Across the river is about twenty metres of cliff face, sheer parts held together by riparian scramblers, integrity maintained by a thin line of emergents just far back enough to not yet have fallen down the cliff embarrassingly replanted root-side-up but not so far back as to be cleared for farmland. This side of the river is low and stabilized by the occasional willow, a riverbank garden interspersed with carefully mown grass maintained by local environmental volunteers as a sign informed me. Yesterday I was spending some time with a software engineering masters student who countered some of my suggestions of whimsical applications to write with rock scissors paper. I ended up 'going first' and surrounding (flet ((idx-of (choice) (search `(,choice) *choices*))) (case (mod (apply '- (mapcar #'idx-of `(,human-choice ,robot-choice))) 3) (0 '|...|))) with some CLOS. I had put together a Debian machine I thought was quite similar to the university's linux labs (that university is split between Sun java and Microsoft C#). Alas, the masters student needed more modern tooling, and produced with mild coaching the same logic as mine, though in the vessel of Microsoft C# and a Microsoft Windows Form having a radio-button choice and a submit button that popped out a message upon submit button click. I think I had seen that modern tooling in a Microsoft Windows 3.1 rock paper scissors game. Some coincidence that I was shown this circa 1992 gui as an icon of 2022's modernity, and that also being the date on ANSI common lisp current. This makes me think I am doing wrong to argue ANSI common lisp with C++ 2017 people. The common lisp of 1992, while still alien (and better) relative to C++ 2017, is not different enough to merit this communication. The point of the student's masters degree is to receive training in running a java program some of the teachers had written in 1997. That has some similarities to my recent-times departure from ANSI common lisp to ACL2. I think I need to invite Gabor's MGL into :program mode ACL2. Strange bedfellows, but not altogether unfamiliar.