[HN Gopher] Device offers long-distance, low-power underwater co...
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       Device offers long-distance, low-power underwater communication
        
       Author : marban
       Score  : 44 points
       Date   : 2023-09-06 16:56 UTC (3 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (news.mit.edu)
 (TXT) w3m dump (news.mit.edu)
        
       | mikewarot wrote:
       | This sounds like an acoustic analog of the radio tracking device
       | that was disclosed by Snowden a decade ago involving a quarter
       | wave antenna that was selectively grounded. It was trackable at
       | 20 miles, and totally passive.
       | 
       | It could run for months on a single coin cell battery.
        
         | beebeepka wrote:
         | I guess I was so enthralled with the rest, that I have missed
         | this device. If it's totally passive, what's the battery for?
        
           | myself248 wrote:
           | Observing the parameter being monitored and deciding whether
           | to ground or not ground the resonant element.
           | 
           | "Passive" in this case meaning that none of the battery power
           | was turned into RF. It did not produce any RF. It merely
           | absorbed more or less RF to encode information.
        
       | backendanon wrote:
       | As a former Submariner and Sonar Technician (trained in
       | oceanography and underwater acoustics), it's interesting that
       | such low power could be used. Long range underwater transmission
       | of sound isn't a new thing. It's possible to passively track
       | targets for up to 3000 nautical miles when the audio gets trapped
       | in the deep sound channel.
       | 
       | The device discussed in the article has only achieved a distance
       | of 300 meters using a slightly modernized version of sonar
       | transducers and receivers that have been around for a very long
       | time. I've seen MIT ocean projects meet the real world and go
       | poof, but it's good to see people are out there trying to figure
       | things out again, in the world after the pandemic.
        
       | soperj wrote:
       | I'm guessing this will really be hell for whales.
        
         | [deleted]
        
         | Gys wrote:
         | [flagged]
        
           | RalfWausE wrote:
           | [flagged]
        
       | ck2 wrote:
       | Can they use this to stop killing whales when they try to talk to
       | military subs halfway around the world?
       | 
       | (the current method is like a person standing next to a jet plane
       | taking off to underwater life)
        
       | chrisBob wrote:
       | It might work at distances longer than 300m, but "they ran out of
       | space on the dock." That seems like such a silly limitation to
       | bring up twice in the writeup.
        
         | RobotToaster wrote:
         | Sounds like a passive aggressive way of saying "tight ass
         | funders didn't give us enough money to test this shit properly"
        
         | jgeada wrote:
         | It's an MIT press release. Technique probably doesn't work at
         | any interesting distance, but this way they can make it sound
         | as if they've discovered something incredible without ever
         | having to acknowledge that they know it won't work as
         | described.
        
         | hinkley wrote:
         | Wow.
         | 
         | If it's "long distance" put the unwieldy piece where you have
         | reserved space and move the less complex piece to borrowed
         | space. Like another jetty, or a beach, or here's a crazy idea:
         | on a seaworthy vessel. You know, to test your marine
         | communications device on a marine vehicle?
        
       | dylan604 wrote:
       | My natural first reaction is what unknown effect will this have
       | on underwater life? We know other types of sonar have had
       | negative effects. Knowing that, this should be studied and
       | considered when making any new underwater sounding equipment. You
       | don't get to go "we never thought about it" now that _we_ know
       | about it.
        
         | backendanon wrote:
         | At 1 million times less power than existing sound transmission
         | systems I'd say it's probably less audio going into the water
         | than a baby whale fart.
        
         | awei wrote:
         | This was also my first thought.
        
       | EricMausler wrote:
       | This is cool. I'm not sure if I missed it, but did they address
       | how a signal is generated by the array in the first place?
       | 
       | My current understanding is that the device will echo a signal
       | back to the source, not propagate it forward or create a signal.
       | 
       | Is it right to assume low power sensors exist and would be hooked
       | up to this array, and then when the sensor triggers the array
       | echos the signal to the other receiver?
        
         | IshKebab wrote:
         | I'm pretty sure only one side of the communication system is
         | "battery free". The other side is a standard phased array.
        
       | Mountain_Skies wrote:
       | Wonder how well it would work for things like RC submarines. The
       | distance increase isn't all that valuable for RC but the lower
       | power required sounds very useful.
        
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       (page generated 2023-09-06 20:00 UTC)