[HN Gopher] Podman Desktop v1.5 with Compose onboarding and enha...
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       Podman Desktop v1.5 with Compose onboarding and enhanced Kubernetes
       pod data
        
       Author : mairindubh
       Score  : 104 points
       Date   : 2023-11-03 19:39 UTC (3 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (podman-desktop.io)
 (TXT) w3m dump (podman-desktop.io)
        
       | lomereiter wrote:
       | Glad to see usability improvements here, but I won't be using it
       | until there's a light theme (asking an application to respect the
       | OS theme is apparently too much these days).
        
         | westurner wrote:
         | "Light mode button?" https://github.com/containers/podman-
         | desktop/issues/576
        
         | eikenberry wrote:
         | Welcome to the club. So many things still don't support a dark
         | theme either. Why aren't dark/light modes standard these days?
         | Super annoying to have to hide a bunch of light mode windows
         | when I'm in a meeting as they reflect brightly off my glasses.
        
           | diarrhea wrote:
           | A very Hacker-News complaint, if I've ever seen one.
        
           | ravenstine wrote:
           | 1997: Now you can completely customize the window UI with any
           | colors you like!
           | 
           | 2023: We have no plans to have our UI not blind you past 8pm.
        
             | paulryanrogers wrote:
             | That's because before Mac OS X theming was nearly free for
             | apps, so long as they didn't override colors from the OS
             | widgets.
             | 
             | Once Apple started dictating UI fashion you'll take it as
             | is or inverted. If you have different needs then go pound
             | sand. After a decade or so they suddenly discovered dark
             | modes are a thing.
             | 
             | The move to the web also took some pressure off because you
             | can override colors in your browser ... Unless you have a
             | per-app browser locked inside Electron or similar.
        
         | smilingemoji wrote:
         | [deleted]
        
           | lagniappe wrote:
           | lynx gopher://hngopher.com
        
           | ruricolist wrote:
           | The Dark Reader browser extension works for HN.
        
             | pests wrote:
             | Chrome has a force-dark-mode option in the :config too with
             | heuristics on how to change things with different modes.
        
           | pests wrote:
           | Dark mode causes more issues than light mode for a lot of
           | conditions. Providing only a darkmode is worse than providing
           | only a light mode, IMO.
        
           | computerliker wrote:
           | HNcute for chrome still works nicely!
           | 
           | https://caro.io/hn-cute
        
         | shaan7 wrote:
         | I had to hard facepalm reading the other replies to this. There
         | are people suffering from things like Astigmatism (myself
         | included) who have an extremely hard time, including headaches,
         | using dark themes. People really need to be a bit more
         | empathetic.
         | 
         | Also, as the OP pointed out, people somehow get angry when all
         | you asked is for an app to follow the system's theme. It has
         | been such a huge regression.
         | 
         | EDIT: typos and clarity
        
           | least wrote:
           | > Also, as the OP pointed out, people somehow get angry when
           | all you asked is for an app to follow the system's theme. It
           | has been such a huge regression.
           | 
           | Was there a time when Podman Desktop supported a light mode?
           | You could change the CSS yourself, which given you only need
           | a light mode, would be pretty trivial.
           | 
           | Please keep in mind that dark themes were introduced _as an
           | accessibility feature_ as well, but not every project can or
           | will prioritize it.
        
       | pydry wrote:
       | I wish they'd give podman compose just a _little_ bit of love. It
       | 's been in a perpetual alpha state for a few years now. E.g.
       | 
       | https://github.com/containers/podman-compose/issues/626
       | 
       | https://github.com/containers/podman-compose/issues/489
       | 
       | The PRs are being neglected too e.g.:
       | 
       | https://github.com/containers/podman-compose/pull/521
        
         | MuffinFlavored wrote:
         | Why not write a Helm chart and deploy it locally with Helm or
         | ArgoCD?
        
           | chucky_z wrote:
           | You're being downvoted. I disagree with that vote, as I
           | cannot tell if this is serious or sarcasm and that makes it
           | an excellent comment.
        
             | dvfjsdhgfv wrote:
             | Well, once you imagine doing this, you'll quickly realize
             | it is actually sarcasm.
        
               | mbreese wrote:
               | I don't know... I used to routinely install HPC batch
               | schedulers on my laptops, so I could see someone
               | legitimately doing this (unironically too).
        
           | pydry wrote:
           | I'm too busy creating Bazel buildfiles for enterprise
           | fizzbuzz deploying it with kubernetes.
        
         | Volundr wrote:
         | Out of curiosity, why do you not want to use the real docker
         | compose with podman, now that it's supported?
        
           | pydry wrote:
           | Half of the point of podman was to avoid the need to run
           | things with root.
           | 
           | Docker compose expects me to have a server running. While I
           | technically _could_ run  "podman system service" and
           | configure docker compose to point at a non-standard socket or
           | port in order to run it I would really prefer not to have
           | that kind of headache just to run a script.
           | 
           | Docker compose was also written by docker and exhibits
           | similar levels of shoddiness to docker. The accumulation of
           | bad design decisions by docker is, indeed, why podman exists
           | in the first place. With a little bit of love podman compose
           | could easily surpass docker compose.
        
             | timost wrote:
             | I agree with you on the state of podman compose.
             | 
             | I just wanted to clarify that you can run docker-compose
             | with podman in _rootless_ mode. This can be done by running
             | podman's systemd user service.
        
         | Rapzid wrote:
         | I was under the impression they were sidelining compose in
         | favor of their k8s manifest flavor which.. Well, let's just say
         | I've never been in a compose file and thought "Man, I wish I
         | was writing k8s manifest syntax".
        
           | dboreham wrote:
           | You can write a tool that translates between compose format
           | and k8s-babble on-the-fly.
           | 
           | When I say you, I mean me. That's my current project.
        
             | tuananh wrote:
             | isn't that https://github.com/kubernetes/kompose ?
        
         | janejeon wrote:
         | We've been using podman compose for semi-production purposes at
         | our company and that's been our experience as well. It's
         | just... it's really rough, there are a ton of "known" issues,
         | and it's rather unreliable. As a result, I've been really
         | trying to push the "just use the docker daemon in prod instead"
         | (to no avail... _yet_ ).
        
           | dboreham wrote:
           | > "just use the docker daemon in prod instead"
           | 
           | Can you expand on what that means?
        
       | denysonique wrote:
       | Another Electron app that isn't visually integrated with Linux --
       | under GNOME/Wayland the app does not have native or at least
       | native looking window buttons, it also has sharp edges without a
       | shadow behind the window, as all other apps.
       | 
       | This is a surprise as Podman Desktop development is lead by
       | RedHat, a company not only behind a Linux distro but one that
       | leads the GNOME project.
        
         | hackandthink wrote:
         | Podman Desktop is mostly for Windows users.
         | 
         | But Electron still feels like a wrong choice. Plugins for
         | Visual Studio Code or Eclipse would be nice.
        
           | jacurtis wrote:
           | > Plugins for Visual Studio Code or Eclipse would be nice
           | 
           | Can't you just use the docker plugins and configure the
           | binary of the docker plugin and point it to the podman binary
           | and it should work. Or just alias podman as docker
        
       | nimbius wrote:
       | Why or how is this different from running podman in
       | Ubuntu/fedora/Linux?
        
         | least wrote:
         | It is a GUI for working with podman, docker, and kubernetes. It
         | is functionally similar to Docker Desktop, which is also just a
         | GUI to work with containers. It is a tool for those that prefer
         | working with containers with a GUI instead of the terminal.
        
           | jacurtis wrote:
           | > It is a tool for those that prefer working with containers
           | with a GUI instead of the terminal.
           | 
           | Sort of. In the case of podman desktop, that is true because
           | you can opt to just install the cli podman if you prefer.
           | 
           | But in the world of Docker, they force end-users on Mac (and
           | I think windows) to install docker through docker desktop
           | even if you don't ever touch the GUI. I don't use the GUI
           | ever, but can't find a way to install docker on Mac outside
           | of the GUI. Maybe there's a way, but at least on Docker's
           | website it seems to be the only way and at my company with
           | ~100 devs no one else has figured it out either.
        
             | bafe wrote:
             | On windows I just use WSL2 with docker installed through
             | the Linux distribution (Ubuntu in my case). This way I get
             | docker on my windows Laptop without the annoying docker
             | desktop
        
               | GordonS wrote:
               | Did you follow a particular guide for how to do that?
               | 
               | I remember trying a while back, when WSL2 was first
               | released, and I couldn't get it to work; IIRC I couldn't
               | get stuff running in Windows to communicate with stuff
               | running in containers in WSL2, and also vice-versa.
        
               | gdubya wrote:
               | I wanted to build a Windows container image but I really
               | did not want to install Docker Desktop. After some
               | digging around I found my way to the Docker server /
               | client binaries for Windows page that allowed me to do
               | this:
               | https://docs.docker.com/engine/install/binaries/#install-
               | ser...
        
             | Timon3 wrote:
             | I think you can use docker-machine for this purpose:
             | https://datamachines.com/blog/how-to-install-a-docker-
             | machin...
        
       | spandextwins wrote:
       | I'm a little confused, podman is just IBM docker, right?
        
         | spandextwins wrote:
         | I was right, it's redhat docker.
        
       | marcrosoft wrote:
       | Have they fixed the macOS time drift issue yet?
        
       | StevePerkins wrote:
       | Where are we at on Podman these days?
       | 
       | If I recall, Podman really caught fire with this community after
       | Docker started trying to charge more people for software. But
       | then Red Hat (i.e. Podman's sponsor) started trying to charge
       | more people for software too, and also became a pariah with this
       | community. It's hard to keep up.
        
         | Matl wrote:
         | Podman is not the sole product of the people behind it, so
         | they're less motivated to go down the Docker hole, imo.
        
         | IshKebab wrote:
         | I used instead of Docker for a while because it came by default
         | on RHEL (I'm using 8).
         | 
         | It has very impressive compatibility with Docker. For 99% of
         | use cases you will not even know you are using Podman. The one
         | case that forced me to uninstall it and use Docker was running
         | `gitlab-runner`'s integration tests which do some funny things
         | with Vagrant and VMWare, and Podman didn't like it. But overall
         | I am very impressed with the compatibility.
         | 
         | There aren't really any advantages to using it for individual
         | users. Being rootless is a huge upside on the server though. At
         | my previous company I accidentally deleted all the containers
         | running on a server because I naively assumed that Docker
         | followed the normal permission model and would only let me
         | delete _my_ containers. Imagine my surprise when I learned that
         | Docker basically runs as root and all users that have access to
         | Docker have root access!
         | 
         | Of course I only made that mistake once, but still... Crazy
         | design.
        
           | heresie-dabord wrote:
           | > There aren't really any advantages to using it for
           | individual users.
           | 
           | Cheers, but his is not true.
           | 
           | Running a container _without root privilege_ is a security
           | advantage for users who run containers that (inevitably)
           | contain vulnerabilities.
        
             | bildiba wrote:
             | Even more so if said containers contain Trojans.
             | 
             | Bit more secure than running directly, but if the container
             | is broken out of, attacker directly gets root.
        
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       (page generated 2023-11-03 23:00 UTC)