(C) OpenDemocracy This story was originally published by OpenDemocracy and is unaltered. . . . . . . . . . . Elections 2024: Is it irresponsible to vote for independent candidates? [1] [] Date: 2024-06 Welcome to openDemocracy’s weekly reader comments round-up. We receive so many carefully considered messages about our work, it seemed a shame to keep them to ourselves! You can send your thoughts to be included in next week’s round-up by replying directly to any of our emails or commenting on our articles. These comments have been edited for clarity, accuracy and length, and aren’t necessarily a reflection of openDemocracy's editorial position. Re: Weekly poll: Is it irresponsible to vote independent in a ‘two-horse race’? Sadly, the answer is yes in the UK’s very rare First Past The Post electoral system. I am a firm advocate of proportional representation, despite being a lifelong Labour voter. It is a much fairer system to represent independent views, and has the added advantage that if there is a change of party, the incoming party does not spend half its term undoing its predecessor’s policies. -Chris Get our free Daily Email Get one whole story, direct to your inbox every weekday. Sign up now Voting for an independent is irresponsible in the case of Donald Trump v Joe Biden, which risks returning an irresponsible maniac to power. It’s not irresponsible in the case of Keir Starmer v Rishi Sunak, where the policy distinctions are trivial, and a refusal to pretend otherwise is strategically important. -Harry I would love to vote for an independent! But in this most serious of times, wars, climate emergency, poverty, deadly viruses affecting humans and nature, major corruption in our world leaders, how could I vote for an independent candidate? I will vote Green again with my fingers firmly crossed this time! -Fiona This year, the US faces a binary choice: fascism, a religious right-wing takeover and the erasure of constitutional rights moulded by greed, fear and Vladimir Putin’s propaganda or the struggle to salvage and improve the democracy envisioned in the constitution. It is a ‘winner takes all and move on’ situation. In the UK, the power breakdown is more modulated. It is worth insisting on noisy minority parties to drive equality, awareness, the development of issues that evolve faster than governments that get heard in Parliament and on public media. Dark and dirty money – from which both parties suffer, whether through old socialist loyalty to comrades or new elitist greed buying approval – needs to be exposed. A huge concern is the creep of disguised oligarchy data-solutions that will own us all. In my opinion, In UK the green voice must be kept afloat, carbon cop-outs addressed, transparency in funding that both big parties hide. -Lizzie Fortunately I am a Scot who can vote for the SNP, but I am sympathetic to the problem of those south of the border, who are trapped between Conservative and Labour. To vote independent relies on knowing as much as possible about the candidate – but finding that out when they are ignored by the press must be very difficult. -Margaret The ‘all or nothing’ voting system simply cannot be believed in when voters have such ready access to alternative views, accurate fact-checking, and the ability to measure their lives against what has been, or is being, promised. Even those who vote for ‘the winner’ quickly start to feel cheated. This would be minimised with any form of proportional representation, allowing true party values to be emphasised and giving voters a wider range of choices for their votes. It would also minimise the ‘tyranny of the minority’ created by a situation where the ruling party has received the votes of no more than 30% of the electorate. Ideally, every potential president, prime minister, MP etc would stand as an independent and be forced to seek temporary allies to support their proposals once elected. This would be far more preferable than the current ‘block vote’ approach enforced when the government of the day feels threatened by the possibility that their proposal may not succeed. -Frank The Labour Party could have won far more elections if only it had not assumed that our country ought to be run with nothing but ‘two-horse race’ contests. If it had introduced a fairer voting system in one of the few periods it has been in power – especially between 1997 and 2010, when the country was no longer a two-horse race country in terms of support for different parties – then we may have been spared many years of misery caused by endless Conservative governments. Most Labour Party members and their local constituency parties have concluded that we need a fairer voting system, and I really hope that if and when Labour gets into power after 4 July that it gets over itself and accepts the necessity of working with all decent MPs from any party with decent policies. We need an end to the Labour Party’s arrogance of assuming that Labour is the only party entitled to form the opposition (and very occasionally, the government). Other countries are more mature about this and accept that people from different parties can work together if their policies and values overlap enough. -Rowan Simply put: voting for a third party in the US is not responsible. In the UK? Responsible – and arguably the only ethical approach. There is legitimate reason to believe that Trump winning will be the cliff edge for American democracy. He doesn't believe in fair elections, considers himself above the law, and is likely seeking a third term to evade legal consequences and appease his ego. He very well may deploy militias, as was seen on 6 January 2021, and use the National Guard to preserve himself. You may not like Biden, but if he wins you can vote for whoever you want in 2028. Trump, meanwhile, is already floating the idea he could change the rules to allow himself a third term in office. By contrast, although Sunak and the Conservatives are promoting some anti-democratic practices, they aren’t yet talking of undermining the fundamental practice of fixed-term Parliaments and voted representatives. Starmer is going to win. He’s not going to get a great big whopper of a thumping victory margin, but he'll get a solid win. Trump v Biden, on the other hand, is looking very, very close – and slightly in Trump’s favour right now. If everyone seriously considering voting for a third party did so in the UK, Starmer would still win comfortably. If the same happened in the US? Trump would probably win. -Jamie Re: Will Labour’s left-wing purges affect its ability to govern? This story needs to be repeated over and over again in Labour Party circles. I'm hard left, and it’s not pleasant at all watching the persecution and attempted elimination of Labour's left, although I moved to the Green Party many years ago because of Kinnock's anti-left purges. I'm a warm welcomer of all those now making the decisive move to the honest tax-and-spend and Green New Deal policies of my fast-growing Greens! -Alan Unfortunately, since Starmer reneged on the platform on which he was elected as leader, he has demonstrated that he cares little for the views of the progressive forces. He is more inclined to use power in a bureaucratic rule. He, in my view, has little interest in politics that includes difference and encourages debate. For that reason, Starmer's Labour Party would only lead to a further restriction of democracy and further consolidation of bureaucratic power. I will definitely not be using my vote to do this! -Pamela Read the original article here. [END] --- [1] Url: https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/general-election-uk-us-donald-trump-joe-biden-rishi-sunak-keir-starmer-vote-independent-candidates/ Published and (C) by OpenDemocracy Content appears here under this condition or license: Creative Commons CC BY-ND 4.0. via Magical.Fish Gopher News Feeds: gopher://magical.fish/1/feeds/news/opendemocracy/