 comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37347478 - Sept 2023 | (0 comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37344146 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37343169 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37341092 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37339808 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37337460 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37337274 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37335732 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37332795 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37332357 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37330688 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37329762 - Aug 2023 (1 | comment) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37323370 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37318295 - Aug 2023 (4 | comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37317859 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge: Why is this bridge | here?_ - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37316842 - | Aug 2023 (0 comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37313777 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37312700 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37309738 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37306042 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _Solving the Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37305110 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _The Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37301368 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | dang wrote: | [2] _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37135725 - Aug 2023 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35033020 - March 2023 | (0 comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34235455 - Jan 2023 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34082009 - Dec 2022 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33047225 - Oct 2022 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32638195 - Aug 2022 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32424060 - Aug 2022 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31860332 - June 2022 | (0 comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31507037 - May 2022 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31396481 - May 2022 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30604924 - March 2022 | (0 comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30159917 - Feb 2022 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29935495 - Jan 2022 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29414458 - Dec 2021 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29370245 - Nov 2021 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29342268 - Nov 2021 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29299497 - Nov 2021 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28961349 - Oct 2021 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28825125 - Oct 2021 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28269668 - Aug 2021 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28259364 - Aug 2021 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28230461 - Aug 2021 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27505912 - June 2021 | (0 comments) | | _Random things that correlate with each other_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27420587 - June 2021 | (0 comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27086785 - May 2021 (0 | comments) | | _A List of Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26531494 - March 2021 | (0 comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26479795 - March 2021 | (0 comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24929219 - Oct 2020 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24700847 - Oct 2020 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24674080 - Oct 2020 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24142621 - Aug 2020 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24040761 - Aug 2020 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22320904 - Feb 2020 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20269912 - June 2019 | (0 comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19971116 - May 2019 (0 | comments) | | _Nicolas Cage Film Appearances Associated with Pool | Drownings_ - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19433624 | - March 2019 (0 comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19207507 - Feb 2019 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18914990 - Jan 2019 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18891348 - Jan 2019 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18523096 - Nov 2018 (0 | comments) | | _Secret correlations the government wants to hide ( | /sarkasm off)_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18416052 - Nov 2018 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious correlations, or how cheese consumption | correlates to death by sheets_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17992300 - Sept 2018 | (0 comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17552811 - July 2018 | (0 comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16911513 - April 2018 | (0 comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13861919 - March 2017 | (0 comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13822944 - March 2017 | (0 comments) | | _Spurious correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13379601 - Jan 2017 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13374807 - Jan 2017 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13212945 - Dec 2016 (0 | comments) | | _15 Insane Things That Correlate with Each Other_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12932331 - Nov 2016 (0 | comments) | | _15 insane things that correlate with each other_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12874313 - Nov 2016 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12806714 - Oct 2016 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12289362 - Aug 2016 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11028637 - Feb 2016 (0 | comments) | | _15 Things That Strangely Correlate with Eachother_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10960967 - Jan 2016 (1 | comment) | | _Spurious correlations (Ridiculous things that | inexplicably correlate)_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10913561 - Jan 2016 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10623264 - Nov 2015 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10621376 - Nov 2015 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10488448 - Nov 2015 (0 | comments) | | _15 Insane things that correlate with each other_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10044953 - Aug 2015 (1 | comment) | | _Spurious Correlations: "Now a ridiculous book"_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9726812 - June 2015 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9720788 - June 2015 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations (aka correlation does not imply | causation)_ - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9711267 | - June 2015 (0 comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9698236 - June 2015 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9607504 - May 2015 (0 | comments) | | _US spending on science, space, and technology correlates | with Suicides_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9480869 - May 2015 (3 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9187178 - March 2015 | (0 comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9056358 - Feb 2015 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlation_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9017468 - Feb 2015 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8950016 - Jan 2015 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8847385 - Jan 2015 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlation_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8088193 - July 2014 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8046149 - July 2014 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7896766 - June 2014 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7778546 - May 2014 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7748697 - May 2014 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7738836 - May 2014 (0 | comments) | | _Per capita cheese consumption correlates with deaths by | bedsheets_ - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7737932 - | May 2014 (3 comments) | | _Insane Things That Correlate With Each Other_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7730750 - May 2014 (0 | comments) | | _Spurious correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7730020 - May 2014 (1 | comment) | | _Spurious Correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7729430 - May 2014 (1 | comment) | | _US Spending on Science Correlates with Suicides by | Suffocation_ - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7728003 | - May 2014 (0 comments) | | _Spurious correlations_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7726004 - May 2014 (0 | comments) | | _Things that correlate_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7721376 - May 2014 (0 | comments) | | _Things that correlate_ - | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7716661 - May 2014 (1 | comment) | tylervigen wrote: | Wild! Thank you for fixing it. I wonder why it was originally | banned. If it's something I can fix to avoid in the future, | I'd like to address it. | dang wrote: | I'm getting there! bear with me... | | Edit: done. Sorry we banned your site and I sure hope you | write more in the future! | | Edit 2: if you'll excuse the morbid aspect, your article | reminded me of another one I read this year about a long- | unsolved murder that took place near where the author grew | up, somewhere in the midwest I think. Unfortunately I can't | find it right now (maybe it will ring a bell for someone) - | but it was also super-well-researched (though less in real | time), and maybe I'm wrong but I think the author has a | similar sensibility to yours. We need more writing like | this. (Edit: I found it: | http://www.codex99.com/unclassified/patty-and-michael.html. | I ran across it because of awesome things previously posted | to HN from that author's site: | https://news.ycombinator.com/from?site=codex99.com. " | _Along the way I've learned more than is probably healthy | about Canadian quintuplets, murdered teenage cheerleaders, | young stage actresses, middle-aged academic cartographers | and elderly Victorian taxonomers._ " - | http://codex99.com/about.html) | | Edit 3: oops I didn't answer your question. I'd say the | thing to fix in the future is the insufficient number of | awesomely-written, intriguing articles by you. This kind of | thing is hard to come by! | [deleted] | davikr wrote: | It kept getting flagged for no reason too. | dang wrote: | No, it was getting killed by software, not flagged. If it has | been flagged (enough to get killed), you would have seen | [flagged][dead] rather than just [dead]. | yihanwu1024 wrote: | I walked on that bridge on 8/30. | | That night, this article appeared in my Google feed. | | Today 9/2 it's on my Hacker News feed. | | Wtf? | exmadscientist wrote: | And I drove under it yesterday! (Not so easy given I live in | Seattle these days.) The world's a smaller place than we | realize. | irrational wrote: | > She described the "baby boom" more acutely than I had ever | heard it described before. For her, it was a "swarm of hundreds | of kids" the exact same age. | | I grew up in the 80s (Gen X). We didn't have hundreds of kids, | but there were dozens of of kids in every neighborhood we lived | in (we lived in Indiana, Texas, Colorado, Florida, and | California). My kids have grown up mainly in the 2010s-present. | There might be a single other kid the age of one of my kids in | the neighborhood. There just aren't many kids anymore. Certainly | not like when I was a kid and especially not like when my parents | were kids. | ShadowBanThis01 wrote: | I think it's unfortunate and a bit annoying that people seem to | have forgotten (or never learned) the meaning of the Baby | Boomers label. Somehow the group called "boomers" has expanded | (by some erroneous definitions) into the mid-'60s. Ridiculous. | | The same thing has happened to "Millennials." Overall, any | labeling after the Baby Boomers is stupid and should be avoided | at all costs. If you want to talk about a particular group, | simply refer to an age range. Then there's no debate. | fireflash38 wrote: | Have you considered that instead the people who have kids are | priced out of your area? | efitz wrote: | That was a fantastic article and some amazing sleuthing! Thank | you for tracking it down. A quarter of the way into the article I | _needed_ to know why that bridge was there, and I've never been | to Minnesota and have no relatives there :-) | | Anyway, your solution to the mystery was very insightful and | probably applies to many domains of inquiry. | UberFly wrote: | Indiana Jones and the Mystery of the Bloomfield Bridge. The | author is a human bloodhound. Highest praise for the good read. | tetris11 wrote: | Fantastic read. I'm impressed at how forthcoming various US city | officials and employees are about giving away infrastructure | plans to anyone who demands it. | | Freedom of Information act, sure. But try gaining access to the | same level of info that Tyler got here in a country like | Germany[0]. In theory very easy, in practice you will be sent in | a vicious circle of disinterested officials passing the buck. | | 0: | https://www.dpma.de/english/our_office/law/freedom_of_inform... | boomboomsubban wrote: | I imagine even in Germany the officials would enjoy dealing | with a kind person expressing enthusiasm about some obscure | records and is willing to put in work themselves. It's not like | US public employees are famed for not passing the buck. | bombcar wrote: | In my experience these city officials are almost overjoyed that | someone is even asking the question. | | They have little community meetings when talking about | developments and road/bike changes and almost nobody attends | them unless there is a big controversy. | | I actually enjoyed it and got undivided attention from multiple | planners and left feeling they knew a lot more about it than I | did and had though of lots of the concerns you could bring up. | c0nsumer wrote: | I've had the same experience. I once noticed that a section | of local highway had been restriped so instead of it being | just white dashes it had white dashes followed immediately by | a brief black dash. This is a fairly light colored concrete | highway that runs east-west. | | I was curious about this new striping, emailed, and very | quickly got an interesting and friendly response about how | they are studying this new striping technique because it | makes the lines more visible. Being light colored pavement, | running east-west (facing sunrise/sunset), and in an area | where it rains frequently (which changes the pavement color) | this made a ton of sense. | | I think that asking a technical question politely was a big | help, but the folks who replied seemed more like talking with | a fellow engineer who was excited to explain why they are | doing what they are doing. | | (I've had other similar experiences when asking questions | about / suggesting light timing changes, etc.) | bombcar wrote: | I've been listening to City Planner Plays on YouTube as he | plays City Skylines and he has quite interesting patter | about the behind the scenes work for development. Many | interesting things come up you might not even realize. | tylervigen wrote: | I was pleasantly impressed too! I've always had good luck | getting replies from officials, but I got particularly good | responses from the folks named in the article. | | Glad you enjoyed it! | ChrisMarshallNY wrote: | This reminds me of _Outside Lies Magic_ [0], a somewhat odd (but | cool) book, that explores stuff like this. | | [0] https://www.kirkusreviews.com/book-reviews/john-r- | stilgoe/ou... | ginko wrote: | >It's not in an area that is particularly walkable, and it | doesn't connect any establishments that obviously need to be | connected. So why was it built? | | As a dedicated pedestrian I find it baffling why you people would | even be wondering about this. You have to provide ways to cross | highways as pedestrian, otherwise you just cut off huge parts of | land. | | I generally find the American approach to road planning where you | have buildings and neighborhoods that can only be accessed by | vehicle startling. What are you supposed to do if you don't have | a car? | tylervigen wrote: | Oh I agree! I didn't spell it out in the article (I am the | author), but I am a huge advocate of walkability. But if you | gave me $1M and asked me to make this area more walkable, I | still wouldn't build a bridge there. It's just so terribly | unwalkable that that project would not even make my list. I | would start with some sidewalks to get folks off the roads. | | Funny story: the original residents of Richfield push back | against building sidewalks, because they thought NOT having | sidewalks would make them more distinguishable from Minneapolis | as a suburb. That is bonkers to me. | speed_spread wrote: | Typical 1950's thinking. Like mass transit, sidewalks are for | poor people who can't afford a car. It's an early form of | transhumanism. Car + Driver, Man + Machine. | bombcar wrote: | The article states litter collects on the end of the bridge. So | _someone_ is using it! | | You find many of these structures where freeways were cut | through in the 60s and 70s because cutting walkability was | considered a serious issue. | | Even if only used ten times a day that's still 3,650 trips a | year. | | Things like this bridge should be encouraged! Cars can drive | around "the long way" - but pedestrians sent more than a | hundred yards out of their way are seriously discouraged. | boomboomsubban wrote: | > article states litter collects on the end of the bridge. So | someone is using it! | | Or litter that would blow onto the interstate if a bit | further away instead gets stuck as it can't climb stairs. | dtgriscom wrote: | Didn't read the article, eh? | throwbadubadu wrote: | > As a dedicated pedestrian I find it baffling why you people | would even be wondering about this. | | Full agree, so the stance of the Grainger guys made me chuckle: | We hate this bridge, cos we hate Taco Bell and it accumulates | litter. (: | BlandDuck wrote: | I know it is popular to assume that americans are crazy and | ignorant, but part of the puzzle is that there were plenty of | other ways to cross the highway. There are two other bridges | just a few hundred feet away (a foot being about one-third of a | meter): | | "Why would you build a pedestrian bridge to an empty field?! | That makes even less sense. Yes there is a neighborhood south | of the field, but if you are in that neighborhood surely you | could just use the sidewalk on one of those other two bridges a | few hundred feet to the east or west." | potatolicious wrote: | ... Have you ever walked over a freeway on the "sidewalk" | that's provided? I actually found that part of the quote | amusing/revealing. As a frequent pedestrian who didn't own a | car for many years, but yet navigated many a suburban area, I | would _vastly_ prefer the independent footbridge over a | narrow 5 ' wide strip while 4,000 lb boxes whipped past me at | 50mph. | | I've done it, and I can tell you besides being a hair-raising | experience, one of the few thoughts that goes through your | head in that moment is "I am meant to be less than those | people in the cars in every way" | | > _" I know it is popular to assume that americans are crazy | and ignorant"_ | | On the contrary, I don't think this infrastructure is crazy | or ignorant at all, but it is pretty emblematic of the way | America defines class. Pedestrians/people who don't own cars | are nearly subhuman, barely given any consideration at all in | the best cases, and actively campaigned against at worst. | | The way the road infrastructure is for pedestrians isn't | _crazy_ , it's entirely rational under a value system where | they have no value. | [deleted] | quickthrowman wrote: | This pedestrian bridge is 2 blocks east of the Nicollet Ave | bridge over 494 and about 5 blocks west of the Portland Ave | bridge over 494. Both Nicollet and Portland Ave have sidewalks | on both sides of the bridge. The bridges are old and not | particularly pedestrian friendly, but pedestrians do use them, | I've walked across the Portland Ave bridge a few times and | didn't find it dangerous or scary. | | Anyways, this section of 494 is being reconstructed over the | next few years, I'm curious whether the pedestrian bridge will | survive or not. | | Here is the physical location: | https://maps.app.goo.gl/TXfx7smGDDym3V46A?g_st=ic | gipp wrote: | I'm about as strident an advocate for better walkability in | America as you'll find, but this is still a silly post. The OP | is not about the question of why one would build pedestrian | bridges in general, but why this _particular_ one exists in | this _particular_ spot, when it is clearly of no value to | anyone and has no obvious rhyme or reason to its positioning, | having no connection to any other pedestrian infrastructure. | Which you know perfectly well if you read any of the post. | | As far as your latter paragraph goes... Read any other comment | thread vaguely related to this topic, I suppose. That exact | conversation is had on this site at least weekly. | unyttigfjelltol wrote: | The post buried the lede that the pedestrian bridge was at | the end of a long avenue that was cut off by an Interstate. | It continued the avenue for pedestrians. | | While I enjoyed the shoe-leather reflected by the piece, I | disagree with the central assumption that reconnecting | neighborhood roads cut by Interstates should be an exception | rather than a rule. In my city several areas are oddly | isolated from one another due to highways that were a | cohesive community fabric before. It's always an insult to | the local neighborhood to seal places off and I'm saddened | conventional wisdom today would require a special exception | to heal the cut. | drewcoo wrote: | To plow an interstate through a city, first seize some land | through imminent domain. Better to seize it from the poor | because they can't afford any legal struggle. | | This effectively splits poor neighborhoods. | | And that can be used as a tool to move or remove those | populations. | | Combine this with redlining for extra "fun" for anybody | black. | | https://www.history.com/news/interstate-highway-system- | infra... | imchillyb wrote: | > And that was by design, she noted. Policymakers and | planners saw highway construction as a convenient way to | raze neighborhoods considered undesirable or blighted. | | With absolutely no citation, quote, or reference, these | types of statements are pure propaganda. | | That propaganda is found right at the top of this piece, | so we can know exactly what to expect from that supposed | journalist. | | Garbage. No facts, just hate. | tylervigen wrote: | >I disagree with the central assumption that reconnecting | neighborhood roads cut by Interstates should be an | exception rather than a rule. | | Author here: That was not meant to be my central | assumption! Sorry if it came across that way. I only called | it out to note that the lack of walkability in the area | made this bridge stand out. I wish that area (and other | areas in my community) were more walkable and bike- | friendly. | pohl wrote: | _I only called it out to note that the lack of | walkability in the area made this bridge stand out._ | | As someone who thoroughly enjoyed the piece, this smells | like ignoring the obvious answer to the question. The | place lacks it. The bridge provides more of it. Mystery | solved, no? Need meets provision! | | I felt the same way when I read about the Grainger | employees complaining about the litter -- which is a | clue, evidence of people walking there -- but you didn't | follow that thread. | true_religion wrote: | If you were assuming the bridge was to provide | walkability then the next question would be "why connect | these two points instead of somewhere more populous?" | | That would lead you right down the same search as the | author. | webnrrd2k wrote: | Well, yes, the specific question is not exactly useful to the | vast majority of the people of the world, but I think that's | a particularly harsh criteria. | | And, I think that's not really the point of the article. The | most useful thing came at the turning point, the advice that | allowed the solution to be found - "...stop looking at old | documents: 'no one writes down the real reason for | infrastructure projects.' She said I needed to look for | people in power." | | I think that's pretty good advice, and has obvious extensions | that makes it pretty useful. | _dain_ wrote: | +1 | | "it's not walkable, so let's not build any walking | infrastructure" | | is there anything more perfectly self-defeating? | onlyrealcuzzo wrote: | I agree with your point. | | And this bridge was built a long time ago when prices were | different - but a bridge like that would probably costs >$1M | today. | | If you're trying to improve the walkability of an area - | building a pedestrian bridge over a highway that hardly any | pedestrian will ever use is probably not the best use of | funding. | unyttigfjelltol wrote: | Millions for cars but not one cent for pedestrians. Nice. | onlyrealcuzzo wrote: | It's about allocating funds. If you have $1M to spend for | pedestrians. You should use that on things pedestrians | will use. Not on a pedestrian bridge no one will use. | unyttigfjelltol wrote: | People did and apparently do use the bridge. Lots of | them, according to the article. | | In any event, the bridge was a _mitigation_ of the | degredation of a walkable neighborhood that the Federal | government was lavishly funding. People wouldn 't use the | bridge if the Federal highway didn't exist, so ... the | result of your logic is build neither? Of course not, you | prefer people to be in their cars, probably electric | ones, failing entirely to see failed mitigation after | failed mitigation of the original misstep which was to | build the highway in the first place. | MereInterest wrote: | > but a bridge like that would probably costs >$1M today. | | For comparison, from a brief search for "cost per mile of | road". | | * $2-3 million per mile of two-lane rural road. | | * $4 million per mile to expand a highway from four lanes | to six lanes. | | * $120k/mile/year in road maintenance. | baq wrote: | Don't want cars someplace? Don't build roads there. | | Don't want pedestrians somewhere? Don't build sidewalks and | footpaths there. | | The way infrastructure is designed has tremendous | implications on demand of modes of transportation. Of | course nobody will walk anywhere if it's unreasonable to | walk anywhere. | | The problem is walkability is so bad people don't even stop | to think if they need to take a car. The just do and drive | 800 ft down the road to visit neighbors. Insane. | tylervigen wrote: | Author here. That is definitely not what I meant to imply at | all! I'm sorry if you interpreted it that way. | | I love walkability and am an advocate of pedestrian and bike- | centric city planning. I wrote that sentence to indicate that | the bridge was especially surprising to me given the context | of the lack of walkability nearby. i.e., "Why make THIS | SPECIFIC PLACE walkable if nothing else around here is?" | browningstreet wrote: | It was clear... truly it was. There are some pretty grumpy | and unnecessarily dismissive readings of your delightful | quest here in this forum. | callalex wrote: | Don't worry, for some reason there is a tiny contingent of | people who just HAVE to let you know that they, in fact, | know more than you because only THEY know that cars are bad | for the environment. | nabakin wrote: | The first part of this comment could only be made by someone | who did not read the whole article. | | Tyler was not saying there was no point to having that bridge. | He was saying given how other bridges were placed according to | important landmarks, he did not understand why this one was | placed in this location seemingly without any important | landmarks. | | You can believe more bridges should exist without needing some | sort of important landmark and believe that it is strange this | bridge was placed in this location without an important | landmark given the other bridges were placed in locations with | important landmarks. These two things are not mutually | exclusive. | | Of course it turned out that there was an important landmark | (the school/church!) but that was Tyler's thought process. | f1shy wrote: | Live in a city where no car is needed, I suppose. | petarb wrote: | Love this type of historical research article. Thank you for | sharing | pix128 wrote: | It's a sad state of affairs when somebody feels compelled to do | this much work to determine why a pedestrian bridge (that | connects two neighborhoods) needs to exist. | mark-r wrote: | This is cool! I've probably driven under that bridge thousands of | times, and honestly I've paid more attention to the Grainger than | to the bridge. Congratulations on digging into the story so | doggedly. | marstall wrote: | truly awesome research! love the portrait of the time the bridge | was built, of a vibrant community of families all the same age, | about be be split in two by 200 yards of pavement. | hindsightbias wrote: | I will think of this bridge as a metaphor for dead code. | tylervigen wrote: | Author here! Glad you all enjoyed the article. It was a fun | journey into the history of my community. | | For the record: I am an advocate of walkability and think there | should be more bridges, not fewer. I just wondered how that one | got there given the context of limited walkability in the area. | DiabloD3 wrote: | I enjoyed reading this. Write more, you're good at it. | Reason077 wrote: | The UK has many similar pedestrian bridges crossing motorways | and other major roads. There must be thousands of them | throughout the country! Wherever there is an existing right of | way (ie: foot path or bridal path) you can't just block it by | building a motorway or other obstruction. So usually that means | building a bridge! | pm215 wrote: | True for motorways, but even on busy dual carriageways | sometimes the planners just say "the footpath crosses the | dual carriageway on the flat", ignoring that this comes | pretty near to being an effective closure of the right of | way; there are some on the A14 near me like that. | | This forum thread lists some other examples: | https://www.sabre-roads.org.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=41259 | adolph wrote: | Y'all even have bridges for boats | | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pontcysyllte_Aqueduct | bufordtwain wrote: | That was a great read, particularly the frequent hidden notes | :) thanks for taking such an immense amount of time to research | and write it all up. | dang wrote: | The notes are so good and so amusing that the article is | worth reading just to enjoy the notes. Don't miss this | rabbit-out-of-hat moment: | | _Believe it or not, I was specifically trained by the | military as a geo-spatial analyst to identify bridges in | black and white aerial photographs taken in the 1960s._ | | Also... @tylervigen, the note after "Peter Wilson of the | Bridges Division got back to me very quickly" doesn't work | for me in either of the browsers I tried. I want to know what | about Peter Wilson of the Bridges Division getting back to | you quickly merited a note! | userabchn wrote: | As others have said, it was an enjoyable read, and I thank you | (and everyone else involved) for caring. One small bit of | feedback: I suggest being a bit more subtle about how much work | you did. At times I wondered if you were telling us things just | to try to impress us with your dedication rather than because | they were an important part of the story. | kasztelan_ wrote: | Huh, it didn't struck me as such. But maybe because I read it | partially over the course of the day. | | In any case the author DID make a lot of effort researching | this and I can imagine it was not always pleasant hitting | dead ends. | fortran77 wrote: | Sadly, Howard Kyllo passed away | | https://www.startribune.com/obituaries/detail/0000423925/ | flir wrote: | This was great. I too go on these ridiculous local history | research binges, but I've never had a good model of how to | write one up. So thanks for the interesting story, and the | template. | qingcharles wrote: | This article is so wholesome, thank you. I was going to just | scroll through it real quick, but I got so engrossed and read | every word. I died laughing about the Kansas City bit! | markphip wrote: | I really enjoyed this. I did not really know where it was going | at first but it got really interesting. My daughter is in | school to become an Archivist so it really started to get my | attention as I went further into it. | | I do have to say in the beginning of the post, I was thinking | it was going to end up being about pork and politics and in a | sense that is how it ended. | | I loved this so much ... "While I am dedicated to this search, | I am not about to fly down to Kansas City to dig through | federal archives, especially when those documents may or may | not be there... | | ...just kidding. Of course I flew down to Kansas City to dig | through the federal archives" | | Thanks for creating this | iandanforth wrote: | Really enjoyed the article! Your tenacity was impressive. | bandyaboot wrote: | This is the third place I've encountered your work in as many | days. I first read it from a social media post, then saw it had | been covered in the Star Tribune, and now here. Good to see | such hard work getting noticed and appreciated. | echelon wrote: | This was such a fun read and a fantastic little mystery. | | Thank you so much for sharing your project with the world and | for making it so entertaining. (Glad you found the smoking gun, | too.) | justincormack wrote: | There were fascinating protests against footbridges when first | created in London, as the people felt they were losing their | priority against the car. I copied out these notes from the | book Leadville about the history of the A40 and the building of | the first footbridge here | https://www.flickr.com/photos/justincormack/256217251 | | The Bridge of Fools, the first footbridge over a road in | Britain | | In 1938 the inhabitants started to protest about the rising | death toll on Western Avenue, the "Avenue of Speed and Death". | They petitioned the Ministry of Transport to impose a speed | limit of twenty-five or thirty miles an hour. The ministry said | that would be an "ingenious provision" to save lives, but it | would be against "the whole object of constructing a road free | from congested traffic". | | On 21 July 1938 the protestors filed across Western Avenue from | the Approach, and then back, causing a huge tailback. The next | day the Ministry arranged to build two bridges, one here and | one by Gipsy Corner, much to the disgust of the protestors, who | thought it would encourage cars to drive faster and to force | pedestrians off more roads onto bridges and subways. A week | later a thousand people demonstrated again for "their right to | cross on the level". | | In September the hastily erected bridge was complete, and five | hundred people demonstrated against it again. The bridge became | a tourist attraction and it was "quite usual to see people from | other districts coming to look at it". | | In October torchlight processions were held on the road every | evening for a week, with a dog with a red light attached to it | and four bearers carrying a coffin, and placards saying "We | want crossings not coffins". | | The war brought and end to the protests, and for a few years | the traffic. | | from Leadville: A Biography of the A40 by Edward Platt | ShadowBanThis01 wrote: | Sounds like the kind of hypocrisy you'd hear from "urbanists" | today: Complain about pedestrian deaths, then complain about | a thing that prevents them. | Reason077 wrote: | The speed limit was indeed reduced, in 2020, to 30 mph on the | elevated eastern section of the A40 (Westway), but remains 40 | mph on the Western Avenue part. | tiahura wrote: | You see these "bridges to nowhere" in analogous places in a lot | of the midwest. I think the city planner nailed it - it was | built in anticipation of development. I.e., back in the 60's | they made guesses about growth and some of those guesses were | wrong. There are probably many others, but these catch our | attention because they're 50 feet up in the air. | Two9A wrote: | Honestly, you see this all over the world where anticipated | development either hasn't materialised or funds have dried | up. The A57(M) freeway through Manchester, England was | planned to continue from its current endpoint southwards, but | the rest of it... never happened. And now there's a bridge | over the A34 that doesn't connect to anywhere. | | As I recall, the M1 emerging from London starts at "Junction | 4" and there were three more junctions planned deeper into | central London, but that part of the road never happened | either. | RetroTechie wrote: | Great article! | | Reminded me of the "Leave as you found" rule: | | Say you're hiking through some fields, and come upon a fence. | If it's open, don't close it. If it's closed, don't pass | through leaving it open. | | Why? Because building a fence takes effort. Maintaining it | too. And if whoever built that fence left it open, probably | had a good reason to do so. | | Read: _until you understand why_ it 's there & in the state | it's in, don't mess with that. If you _do_ know who put the | thing there & how it's used, then by all means have at it. | | And the detective work here: hacker spirit in optima forma! | Kudoz to the author. | quinncom wrote: | Have you spoken with Roman Mars yet? I hope this will be a 99% | Invisible episode soon. | asmithmd1 wrote: | Thanks for the thorough research, not just on-line, but | including calling people. | | I occasionally go down rabbit holes like this and I have not | gotten the helpful responses from officials I have contacted in | the New England area. I don't know if I was telegraphing some | agenda the officials did not want to further, or if it was | because you were dealing with "Minnesota nice" people. I first | heard of Minnesota nice when a curmudgeonly co-worker was | grumbling about calling Anderson Window, "I hate calling them, | they are so effing nice!" | jeffrallen wrote: | > She told me to stop looking at old documents: "no one writes | down the real reason for infrastructure projects." She said I | needed to look for people in power. | | Wow, the whole thing was interesting, but that insight was the | most interesting. | lifeisstillgood wrote: | Hang on. The MnDot report says "Average Daily Traffic:151,000". | But. That must be the car traffic under the bridge - surely 151K | people don't walk across it each day. And if so, why would you | measure that? It's like measuring how much water flows under the | Golden Gate bridge and ignoring how many cars go over it. | | We are just so car focused it influences everything and we don't | notice | tylervigen wrote: | Ha! Love the analogy. I agree. That statistic is totally | unhelpful. | ogurechny wrote: | For example, the number describes how much traffic will go to | alternative paths in case of some accident or planned | construction work that blocks the road. Then it can be quickly | deduced how far they should reroute drivers to get them use the | roads that handle the additional load (instead of local streets | with low limit on throughput). | codingdave wrote: | > The MnDot report... | | You are looking at a report from Minnesota's DOT. Their job is | to be concerned with roads and cars. Sure, our society is | overly focused on cars, but you can hardly blame the DOT for | putting out reports on their own subject area. | neilv wrote: | My (least) favorite pedestrian bridge curiosity: | | https://goo.gl/maps/dJZew2G2EJJcEgvP9 | 42deg21'21.6"N 71deg06'49.6"W Memorial Drive, Cambridge, | MA 02139 USA | | Look at how far a pedestrian has to walk, just to cross a 4-lane | street, to get to the park. And close to half the walk is uphill, | just to elevate over the street. | | Every time I see it, it makes me angry. (Partly because this | ridiculous imposition of a pedestrian bridge is emblematic of the | area's crazy emphasis on cars. When Boston or Cambridge gets a | little strip of park green space, they somehow tend to end up | with a freeway of angry cars right up alongside it.) | Ekaros wrote: | Seems that this is some sort of accessibility design. It really | should combine both stairs and ramp. But that might have cost | bit more... | Cerium wrote: | Any ramp style bridges that are U shaped annoy me. I much | prefer ramp style bridges that are H or Z shaped so you can | make productive walking in your goal direction for both the up | and down legs of the trip. | tylervigen wrote: | Author of the original article here. I actually remember that | bridge! It's such a huge mass of concrete. For me it is | memorable because it's right next to the only Microcenter in | Cambridge. If I wanted to buy a Raspberry Pi while in law | school (more common of an occurrence than I care to admit), | that's where I'd go. | fla wrote: | The advantage of the soft slope is that it can be used with a | wheelchair. | | Edit: ...and of course bikes etc | Ekaros wrote: | Bikes can do pretty extreme climbs without much issues. And | probably would hate that tight u-turn. | worklaptopacct wrote: | City planners in Warsaw, Poland have apparently noticed that | underground passages are actually an inconvenience to | pedestrians and now I'm seeing a trend where such crossings are | starting to get surface-level crosswalks as well, such as at | Rondo Dmowskiego[0], a principal public transport hub. Such | changes are a life quality improvement to people with | disabilities - elevators are breaking left and right, cutting | off people who rely on them. Right now I live in Berlin and the | public transport notification page is always filled with | reports of broken elevators all around the city. | | [0] https://www.transport- | publiczny.pl/img/20210430130147Dmowsk2... | c0nsumer wrote: | I don't know this area, so I don't know how good it is there, | but these are pretty nice if you're cycling. I imagine if one's | in a (motorized) wheelchair it's a fair option as well. But it | sure seems like there should also be a set of steps cutting off | much of the distance for those who can/want to use steps | instead. Maybe even with a bike gutter along the steps like so | many transit systems have in their stations. | kdmccormick wrote: | Ugh, there is so much to be angry about when it comes to Boston | area parkways. First and foremost, they are maintained by the | MA Dept of Conservation and Recreation under the guise that | their purpose is to provide access to the river parks (rather | than their real puprose, providing drivers access to downtown | Boston/Cambridge). And among MA agencies, DCR is paradoxically | backwards when it comes to providing bike- and ped-friendly | improvements. The DOTs of MA, Boston and Cambridge are somehow | way more progressive when it comes to these things. Just | compare the Somerville/Cambridge community paths and new Boston | core cycletracks with the stupid little "bike paths" on either | side of the Charles. | | My favorite un-fun fact was that James Storrow was an ardent | advocate for the public parkland along the river, and opposed | building a highway on the land. After his death, MA thanked him | for his service by... building a highway through the park and | naming it Storrow Drive. | unyttigfjelltol wrote: | Mine is right across the river [1]... There are (or were) old | 1930s stairs from the deck of the BU bridge across the river to | ... nothing. Access to the pedestrian path on the south side of | the river requires backtracking a quarter mile to a pedestrian | bridge. | | [1] | https://www.google.com/maps/place/Fenway%E2%80%93Kenmore,+Bo... | tosser0001 wrote: | That bridge also took over 2 years to complete at an absurd | cost after the one it replaced was damaged. While it was under | construction, there was a temporary red light installed at the | intersection of Magazine St. which was far better all around as | it allowed pedestrians to just cross the street much closer to | the only real stores in the immediate area (and a Starbucks, | now closed.) | | While the bridge is well-built and provides wheelchair and bike | access, its location is inconvenient. It's so far away from any | of the few available amenities that many people just try to | dart across the road from the park and community pool. Two | people have been struck in killed trying to cross in the past | few years. | | Other than a single water bubbler at the BU boathouse, that | only went in a couple of years ago, there isn't a single place | to get a drink (let alone buy one or get a snack) the entire 4+ | mile length of the river in Cambridge from the Museum of | Science to the Elliot St. Bridge, without crossing Memorial | Drive. It's unclear to me why they just don't take down the | footbridge and make the stop light with crosswalk permanent. | There seems to be some issue with the fact that Cambridge | itself doesn't really have control over the road itself or the | land along the River as it's controlled by the Department of | Conservation & Recreation (the "dcr") which is a State agency. | | The footbridge that I find oddest is the one across Rt. 2 past | Alewife just over the Cambridge line in Arlington. | | https://goo.gl/maps/8JrUQHn2j4B7TuE56 | 42.399443, -71.147645 Arlington, Massachusetts | | I assume it has a similar story to the OP in that whatever | utility it may have had has long since passed. ___________________________________________________________________ (page generated 2023-09-02 23:00 UTC)