[HN Gopher] Researchers mined an old drug forum and fed the entr...
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Researchers mined an old drug forum and fed the entries to an AI
Author : Hooke
Score : 42 points
Date : 2023-10-02 21:47 UTC (1 days ago)
(HTM) web link (pioneerworks.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (pioneerworks.org)
| beefman wrote:
| Erowid is great, but the trip reports were universally fanciful,
| typically having no real connection to the drug (often drugs)
| being described. It became a literary form of their own, and
| something of an inside joke among psychedelic users.
| droopyEyelids wrote:
| I saw some discussion around the flaws of mri imaging to study
| cognitive states.
|
| If i recall correctly, something like 70% of people fall asleep
| in the MRI so theres no baseline brain state to compare.
| ProjectArcturis wrote:
| I did fMRI research for 12 years. You are not recalling
| correctly.
| flenserboy wrote:
| Let's hope that lots of old forums in other areas of interest
| (programming, engineering, etc.) are preserved so that the same
| sort of work can be done. A current forum which would be most
| interesting to see results from would be the Ray Peat Forum, for
| better or for worse.
| dylan604 wrote:
| What happens if we go back too far in the forums and the AI
| starts suggesting the use of leeches and the letting of blood?
| flenserboy wrote:
| What happens if we find out some dismissed cures/methods
| actually have value? That could really upend things.
| ipaddr wrote:
| How would one take an existing forum and transform it into a
| model that could be used?
| rideontime wrote:
| Will Erowid and/or its users be at all compensated for providing
| the data for this?
| cypherpunks01 wrote:
| "All information on Erowid.org is provided non-commercially for
| purposes of teaching, scholarship, research, and criticism."
|
| The point of the website is to collect information about drugs
| for education and research purposes. It's a 501c3 nonprofit,
| which operates explicitly for public education. It's funded by
| donors, not by consumers of the info collected.
| ShamelessC wrote:
| Did you ever use the site? It was like a handshake agreement
| situation where you had no idea how full of shit the posts
| were. If people weren't outright lying, they could (very well)
| be experiencing wish fulfillment or placebo. Many of the
| "negative" experiences were similar - describing reactions that
| were frankly hard to believe. Posts tended towards fictional
| exaggeration. Further, many users were anonymous, pseudonymous,
| lying about identity, or posting in a time when many believed
| no one would be probing through the internet trying to identify
| folks.
|
| tl;dr - I seriously doubt any of the users wants to be
| identified, much less compensated for providing "data".
| rideontime wrote:
| That's been my experience with the site, too, which made me
| raise my eyebrow at the article's claim of "first-hand
| testimonials that have been vetted for authenticity and
| accuracy." If the data's such junk (which I surely won't
| argue with), why study it?
|
| e: From the original paper:
|
| > Rigorous quality control is conducted by trained experts
| with careful consideration given to "quality, credibility,
| and focus on effects or outcomes" (www.erowid.org). By means
| of that mechanism, all reports that provided the basis for
| the present investigation have successfully exceeded a
| standard quality filter.
|
| Totally.
| dylan604 wrote:
| I once had a disagreement with a lead dev for an in-house
| tool that was a glorified DAM. their forms were not kept up
| to date, and so users were forced to enter bad data which
| skewed query results. when pressed about why the fields
| were forced to choose from an outdated pre-populated enum,
| i was told "bad data is better than no data".
|
| maybe the AI researchers are from the same school of
| thought. having bad/unvetted medical data/advice on
| psychedelics would be better than no data at all, right? /s
| morkalork wrote:
| The trip reports for datura are legendary for their
| outlandishness.
|
| On point though, many of the chemicals in question aren't
| legal so not sure how much users would want to be
| identified..
| deleriousmuffin wrote:
| If you had actually ever tried datura, there's no way you'd
| be so dismissive of people's reports of using it as being
| "outlandish".
| plussed_reader wrote:
| Yes, no true scotsman would dismiss a datura trip report.
| redavni wrote:
| Research is very clearly covered under fair use.
| rideontime wrote:
| Even when you do it to develop a commercial product?
| 0xcde4c3db wrote:
| Research falls under "purpose and character of the use",
| which is only one of the four factors considered in fair use
| analysis. I gather a court _could_ decide that this outweighs
| the other factors, but I doubt that can safely be taken for
| granted as a general rule.
| brandall10 wrote:
| As someone who contributed to the site many years ago, I am
| more than happy for my experiences to be used in this fashion.
| cypherpunks01 wrote:
| Erowid is a member-supported organization providing access to
| reliable, non-judgmental information about psychoactive plants,
| chemicals, and related issues. (from mission statement)
|
| Anyone who has benefited from Erowid's psychoactive drug info
| should consider donating!
|
| https://erowid.org/donations/
| visarga wrote:
| I was sure it was going to be Erowid.
| [deleted]
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(page generated 2023-10-03 23:00 UTC)