SUBJECT: MSG THREAD ON THE PHOENIX PROJECT FILE: UFO1543 PART 2 * Forwarded from "ParaNet UFO Echo" * Originally from ParaNet Information Service * Originally dated 08-20-92 13:23 <..Continued from previous message> No. ParaNet has long questioned both of those sacred cows. To this point we have seen no acceptable proof for the existence of any underground alien base near Dulce, nor have we seen adequate proof for the existence of "Operation Majestic Twelve". We have publicly stated as much on many occasions. PP> According to our sources within the intelligence community, the PP> Dulce Scam, perpetrated by the disinformation specialists of MAJI, PP> better known to you as Majestic Twelve with help from the CIA and PP> NSA, is considered one of their most brilliant success stories. But, of course, these "sources" cannot be named, and all we have to go on is your word that they even exist. And, unfortunately, you are making a concerted effort to keep anyone from knowing who *you* are, either. Anonymous stories relayed by anonymous story tellers. Sorry, but that's not "evidence". PP> We sent in experienced investigators, not amateurs, to check out PP> the alleged Dulce Base. Those people knew what to look for, how to PP> look for it, how to get answers, and are not easily mislead. We have no evidence for this except your say-so. PP> If you do not agree with our findings, get off your posterior, go PP> to Dulce, and check it out for yourself. We have. PP> In fact, we invite PP> anybody to do the same thing. We're sure you'll find exactly what PP> we did ... We didn't. PP> You imply that you're good at asking questions -- how are you at PP> answering them? We have a few questions ... Would you mind sharing PP> with all of us, everyone on the BBS's and the public, what hard PP> evidence you have that, without question, supports the presence and PP> validity of the Dulce Base. Would you mind sharing what hard evidence you have that we ever said anything of the kind? We have never said anything in support of the presence of a secret alien base at Dulce. In point of fact, we consider it extremely unlikely that any such base exists--at Dulce or anywhere else. That's one of the reasons we have so much trouble with your "K-2" report, which purports to document the existence of just such a base in California. PP> Unless you have irrefutable PP> evidence to present, made available for public scrutiny and PP> evaluation, which invalidates the findings of the Phoenix Project PP> regarding Dulce, K-2, or the Ultimate Secret, or our future PP> reports, back off. Either put-up or shut-up. In other words, get PP> off our back. All right, challenge accepted. Let's start with this statement from your "Ultimate Secret" report: PP> According to eye-witness testimony, the CIA PP> agent in charge of this covert operation, wearing the PP> uniform of an AF Colonel, was William C. Cooper. ... PP> This witness testifies that this is the PP> same William C. Cooper, who has been prominent since 1988 PP> in the civilian UFO movement. Is this "William C. Cooper" supposed to be the famous Bill Cooper we have all come to know so well? Apparently so. Unfortunately, in his own published documents Bill Cooper gives his full name as "Milton William Cooper", not "William C. Cooper". Either Cooper doesn't know his own name, or the Phoenix Project's "eye witness" doesn't know what he's talking about. And while we're on the subject of Bill Cooper, it is instructive to compare some of the text of the Phoenix Project's "Ultimate Secret" document with some of Bill Cooper's material on the same subject. Cooper writes in his "Operation Majority--Final Release": BC> [Project Grudge] was financed by CIA confidential BC> funds (nonappropriated) BC> and money from the illicit drug trade ... BC> The purpose of Project Grudge BC> was to collect all scientific, technological, medical and BC> intelligence information from UFO/IAC sightings and BC> contacts with alien life forms. This orderly file of BC> collected information has been used to advance the United BC> States Space Program. Now look at the corresponding paragraph of the Phoenix Project's "Ultimate Secret" report: PP> Project Aquarius was funded by CIA confidential PP> funds (non-appropriated) ... PP> The purpose of Project Aquarius PP> was to collect all scientific, technological, medical and PP> intelligence information from UFO/IAC sightings and PP> contacts with alien lifeforms. This orderly file of PP> collected information has been used to advance the United PP> States' Space Program and provided the data needed to PP> develop present stealth technology. You don't have to be an intelligence agent to see that these two passages are virtually identical in both content and phrasing. Since Cooper's statement is dated 10 January 1989, more than half a year before the "Ultimate Secret" report's "origination" date of 4 August 1989, we seem to be left with three possibilities: (1) Cooper was somehow privy to the Phoenix Project's investigative results even before they were first put to paper; or, (2) the Phoenix Project plagiarized Cooper's writings; or (3) the Phoenix Project's own investigations drew on the same tainted and discredited sources as Cooper apparently did in compiling his own materials. Whichever one you pick, it's not a pretty picture. But it gets worse: PP> The basic information revealing the existence of PP> Operation Majestic-12, the crashed UFOs, alien beings, PP> and their secret bases within the United States, was PP> obtained through the Freedom of Information Act from the PP> files of the CIA, NSA, FBI, State Department, the U.S. PP> Air Force. This is utter nonsense, as any perusal of published FOIA documents on UFOs would quickly reveal. FOIA requests have forced the government to disgorge many hundreds of pages of UFO documents over the years, but they provide little if any support for the existence of Operation Majestic Twelve, crashed saucers, alien beings, or secret bases. If the Phoenix Project is relying on already published documents as their source for this claim (e.g., "The UFO Cover-UP" by Lawrence Fawcett and Barry Greenwood, or "Above Top Secret" by Timothy Good), then clearly they have not examined them very carefully. On the other hand, if the project really does have such explosive FOIA documents in its possession, let's see them; their publication would do more to establish the project's credibility than anything else it could possibly do short of producing a live alien. PP> PROJECT GRUDGE: This project was originally PP> established in 1953, by order of President Eisenhower and PP> is under the control of the CIA, NSA, and MAJI. Project PP> Grudge went underground and another project, Project ********************************************** * THE U.F.O. BBS - http://www.ufobbs.com/ufo * **********************************************